Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
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[X] Plan Reasonable
[X] [Execution] Surprised and curious. While you had raised the issue of embezzlement and divided loyalties, the Count had also noted and accepted both. You want to know what did he actually do to cross the line, from the implications, he had sabotaged the army in some way for an outside party. Both for your own interests and for national interests, you want to know what the Count found.
 
There is investigating and penetrating.
One is gathering up the rumors from the surrounding area, observing the magic from a distance and checking for recent movements to and from.
Refusing to do this is either cowardice(which anyone paying attention would know we don't suffer from it when we opted to shank undead with a weapon our size) or else being under their thrall. We're a local, peasant origin. Everyone knows the locals liked their vampire counts.
Or the more likely reason is it would be insane to send a journeyman level wizard against a powerful necromancer and not expect them to get caught and slaughtered

We don't even have a spell for sneaking yet for Ranalds sake
 
It's not refusing to do so unless he orders to do so and we say no
WoG, the Count can and will write in options which we don't take that he can see needs to be taken. It will cost us a lot of relations
we have limited slots of missions to plan and propose, and we can't really afford to waste some slots on an impractical suicide mission that won't really get us anything.

How would that even give us anything of value?
*Facepalm*
That's like 90% of actual spy work?

-You find out if the recent local villages have seen anything odd lately.
--Powerful or large numbers of undead will be linked to disappearances and sightings.

-You find out if anyone has been traveling to and from lately
--This lets you find out which locals are in league with the necromancers, which lets you locate and subvert/remove their agents OUTSIDE the castle. Necromancers still have to deal with information transfer issues, they can't do everything by scrying.

-You do an assessment of the ambient magic.
--Powerful workings of magic are visible to us as a wizard...which means the above mentioned scrying, necromantic workings, etc can be detected and mapped to see what they are doing in the neighborhood.

Like, a suicide mission is only on the books if you think Count Van Hel is an idiot.
 
WoG, the Count can and will write in options which we don't take that he can see needs to be taken. It will cost us a lot of relations
So, did you literally not read any of the posts where I replied to you before?
We have to address it, but we can address via the report instead of via suggesting a mission where we go in along to spy/assassinate an older vampire-necromancer.
It's not refusing to do so unless he orders to do so and we say no
Note that order us would be the write in. aka explicitly addressing it.
---
*Facepalm*
That's like 90% of actual spy work?
No, it isn't. Definitely not any of the spywork we have done so far.
-You find out if the recent local villages have seen anything odd lately.
--Powerful or large numbers of undead will be linked to disappearances and sightings.
No, they won't be. The undead are in sylvania, not outside of it. So skirting the villages near the border tells us nothing. also the peasants will not give us exact quantities of undead either. Also, provides no new information, we already know there is a powerful necromancer vampire in drakenhof... so this gives us 0 new information
-You find out if anyone has been traveling to and from lately
--This lets you find out which locals are in league with the necromancers, which lets you locate and subvert/remove their agents OUTSIDE the castle. Necromancers still have to deal with information transfer issues, they can't do everything by scrying.
No, it doesn't. You need to follow actual leads instead of randomly talking to random peasants across an entire freaking border for such a thing. This is not like the book theft where there were only 3 possible exists that keep logs. This is you wanting to sniff in the villages over an entire border and hope they could tell us "oh yea, a vampire passed by X days ago". even if they could, it won't lead to anything. so what if a vampire passed by?
-You do an assessment of the ambient magic.
--Powerful workings of magic are visible to us as a wizard...which means the above mentioned scrying, necromantic workings, etc can be detected and mapped to see what they are doing in the neighborhood.
No, it doesn't. Your plan was literally to look from the outside of the border inwards. Our detection range is not that long. even if it was, it won't tell us anything that we don't already know. Not to mention sylvania is so steeped in necromancy that the undead are always rising anyways. so it would be even harder to detect anything meaningful.
Even if we happen to come across a ritual being performed... we can't do anything to stop it. since we can't solo a group of vampire necromancers. This requires the army, who can benefit from our magical sight directing them towards hotspots. Rather than sending us in alone
 
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The list of potential orders to suggest will not all be created equal. Some will be better uses of your time than others, some will be more dangerous than others, some will be more urgent than others. And because of limited information, often you will not know which will be which.

But while there will be better and worse options, there won't be trap options.

