I mean.

We were just told he's going to focus on anti perfects, why are we using Perfects then?

I feel our good play right now would be cherry tapping with Basic Attacks honed just enough to punch through his Rebuke, and then going for big hits, especially since he doesn't seem to be readying any persistents beyond his Rebuke.
 
-[X] 38d6 Defense (37d6 tricks)
-[X] Summon a 40d6+9 Atgeir Bodyguard (19d6, 1 Bonus Die, -29 Orthstirr)
-[X] Summon a 40d6+9 Sword Guard (19d6, 1 Bonus Die, -33 Orthstirr)
-[X] Use Halting Vortex to stop anything we can stop with it (-4 Orthstirr)
-[X] If both our guards get taken down, start using 32d6 Reinforced Slice-Aside Tricks (-35 Orthstirr per use), with our riposte being one of the Basic Attacks below.
-[X] Final line of defence: Focus Guard (-14 Orthstirr)
-[X] Attack
-[X] 48d6 Attack (43d6 tricks)
-[X] Open up with a Contested Movement with 14d6 Stoked Dice
--[X] Hit with a Sharpened x8 Lightning-Charged Flashfire Cleave attack using Puncture (-24 Orthstirr)
-[X] Hit with up to six 8d6+5 Honedx7 Lightning-Charged Basic Attacks (-8 Orthstirr each)

Hmmm. These numbers are off. You should have way more dice in defense (as in, you actually have more and it's not indicated in the '38d6 Defense' line)...you also need to specify how many Slice Asides there are and how Reinforced they are (x27 based on the cost...well, Honex7 and Reinforcex20, to maintain equal Hone acrosss stuff)...at the moment they're 5 dice a pop, but you could get that down by adding to the cost a bit...you also don't need to assign more than Sharpenx1 on a Contested Movement Counterattack as they are unrolled. And your offense is currently 6d6 because in terms of dice it's the Basic Attacks and nothing else.

My main thought like, very simply put, is that if you think this will do a ton of damage to him, more than a Flashfire Cleave, then why not take the opportunity to deliver it in a form which is effectively unblockable/dodgeable.

It's not actually better than Flashfire Cleave, it's slightly worse...it is better than Flashfire Cleave after armor is pierced. Which is why there are two examples of Flashfire Cleave in the plan earlier in the turn.

It is expensive, but it'll actually be less expensive if it's delivered via CM because you don't need to put in a bunch of dice to get through his defence, right?

Also like, if it hits like a train, it's definitely worth the cost.

It's not actually expenses, it's taking our hand off our atgeir mid-Contested Movement to unleash it. That seems...potentially risky to me, and while the damage is higher than Firebomb Strike it's not that much higher (FBS is 8-10, Sparkbomb is 10-12). Maybe that's not a concern with the Perfects thing, though...lemme think a minute.

I mean.

We were just told he's going to focus on anti perfects, why are we using Perfects then?

I feel our good play right now would be cherry tapping with Basic Attacks honed just enough to punch through his Rebuke, and then going for big hits, especially since he doesn't seem to be readying any persistents beyond his Rebuke.

I can remove perfects and basically not change my plan at all...they're, like, a tertiary focus if that.
 
I mean.

We were just told he's going to focus on anti perfects, why are we using Perfects then?

I feel our good play right now would be cherry tapping with Basic Attacks honed just enough to punch through his Rebuke, and then going for big hits, especially since he doesn't seem to be readying any persistents beyond his Rebuke.

I would note for the record that my plan doesn't really rely on any Perfect Defences, it uses Sword/Atgeir guards as rolled defences, with our second line of defence being Slice-Aside, and Contested Movement specifically to counterattack against any scary-looking attacks and thwack him with another Flashfire Cleave.

There's a mention of Halting Vortex, but only sort of like, as a caveat, if there happens to be anything it can actually usefully stop, which there probably won't be.

