Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest
- Thread starter Boney
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- warhammer warhammer fantasy fantasy be gay do crimes (gay) female protagonist pansexual protagonist ck2 quest divided loyalties mountain vietnam ranald is real this is a dwarf quest (dwarfs) this is maybe an elf quest this is not a vampire quest this is not an empire quest try it and find out open voting
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Added, thanks.
Ok, going to be a while before I get to sit down and write a turn plan, but until then:
@Boney, can we ask some specific questions about the information in the books we bought? More specifically:
On minor Gods:
-Is there any information about Halétha?
-Any information at all about Haleth? Is she even quest-canonical?
-Are the any Goddesses with V's or chevrons in their symbolism?
-Are there any Goddesses that are thought to be sisters?
On Hekarti and Loec:
-Is there any indication that Hekarti and Loec are related?
-Does Mathilde see any similarity between Loec and Hekarti's domains?
@Boney, can we ask some specific questions about the information in the books we bought? More specifically:
On minor Gods:
-Is there any information about Halétha?
-Any information at all about Haleth? Is she even quest-canonical?
-Are the any Goddesses with V's or chevrons in their symbolism?
-Are there any Goddesses that are thought to be sisters?
On Hekarti and Loec:
-Is there any indication that Hekarti and Loec are related?
-Does Mathilde see any similarity between Loec and Hekarti's domains?
dinomannitro6
all your gender is belong to us
- Location
- The Land Where The Sunflowers Bloom
[ ] MAX: Learning: (Ritual Magic)
[ ] EGRIMM: Attempt a Windherder enchantment with Egrimm (Ring of Sudden Dawn)
[ ] WEB-MAT: Investigate Gryphon Wood with one or more members of WEB-MAT (Johan and Egrimm)
[ ] Attempt to bring a Major House or Ward into the Waystone Project (Frost)
[ ] Investigate Alric
[ ] EIC: Investigate what trade goods the Eonir might be willing to import from the Empire.
[ ] Seek an agreement with a Cult to have access to their libraries (Verenans)
[ ] Serenity: Windsoak Mushrooms (1/2)
My initial ideas for a plan. Still has an AP left to assign.
[ ] EGRIMM: Attempt a Windherder enchantment with Egrimm (Ring of Sudden Dawn)
[ ] WEB-MAT: Investigate Gryphon Wood with one or more members of WEB-MAT (Johan and Egrimm)
[ ] Attempt to bring a Major House or Ward into the Waystone Project (Frost)
[ ] Investigate Alric
[ ] EIC: Investigate what trade goods the Eonir might be willing to import from the Empire.
[ ] Seek an agreement with a Cult to have access to their libraries (Verenans)
[ ] Serenity: Windsoak Mushrooms (1/2)
My initial ideas for a plan. Still has an AP left to assign.
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- Location
- Australia
I'm not sure that's a good idea. There isn't a significant amount of metal, greed, artifice, or logic out in the wilderness, so the access to his favourite wind would be limited. It'd be like bringing along an amber wizard to do a job in a big city.
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Johan was sneaky when we were infiltrating the skaven bases under K8P. Perhaps he would be better to take along when investigating Alaric?
We can potentially take Egrimm to the Wood instead.
What does the Ring of Sudden Dawn do?
I'd like to bring the Bretonnian Damsels into the project this turn, if we can. They might bring more knowledge of rituals like the Life Order is struggling to recall, and there's the connection to the Fay Enchantress and Athel Loren we could potentially leverage if we get them on board.
We can potentially take Egrimm to the Wood instead.
What does the Ring of Sudden Dawn do?
I'd like to bring the Bretonnian Damsels into the project this turn, if we can. They might bring more knowledge of rituals like the Life Order is struggling to recall, and there's the connection to the Fay Enchantress and Athel Loren we could potentially leverage if we get them on board.
This
FTFY
We planned on teaching our greatsword technique right?
We should also remember that Halethan Hedgewises are an option for The Father Coin.
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Strong indicator that we should groundwork this or next turn. The project hasn't actually started before we do that, and being perfectionist about gathering up everyone before we even get started would be a total waste of time.
- Location
- New York
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- He/Him
Ok, did we want to bring anyone else in on the project immediately? I vaguely remember wanting elves of the frost ward for some reason but I can't remember why.