If you suggest investigating Drakenhof and the Count chooses to give that as the order, it won't mean you're forced to knock on the front doors of the castle and ask whoever answers if they've heard the good word about Sigmar. The question to consider is: is it likely that I would be able to gather useful information. And: would the information I could gather be more valuable than other actions I could be doing. And even: would the Count expect me to suggest this.

But you don't have to ask: is this the booby-trapped option that will cause the QM to cackle and pull the lever marked 'inevitable death'.
Adhoc vote count started by BoneyM on Jan 25, 2018 at 9:36 PM, finished with 151 posts and 32 votes.

  • [X] Plan Reasonable
    -[X] Report: Stick to the facts. We very discreetly acquired Petr and Maksim von Stolpe, using the Count's authority to borrow troops. We looked at the burst of magic flooding into the mound, and reasoned our way to it coming from Drakenhof. We are starting to build a network of contacts now that we don't need to focus on tracking down the ledger.
    -[X] One-on-one report: We've bought a shack for carrying out the kind of business that is impractical to carry out in the Elector Count's castle. If you need to get hold of us while we're there, send a messenger to this innkeeper, one of our nearby agents. We'd advise the Count not to show up personally as it would be likely to draw attention.
    -[X] Possible orders:
    --[X] The disappearance of yourpredecessor is very concerning, especially since he's actively trying to sabotage the hunt for him. He must be found, and I've got a lead: Julbach.
    --[X] The Stirlandian League is a cancer eating at Stirland's economy, and it can be destroyed now that we have the ledgers.
    ---[X] ...but you could also leave it in place so we can take it over from Wilhelm von Tarshof once we track him down.
    --[X] I've got the budget for a proper network of informants, now it just needs building.
    --[X] Variant Writein: Drakenhof. This must be investigated... at a distance. Let me do research and make inquiries among the Grey Order and in other high places.
    [X] [Options] Plan Sanity
    -[X] The disappearance of your predecessor is very concerning, especially since he's actively trying to sabotage the hunt for him. He must be found, and I've got a lead: Julbach.
    -[X] The Stirlandian League is a gold mine of information, and it must be yours.
    -[X] The castle staff can be a great source of information and first line of defence - they should report to you.
    [X] [Execution] The Professor's actions were foolish in the extreme. He learnt nothing from being caught once, didn't appreciate his luck in being sent to a higher position still, and thought he could keep his presumably outrageous embezzling while working for a retired Witch Hunter. One should know the difference between acceptable, frowned upon and forbidden. And one should also have more good sense than a suicidal horse. He had it coming.
    [X] [Execution] Surprised and curious. While you had raised the issue of embezzlement and divided loyalties, the Count had also noted and accepted both. You want to know what did he actually do to cross the line, from the implications, he had sabotaged the army in some way for an outside party. Both for your own interests and for national interests, you want to know what the Count found.
    [X] Execution: While the Professor got what was coming to him, both for his crime and his stupidity, Mathilde is surprised by the casual manner in which van Hal carried it out. She'd expected a trial, or at least some kind of official statement before a formal execution, not just shooting him during the reports.
    [X] [Execution] The stupid son of a .... Really? He barely escapes with his head attached once, and decides to try it again, right under the noses of a Witch Hunter, the Emperor's own spymaster and, hell, me? I'll probably feel bad later, but right now the level of stupid in evidence has me practically apoplectic.
    [X] [Execution] [Shaken] The Professor's actions might have been foolish, but surely there must have been another way than a summary execution? Was I so mistaken in hoping that he'd learned his lesson the first time around? I did the right thing by informing Van Hal, but he is dead because of it...
    [X] The disappearance of your predecessor is very concerning, especially since he's actively trying to sabotage the hunt for him. He must be found, and I've got a lead: Julbach.
    [X] [Options] Plan Sanity
    [X] There is a risk of enemy agents infiltrating the castle staff - they must be watched.
    [X] Seriously what is up with the East Wing.
    [X] The Stirlandian League is a cancer eating at Stirland's economy, and it must be destroyed.
    [X] Drakenhof. You almost hesitate to suggest it, but... surely this must be investigated.
    [x] react to the count intterogation results ?
    [x] I need a proper information network. Please fund me wandering around making friends.
    [x] The castle staff can be a great source of information and first line of defence - they should report to you.
    [X] The Stirlandian League is a gold mine of information, and it must be yours.
    [x] So, Drakenfang... You'll ask around if someone knows what's up with that. Your Order may share something, as well as your teacher, and you can even inquire the imperial intelligence.
    [X] [Execution] While the Professor got what was coming to him, both for his crime and his stupidity, Mathilde is surprised by the casual manner in which van Hal carried it out. She'd expected a trial, or at least some kind of official statement before a formal execution, not just shooting him during the reports.
    [X] Execution: While the Professor got what was coming to him, both for his crime and his stupidity, Mathilde is surprised by the casual manner in which van Hal carried it out. She'd expected a trial, or at least some kind of official statement before a formal execution, not just shooting him during the report
    [X] Plan Reasonable
    -[X] ...with a slightly shaken partial confession? "Someone pulled strings to assign a fresh journeyman wizard here, and until now I'd thought it was either Imperial Intelligence/the Emperor or the Grey Tower. They've just asked for a report on Anton for now- possibly as he was the only holdover- but the chance is good they'll ask for more. I truely want to help my home, my people, the commoners of Stirland, and you seem to want the same thing. End the Vampire threat. Build up the province.
    [X] [Execution] The stupid son of a .... Really? He barely escapes with his head attached once, and decides to try it again, right under the noses of a Witch Hunter, the Emperor's own spymaster and, hell, me? I'll probably feel bad later, but right now the level of stupid inevidence has me practically apoplectic. ...At least I can try to focus on my indignation, not my nausea that I got him killed.
 