Hmmm. These numbers are off. You should have way more dice in defense (as in, you actually have more and it's not indicated in the '38d6 Defense' line)...you also need to specify how many Slice Asides there are and how Reinforced they are (x27 based on the cost...well, Honex7 and Reinforcex20, to maintain equal Hone acrosss stuff)...at the moment they're 5 dice a pop, but you could get that down by adding to the cost a bit...you also don't need to assign more than Sharpenx1 on a Contested Movement Counterattack as they are unrolled. And your offense is currently 6d6 because in terms of dice it's the Basic Attacks and nothing else.

Slice Asides are "as many as he launches attacks" similar to the Halting Chops in your last plan, and are basically being fuelled entirely with Orthstirr as Trick Defences. With the level of Reinforcement, I was just rolling it into the final cost, but I can definitely specify it.

Do we need to Hone a Defence Trick? If I'm reading you right, you're saying Honex7 to keep consistent with the basic attacks, but my idea is that the counterattack will "pull" from one of the Basic Attacks listed lower in the plan, so there's not necessarily a reason to specify it.

In offence, you're right, there was a Flashfire Cleave which was a standalone but then got deleted somehow. Fixing.
 
Okay, edited my plan slightly. Looking it over and doing the math, I did not replace the Contested Movement counters with Sparkbombs because the numbers work out so that two of those on Gabriel post-armor piercing will kill him, so having more than one in the plan is, uh, not very useful. Two Firebomb Strikes after his armor is pierced are still rough, but survivable. It's intended as a 'nothing else worked, let's try this' effect and we need to control the timing on those while he controls the timing of if our Contested Movements go off as he controls when he attacks.

Also, upped the two main defenses to 50d6 each. Just to be extra safe. We'll see if it's enough.

I would note for the record that my plan doesn't really rely on any Perfect Defences, it uses Sword/Atgeir guards as rolled defences, with our second line of defence being Slice-Aside, and Contested Movement specifically to counterattack against any scary-looking attacks and thwack him with another Flashfire Cleave.

There's a mention of Halting Vortex, but only sort of like, as a caveat, if there happens to be anything it can actually usefully stop, which there probably won't be.

This is pretty much true of my plan as well...it's in there and potentially wastes a little Orthstirr, but it's not the intended means of defense by any means.

Slice Asides are "as many as he launches attacks" similar to the Halting Chops in your last plan, and are basically being fuelled entirely with Orthstirr as Trick Defences. With the level of Reinforcement, I was just rolling it into the final cost, but I can definitely specify it.

You can't have more than you have dice to invest. There was a specific number of HHC's I had last turn and they all take dice...Orthstirr can't build an attack or defense from noting, it needs at least 1 combat pool die to exist.

Do we need to Hone a Defence Trick? If I'm reading you right, you're saying Honex7 to keep consistent with the basic attacks, but my idea is that the counterattack will "pull" from one of the Basic Attacks listed lower in the plan, so there's not necessarily a reason to specify it.

You need to Hone every legal action. Things that can't be Honed don't count, but other stuff does and Hone does work on defenses that use a weapon.

In offence, you're right, there was a Flashfire Cleave which was a standalone but then got deleted somehow. Fixing.

Check.
 
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This is pretty much true of my plan as well...it's in there and potentially wastes a little Orthstirr, but it's not the intended means of defense by any means.

Yeah, you never know, there might be the odd thing it can stop, it's worth having it mentioned at least.

You can't have more than you have dice to invest. There was a specific number of HHC's I had last turn and they all take dice...Orthstirr can't build an attack or defense from noting, it needs at least 1 combat pool die to exist.

That was what I thought about Halting Vortexes and other Trick Defences the other turn! But that's because they're Perfect Defences whilst this is still a rolled defence , right?

Anyway, I'll edit it so that there's a dice allocation and Honed is included right now. Up to four should be fine I think.
 
In fact, practice what I preach, here's my own submission.

