Threads Of Destiny(Eastern Fantasy, Sequel to Forge of Destiny)

Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
[X] Plan Purposeful Design (flexible)
-[X][bonuses] Combat Perception 20, Social Perception 10, Physical Avoid 10
-[X][meridian] 5 head, 1 heart

-[X][techniques] 3C (6TP)
 
Adhoc vote count started by naths on Sep 9, 2020 at 10:45 AM, finished with 134 posts and 62 votes.
 
Head: 8 (3x HDW, 1x RME, 3x MoSS, 1x blank)
If we give HDW 5 Head won't we be unable to equip it? I like 5 Head, PMR will have that same amount at level 5 while MoSS and MSS both have the same number of Head and Heart so we'll be able to switch between social and adventure pretty seamlessly regardless of if we choose compact or not. But will be be allowed to equip HDW or will we have to give up one of the Head based Arts for a turn?
 
If we give HDW 5 Head won't we be unable to equip it? I like 5 Head, PMR will have that same amount at level 5 while MoSS and MSS both have the same number of Head and Heart so we'll be able to switch between social and adventure pretty seamlessly regardless of if we choose compact or not. But will be be allowed to equip HDW or will we have to give up one of the Head based Arts for a turn?
We opened a head meridian this turn, which the front page does not yet reflect (I don't think we've actually done it yet within the turn, but it's in our plan for this turn).
 
[X] Purposeful Design with Bling
-[X][bonuses] Combat Perception 20, Social Perception 10, Physical Avoid 10
-[X][meridian] 5 head, 1 heart
-[X][techniques] CB (6TP)


Recycling weak powered techs into strong powered ones has always been a solid positive in my book. Arts that don't have at least a B ranked technique will grow obsolete soon anyways. If we are modding an art, we ideally want it to last us for a while.
 
Recycling weak powered techs into strong powered ones has always been a solid positive in my book. Arts that don't have at least a B ranked technique will grow obsolete soon anyways. If we are modding an art, we ideally want it to last us for a while.
It becomes obsolete because opponents defeat those techs easily, but HDW techs arent going to be contested, as we know dispelling communication or perception techs is extremely rare and no one dispels a translation, and those techs arent used against someone


Having those higher ranked techs will gain us nothing of import, while greatly increasing the cost
 
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I thought the main thinking regarding C rank is due to its intended use as a Battlefield Communications art which we want to be as cheap as possible to allow us to keep it activated basically anytime we need? B ranks are still fairly expensive qi wise after all, and we wouldnt want to burn much qi for something we want as a peripheral utility art.
B rank is actually cheaper unless you are talking about upkeep, here. A comm tech that's B rank is more likely to be longer lasting (as we have more design points to throw at it) and less likely to be countered. Given B rank tech just costs twice as much as C rank, if we are forced to use the C rank three times in fight not only would we be using more Qi but we'd also be constantly having to lose time doing so.
Few of the possible 3C techniques are likely to be directly contested and can afford to lag behind. We don't know much about the infosec meta but it looks like jamming the comms is an exceptional occurrence, a cheap C upkeep perception technique makes sure that they need to invest actual resources into stealth to avoid our detection, and no one is going to fight a translation tech.
It becomes obsolete because opponents defeat those techs easily, but HDW techs arent going to be contested, as we know dispelling communication or perception techs is extremely rare and no one dispels a translation, and those techs arent used against someone


Having those higher ranked techs will gain us nothing of import, while greatly increasing the cost