Codex
Fantasy Addict
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Alright, so getting into the update:
Or maybe I'm looking too deeply and the parts of Loec that are largely venerated by the Elves are very distinct from what humans appreciate about Ranald. I can't remember humans having any seriously prominent Gods of Theatre, Music, Dancing and Festivals and stuff like that. WHF humans are allergic to fun sometimes, justifying it with stuff like "Slaanesh will prey on you for that" or whatever. Humans tend to worship Gods for things they want, rather than things they are. They want mercy, so they pray to Shallya. They want to survive, so they worship Ulric. They don't want to die, so they pray to Morr. They want healthy children and lots of fields, so they pray to Rhya. They want good luck and freedom from their oppression, so they pray to Ranald.
Actually, you know what, let me quote Page 47 of High Elves 8th Edition, the Dragon Mage section:
"Into every generation of Caledorian nobility, a handful of Dragon Mages are born, Elves who have a sensitivity not only to magic, but to the slumbering minds of Dragons. Many nascent Dragon Mages only recognise their destiny when their sleep becomes haunted with dreams of fire and blood, in which they ride Dragons the color of the setting sun. Such dreams mark the dying days of a mage's tutelage, for they herald an impeteousness that is ill-suited for the study of anything other than Fire Magic"
In the tabletop, Dragon Mages only cast from Lore of Fire, and they have the "Reckless" special ability. This gives them an additional +2 to casting Lore of Fire spells (on top of any other bonus, like their Wizard level. That is Staff of Volans level bonus), but it also means that they get no bonuses whatsoever to dispelling enemy spells. They're just garbage at dispelling. Even Elves have those people who aren't well suited to everything.
My proposal: Investigate Gryphon Wood with Johann, Investigate Alric with only Mathilde, Lay Foundations, Explore Ward of Frost, Get Verenan cooperation with the Library, Explore what the Eonir want trade-wise with the EIC, and two more WEB-MAT actions. Maybe we let Max write papers and do Windherding with Horstmann.
This is is all very tentative, and I don't make plans, so I could be convinced.
An interesting exploration on the societal and psychological differences between the Warhammer races. I always enjoy when Boney explores these parts of the Warhammer World. I enjoyed it with the Dwarves, and I'm sure I'll continue to enjoy it with the Elves.
Hekarti makes a lot of sense, particularly as Boney is putting more focus on her aspect as the Goddess of Magic rather than the Goddess of Dark Magic specifically. Loec intrigues me here, because the way Mathilde describes him is very distinct from the way Ranald would be described. She emphasies his focus on music, dance and ambush tactics, and aside from similarities between Night Prowling, which is more of an urban thievery thing, to ambushes, that holds little similarity to how Ranald would be described. Is this simply a matter of the books Mathilde is consuming focusing on aspects that differentiate him from Ranald, or Mathilde simply viewing him as a different god and therefore focusing on aspects of him that don't entirely resonate with Ranald?
Or maybe I'm looking too deeply and the parts of Loec that are largely venerated by the Elves are very distinct from what humans appreciate about Ranald. I can't remember humans having any seriously prominent Gods of Theatre, Music, Dancing and Festivals and stuff like that. WHF humans are allergic to fun sometimes, justifying it with stuff like "Slaanesh will prey on you for that" or whatever. Humans tend to worship Gods for things they want, rather than things they are. They want mercy, so they pray to Shallya. They want to survive, so they worship Ulric. They don't want to die, so they pray to Morr. They want healthy children and lots of fields, so they pray to Rhya. They want good luck and freedom from their oppression, so they pray to Ranald.
The Elves had a rich and well constructed society before Chaos came to the world that they can still recall. Human society was barely a thing before Chaos came to the world, and their lives and memories are much shorter. Perhaps it's just the fact that Human society was born into a world of Chaos and destruction that leads them to be so desperately attuned to extremes, compared to Elven society which still recalls the time before the world was war after war and death after death. The Elves still long for the time before the world became what it is, but for humans, this is what it's always been. I think that plays a factor into the ways in which Humans tend to dedicate themselves into extremes. Life is short, so why waste time being indecisive and moving around when you can commit?
The interesting thing is that even Elves have mono-wind casters, although their mono-wind effect is probably different than humans. Shadow Dancers of the Asrai cast exclusively from Ulgu, and the Dragon Mages of Caledor are stated to be---
Actually, you know what, let me quote Page 47 of High Elves 8th Edition, the Dragon Mage section:
"Into every generation of Caledorian nobility, a handful of Dragon Mages are born, Elves who have a sensitivity not only to magic, but to the slumbering minds of Dragons. Many nascent Dragon Mages only recognise their destiny when their sleep becomes haunted with dreams of fire and blood, in which they ride Dragons the color of the setting sun. Such dreams mark the dying days of a mage's tutelage, for they herald an impeteousness that is ill-suited for the study of anything other than Fire Magic"
In the tabletop, Dragon Mages only cast from Lore of Fire, and they have the "Reckless" special ability. This gives them an additional +2 to casting Lore of Fire spells (on top of any other bonus, like their Wizard level. That is Staff of Volans level bonus), but it also means that they get no bonuses whatsoever to dispelling enemy spells. They're just garbage at dispelling. Even Elves have those people who aren't well suited to everything.