[X] Plan: Like a Book
-[X] Stoke Frami (+187 Orthstirr)
-[X] 36d6 Attack
-[X] 50d6 Defense
-[X] 0d6 Intercept
-[X] Maintain Stoker State Stage 2 (-6 Orthstirr)
-[X] Prepare a Atgeir Bodyguard (20 + 1 (Hugareida) + 31 (Extra Orthstirr): Total 52d6 + 4 (Frenzy) ) (45 Orthstirr)
-[X] Activate Slipstream (-16 Orthstirr) immediately and use Ember-Wing Cloak (-6 Orthstirr) as necessary to control distance
-[X] Use up to (6) 10x Honed, Lightning-Charged Basic Attacks (1d6 + 10d6 (Hone) + 4 (Frenzy): Total 11d6 +4) (Total of 66 Orthstirr ), each enhanced with a follow-up 3x Sharpened Sword Strike (66 Orthstirr Total for the extra attacks, not sure if this just mirrors the die investment or not, but it'll be at least 7d6 between the Sharpens and the Hugareida Bonus), once Gabriel runs out of Defenses, release our Stoked Pool with a Sharpened, Lightning-Charged Stoking Strike with Puncture (17 Orthstirr, Stoked Pool + 2d6 + 4 (Frenzy)) and use up to 4 Lightning-Charged Firebomb Strikes unless he yields or disengages by this point (9d6 + 7d6 (Extra Orthstirr) + 1d6 (Hugareida) + 4 (Frenzy): Total of 17d6 + 4) (11 Orthstirr Each)
-[X] After the Atgeir Bodyguard is overcome, react to the incoming attack using Contested Movement, augmented with Fight Of Your Life (3 Orthstirr for 14d6 + 4 (Frenzy) and a Sharpened, Lightning Enhanced Flashfire Cleave with Puncture as our retaliation (16 Orthstirr Total), from there, commit up to 3 Honed, Reinforced Slice-Aside Tricks (10d6 + 9d6 (Hone) + 21d6 (Reinforce) + 4 (Frenzy) + 4 (Armor): Total of 40d6 + 8 for 38 Orthstirr each), to continue ablating his defenses down and hopefully create our opening. Disengage using EWC if all remaining defenses are exhausted to try to Round Break
-[X] Tactics – Use Slipstream and a powerful Atgeir Bodyguard, and then punish his overcompensation towards offense by trying to overwhelm his defenses with a series of fast attacks, while building up heat for a powerful exploit once an opening is made. Maintain pressure to hopefully deny him from any slow moving techniques and discourage him from recovering his Focus. Stay on the move.

We already know he's going to be moving to a heavy offense intended to punish our usual reliance on Perfect and Trick Defenses, which means his defense is going to be relatively lacking--probably a handful of heavily stacked defenses to eat our retaliations and shrug off the occasional lucky roll. I don't think he's reserved a lot of defenses against simple, low cost high speed attacks as a result, and the combination of Sword Strike Followups and Honed Basic Attacks should get many hits off for each of his, especially when we start adding in Slice-Asides towards the end of our attack chain. Once we put a crack in his defenses, we exploit that by dumping our Stoked Pool out into a powerful attack.

This effectively layers 12 or more attacks in the space it would normally take 6 exchanges, and we know he's pivoting to a high offense stance that tries to bully us with his Giant Dice Pool while removing our option of Just Saying No. It also means most of his Fervor is going to be supporting that High Offense, Anti-Perfect stance, which means that he's probably only got a couple of stored up defenses to eat our retaliation, since he's probably hoping to brute force bash our defenses down before that runs down. With our modest speed edge and our focus on multi-hit attacks, this should be able to just absolutely run him over and create that opening for a powerful reversal before he bashes our own defense array down.

As for the Question.

[X] "So, the way we normally train is by refining our control of the Body( Hamr) , acuity of the Mind( Hugr) , and those with strong sensitivity or the right opportunities can embody their Spirit( Fylgja) , I'm curious what you call your own focuses in those fields."
 
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Isn't Gabriel going for a ton of excessively-juiced up basic defences? The counter to that should be to cherry tap each of those defences with attacks that don't have a chance of working, then start 'getting serious' midway through after burning through a bunch of his Fervor.
 