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If you suggest investigating Drakenhof and the Count chooses to give that as the order, it won't mean you're forced to knock on the front doors of the castle and ask whoever answers if they've heard the good word about Sigmar. The question to consider is: is it likely that I would be able to gather useful information. And: would the information I could gather be more valuable than other actions I could be doing. And even: would the Count expect me to suggest this.
To expand on which... skirting the outskirts of sylvania is too far away from the center of power to give any meaningful new information. (we already know there is a vampire necromancer with vampire minions trying to acquire power here via subterfuge). and going to the castle itself is beyond us.

We need actual leads to investigate here. And we have a lead, namely a captured noble that our boss will be roughing up for info about his vampire connections. Maybe he would be able to name some other nobles who work with the vampires for us to investigate?

... that being said. I get the feeling van hal would probably want it to be mentioned as an option. But we would have to hunt for leads?... which brings us back to our predecessor... I suspect him, a lot, based on the seeming relation he had to the death of van hal's predecessors. so maybe mention in the report that we suspect he might be a lead on the vampires?
 
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Are you sure this quest isn't titled "i can't believe such a bargain spy exists in this den of snakes and insanity!" or "I can't believe my school tuition is eating up all of my legitimate income!" :p

Excellent quest btw.
 
Maybe he's doing service to the von Carsteins in return for eternal unlife. Power hungry bastard like that, I wouldn't put it past him to skirt damnation just to get more.
 
I recalled that QM mentioned at the start that how we present the choices matters.
We can't just not present important choices, but we can phrase them in certain ways to lead the players of our lord liege to vote a certain way.

I started with plan reasonable, added in some of my conjectures on there being a vampire plot. And then phrased things a certain way... could the previous spymaster be related to the plot? Can we investigate the vampire infiltration on our side of the border by investigating the local nobility for potential leads? (and whatever other ideas we come up with if he goes for this). Actually thinking about it. finding, catching, and killing the vampires on our side of the border is probably good idea.

I also removed the part about telling him about our hidey hole.... he doesn't actually need to know such specifics. And having him send us messengers there is a bad idea as it reveals the location to others who are watching. As for him contacting us when we are out of the castle... we check in regularly exactly for that purpose. Also, while we claim she is merely "nearby contact". Our shrine is literally under her inn

