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Changing Destiny (Kancolle)

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BF110C4 said:
Shit. Shit... I can argue about pilot rotation and better tactics, but that might prolong the war enough that the americans get more than two bombs, or I could argue about keeping the US outside our operational plans and just conquering the european holdings, but that will give those poor people to those sadistic monsters.

And if I try to moderate the psychos in the navy and army I will die either by my superiors in a kangeroo court or by my subordinates in the middle of the night.

Shit...
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it's the same problem Schreiber is facing: you can't help a horrific regime win, but you're trying to save the lives of people and shipgirls under your command.
That said, there's pushing for Manchuria. Once the natural resources there beyond arable land are secured and exploited, there's far less of a reason to go after the oil fields in SEA.
obssesednuker said:
The bigger problem is that Schreiber is on a timer. Two, in fact. The first is Pearl Harbour. Once the Japanese bomb the port then Roosevelts hands are untied enough in regards to aiding Britain that war with Germany is inevitable.
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And Hitler refuses to keep his big mouth shut.
obssesednuker said:
The other, more terrifying from the perspective of any German who would realizesit, timer is with the Soviets. If/When Barbarossa goes off, then Germany becones committed to a death grapple with a tyranny that rivals the Nazis for sheer evil and was ultimately far more militarily and industrially effective then them.
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That's the key word. Ultimately. Hitler's 'we kick in the door, and they crumble' wasn't entirely inaccurate. The recent purges and Winter War left the Red Army weak... but they are rebuilding. But Germany is also building up itself, so going early is to its disadvantage. The whole situation's a 'pick the least worst option'.
obssesednuker said:
Even if Barbarossa doesn't go off, then the Red Army will be able to complete its reform and rearmament program which means that by 1943 Stalin might start getting... ideas, unless the Germans can make the price too high for him to think it worthwhile.
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Germany was never going to match or exceed the USSR's industrial and military output. The only way to win without the Japanese Army pressing in from the East, and somehow succeeding at that, is to pull off the knockout punch Barbarossa was supposed to be. It's a classic Prussian strategy: Win against a larger economy/military by speed, superior tactics, superior strategy, and just destroying the enemy military as fast as possible. Germany and Japan are not capable of sustaining a long war. Not like the USSR or the United States.
 
Always Late said:
The only way to win without the Japanese Army pressing in from the East, and somehow succeeding at that, is to pull off the knockout punch Barbarossa was supposed to be. It's a classic Prussian strategy: Win against a larger economy/military by speed, superior tactics, superior strategy, and just destroying the enemy military as fast as possible.
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The problem is that we know how well that attempt worked out for the Germans. Namely that it didn't. The Germans found they simply couldn't destroy the Red Army faster then the Red Army could replace their losses and they didn't have adequate enough logistics to reach the critical targets that would have undermined the Soviets administrative-political ability to resist. They also didn't have the time to build the logistics up before the Soviets got powerful enough to successfully defend against a German attack, so from a hindsight position we can tell that a 1942 Barbarossa isn't really a starter either.

The real trick Schreiber needs to pull off is that he has to knock the Nazis off and then bring the war with the British to a conclusion before the Americans or the Soviets get involved. With the British out, the Americans don't have the political impetus to get involved and Stalin won't move for fear of uniting the world against him. This is a tight and problematic balancing act: move too fast and the plot may fail from inadequate preparation and/or premature discovery. Move too slowly, and they won't have enough time to force the British to the peace table before the Soviets and/or Americans enter the war (or worse, are already in it) and effectively seal their doom.
 
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Thorthemighty said:
While leaving the Brits, Americans, Russians, Japanese, Italians, the Free French, etc. all scratching their heads and wondering what the heck was up.
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Until the Germans start broadcasting that one of their captains has turned traitor, condemning him and the Navy as disloyal to the Führer, Volk, and Vaterland. Or Schreiber radios the Allies with his intent to defect. Or the Allied Navies try signaling the Nazi warships no longer flying the Swastika. Or some combination of all three.
 
So Schreiber intends to sortie Bismarck after all instead of defecting it seems. This... should be interesting. We know that at least an American and a German have come back in time. But we have yet to hear from any British admirals who may have come back. Because if any have, I would wager they'd be doing everything they can to watch Bismarck's every move. And if that's true, then when Bismarck does move...

Well, the Royal Navy had a lot of Battleships. I wonder what it would be like to see them all in the battle line engaging a target together?
 
Well, would the Nazi Foreign Intelligence apparatus make note of Admiral Thompson in Washington D.C.? And to extend the trail of butterflies further does Admiral Schreiber know of Admiral Thompson from the OTL? Could he then add it all up and see that there might be other returnees?

In the end, would it matter?
 
Wouldn't it be best for officers in the Axis navies to play as close to the history book as they can? That way the allied officers can trust their memories of how things were "supposed" to go.
 
Anti-No said:
Not believing is the rational response. Thing is, a lot of people say there is 'something' there. Checking to see what is actually going on (whatever that may be) is what a good officer would do.
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Furthermore: even if you were totally unconvinced, the first step in putting this thing to rest as fast as possible would be to go along with whatever test they come up with and watch it fail utterly.

theJMPer said:
Wouldn't it be best for officers in the Axis navies to play as close to the history book as they can? That way the allied officers can trust their memories of how things were "supposed" to go.
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In order for them to do that, the Axis time-travellers would need to strongly suspect that there are Allied time-travellers in play.
 