Isn't Gabriel going for a ton of excessively-juiced up basic defences? The counter to that should be to cherry tap each of those defences with attacks that don't have a chance of working, then start 'getting serious' midway through after burning through a bunch of his Fervor.

Basically, we know he's doing heavy offense this turn, so we know most of his Fervor and dice are supporting that. So the idea with my plan is to effectively cherry tap through his stacked layer of powerful defenses in order to set up for uncontested hits. I kept it at six basics and Sword Strikes (For a total of 12 attacks in the space of six) because he's scaled his defenses apparently to deflect a small number of powerful blows, but if he wants to start winning with his high offense, penetrating strikes--something has to give, and my bet is that it's going to be that he doesn't have that many readied defenses, even if the ones he has are really powerful.

We got so many successes we literally got to see his character sheet--as well as the exact amount of Orthstirr we need to invest to do damage. Then the plan basically told us everything he's doing this upcoming turn.
 
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Basically, we know he's doing heavy offense this turn, so we know most of his Fervor and dice are supporting that. So the idea with my plan is to effectively cherry tap through his stacked layer of powerful defenses in order to set up for uncontested hits. I kept it at six basics and Sword Strikes (For a total of 12 attacks in the space of six) because he's scaled his defenses apparently to deflect a small number of powerful blows, but if he wants to start winning with his high offense, penetrating strikes--something has to give, and my bet is that it's going to be that he doesn't have that many readied defenses, even if the ones he has are really powerful.
It would be valid if the thing that is giving way is his Fervor reserve (which regenerates), however. We can do the same idea of excessive offence and defence (relative to our powerlevel) by burning Orthsirr to fuel it. It seems to me that Gabriel is trying to close out the fight this round?
 
I mean, if he can close it out, he will, but Chivalric Cultivators thrive in extended battles. I don't think he's going to bet the proverbial farm on this exchange, but he is going to try to put himself in a powerfully advantageous position if he can. His incoming assault is tailor made to punish Halla's usual defensive strategy of using a lot of perfect defenses and only a token number of conventional ones with relatively low dice pools to allow her to maintain a blistering offense.

But we also know that Anti-Perfects are expensive, and that Chivalrics don't nova as well as Norse do, he's trying to Nova, and we already seemed to establish that his defense feels shaky and overextended, that smacks of being vulnerable to pressure.

EDIT: After some consideration, I realized that his floor might be 11 in his armor (And 6 without), so I've adjusted to make sure each attack intended to pressure him has at least 11 Orthstirr behind it.
 
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Also, is it just me, or is Gabriel kind of fighting like a mini-Steinarr? Lots of highdice basic attacks and defences and a couple of Wildfire Blackflame attacks to spice things uo?
 
Also, is it just me, or is Gabriel kind of fighting like a mini-Steinarr? Lots of highdice basic attacks and defences and a couple of Wildfire Blackflame attacks to spice things uo?

That's just Chivalrics for you, they have gigantic dice pools and stupid sustain, as well as being able to just straight up ignore attacks below a certain level of investment. The fact Steinarr got there with a paradigm that's not about sustain at all is because Steinarr is a half-step Hero who got there without any real cheat codes, just on pure Hard Work and Effort.

Models the historical purpose of a Knight pretty nicely, where they were effectively the MBTs of the Middle Ages, just utterly unanswerable to anything but their peers as long as they had full access to their kit, and needing special tactics to bring down even by their peers. (You needed to bring specific kinds of weapons, or alternately tackle them and shove your dagger into their armpits or their visor.)

Anyway, I've got to get to bed now, my plan's been dropped, what remains is to see how things play out I guess. I'll integrate feedback in when I wake up.
 
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[X] Plan: Like a Book

The big issue here is no use of Flashfire Cleave, IMO. Like, for at least the first Contested Movement it's a flatly better attack than the other options, I think. After you get one through that's much more arguable, but you need one for armor-breaking, IMO.

I do also worry that the Slice Aside attacks hit his Rebuke and bounce, but we don't actually know that one way or the other.
 