We actually do know that they risk being contested, because Ling Qi is already capable of contesting them. Basically any social arts (and even some non social perception arts) have screen techs, and obviously anyone who has stealth can also contest them. Here is what Ling Qi can use to lolnope the C techs we are planning to have:
Breeze in the Vault: C rank
Duration: Short
Calling upon the mastery shown by the girl in slipping unnoticed through the realms of the gods, the user channels the qi of wind to become silent and trackless, passing through perception as no more than a silent breeze. Greatly increases most stealth derivatives while active. In addition the user may outright ignore the effects of formations and techniques of C rank or less (modified by potency) which would detect, impede or record them, without interacting with any conditional requirements that they might have. Active attempts to track or divine the users location remotely suffer a 1 rank penalty before being compared to the users stealth.
Winds of Winter Yearning: C
Duration: Long
This piece is not played aloud for mortal ears, carried on the flows of the users qi, this soft and ephemeral melody is the music of winter winds rattling windows and tugging at roof tiles. No more than pleasant background to the listeners closest, but a song of exclusion to those outside. While active, the user and up to three allies in Immediate range are shielded from outside scrutiny, increasing their effective social defense against viewing arts.
Lighthearted Gossip: B
Duration: Long
It is easy to make the eye and the ear slide away in the face of directionless words. To outside observers the users conversations appear as no more than irrelevant musings and circular nonsense. Affects the user and up to five designated targets within Near range. Opponents must exceed the users Manipulation+Speech derived with social perception in order to penetrate the screen.
Cheerful Muse Accompaniment: B
Duration: Long
Some people can be quite rude, seeking to listen in on things that are not for their ears. Activating this technique, the user shrouds themselves and up to five other willing targets in a shroud of cheerful but inane speech, that at first seems important until eavesdroppers notice subjects and sentences alike circling back to their beginning in an endless loop of noise. Offers defense against social techniques, offering a significant bonus to the users poise when attempting to defend against outside listeners.
Any of those would just renders the upgraded Canto unable to work, and any of the screen techs would make the comm tech unable to work even on allies.
 
B rank is actually cheaper unless you are talking about upkeep, here. A comm tech that's B rank is more likely to be longer lasting (as we have more design points to throw at it) and less likely to be countered. Given B rank tech just costs twice as much as C rank, if we are forced to use the C rank three times in fight not only would we be using more Qi but we'd also be constantly having to lose time doing so.




We actually do know that they risk being contested, because Ling Qi is already capable of contesting them. Basically any social arts (and even some non social perception arts) have screen techs, and obviously anyone who has stealth can also contest them. Here is what Ling Qi can use to lolnope the C techs we are planning to have:




Any of those would just renders the upgraded Canto unable to work, and any of the screen techs would make the comm tech unable to work even on allies.

Mhm, i would say it isnt quite as bad. One thing we need to consider is that there is a difference between social contests (social perception vs poise) and combat contests (combat perception vs stealth)

Breeze in the Vault seems to be a combat contest and I agree that BtV will trump any C rank effect about recording LQ, so if the new Canto has an effect like that, BtV would win against C canto and not against B canto. Combat perception buffs for Ling Qi (such are common in techniques like that) should still apply though. BtV does nothing for social contests as far as i see.

Winds of Winter Yearning seems to be a purely social screen and it is true enough that a B canto would have an easier time with it, but depending on our stats a C canto might still work. Winds of Winter should do nothing for combat contests though and the way I understood it, dedicated social screens like that arent sturdy enough for a combat situation, since they arent meant for one. It should be possible to brute force this thing (would of course be very noticeable at a party, which would be a loss of face, but we dont really care about that in a fight)

Cheerful Muse and Lighthearted Gossip also seem to be purely social. Since these are B techs of art levels at a higher potency than HDW there is a good chance that Canto wont get through either even as a B rank, but yeah B rank canto would still have a better chance than C rank. These screens also do nothing in a fight


I would agree that there are likely combat screens too, but honestly at that point we need to ask ourselves what we want out of this tech. Do we want to become a dedicated Com-specialist? Do we want to do long range coms? My answer to that is no, because to me this is an utility tech that needs only enough range as we need for battles. Anything more is something i would leave to specialists. So if we are in a situation where there is strong enemy com-interdiction then our answer should be to try and gank the enemy interdictor instead of trying to fight through communication techs.

I think it is perfectly fair to want a stronger Canto, since we did use it in the story for both the social and the combat mode and it is true that B rank has a better chance at finding stealthed opponents and getting through screens at parties. We are intending to put a fair bit of work into perception arts and it would be funny if LQ ends up as being really good at perception stuff at the end of that. However, social screens shouldnt be used as an argument for combat situations. And I already mentioned arguments pro 3 C before, so i wont repeat them here.

(As an aside: despite being pro 3C, here is a pro-BC argument: BC lets us discover more of the tech design system, and working out how the system works was one of the purposes of the modding action in the first place)
 
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We actually do know that they risk being contested, because Ling Qi is already capable of contesting them.
Ling QI's "we isolate you from your allies even when you're in the middle of your allies" trick has been used on someone every major battle we've been in, hasn't it?