Mathilde going through an entire philosophical discussion about the differences between the mindsets of humans and Elves just because she bought some books. Fascinating.
It actually takes her effort to bring herself down from her own musings at this point, which seem to increase the longer the story goes on, to focus on more grounded things. My suspicions on her ascension being farther along than expected gets stronger with every update.
I think this is a bit of a hint that we should get moving on the groundwork action. I would like to continue recruiting, but at this point I think we have a solid base from which to work from and Mathilde seems to think so too.
Have I said how much I like that Boney interprets the thread's discussion that he reads through into Mathilde's musings and thought processes? I find it a really nice way to include the audience into Mathilde's characterisation while maintaining who she is. It also depicts a very solid understanding of what the thread's desires are and allows for Mathilde to specifically address the thread's concerns to mollify them and provide direction and solutions to the problems brought up by us. It really helps me solidify what I want to do with the turn plan.
I do not want to bring anyone else with us to Alric. That would be dangerous, and no one else has the capabilities to match Mathilde. I 100% support bringing Johann along into Gryphon Wood though. That seems like the sort of adventure he'd be suited for. This is where Johann excels, dangerous journeys into unknown areas. I can think of a few airborne contagions that might be in the area which I'd prefer Johann walk into rather than Mathilde. Gotta make use of those golden lungs.
I support doing Alric investigation solo, and Gryphon Wood with Johann, to clear the cost of Tochter and Elrisse. Clearing our conciousness and getting some action. Sneaky Mathilde's great.
While the second option is good and I think it might be useful, I'd prefer a personal look. The EIC doesn't have much of a presence in Eastern Talabecland, Ostermark or Ostland, because we've been focusing on the central and western sections of the Empire. Instead, I think we should analyse what sort of good the Eonir might want so we can further consolidate our position and alliance. We want to make sure the Eonir think that they're better off with us than against us. A reminder that the council almost voted against contact, with a tiebreaker being necessary.
I am currently of the mind that we should do this action.
I want to explore the Ward of Frost. We've kept Cadaeth and the Council of Frost waiting, but they were our contacts and I'd like to see them. Getting some Forestborn support would be nice, especially since they're one of the more invested parties, what with them bordering Salzenmund.
My suggestion is to try to contact the Verenans. Obvious reason being that they're the best contact for books.
My proposal: Investigate Gryphon Wood with Johann, Investigate Alric with only Mathilde, Lay Foundations, Explore Ward of Frost, Get Verenan cooperation with the Library, Explore what the Eonir want trade-wise with the EIC, and two more WEB-MAT actions. Maybe we let Max write papers and do Windherding with Horstmann.
This is is all very tentative, and I don't make plans, so I could be convinced.
K von Carstein
Likes to go for a walk
- Location
- Belgium
- Pronouns
- He
Maybe beginning the project?
[ ] Lay the foundations: work with the current members of WEB-MAT and the Waystone Project to build a single unified framework for understanding the Waystones.
I really want to begin this turn, it has been months irl and we didn't do anything Waystony. Of course we had very good reasons, but now that we have enough people to begin let's do this. We can always add more people later.
dinomannitro6
all your gender is belong to us
- Location
- The Land Where The Sunflowers Bloom
Cadaeth was the one who introduced us to the project, and she is on the ruling council of the ward, so presumably they would be wiling to work on the project. And the forest beings would bring interesting insights to the project.
Codex
Fantasy Addict
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Johann is metaphysically made of metal. His specialty is smashing things, which works regardless of the setting he is in. If he was a Journeyman, maybe I'd agree, but a Magister of his ability is capable of dealing with an absence of his wind when fighting, especially since his main forms of combat with metal is usually by producing it from the Aethyr or enhancing his own body, neither of which require existing metal.
Even Johann's sense don't necessarily require metal.
His senses work best with metal, but he has proprioception that lets him feel where everything is and he's adapted to it. He's been going on trips and exercises with Kadoh for over a year inside a magical forest by now. I think he's learnt to adapt his abilities to a forested environment by this point. Worst comes to worst, he's a good tank.