The big issue here is no use of Flashfire Cleave, IMO. Like, for at least the first Contested Movement it's a flatly better attack than the other options, I think. After you get one through that's much more arguable, but you need one for armor-breaking, IMO.

I do also worry that the Slice Aside attacks hit his Rebuke and bounce, but we don't actually know that one way or the other.

11 Orthstirr each, that beats it. That being said, I'll probably switch to the Cleave in my morning revisions, pending any new Revelations
 
And we can ask @Imperial Fister if this will work or we need to tweak it/rethink, and he'll tell us either for free or for a Reward Dice.
Yeah, you can mess around with it. I don't really understand the question, to be honest.
@Imperial Fister what's the current ruling on that so we can plan around it? Do damage ups to Flashfire Cleave only hit the armor damage now or what? Or all but one, I guess, based on this result?
1 always penetrates, the rest hits the armor unless that's pierced, in which case the remainder carries on
I'm pretty positive it's where he's getting his physical enhancement stuff, yeah.
Maybe, maybe not
@Imperial Fister important question: Once an attack breaks a Sword Guard or similar defense, what happens to it? Is it gone at that point, or does it continue on to potentially break other such defenses?
If it gets defeated, it breaks and needs to be re-summoned
(which given voting patterns is probably the one which will win lol)
I'd just like to say that I very much appreciate you trying to make plans. This isn't the easiest of systems and the effort is noticed
Sometimes, I am inspired on plan names. This was not one of those times. :(
I'm the same way. Not all the trick names are 10/10 grand slams after all
As for the Question.
You can ask multiple, by the way. Also good job remembering to ask questions
 
Does 6 (11) equal to:

1) All attacks with 6 Orthsirr or less are negated (IF Attack has Orthsirr <= 6, negate)
a) All attacks with less than 6 Orthsirr are negated (IF Attack has Orthsirr < 6, negate)
2) All attacks with 11 Orthsirr or less are negated (IF Attack has Orthsirr <= 11, negate)
a) All attacks with less than 11 Orthsirr are negated (IF Attack has Orthsirr < 11, negate)

Then of course, is 11:

a) Armor penetration? So Knightly armor of 36 would have had rebuke (12)
b) Soma 'Infusion' x2 +1 (This would fit with the 'a)' interpretation)

And of course, 6:

a) Armor Penetration/2, rounded up?
b) Soma 'Infusion' +1 (This would fit with the 'a)' interpretation)

---

I think Gabriel probably has Soma 10 (average 25 vs rolled 29) or Soma 11 (average 27.5 vs rolled 29), with either Soma ''infusion'' 6 or 5 respectively, to get his Endurance of 16. Presumably Soma is ~1/3 easier to raise than Hamr.
 
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11 Orthstirr each, that beats it. That being said, I'll probably switch to the Cleave in my morning revisions, pending any new Revelations

I think that applies only to the defense and you'd need to up the attack separately. I could be wrong, but that's my concern.

If it gets defeated, it breaks and needs to be re-summoned

Sorry for confusing wording there, that wasn't the question I was trying to ask (I think we all got what happened to the Guard):

The question is what happens to the attack after it breaks a Guard? Does it continue onward to potentially break other Guards or not?
 
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Yeah, you can mess around with it. I don't really understand the question, to be honest.

Sorry, essentially what I was trying to ask was whether it's possible for us to lock-in/confirm that we still get Crowfeeder's "blade restores itself so it has unlimited uses of Sharpen" whilst going for a different wording along the same lines, which maybe shoots for another enhancement at the same time. Happy to use reward dice here!

The wording in question was:
I have the soul of a warrior, my edge forever sharpens for battle without dimming.
(Or something along these lines.)

Apologies, I imagine that was not terribly clear!

I'd just like to say that I very much appreciate you trying to make plans. This isn't the easiest of systems and the effort is noticed

Thank you!

Have to give a lot of thanks to Deadman for helping me learn the system and giving feedback and advice, honestly.
 
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[X] Plan: Like a Book

[X] "So, the way we normally train is by refining our control of the BodyHamr, acuity of the MindHugr, and those with strong sensitivity or the right opportunities can embody their SpiritFylgja, I'm curious what you call your own focuses in those fields."
 
