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Slayers are the result of oaths being declared unfulfillable in the literal sense. Such as if we had sworn to protect Abelhelm with our life and he died. While the Chaos Dwarves are currently impossible to get at (information we don't even have in character, btw), they are by no means totally beyond the reach of dwarves for all of time. It'd be a grudge that's damn hard to redress, sure, but there are shitloads of those and dwarves are perfectly content to think in centuries anyway. And I find the idea of trying to hide real slights against the Dwarves to try to save them from themselves to be highly arrogant.
 
[X] Remain silent
[x] Cook with Panoramia and Titus
[x] 'Make sure the ale hasn't gone bad' with Johann
[x] Drinking
[x] Gambling
[x] Put on a magic display (Petty and Lesser only)
[x] Yes to Shenanigans

Ugh, this vote is annoyingly stressful when we should be voting about how Mathilde is going to get smashed.

I'm changing my vote to err if on the side of not having to unsay things you never said in the first place.

Our waifu Titus can wait.
Heresy. :mad:
 
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Edited my vote to silence.

Pages of vitriolic arguments and ad hominem attacks and putting words in peoples' mouths later, I no longer care.

Even skimming this discussion was a miserable experience. Changed my vote so hopefully it can just remain over and done.

I'm sure whatever BoneyM writes will be well written anyway.
 
[X] Remain silent
[x] Cook with Panoramia and Titus
[x] 'Make sure the ale hasn't gone bad' with Johann
[x] Drinking
[x] Gambling
[x] Put on a magic display (Petty and Lesser only)
[x] Yes to Shenanigans

Ugh, this vote is annoyingly stressful when we should be voting about how Mathilde is going to get smashed.

I'm changing my vote to err if on the side of not having to I say things you never said in the first place.


Heresy. :mad:
It would have been better if it was all funny ones instead of having a big one mixed in
 
[X] Join the hunting with Esbern and Seija
[X] Join the hunting with Maximilian

[X] Hold a Ranaldan religious service
[X] Gambling
[X] Play with a giant wolf
 
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Even skimming this discussion was a miserable experience. Changed my vote so hopefully it can just remain over and done.

There's still the What to tell our master and the Grey order vote coming up, and to be honest, I can see the debates repeating themselves all over again between the lying to the Grey Order versus disclosing everything dilemna - and no, if we are still discussing the Liber Mortis in the middle of the EIght Peaks Campaign, I don't think the passage of time would soften discussions on that vote. Thankfully, it won't come out until after the Karak Eight Peak campaign, unless the QM drops a dilemma where the Grey Order is explicitly asking for a report on the Karak Eight Peaks campaign and details about the ritual we disrupted , during the Campaign itself (something tells me this isn't going to happen, given how this second round of discussions have played out).

It does beg a question: is there a way to make the future Report to the Grey Order vote much less combative?
 
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A confirmed GM statement. He just did us the biggest solid ever, and people want to fail at worshiping him right after?

That's not just kind of silly, it's unfair to the god himself.
You know, if you (and others, yours is just the most straight forward 'here's a non-quoted quote', i apologize if this seems like i'm targeting you and you alone or anything like that, as that's not intended) want to use a GM quote you should give the full context or at least include the link:
Ranald is a strange god. Almost all citizens of the Empire worship him when appropriate, the common sign of the crossed fingers being an entreaty to him for good fortune. And yet he is almost as actively suppressed as the Outlawed Gods, such as the elven god of murder, Khaine, or the shipwrecker's god and enemy of Manann, Stromfels. To understand why, you must understand the fourfold nature of Ranald.

Most know Ranald as Ranald the Gamester, God of Gaming, Gambling, and Luck. A prayer to him is a thumb on the scale of chance, tipping the odds in your favour. He is especially venerated by those who make fortunes by chance - gamblers, of course, but also merchants, businessmen and traders. He is worshipped by most citizens in small ways, with crossed fingers, lucky amulets and superstitions all being prayers to the God of Luck. Trade and business guilds are often dedicated to him, and small, hidden shrines to him can be found in most slums and shanties in the towns and cities of the Empire and beyond - except in Marienburg, where a large temple to Ranald stands openly. It is also said that anywhere there is gambling is a shrine to Ranald.