I'd expect the comms tech to be contested by various standard practices by people who don't even know it's there.
 
Like, seriously. There is no reason to believe 'social screen tech that would not let people hear you talk' suddenly stop working in combat.

If we go CCC, we know that something like this will happen: Ling Qi will be coordinating a team with multiple engagement, and a green ally will meet a green enemy. A minute within the fight, when Ling Qi is coordinating and talking, suddenly Ling qi can't perceive said ally anymore nor talk to them, and we get a vote on "do we rescue, or continue what we are doing".

OTOH, with BC, we'd not have the tech be scrambled, and as such if there is such a vote it would be because we could see our ally is in danger, not "we don't know if they are".
 
Like, seriously. There is no reason to believe 'social screen tech that would not let people hear you talk' suddenly stop working in combat.

If we go CCC, we know that something like this will happen: Ling Qi will be coordinating a team with multiple engagement, and a green ally will meet a green enemy. A minute within the fight, when Ling Qi is coordinating and talking, suddenly Ling qi can't perceive said ally anymore nor talk to them, and we get a vote on "do we rescue, or continue what we are doing".

OTOH, with BC, we'd not have the tech be scrambled, and as such if there is such a vote it would be because we could see our ally is in danger, not "we don't know if they are".
In that scenario they'd have to attack either within the Mist to disrupt our comm's which is already in our death zone and filled with allies.
OR from outside it but the Mist is also a buffer zone agains't attacking from outside and were likely having Six boosting our comm's
In addition to WHR protecting it with the shield charge and Zhengui just redirecting the attack to him if it's spiritual
Cheerful Muse's Accompaniment: C
When Ling Qi activates a non damaging music or wind art, if Sixiang has not already acted that turn, they may activate this technique and enhance one parameter of the art significantly. Valid parameters are Hit, Effect, Duration, or Resist.
Course I'm hoping Utility win's because I'd imagine the clunky translator would have better odd's of success getting slotted as the 3rd tech with the passive's split evenly between Social and Combat perception :V
 
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Like, seriously. There is no reason to believe 'social screen tech that would not let people hear you talk' suddenly stop working in combat.

If we go CCC, we know that something like this will happen: Ling Qi will be coordinating a team with multiple engagement, and a green ally will meet a green enemy. A minute within the fight, when Ling Qi is coordinating and talking, suddenly Ling qi can't perceive said ally anymore nor talk to them, and we get a vote on "do we rescue, or continue what we are doing".

OTOH, with BC, we'd not have the tech be scrambled, and as such if there is such a vote it would be because we could see our ally is in danger, not "we don't know if they are".

We know of four effects that could conceivably act in this way. MSS's screen isn't perfect and thus a C-ranked comms technique would be perfectly capable of contesting it. PMR's screen auto-fails if the speaker wants it to. HDW's screen is easy enough to escape and also requires that they be "allies". Finally our domain's isolation would be just as effective against B-ranked comms as C-ranked and could plausibly contest A-ranked comms. Purely perception based comms might actually be more resilient given how our domain screws with group buffs, though that is purely supposition.

The only time our side's comms have been disrupted has been by a peak Green and even that required a degree of compliance from us. When we were being chased down by an Y'lith'kai army they found it easier to disrupt our higher-realm escape talisman than our comms.

We don't know what the comms meta is like, but it is strongly suggested that infosec is not anyone's focus.

Edit: B-rank perception would be more valuable as stealth appears to be more contested. However a B-rank perception technique, even on upkeep, is expensive enough that we are not able to have it on all the time. Establishing a C-rank baseline for anyone trying to evade our detection is valuable. Ideally we would then have a higher rank technique for actually finding stealthed people we know are there but that's less important given how our offense works.
 
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Like, seriously. There is no reason to believe 'social screen tech that would not let people hear you talk' suddenly stop working in combat.

If we go CCC, we know that something like this will happen: Ling Qi will be coordinating a team with multiple engagement, and a green ally will meet a green enemy. A minute within the fight, when Ling Qi is coordinating and talking, suddenly Ling qi can't perceive said ally anymore nor talk to them, and we get a vote on "do we rescue, or continue what we are doing".