[X] Plan: Like a Book
[X] Plan Defence in Depth

I really like capitalizing on our godly tactics rolls.
Edit: also approval voting Skippy's plan.
 
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Whilst I really like that we've got a third plan in the running, I do feel that Plan: Like a Book has a few weaknesses at present which mean it is not ideal here?

It heavily relies on attacks which we have no reason to believe Gabriel can't stop. Whilst he did overcommit to stopping our Basic Attacks last Turn, even a modest defence should stop attacks which do not even break twenty dice. If this were purely to apply pressure/exploit vulnerabilities, then that would be one thing, but with the lack of Flashfire Cleave or any attack with a proper number of dice backing it, it's seriously wanting in terms of effective offence. If he has any rolled persistent defence at all, then basically nothing in this plan can get through it. The single Contested Movement + Spark Bomb combo will hopefully get through, but on its own that's not really enough.

On the defensive side, it uses Slice-Aside Tricks which are working off of only 20d6, which seems kind of hard to justify if you assume as this plan does that Gabriel will be focussing more of his dice on offence. He was already able to beat his way through a 30d6 Atgeir Bodyguard in the last round, so what can he do if he really goes on the attack?

I am going to repost my plan and reiterate why I think it is a better option:

[X] Plan Defence in Depth

-[X] General
-[X] Activate Slipstream (-16 Orthstirr)
-[X] Ember-Winged Cloak (-6 Orthstirr)
-[X] Activate Stoker State Stage 2 (-6 Orthstirr)
-[X] Stoke our Frami (+187 Orthstirr)
-[X] Layered Defence
-[X] 42d6 Defense (37d6 tricks)
-[X] Summon a 50d6+9 Atgeir Bodyguard (19d6, 1 Bonus Die, -39 Orthstirr)
-[X] Summon a 50d6+9 Sword Guard (19d6, 1 Bonus Die, -43 Orthstirr)
-[X] If both our guards get taken down, against average-looking attacks, start using up to four:
-[X] 42d6 Reinforced x28 Honed x7 Slice-Aside Tricks (1d6, + 5 Bonus Dice, -49 Orthstirr per use), with our riposte being one of the Basic Attacks below.
-[X] Against scary-looking attacks, see below under Counter-Attack.
-[X] Attack
-[X] 44d6 Attack (35d6 tricks)
-[X] 52d6+4 Sharpened x8 Lightning-Charged Flashfire Cleave attack using Puncture (35d6, -39 Orthstirr)
-[X] Hit with up to nine 8d6+4 Honedx7 Lightning-Charged Basic Attacks (1d6, -8 Orthstirr each)
-[X] Counter-Attack
-[X] Respond to any particularly scary-looking attacks with Contested Movement, first using our Stoked Dice as a bonus, and Fight of Your Life thereafter, with our counter-attack being another Sharpened Lightning-Charged Flashfire Cleave with Puncture (-24 Orthstirr)
--[X] Try and use this counter-attack at least twice, even if he does not throw any particularly scary-looking attacks.
throw any particularly scary-looking attack.

- Layered persistent rolled defences in the form of our Sword Guard and Atgeir Bodyguard will significantly slow down his offence, if not stop it outright. Having two gives us a contingency against attacks that can eat a spectral weapon, which we know definitely do exist as we've seen two different examples already when fighting Steinarr.
- Slice Aside with a decent number of dice allowing it to actually stop a meaningful attack - this is all the more imperative if we believe he will go more heavily on the offense this round!
- Flashfire Cleave does a lot of damage and is especially effective against his armour, and this plan hits him with one right off the bat, and then probably another two or more times. If we hit him with a couple of these we're getting well on our way to ending the fight.
- By using Contested Movement to counter his most serious, scary attacks, we both protect ourself against anything our other defences can't stop, and every time it happens, we hit him really hard and bypass all his defences.
- I think this gives us a good chance of stopping most of his attacks cold, and effectively hitting him through his armour at the same time.
 
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