She is often referred to as the Goddess of the Forest of Shadows, but specifically she is the one who protects people from the Forest of Shadows. While Taal and Rhya are those worshipped in the larger towns and cities, in the rest of Ostland many call on Halétha instead. Where Taal and Rhya is 'here's how to live in harmony with nature', Halétha is more 'there is no nature here, here's how to carve something you can live on from the darkness'.
Nordland Haleth is simple enough, the general explanation is that those in central and western Nordland adopted her from those in eastern Nordland, which is within the Forest of Shadows, as a general hunting Goddess. Middenland Haleth is more puzzling. It looks like both arose at about the same time as the Cults of Taal and Rhya were expanding their influence in Ostland, so it might be a result of a Haléthan diaspora.
Lots. They're very basic symbols and pretty much every language has at least one as a letter, including Khazalid and Dark Tongue. Shapes like V are used to represent trees, flowers, springs, cups, lakes, and a yonic symbol, while shapes like chevrons are used to represent mountains, roots, sunshine, rivers, and a yonic symbol.
Shallya and Myrmidia, Hyacinth and Groplotta, Clio and Scripsisti, and a handful of paired river goddesses. Familial relationships don't seem to be common among minor Gods, and when they do occur it's usually because they're being chained in to the family tree of the main pantheon.
Hekarti and Atharti are explicitly said to be twin sisters but there's no information about any other relations. Some are referred to as Loec's children - Alith Anar, Wardancers in general, and bizarrely Draugnir in one place - but it doesn't seem to ever be applied in a way that is meant to be literal.
Not really. If you really wanted to you could draw a line between Loec's shadows and Hekarti's darkness, but magically the two are completely different. Hekarti is as associated with the Wind of Shadow as she is with all the others, and Loec is associated with shadow and only indirectly with the Wind of Shadow, which might make sense if you were trying to argue that Loec is Hekarti's son, but not the other way around.
Just having the mushrooms present doesn't mean that you're instantly and perfectly able to recall everything you observed and discovered about them. You could study them all over again to refresh the bonus if you wanted to.
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- Location
- Earth
I'd only support that action if we take it alongside or after the 'stare at a waystone' action. Because Mathilde has been bluffing about what she brings to the table, which is to say zilch, and I suspect it'd be easier to maintain that fiction if she has more to work with than the few days she spent hurriedly on campaign.
Also, could somebody remind me why we're against bringing Egrimm to investigate Alric? It's been a while and the arguments have slipped my mind.
No, i meant apprentice teaching classes so we can teach Eike. The earliest she can graduate from junior apprentice is pretty soon
- Location
- Moscow
What does the "Timeless" for paper on coins mean? I thought it just referred to coins being physically present and not something to write on from memory.
The paper would just be descriptions and rubbings, without any derivative insights.
Codex
Fantasy Addict
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For those curious, Loec has a bit of a relationship with Dragons. This is from 8th Edition Wood Elves Page 52:
"Though Forest Dragons seldom pay heed or homage to the deities of the Elves (few are prepared to admit the existence of beings nobler or more powerful than Dragons), most have a grudging respect for Loec, the Lord of Laughter. At heart, Dragons are creatures of cunning and intellect, and they admire the legerdemain by which the Shadow Dancer rescues Elven souls from Slaanesh as well as the trickery Loec employs to erode the Dark Prince's vengeance once the deed is done. Indeed, many Forest Dragons hold true to the belief that Loec honed his cleverness under the tutelage of Draugnir, Father of Dragons. The Wardancers, being Loec's foremost devotees, hold that the opposite is true, and love to engage Forest Dragons in battles of wits to prove their point"
Qu'aph, the Nehekharan Snake God that Mathilde got a sense of deja vu from, also has a relationship with Dragons. Although it is...different:
"Qu'aph was said to have preyed on the Dragons that dwelt in the Great Land before the coming of Man. The God would lie in ambush beneath the surface of the desert before lunging towards his prey and sinking his spear-sized fangs into their scaly throats" Tomb Kings 8th Edition Army Book Page 44
Does this have any sort of connection whatsoever? I dunno. Just throwing it out there.
- Location
- Utrecht
We are hoping to not get noticed by Alric, in case he does regain power. Horstmann might not be any good at stealth, and light magic is terrible at it.
- Location
- Aotearoa
On the other hand, Mathilde can do the sneaky sneaky while referring back to Egrimm as 'man in the chair', helping us interpret the clues on what what Alric is up to?
That would be possible.