[X] Plan Conjectures
-[X] Report: Stick to the facts. We very discreetly acquired Petr and Maksim von Stolpe, using the Count's authority to borrow troops. We looked at the burst of magic flooding into the mound, and calculated that it came from Drakenhof.
-[X] Share some conjectures: The fact that the books were stolen at night by human shaped things that actually managed to traumatize horses by being nearby. As well as the powerful necromancer in drakenhof who put the alarm trap and then raised the dead in the mound suggests that the books were actually stolen by vampires, and that there is a pretty powerful necromancer among the vampires. The fact the books were kept rather than destroyed suggests they intended to use them, probably after installing their own patsy as a stirland elector count. The series of unfortunate deaths of Van Hal's predecessors and the connection between them and the noble we captured is further cementing the idea that we have a vampire making moves on stirland via subterfuge instead of an overt and open invasion. We should probably take steps against assassination attempts by vampires, and hopefully whatever info our guest at the dungeon provide will be a useful lead in the investigation.
-[X] Possible orders:
--[X] The disappearance of your predecessor is very concerning, especially since he's actively trying to sabotage the hunt for him. He must be found, and I've got a lead: Julbach.
---[x] Capture of predecessor can lead to taking over the Stirlandian league for purpose of spying
---[x] Could he be related to the vampire plots? if so then finding him is a priority.
--[X] The Stirlandian League is a cancer eating at Stirland's economy, and it can be destroyed now that we have the ledgers.
---[x] The former spymaster has been acting against us. He probably still controls his spies in the league. Destroying it now would deprive of him of valuable resources, but may also destroy possible leads on his location
--[X] I've got the budget for a proper network of informants, now it just needs building.
--[X] Variant Writein: Drakenhof. This vampire plot to subtly take over stirland is concerning. We know there are vampires in sylvania, but who and where? And what exactly have they done in stirland so far? I could try to examine other stirland nobles for possible vampire connections, although this seems a bit of a shot in the dark. Alternatively, follow up any leads acquired from the interrogation of Stolpe.

[X] [Execution] Surprised and curious. While you had raised the issue of embezzlement and divided loyalties, the Count had also noted and accepted both. You want to know what did he actually do to cross the line, from the implications, he had sabotaged the army in some way for an outside party. Both for your own interests and for national interests, you want to know what the Count found.
 
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[X] mrttao

Perfect

Are you sure this quest isn't titled "i can't believe such a bargain spy exists in this den of snakes and insanity!" or "I can't believe my school tuition is eating up all of my legitimate income!" :p

Excellent quest btw.
Well...it seems everyone we've dealt with on a personal basis so far likes us thanks to Ranald:
-Anton - Thinks of us as his little sister. Oh dear.

-Abelhelm - Suspicious(of course), but he's reasonably convinced we mean no ill, and thats high praise for a wizard by a Witch Hunter. That we joined him in stabbing evil helps cement that. And I suspect he might have a higher Intrigue than we do. :V

-Wilhelmina - Weirdo, friendly,weirdo, but the weirdo that got her ledgers for her.

-Kasmir - Very useful for running into horrible gribblies, stabbing horrible gribblies in the right proper way instead of just using magic, and generally sort of decent for a witch. But still a witch.

-Marcus - "Tiny, but fierce!"
 
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[x] mrttao
i agree with @veekie thats a really well put together vote. Let's hope people see it and change to it...
 
Pretty sure we don't actually know that the books were stolen by vampires. The loaders could've "just" been zombies - it was dark, they never talked, and the cart driver was busy trying to calm his horse. Given that it's Stirland, there's a good chance it's vampires, but if Total Warhammer (and my memory) is to be believed, a powerful human necromancer moved into Castle Drakenhof while all the Von Carsteins were... indisposed.
 
Pretty sure we don't actually know that the books were stolen by vampires. The loaders could've "just" been zombies - it was dark, they never talked, and the cart driver was busy trying to calm his horse. Given that it's Stirland, there's a good chance it's vampires, but if Total Warhammer (and my memory) is to be believed, a powerful human necromancer moved into Castle Drakenhof while all the Von Carsteins were... indisposed.
Zombies are useless for moving ledgers like that. It may be brute labor, but it does require some finesse because hauling cartloads of books and paper without ruining them requires a little more finesse and initiative than zombies offer, even with a commanding necromancer on hand.

That said, any undead with intelligence can theoretically be used.
But low level vampires are the most likely to get away with it clean. Especially if they insisted on working at night.
 
Switching to

[X] Plan Conjectures

[X] [Execution] Surprised and curious. While you had raised the issue of embezzlement and divided loyalties, the Count had also noted and accepted both. You want to know what did he actually do to cross the line, from the implications, he had sabotaged the army in some way for an outside party. Both for your own interests and for national interests, you want to know what the Count found.