OTOH, with BC, we'd not have the tech be scrambled, and as such if there is such a vote it would be because we could see our ally is in danger, not "we don't know if they are".
you even quoted the screening techs. They all explicitly say that they work against social perception or boost the defense against social perception. They do not block combat perception and the social screens dont stop us seeing the people, that is just not how they work or what they are intended to do. And it is possible to brute force social screens open, we have seen it happen. This is something we can also do, but doing so at a party would be a bit of a gaffe at a party, so Ling Qi just doesnt do it there.

Now if you are talking about *combat* techs that isolate our group members from our communication tech, then i will repeat our previous question: How far do you want to go into the Communication support build? Do you want LQ to become a full on Communication expert? This is a serious question btw, because if you want that then you should say so.
We also have pretty decent Perception stats, so disappearing our allies really isnt as easy as you want to make it sound.
 
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While I am tickled by the idea of a translation technique, ultimately I do not think it is that useful or productive to invest in that area for HDW. As such I will be voting for

[X] Purposeful Design with Bling

The purpose, as I understood it, was to modify HDW to better fit its role as a combat perception mainstay, giving us that juicy radar effect to a heightened degree and range, while, also, investing a bit in some combat communication so that we can better coordinate with allies against our foes. A translation effect may help with the second feature, until we learn the language, but I believe ultimately is not useful in the grand scheme of things.

We know that there are translation talismans, we had one in the Corrupted Caverns after all when spying on the Shishigui, and if we need such tools we should acquire said tools. But I don't think a translation effect on a predominately combat perception focused art is the way we want to go.

Other than the translation effect, I'm not seeing a lot of discussion on what the third tech in the 3C technique plans should be. Regardless, I think a heavily superior radar with longer range and more detail, as well as more difficult to avoid, is what I want from HDW and I think a B ranked tech would really be able to supercharge our current D rank radar.
 
[X] Plan Purposeful Design (SP-oriented)
-[X][bonuses] Combat Perception 18, Social Perception 13 , Physical Avoid 9
-[X][meridian] 5 head, 1 heart

-[X][techniques] 3C (6TP)

29 people have voted​
 
[X] Plan Purposeful Design (flexible)
-[X][bonuses] Combat Perception 20, Social Perception 10, Physical Avoid 10
-[X][meridian] 5 head, 1 heart

-[X][techniques] 3C (6TP)
 
[X] Plan Purposeful Design (flexible)
-[X][bonuses] Combat Perception 20, Social Perception 10, Physical Avoid 10
-[X][meridian] 5 head, 1 heart
-[X][techniques] 3C (6TP)
 
A translation effect may help with the second feature, until we learn the language, but I believe ultimately is not useful in the grand scheme of things.
If we wanted to use HDW as a way to tap into enemy communication networks, it'd be great. And HDW might not be a terrible Art to turn to that purpose, if we don't mind the enemies in question having a very good chance of knowing we're listening in.

But at the moment we're more considering how to maintain our own communications than how to tap into other people's.

And when we're acting as an ambassador, we're almost certainly going to want to run our social suite of Arts, so the translation function would be of questionable utility for our upcoming task.
 
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Journey to the East: Phoenix Home
Phoenix Home stretched out before Gu Xiulan.

Once, before the cataclysm, it had been the summer palace of the Lu. A great sprawling complex built upon an artificial hill, overlooking some of the richest farmland in the province. Now, dunes stretched as far as the eye could see, and only the faint scent of salt in the northern wind hinted that they ever ended.

But they were clean dunes, white and pale pink sand rather than clinging gray ash or blackened corruption. Three great oasis watered the city at the foot of the palace hill, and the canals that lay between spread soft greenery through the reds and whites of the city's structures. Roads spread out from the city's walls like a web, carrying stone and metals out and bringing foodstuffs and organic goods in.

But Gu Xiulan did not have eyes for the city, only the palace above. In the Cataclysm the high nand fluted towers and aerial paths of the Lu had been destroyed, melted really. What had remained was a great multihued mountain of fused glass and metal, a jagged and ugly mound of raw material.

The Gu had done much to alleviate that, in the millenia that they had sheltered here. Glass had been reheated, and metal recast, shaped by a thousands of craftsmen over the centuries into something fit for habitation. Gu Xiulan allowed her eyes to wistfully trace the thin spires of rose pink glass and shining gold.

