pucflek
Verified simpleton
- Location
- Czech Republic
I mean yeah i suppose Stave could be used as a weapon but in this case its more of a magical kind.
Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest
- Thread starter Boney
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- Fantasy Users' Choice!
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- warhammer warhammer fantasy fantasy be gay do crimes (gay) female protagonist pansexual protagonist ck2 quest divided loyalties mountain vietnam ranald is real this is a dwarf quest (dwarfs) this is maybe an elf quest this is not a vampire quest this is not an empire quest try it and find out open voting
Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
Codex
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Can someone explain to me what's up with GW's treatment of Halflings? I'm reading through WFRP 2E Religion, and the Halfling section is probably the crappiest information that could be supplied. Sometimes the book feels like it's giving me a neutral perspective that's mostly not biased, other times it hits with hard bigotry and xenophobia and I get no actionable information.
I looked in the wiki to see what information I could get out of their pantheon, and apparently they get minimal representation in Tome of Salvation and more depth is added with 4E. Halflings also don't have Army Books and I don't think they have any signficant heroes/units in Warhammer in general? Despite being one of the 4 starting races of WFRP 2E it feels like they really skimped on them.
I looked in the wiki to see what information I could get out of their pantheon, and apparently they get minimal representation in Tome of Salvation and more depth is added with 4E. Halflings also don't have Army Books and I don't think they have any signficant heroes/units in Warhammer in general? Despite being one of the 4 starting races of WFRP 2E it feels like they really skimped on them.
deathofrats0808
Don’t think of it as dying; just as leaving early
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- Earth
No I didn't. That was Nerdasaurus. And she might just be an Eonir or might be a forest that just looks like an Eonir.
Cadeath could be what happens when an elf steeps their soul in too much of the jade wind.
Or maybe it's because she's the Vicereine. Maybe being a viceroy/vicereine of Laurelorn is more than a political appointment, but actually a magical-spiritual one instead and she has to be "connected" to the land she governs somehow?
Maybe she's a dryad hivemind puppeting an elven shell.
We don't really know what she is, but she is an "ambassador for both Eonir and Laurelorn", implying that those are separate entities, and that she's familiar enough with both to be chosen to represent them.
Huh, depending on which she feels she belongs to, she might have some divided loyalties herself.
Hm, Eonir politics are beginning to sound complex. We have Viceroys (Cadeath calls herself the vicereine of the city of Oldenlitz, implying there might be other viceroys of other locations), we have the grey lords who never leave their tower, we have Laurelorn itself as a possible faction, we know the isolationist faction lost their ruling family to beastmen recently (elf recently or human recently?).
Or maybe it's because she's the Vicereine. Maybe being a viceroy/vicereine of Laurelorn is more than a political appointment, but actually a magical-spiritual one instead and she has to be "connected" to the land she governs somehow?
Maybe she's a dryad hivemind puppeting an elven shell.
We don't really know what she is, but she is an "ambassador for both Eonir and Laurelorn", implying that those are separate entities, and that she's familiar enough with both to be chosen to represent them.
Huh, depending on which she feels she belongs to, she might have some divided loyalties herself.
Hm, Eonir politics are beginning to sound complex. We have Viceroys (Cadeath calls herself the vicereine of the city of Oldenlitz, implying there might be other viceroys of other locations), we have the grey lords who never leave their tower, we have Laurelorn itself as a possible faction, we know the isolationist faction lost their ruling family to beastmen recently (elf recently or human recently?).
Codex
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It wasn't an isolationist faction per se, just the final major house of Kor Immamor. Kor Immamor was the city destroyed by the Dwarves in Laurelorn territory, so they would not have liked the idea of working with Dwarves on Waystones. With them dead, no one is opposing the project.
deathofrats0808
Don’t think of it as dying; just as leaving early
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- Earth
That's because they're mostly a joke in Warhammer outside of the RPG. And the RPG is both written by different people (hell, a different company) from the Army Books and leans more into being written from a perspective.
Halflings are simple, and a lot of people (both IC and OOC) mistake that for them being stupid. But they're not, they're merely free of embellishment. They're simple like an empty belly or a warm fire is simple. And when they need to be, they're simple like a knife is simple.
Doomed Wombat
Let's go Darling!
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- Dancing on wires!
Sure for the narrative, in universe its easy to be strong when you've just got infinite power.
I'm seeing a lot of Finubar hate.
but I would point out that for every impassioned mistake he was made and regretted (Which is a chronic elf problem, not a him problem), the man has made a hundred good, logical choices.
This is the man that opened up and normalised relations with the old world and has worked to reforge alliance's others have dismissed as forever broken.
the man isn't prefect, but he is far from a bad king.
but I would point out that for every impassioned mistake he was made and regretted (Which is a chronic elf problem, not a him problem), the man has made a hundred good, logical choices.
This is the man that opened up and normalised relations with the old world and has worked to reforge alliance's others have dismissed as forever broken.
the man isn't prefect, but he is far from a bad king.
Our opinion of Finubar - just like our opinion of Thorgrim - has greatly suffered because Mathilde has had more experience with their mistakes rather than their accomplishments.
We never see the good stuff they do and we never see things from their perspective - not sure how to change that other than investing a few social actions, maybe?
