I mean on the one hand yeah it is probably not likely, on the other Slaan can die to daemons and daemons can die to LM is the latter is lucky. Magic is not a predictable thing.
Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest
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I mean on the one hand yeah it is probably not likely, on the other Slaan can die to daemons and daemons can die to LM is the latter is lucky. Magic is not a predictable thing.
K von Carstein
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If there's enough daemons, they can kill anyone. It takes probably way less to kill a LM than a Slaan. And the incoherences of the lore strike again😏
There's a also the 'we need to get lucky once, you need to get lucky every time' factor. Even if a slann is likely to win the fight against a greater daemon ninety nine percent of the time, even if they win the daemon is only banished, and can come back to have another go in a century or two. Over the centuries, that can add up to a fair but of attrition,
Well yeah, but even so and if the chances of a LM against the daemon are just as bad, roll a 1d1000, on a roll of 1000 the LM kills a Slann, it is just improbable not impossible is what I am saying.
Yes and no, there could be a weight class issue, that you can punch up one class at very low probability, but you can't punch up two.
I'm not sure whether that's in theme for Warhammer or not. On the one hand, a gritty setting you can usually always get unlucky and die, that you're never safe. On the other, there are also apparently some very, very long lived people out there that haven't lived safe lives, so you'd think they'd have got unlucky be now.
On the other hand, those same people may have things like literal divine backing or precognition meaning that the one in a thousand white room chance never comes up.
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I mean, memes aside, that's not how actual interactions work even in real life, much less with the winds of magic - magic puissance is under no obligation to follow the transitive property.
Sure, but channeling the raw stuff of Chaos is not something we do In real life.
This on the other hand yeah I have to agree with. There has to be some reason all those Slann are not dead already.
K von Carstein
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True. Those Slaans fought in the first demonic invasion, survived it, and then lived for another 5000 years. The luck necessary to vanquish them is probably too low for anyone till now.
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I do not think a cultist, no matter how bad, can tank relationships, the Empire is quick to disavow those and the Dawi are not unaware of their existence, heck, they have their own even if its much rarer and causes them much shame each time.
He could, however, cause a honour chain reaction of slayers and make the Dawi somewhat more suspicious and untrusting of either umgi as a whole, or mages.
Edit: and no, Malekith doesn't count, because unlike the Empire, the elgi didn't disavow him. After 2 diplomatic overeaches. Where the Empire would be the one sending the diplomats if a wizard turned cultist. My point admitedly assumes that whoever is in charge of empire diplomacy is either smarter or humbler than Caledor 2 (not a big hurdle, but still, Dieter IV was real), but at that point, a cultist is not the main reason for the tanking of the relationships, just the igniting spark.
Second Edit: Also, above I am talking based solely on abstract hypotheticals, if we were to talk solely about the Horstman diplomacy tanking scenario, well, we know who is responsible for the current Empire diplo, and we know he is competent.
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Also you can say many things about the Witch King but he is not a cultist nor ally to Chaos, though he might have been their tool for a time. It was with very careful hands that the Dark Gods handled him.
The Cytharai are pretty much the poster gods for evil but not chaotic.
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This has always seemed super arbitrary to me. What keeps them from being chaotic? Like, the aesthetics and day-to-day routines seem pretty much indistinguishable from Slaaneshi/Tzenschi cultists, and the goals of the dark elves definitely advance the goals of chaos...
Add that to the ridiculous, cartoonish levels of evil- they get a lot of the skaven treatment, where realistic constraints on logistics and population reproduction needs get hand-waved away so we can get images of sorceresses bathing in blood.
And it's like, I get that GW probably started out with just the chaos gods, and built them up to be the really big, really bads of the setting. But then they decided they wanted a bunch of other flavors of evil so we get, despite the in-lore absolute dominance of the chaos gods, at least three other flavors of evil that are anti-chaos somehow.
Given the known 'unreliable narrator' issues, occam's razor says that Skaven, Orcs, and Dark Elves are tzensichi, Khonrnite, and Slaanishi respectively. They are strongly associated with the same emotions/aesthetic, and there's no particular reason they *don't* worship chaos- at least, that I can see.