"A bit fragile innit," commented Zheng Nan said, shading his eyes.

Gu Xiulan's eyebrow twitched.

However handsome he was, the Zheng scion had begun to wear on her nerves during the trip. He was so utterly, unrelentingly crass, and not even in the charming accidental way that Ling Qi managed. Zheng Nan knew his manners. He just chose not to employ them.

"Many enemies have thought so as well," Gu Xiulan sniffed, pulling her head back inside the carriage. They were currently moving slowly, having joined the city's incoming traffic. It would be unbecoming to disrupt the cities lifeblood without an emergency to justify it. "Yet still the Palace of Dawn stands."

"That's just walkers though isn't it? Hardly a thought in those empty skulls," Zheng Nan said idly. "You need some good solid stone and earthwork in a fortress. That's why the hill is good. You featherheads always did like your shiny nests and sparkly bits though."

Gu Xiulan shot him a scowl from behind her golden veil. "We have seen off more than a half dozen incursions from organized forces, headed by long dead generals," she sneered. "You might know that, if you bothered to read, or if the Zheng ventured out of their little play zone to fight real battles."

She had long lost her reticence to insult this irritating man.

"Now that's just mean," Zheng Nan mused. "It's not like we don't want to fight you know? We just won so hard that there's no one left, and our vassals are a bunch of sissies."

Gu Xiulan huffed. Only the Zheng would be disappointed that their vassals held no pretensions of rebellion. As if they had not stamped out dissenters with savage glee in the past. "Barbarian."

"That I am," Zheng Nan said flippantly.

Annoying man, Xiulan thought.

"It's okay, I think your nest is really pretty," Linhuo chirped cheerfully in her head. "It's so warm and nice here! I just want to fly around and dance in the fires!"

At least someone was appreciative, Gu Xiulan thought. She would have to make arrangements for Linhuo to visit the Subterranean Sun's nest. The ancient sun crow's energies were as invaluable to the cultivation of spirits and spirit beasts as they were to powering the Palace's defenses and purifying the surroundings of creeping taint.

They proceeded in silence for a time, approaching the city gates. "Any ideas on how long I'm going to be waiting to meet with your old man?"

"I can't imagine that you will have to wait at all," Gu Xiulan replied. "You bear a message from…" Duke wasn't the right word for the Zheng. "The leaders of Ebon Rivers."

"Nah," Zheng Nan dismissed, waving a meaty hand in dismissal. "S'not right to favor foreigners over family. I'll keep for a bit. How long's your meeting with your old man going to be. Think I have time to grab a bath? Heard you have some real nice mineral springs around here."

She eyed Zheng Nan dubiously. How convenient of him to offer an excuse to hold off his meeting in a way that not offend any sensibilities. After all, it would be rude to force a guest to a meeting immediately if they requested hospitality. That was one reason she found him so very irritating. Zheng Nan was clearly intelligent enough. He simply chose to act the ruffian.

"I am sure something can be arranged. The Palace springs are open to the guests of the Gu," Gu Xiulan replied airily.

"Haha! Very good," Zheng Nan laughed. "Hear that boys! I bet I can score at least one of you a guest invite! Who wants to come get wet with me!"
Gu Xiulan's eyebrow twitched as he catcalled her retinue. She drew the shutter on her carriage window down.

It seemed she was going to be meeting Father sooner than she had anticipated.


***​




The doors of the throne room closed slowly behind her.

The hall was a veritable cavern of steel, gold and glass. Twelve great pyres burned along the walls, and the pale blue fires rose almost to the ceiling twenty meters overhead. A thick carpet of crushed velvet, imported from the Celestial Peaks covered the tiled floor. At the far end of the room was a scalloped stairway, carved from rose glass, and at the top, a burning curtain of white flame concealing Father's throne and guarding him against assault.

Normally this place would throng with courtiers, tradesmen and soldiers, attending to her Father and matters of court. Today, it was empty.

She was alone here, Linhuo had been left to gorge herself and undergo evaluation by the clan's experts in spirit health. There was only the shadow behind the fire, Father's silhouette.

Gu Xiulan held in her trepidation with admirable aplomb, but still, in the back of her mind, she felt some dread. Mother and Yanmei had both disapproved of what she had done. Mother had been angry, and that had hurt. Even if she knew that it was out of concern for her, it had hurt.