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We saw things from Thorgrim's perspective twice now, and people were sympathetic and understanding to him at first.
Then he refused to tell Belegar that K8P's Waystone network was back online, and people understandably went back to hating or disliking him for making stupid decisions because Belegar now despises him over a misunderstanding.
You can add both the Grand Theogonist and Alric to that list as well.
- Location
- Norway
We don't have a lot to go on for if Finubar is an alright Pheonix King or not, but my opinion of him nosedived after Asarnil went "this saber-rattling Marienburg is getting up to has Finubars fingers all over it" or something to that effect. Might be that Asarnil is wrong, and he is clearly a biased source, but would Marienburg really be so belligerent with the Empire if they didn't have Ulthuan in their corner?
Doomed Wombat
Let's go Darling!
- Location
- Dancing on wires!
And is certainly a good one compared to some of his predecessors.
Irregardless I'm remembering from somewhere (probably headcannoned it though) that a lot of elves felt he wasn't really focusing on the issues they saw as important, which I guess I then head cannoned into him having seen the world and decided that they needed to do soemthing different.
Anyway if I were to give an example of him potentially doing something good for us its thanks to him that we can go to Ulthwan. While officially only Lothern is open to us, (and I imagine the shadow warriors wouldn't give a damn even if humans weren't allowed at all) I imagine that helps a lot and he was the person who stood up for humans on that issue.
Side note I've always thought it'd be an interesting scenario to have elves pissed at Finbur for allowing humans only to Lothern. While not a complete monopoly on goods from the outside world, the only way for elves to get them without going through Eatine is to get them themselves.
Probably not, but he's likely talking about the fact Finbur's from the "merchant" kingdom. His personal dislike of Finbur likely amplifies an already existing "I'm a cool warrior they're icky merchants" vibe.
As for whether or not Finbur would help them...well circumstances are different.
- Location
- Finland
And Sigmar.
Ok it was one, and frankly it was as much on our friend the cleric, but still...
Probably. It's been mentioned somewhere in quest that Marienburg is ruled by a council of great houses, and they are all locked in an endless cycle of one-upmanship against each other, so they are all sort of egging each other on in regards to antagonising the empire.
Meta knowledge, that's Asarnils bias talking, it don't sound like something Finubar would do.
To be fair, while I really doubt Finubar would do it directly, it wouldn't surprise me if he (probably unintentionally) offered enough support to Marienburg to give them the idea that they can get away with this, while a different (read more martially inclined and like Asarnil would prefer) Phoenix King would have held them further at arms' length due to having less interest in trade.
After all, implying you value someone highly can be good for diplomatic negotiations, but it means that the other person does indeed think you value them highly. And therefore, that you might defend them even when it is really not in your best interest. So it isn't necessarily his fault but it could definitely be argued to be a tradeoff he made in the certainty that nothing like what is currently happening would happen.
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Doomed Wombat
Let's go Darling!
- Location
- Dancing on wires!
Possibly, although I imagine he's far from blind to the situation.
Last time Marienberg was (legally) in the right, this time they're in the wrong cause they're acting out over a threat to their monopoly, and this risks dragging Ulthuan into round two with the Karaz Ankor. Finbur maybe a merchant, but he made is career as a diplomat so I imagine he recognises this and isn't going to burn down what made him the Phoenix King in the first place.
Anyway, I'd say if anything other kingdoms would be more willing to support Marienberg, after all there's many elves who'd welcome round 2 with the dawi, the cloak of beards still gets picked up frequently for a reason.
- Location
- Oklahoma
It would probably be best to not make any judgement calls as to Finubar's character, either positive or negative, when in character Mathilde had very little basis for it.
There's just not enough information at the moment.
Also it's just not, ah, relevant at all at the moment. High potential for it to be in the future due to the direction of the quest, bit not currently and hopefully by then we'll have some actual basis for a character judgement.
There's just not enough information at the moment.
Also it's just not, ah, relevant at all at the moment. High potential for it to be in the future due to the direction of the quest, bit not currently and hopefully by then we'll have some actual basis for a character judgement.
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- Location
- Canada
[x] [LIBRARY] The Eonir of Laurelorn: Esoteric Dwarven (150 gc), Beastmen: Extensive Imperial, Extensive and Antiquarian Dwarven (300 gc), Waystones and Henges: Esoteric Imperial (150 gc and 4 CF)
On the other hand we are playing Mathilde Weber not Rational Bot #123. Asarnil is a friend and comrade in arms, Finubar is a name in a history book. 'Fuck that guy' seems like an entirely reasonable IC reaction regardless of its ultimate merits.
Doomed Wombat
Let's go Darling!
- Location
- Dancing on wires!
Insubordinate...definitely, though at the very least he seems to have gotten that under control in recent years.
Racist. I don't think so personally. His personality is grating, at times but no more than a usual elf and certainly by the standards of Caeldor he's actually got surprisingly few biases.
Notably Caledor is one of the most anti dwarf places in Ulthuan (Caledor II cloak of beards etc.) and when we went to recruit him I expected that to be a problem, but he's fine doing jobs with dwarfs and so forth as long he gets paid and he charges everyone the same seemingly (a shit ton). At the very least by the standards of the Asur you can call him many things, but racist isn't one of them.