The second most followed aspect of Ranald is that of Ranald the Night Prowler, God of Thieves. Though this aspect is poorly looked upon by most of those in power, the Strictures of Ranald the Night Prowler frown on violence, so cities with a criminal underbelly dominated by Ranald are vastly preferable to those dominated by Khaine. Worship of Ranald is built right into the Thieves Cant, the deliberately confusing argot of the underclasses, and the majority of Ranald's priests began by worshipping this facet of him.

The least-known guise of Ranald is Ranald the Deceiver, God of Irony and Illusion, Charlatans and Tricksters, favoured by spies, liars, con artists, and Grey Wizards. He smiles on attempts to outwit and outfox your enemies, though he smiles just as readily on suitably entertaining failures. To openly admit to worshipping him is to fail at doing so, as no true liar admits to being one, so worship of this guise tends to be more personal and uncodified than even that of Ranald's other followers.

And finally, there is the most thoroughly and enthusiastically suppressed face of Ranald: Ranald the Protector. He is the God of Freedom, of defending the defenceless, assisting the poor, and standing up for the rights of the common man. But when taken to extremes, he is also the God of revolution, equality, and democracy, and as such is a constant danger to the status quo of the Empire. He is worshipped by rabble-rousers, democrats, cells of would-be revolutionaries and groups of brigands that steal from the wealthy to give to the impoverished. These worshippers are much of why the worship of Ranald is outright forbidden in Bretonnia, and viewed with so much suspicion elsewhere.
Relevant bit in red. Admitting to worshiping 'Renald in general' is not failing at worshipping him, openly admitting to worshiping Renald in the guise of Renald the Deceiver is failing at doing so.

Also just in general i have to chime in on the side of 'wow the silence vote is turning me off with their arguments'. I voted for telling them originally because i thought it'd be more interesting, and am a little tired of the general thread (and lets be frank, SV/SB/etc in general) tendency towards "only we can be trusted with anything"; while for mathilde it makes far more sense than in most quests i've seen it in, its just personally not to my taste. I nontheless was open to counter arguments and have been skimming the thread and all its done is make me less inclined to vote for silence.

Also since i haven't really posted much in here, sticking mainly to reading, wanted to remind @BoneyM that this is a great story! I have some quibbles about minor things as i would with literally any work, like worries about power inflation and metagaming, but you've shown that you're on the ball with regards to that and putting way more thought into things than most quests, all while producing great narratives quickly :)
 
There's still the What to tell our master and the Grey order vote coming up, and to be honest, I can see the debates repeating themselves all over again between the lying to the Grey Order versus disclosing everything dilemna. Thankfully, it won't come out until after the campaign, unless the QM drops a dilemma where the Grey Order is explicitly asking for a report on the Karak Eight Peaks campaign and details about the ritual we disrupted.
Oh god, please no.

Maybe we will just write a report on the campaign as a whole. I feel it won't get as bad when there's the whole report to write/vote on. I don't want to hear anything to the contrary, leave my delusions alone.
 
Ugh, this vote is annoyingly stressful when we should be voting about how Mathilde is going to get smashed.
easy. Read Liber Mortis, sneak into Abel's tomb, resurrect him, don't get killed by the witch hunter for necromancy, and bingo bango bongo, more smashin' than Sans

oh you meant smashed as in hammered. Oops.

...why are all the euphemisms for drunk things dwarfs do sober?

Edited my vote to silence.

Pages of vitriolic arguments and ad hominem attacks and putting words in peoples' mouths later, I no longer care.

Even skimming this discussion was a miserable experience. Changed my vote so hopefully it can just remain over and done.

I'm sure whatever BoneyM writes will be well written anyway.
Just do what I do: get weirdly revanchist over neglected votes that nobody cares about, make a blood pact with Omegahugger to save our best boy, and generally lower the already supercritical level of discussion.