Gu Xiulan didn't regret what she had done. She would not be irrelevant. She would not be mediocre. She would not fall behind. She refused that fate. Under the fabric of her gown, Ling Qi's gift was cold against her skin.

But Father had always been distant, not cold precisely, but detached. Yet despite that Mother had said that she had upset him as well. If…

Straightening her shoulders, Gu Xiulan cast out her doubts and moved forward. Her footsteps were near silent on the soft carpet, yet they seemed to echo in the vast, empty hall. She stopped precisely eight paces from the base of the stairs and clasped her hands to bow to the silhouette behind the fire.

"The returning daughter greets her august Father, and presents herself for inspection," Gu Xiulan said crisply, her voice seeming quiet compared to the crackle of the pyres.

Her response was silence. Then, the quieting of the fires. She felt the heat of the curtain recede, and heard the quiet yet purposeful sound of footfalls on glass. Gu Xiulan maintained her posture, even as she prepared her arguments defending her actions.

The footfalls descended the steps, one by one.

"Raise your head," said Father. His voice was that of a commander of men, stern and brusque.

Gu Xiulan took a deep breath and straightened up. Father wore his robes of state. Many thick layers of fabric and silk, patterned off dancing flames. On his brow was a thin circlet of platinum, with a single ruby inset at his brow. It burned with the power of the sun. It held back his dark hair, which fell to his shoulders.

Father's aristocratic features were blank as he observed her, but she could feel the weight of his attention in her channels. Studying and judging. Gu Xiulan prepared herself for reprimand.

She was not prepared when his arms wrapped around her.

For a moment, Gu Xiulan stood stiffly in her Father's gentle embrace, but as he stroked her hair, as he had in only her oldest memories. The tension bled out, she returned the embrace

"My daughter. I am sorry for your suffering," Father's stern voice was soft, and tinged by regret.

"I am not," Gu Xiulan said, any sniffle in her voice muffled by Father's robe. Her arm still burned and ached, but Father was careful not to jostle it. "I-I do not regret it."

"Of course you do not," Father said, and she was startled to hear understanding in his voice. "You are my daughter."

She didn't understand.

"Do you know,Xiulan, why only two of your uncles live and have public lives?" Father asked quietly.

"I had thought them lost on campaign," Gu Xiulan muttered, embarrassment at her position was starting to reassert itself, but she couldn't quite bring herself to let go of him yet.

"Some were," Father said, his voice distant with remembrance. "But Xiulan, the men of the Gu burn bright, but so many of us burn quickly."

"I'm not-" Xiulan began. An old bit of shame, long unspoken entered her voice.

"You are not. Yet you are my daughter all the same. There is more of me in you than there is in your sisters. It is my failure that I did not recognize that," he finally stepped back, unruffled by the embrace. There was a hint of fire and affection in his eyes. "Your sisters take after your Mother, even Yanmei, whose flame burns so coldly. We had agreed that she would raise our daughters in accordance with her ways, and until now I had no reason to think wrongly of that."

Gu Xiulan felt unsteady. But she felt a spark of something in her chest, pride or delight or hope she wasn't sure.

Father's expression was blank once again. "Tomorrow Xiulan, I have cleared time for us in the Cloudflame spire. You will show me what you can do, and after…" He closed his eyes for a moment. "Soon I will embark on the annual perimeter march of our lands. You will attend as well. It is past time that I teach one of my children to campaign."

"Mother always said that sort of thing was not suited to a young lady," Gu Xiulan said slowly, but she didn't object.

"And your Mother and I have already had this argument," Father said, observing her again. "You will continue to do dangerous things, seek trials and challenges to feed the fire in your blood. Am I wrong? Should I forbid it, will you obey?"

Gu Xiulan looked away, unable to meet his piercing eyes. "...No Father."

Yet he seemed satisfied with the admission. "Then, training. Training in war. Training to harness your reckless nature, such that you might only burn yourself when you choose to. If I must treat you as a son to maximize your chances of survival, so be it. I am willing to endure your Mother's wrath for that."

"I-Father," Gu Xiulan stumbled on her words a little. There were a hundred things she could say, but none of them seemed right. Except one.

"Thank you."
 
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