Skywalker_T-65 said:
Schreiber smiled, even as he felt like his heart had been stabbed. The loyalty...at times, he felt he didn't deserve it. He was, fundamentally, plotting to unseat the legitimate government of Germany. No matter how cruel and evil that government was.
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Little side-note here. The Nazis aren't considered an exactly legitimate government by the Germans. When talking about Nazi Germany it's always dictatorship that gets used and one of the first things when discussing them is learning how they actually broke a lot of laws to grab power as they did and how they used intimidation tactics and outright violence to ensure that "democratic" votes in the Reichstag turned out in their favor and sealed their power grab. They were a government but no one would ever call them legitimate. It doesn't get outright stated, but it is very, very, very heavily implied that the Nazis were in fact usurpers to power.

Also, in many chapters you write Kreigsmarine instead of Kriegsmarine.
 
theJMPer said:
Wouldn't it be best for officers in the Axis navies to play as close to the history book as they can? That way the allied officers can trust their memories of how things were "supposed" to go.
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I think that given whats happened in the Atlantic, there's no point in following it. Besides the damage that defecting would do to the KMS would be far better in terms of ending the war than following the script.
 
Skywalker_T-65 said:
Chapter 26
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New chapter! :D

And goodness gracious that was so worth the wait. You really did a great job with the Admirals and I'm wondering just what in blazes happened with King. Either King really, really holds a grudge or whatever happened was beyond mere apologies. Here's hoping more level minds prevail in the end.

Superbly done, sirrah. Now go get some rest and dream of Sara.
Skywalker_T-65 said:
Waaaaaaaayyyyyyy back in the thread, people discussed ship girls going back in time instead of our Admiral. Well, there you go :V

(my barely functional brain thought it was a good idea)
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It most certainly was a good idea! Lots of emotion in that one and really enjoyable.
landcollector said:
And a large one too. If Stark is convinced, I still expect King to go behind his back to stir up shit.
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I concur. And it's the last thing they need at this particular stage.
Always Late said:
Or sortie then defect. Some Hunt for Red October shit.
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That would be pretty cool.
Dirtnap said:
So...they're gonna go visit Skipjack.

$5 says she nicks King's wallet.
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Subthieves gonna subthief.
 
For that German, I would requist waiting till Bismark her sister ship is ready as well.
Germany was also working on a carrier, but after the loss of the Bismark, they stopped working on it, the USSR played a bit with it, before using it as a target.
If he can get them together, finished, for a heavy raid...

For Japan, pushing for the third Yamato class to be build as a carrier straight from the start, for one.
Zipang plot.
Greater focus on the submarines, I-21 & I-400 classes being used in greater numbers and on a wider spread of missions.

USA, getting those never builded Lexington Battlecruisers build, so they have some good escort ships for the carriers.
Pushing true the build of the Iowa and Montana classes for the same reason.
If their construction was not halted, they could maybe have prevented the loss of some of the carriers.
Getting a dockship designed and build, recovery and transport of heavily damaged ships becomes then way easier.
Getting the Merlin Engine and pushing true anti-submarine warfare tavtics, including convoy and city night lights, before it was tohave happend.
King is a problem, from 41 to 45, strike iron while it is hot and try to leek the current high admiral around, King was retirement age in 42.
He does not get that if England starts to suggest things to solve a problem, you are already way to late with solving said problem.
Wich if he anti england habit is true, could get him to maybe act before they can even make said suggestions?
O, who am I kidding???
 
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Vianca said:
For that German, I would requist waiting till Bismark her sister ship is ready as well.
Germany was also working on a carrier, but after the loss of the Bismark, they stopped working on it, the USSR played a bit with it, before using it as a target.
If he can get them together, finished, for a heavy raid...

For Japan, pushing for the third Yamato class to be build as a carrier straight from the start, for one.
Zipang plot.
Greater focus on the submarines, I-21 & I-400 classes being used in greater numbers and on a wider spread of missions.

USA, getting those never builded Lexington Battlecruisers build, so they have some good escort ships for the carriers.
Pushing true the build of the Iowa and Montana classes for the same reason.
If their construction was not halted, they could maybe have prevented the loss of some of the carriers.
Getting a dockship designed and build, recovery and transport of heavily damaged ships becomes then way easier.
Getting the Merlin Engine and pushing true anti-submarine warfare tavtics, including convoy and city night lights, before it was tohave happend.
King is a problem, from 41 to 45, strike iron while it is hot and try to leek the current high admiral around, King was retirement age in 42.
He does not get that if England starts to suggest things to solve a problem, you are already way to late with solving said problem.
Wich if he anti england habit is true, could get him to maybe act before they can even make said suggestions?
O, who am I kidding???
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Well a bigger thing might be not letting the brits have North Carolina and her sister for the first half of 42.
 
theJMPer said:
You mean acquires a brand new wallet at the same time that--purely coincidentally--King misplaces his?
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Oh no, this is straight up nicking. Because Sub :p, seriously the guys on board subs would generally take anything not nailed down.

Ice Cream Machine (A big one), toiletries, uniforms, guns, ammo, whatever.
 
Dirtnap said:
Oh no, this is straight up nicking. Because Sub :p, seriously the guys on board subs would generally take anything not nailed down.

Ice Cream Machine (A big one), toiletries, uniforms, guns, ammo, whatever.
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does this mean in the future we'll see destroyers sending ransom videos to carriers demanding ice cream for fairy pilots they pulled out of the drink.
 
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