And giving up on the unpopular 'confession is good for the integrity of the cerebellum' angle. For now. But we should spend some time on that...

Vampire or human Necromancers, neither are something the boss wants to have around.
 
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Pretty sure we don't actually know that the books were stolen by vampires. The loaders could've "just" been zombies - it was dark, they never talked, and the cart driver was busy trying to calm his horse. Given that it's Stirland, there's a good chance it's vampires, but if Total Warhammer (and my memory) is to be believed, a powerful human necromancer moved into Castle Drakenhof while all the Von Carsteins were... indisposed.
thank you for that insight. I want to joke that this is why I called it "conjecture", but I really didn't consider the possibility that they were zombies.

Would zombies be coordinated enough to load up a cart with books? I am not too sure about this bit of WHF lore. I thought not...

If so then we are looking at a single necromancer, maybe human or maybe vampire, with a group of zombies?
 
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Pretty sure we don't actually know that the books were stolen by vampires. The loaders could've "just" been zombies - it was dark, they never talked, and the cart driver was busy trying to calm his horse. Given that it's Stirland, there's a good chance it's vampires, but if Total Warhammer (and my memory) is to be believed, a powerful human necromancer moved into Castle Drakenhof while all the Von Carsteins were... indisposed.
Zombies are useless for moving ledgers like that. It may be brute labor, but it does require some finesse because hauling cartloads of books and paper without ruining them requires a little more finesse and initiative than zombies offer, even with a commanding necromancer on hand.

That said, any undead with intelligence can theoretically be used.
But low level vampires are the most likely to get away with it clean. Especially if they insisted on working at night.
 
[X] Plan Conjectures
[X] [Execution] Surprised and curious. While you had raised the issue of embezzlement and divided loyalties, the Count had also noted and accepted both. You want to know what did he actually do to cross the line, from the implications, he had sabotaged the army in some way for an outside party. Both for your own interests and for national interests, you want to know what the Count found.

Voting blind. :V
 
[X] Plan Conjectures
[X] [Execution] Surprised and curious. While you had raised the issue of embezzlement and divided loyalties, the Count had also noted and accepted both. You want to know what did he actually do to cross the line, from the implications, he had sabotaged the army in some way for an outside party. Both for your own interests and for national interests, you want to know what the Count found.
 
[X] Plan Conjectures

Oh yeah there's a bunch of human necromancers around- Lothar von Diehl, Heinrich Kemmler, Dieter Helsnicht, even the phantom of Vanhal returned as the outside chance. Still a necromancer's ability to do subtle beyond of the utility of shoving Dhar, aka condensed evil, into things is... limited (looking at you "Doomlord Helsnicht"). If the masters of Drakenhof returned is the worst possibility then we should prepare for it, and if it turns out to be a slightly-less-dangerous bone crazy madman, then hey bonus.
 
thank you for that insight. I want to joke that this is why I called it "conjecture", but I really didn't consider the possibility that they were zombies.

Would zombies be coordinated enough to load up a cart with books? I am not too sure about this bit of WHF lore. I thought not...

If so then we are looking at a single necromancer, maybe human or maybe vampire, with a group of zombies?
Zombies are useless for moving ledgers like that. It may be brute labor, but it does require some finesse because hauling cartloads of books and paper without ruining them requires a little more finesse and initiative than zombies offer, even with a commanding necromancer on hand.

That said, any undead with intelligence can theoretically be used.
But low level vampires are the most likely to get away with it clean. Especially if they insisted on working at night.
I always misjudge how competent zombies are in fiction, they're so varied. Speaking of, we should really think about taking that "study the undead" option - it's becoming relevant rather quickly.
 
I always misjudge how competent zombies are in fiction, they're so varied. Speaking of, we should really think about taking that "study the undead" option - it's becoming relevant rather quickly.
Not to be a spoilsport, but it feels being a witch who studies undead around a Witch Hunter might maybe not be the best idea?:p (This is a joke)

[X] Plan Conjectures
[X] [Execution] Surprised and curious. While you had raised the issue of embezzlement and divided loyalties, the Count had also noted and accepted both. You want to know what did he actually do to cross the line, from the implications, he had sabotaged the army in some way for an outside party. Both for your own interests and for national interests, you want to know what the Count found.
 
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