;):wink::wink2:
 
There's still the What to tell our master and the Grey order vote coming up, and to be honest, I can see the debates repeating themselves all over again between the lying to the Grey Order versus disclosing everything dilemna. Thankfully, it won't come out until after the campaign, unless the QM drops a dilemma where the Grey Order is explicitly asking for a report on the Karak Eight Peaks campaign and details about the ritual we disrupted.

Ironically: if we don't lie to the dwarves, we will have to lie to the Grey Order so we don't get in trouble and look like idiots for for not lying to the dwarves.

But if we lie to the dwarves then we can tell the truth to the order about how we lied
 
Ironically: if we don't lie to the dwarves, we will have to lie to the Grey Order so we don't get in trouble and look like idiots for for not lying to the dwarves.

But if we lie to the dwarves then we can tell the truth to the order about how we lied
I had to read that a second time to make sense of it.

The non-badass action scenes and sexy love interests parts of being a secret agent suck.
 
Ironically: if we don't lie to the dwarves, we will have to lie to the Grey Order so we don't get in trouble and look like idiots for for not lying to the dwarves.

But if we lie to the dwarves then we can tell the truth to the order about how we lied
okay, please explain why the college would object to the forces of order being more well informed.
 
Just do what I do: get weirdly revanchist over neglected votes that nobody cares about, make a blood pact with Omegahugger to save our best boy, and generally lower the already supercritical level of discussion.

To be fair, I think the quest readership has ballooned up since the QM reactivated the quest. I wasn't around in this quest before it's reactivation, and I'm sure many voters likewise weren't. I imagine that quite a few of the earlier neglected votes would have had much more discussion, had they been put to a vote today.

But if we lie to the dwarves then we can tell the truth to the order about how we lied

Future voting topic:

What should Mathilde share with her Master about her expedition to Karak Eight Peaks?
[q/Joking] Test the power of Ranald's coin against the paranoia of the Grey Order

Algard: So how did you managed to contain the energies released by disrupting the ritual?
Mathilde: (Lying) I grounded the energies of the ritual as hard as I could in the best traditions of the Colleges and Teclis teachings and prayed to the gods for survival.

Edit: Yes, I know of BonnyM's response to the Grey Order vs Ranald's coin. I'd actually likely vote for full disclosure to our Master at a minimum in light of the QM hints that it's a very, very bad idea to test the limits of the coin against the Grey Order.
 
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To be fair, I think the quest readership has ballooned up since the QM reactivated the quest. I wasn't around in this quest before it's reactivation, and I'm sure many voters likewise weren't. I imagine that quite a few of the earlier neglected votes would have had much more discussion, had they been put to a vote today.



Future voting topic:

What should Mathilde share with her Master about her expedition to Karak Eight Peaks?
[Q] Test the power of Ranald's coin against the paranoia of the Grey Order

Algard: So how did you managed to contain the energies released by disrupting the ritual?
Mathilde: (Lying) I grounded the energies of the ritual as hard as I could in the best traditions of the Colleges and Teclis teachings and prayed to the gods for survival.

- A much smaller in scope moratorium: what would happen if Mathilde used Ranald's Coin to lie to the Grey Order? Would they be made suspicious by not being suspicious? This is very much an unstoppable force vs immovable object debate, as the Coin really is that powerful but the Grey Order really is that paranoid, and the topic tends to keep going around in circles. Best to avoid having to find out.
 
[X] Tell Belegar and Kragg.

I'm sorry, but the arguments against disclosure have gotten friggin repulsive. People are constantly hammering the 100% OOC argument that even mentioning Chaos Dwarves will cause Terrible Consequences. Never mind what Mathilde would think. Maybe she honestly wants Kragg's insight into whatever actually happened, maybe she feels obligated to repay the frankly amazing levels of trust King Belegar has extended to us. Maybe, instead of flying off the handle and going crazy, Belegar and Kragg's reaction would be to nod solemnly, tell the important information about the Chaos Dwarf's capabilities to some few who should know, and then continue on with their lives doing important things over on this half of the planet? Mainly, though, I'm voting this way because I can't stand the tone of the argument people have fallen to. Stop hitting people over the head with your OOC hammer of apocalyptic consequences. The vote is supposed to be what the character decides to do, not some optimal decision based on overinflated conjectures and fearmongering. At this point, if the "Remain silent" vote wins, it might be in-character because Mathilde was simply too scared to say anything.