And it bugs me that despite the cartoonish levels of evil, the non-association of Malakith with chaos is somehow used as an excuse to 'redeem' him in the end times. Which I hate, and am grateful that it will never be DL canon.
K von Carstein
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The Cytharai is evil because it's constituted of gods of violence, murder and cruelty, but it doesn't want the end of the world. It wants elves to worship and sacrifice to them, but it has a very pressing interest in keeping the word alive. After all, they are dependent on the beliefs of their worshippers, who exist only in one world.
Chaos on the other hand wishes to consume the world and everyone in it. It isn't fuelled only by worship but also by the emotions of all mortals, possibly from several universes.
Yeah, that was stupid. Malekith is irredeemable, end even wanting to save the world he lives in doesn't erase the millennia of atrocities and the millions of victims he and the Druchii inflicted on the world.
Seriously, I doubt there is one elf in Ulthuan who didn't lost someone to the Dark Elves, or knows someone who did. There's no hope of reconciliation and no way for them to work together like in ET.
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Well I just realised that like some kind of uncivically minded cad, I haven't voted yet! Shocking! Disgraceful! Where's my community spirit?
[X] Plan Redshirt v4 with Gyro
Ah, that's better.
[X] Plan Redshirt v4 with Gyro
Ah, that's better.
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I guess the part I don't get is how they remain unique and independent despite directly competing for portfolios with the chaos gods? Like, why haven't the chaos gods eaten the Cyrathari yet, the way Ulric did to the old wolf-god and Stromfells was trying to do to Manhavok?
Either Khaine runs and hides more than Ranald, or the chaos gods don't attack them for some reason, or we are just supposed to ignore the issue and pretend that the chaos gods only fight against the good factions.
K von Carstein
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I don't know. Maybe the not-Chaotic gods as a whole (evil and good) are too powerful to easily consume? Maybe Chaos wants to play with its food before eating? Or Tzeench is distracting the other Three for one of his plot?
The Phoenixian
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Perhaps part of what separates the gods from Chaos Gods is the very idea that they're separate.
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Chaos gods fight against all factions, including chaos.
That they have not eaten every other god that exists vaguely in similar metaphysical role as they do indicates that they can't just nom gods at will.
I'd guess the non chaos gods are atleast somewhat anchored into the world in a way that chaos gods are not, and that gives them a level of protection against chaos gods?
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I suspect that "eating" other gods is really hard, and the bigger the god the harder it is.
Honestly Khaine feels like he's halfway through getting digested by Khorne. He's the god of hatred and murder - no chaos god there. Only, he's also the god of warfare, despite there being another god of warfare in the same pantheon? Bit of a stretch, but sure. And he drives his followers into berserker rages...
Khaine is specifically the Elvish god of murder. His portfolio is far more focused than that of Khorne's, and as no elves pay homage to Khorne, has a safe supply of unsullied veneration to draw on. The warp being the warp, as long as the Asur and especially the Drucchi acknowledge Khaine in story and worship, he will persist. Also his sword is literally stabbed into the planet.
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deathofrats0808
Don’t think of it as dying; just as leaving early
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The only Elven God of War is Khaine.
He's also the god of blood, war, cruelty, destruction, and violence.
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Hence some elves went out shopping for a new god of war.
Which leads us directly (read: convolutedly) to where we are now.
I guess the important distinction here is that with Khorne, it is simply violence for violence's sake, whereas with Khaine, there is a healthy dose of sadism and personal hate to it.
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Chaos gods do not rely on worship as far as i'm aware.
They like to get it, but it's not necessary for them the same way it seems to be to the other gods.
And intentionally setting up "totally not chaos" gods seems like a bad idea because they would be easy for chaos cults to subvert.
And that's before we ignore the whole "trying to create a god out of nothing" is probably not something people in setting would think of doing.
They like to get it, but it's not necessary for them the same way it seems to be to the other gods.
And intentionally setting up "totally not chaos" gods seems like a bad idea because they would be easy for chaos cults to subvert.
And that's before we ignore the whole "trying to create a god out of nothing" is probably not something people in setting would think of doing.