[X] Gambling
[X] Hold a Ranaldan religious service

...also, I don't know why playing with a giant wolf has been so popular all day long. I think some people might think it's necessary to hang out with our Wolf? *shrug*

Edit:
[X] Telling war stories
 
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[X] Tell Belegar and Kragg.

I'm sorry, but the arguments against disclosure have gotten friggin repulsive. People are constantly hammering the 100% OOC argument that even mentioning Chaos Dwarves will cause Terrible Consequences. Never mind what Mathilde would think. Maybe she honestly wants Kragg's insight into whatever actually happened, maybe she feels obligated to repay the frankly amazing levels of trust King Belegar has extended to us. Maybe, instead of flying off the handle and going crazy, Belegar and Kragg's reaction would be to nod solemnly, tell the important information about the Chaos Dwarf's capabilities to some few who should know, and then continue on with their lives doing important things over on this half of the planet? Mainly, though, I'm voting this way because I can't stand the tone of the argument people have fallen to. Stop hitting people over the head with your OOC hammer of apocalyptic consequences. The vote is supposed to be what the character decides to do, not some optimal decision based on overinflated conjectures and fearmongering. At this point, if the "Remain silent" vote wins, it might be in-character because Mathilde was simply too scared to say anything.

[X] Gambling
[X] Hold a Ranaldan religious service

...also, I don't know why playing with a giant wolf has been so popular all day long. I think some people might think it's necessary to hang out with our Wolf? *shrug*
Mate, this is not 100% OOC. Dwarves created Black Orcs. We don't know the details, just that they did. That's a big issue. And it comes with a side order of possession and control by a Greenskin god.
 
"My archers," Codrin begins immediately, "will atone for their showing today."

Ulthar frowns. "Can't expect manlings to take it in stride when heaven and earth take a side on the battlefield."

"They are Stirlanders," Codrin responds. "Their ancestors kept their heads when the hungry dead snapped at their heels and the wind itself tried to tear the soul from their bodies. They will atone." None of these Dwarves are from Zhufbar or Karak Kadrin, so none have had to face the terrors of Sylvania, but they understand the sentiment and a series of understanding nods meet Codrin's words. "More happily, the other forces under my command have done themselves and this Expedition proud. We received the greenskin charge without a single step back, and bloodied them for the attempt." Pride is clear in his voice, and you wonder at what long-term effects there could be of the Runic bolstering he had unknowingly experienced.
Codrin is probably the scariest guy in the expedition. If he hadn't come out and said he was trying to kill as many adventurers as possible I'd never have suspected him of being anything but a good commander who wants the best for all his men.
 
okay, please explain why the college would object to the forces of order being more well informed.
... because they are the Grey Order? The guys who mind wipe their non magical agents as policy, locked the memory's of Skaven until it's relevant, have some many skeletons in the closet that even they don't know how big it is, and how we fondly remembered about how our own master regularly gaslight us as a pranks and training.

The company policy is : We don't say shit, and when we do it's probably bullshit.
 
Mate, this is not 100% OOC. Dwarves created Black Orcs. We don't know the details, just that they did. That's a big issue. And it comes with a side order of possession and control by a Greenskin god.

And you think the Dwarves wouldn't want to know that one of their enemies is capable of doing something as drastic and dangerous and creating Black Orcs? I don't see this as the memetic mindkiller people have made it out to be. I think it's important strategic-level information. Like, what's the IC explanation here? Evil Dwarves exist and did something with world-wide implications, therefore it shouldn't be talked about because it'd make our allies upset? :???: That's a bit of a leap, yeah?
 
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