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Attempting to Fulfill the Plan MNKh Edition

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It may very well be worth it to keep the generals on account of us needing the actions to overhaul the military.

We are the Soviet Union, bleeding men and territory for time is one of our favored pasttimes.
 
Cavalry as an breakthrough force is completely outdated eh. If we are relying on them to do that against the Wehrmacht, we would be beyond fucked.
 
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I don't think killing the old generals (as opposed to expanding the kill lists) is worth the loss of 20 PI and another die per turn.

PI is too useful for achieving other opportunities, and we are going to be hurting for dice for the next few turns.
 
Frankly, I am completely opposed to expanding the list. It's either base purge or base + generals for me. They are also roughly equal where PI is concerned.

If we are going to purge more people than the bare minimum, at least make it worth it.
 
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It's definitely not worth it from a purely VSNKh, economic growth perspective. It's our one shot at using our political influence to make a major impact on the military leadership and the potential course of the war, though, which I think is worth it if only because we're not getting another one and putting that "friends with Stalin" trait to work tends to be a good idea when given the chance.

And yeah, I also don't want to expand the lists, killing off even more of our own people out of sheer opportunism is no bueno.
 
Reminder that the Old Guard were also responsible for getting a bunch of far more competent military officers killed later on in the Purge.

Like, these are politically influential guys who're going to use that influence to wreck our military for their outdated pet theories!
 
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Random Member said:
Reminder that the Old Guard were also responsible for getting a bunch of far more competent military officers killed later on in the Purge.

Like, these are politically influential guys who're going to use that influence to wreck our military for their outdated pet theories!
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Looks at wikipedia.
On 11 June, he[Budyonny] was one of the judges at the trial of Tukhachevsky and seven other Red Army commanders, whose execution was the start of a massive purge of the Red Army officer corps. At the trial, he provided testimony that Tukhachevsky's efforts to create an independent tank corps was so inferior to horse cavalry and so illogical that it amounted to deliberate "wrecking."
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...Yeah, I don't think we can afford for this guy to live.
 
ctulhuslp said:
The answer to this is not submitting to outdated forms of warfare, it's building more trucks. Many, many, many more trucks.
We have no idea what to do with all the oil anyway.
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DkArthas said:
Cavalry as an breakthrough force is completely outdated eh. If we are relying on them to do that against the Wehrmacht, we would be beyond fucked.
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Cavalry, by now, is ersatz motorized infantry anyway. They fight on horseback pretty much on only one occasion - when enemy is at the charge distance and is not aware of it.

And while proper motorized force would be nicer for exploitation - breakthrough is done with artillery and infantry, exploitation with everything else, not the other way around - we cannot be sure that we would have that properly organized and well-equipped motorized force.

And should we lack it, having an ersatz in form of cavalry is better than having nothing.

Random Member said:
Reminder that the Old Guard were also responsible for getting a bunch of more competent military officers killed later on in the Purge.

Like, these are politically influential guys who're going to use that influence to wreck our military!
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1) We would have more PI to save these guys then, if we go for expanded list.
2) This RKKA Old Guard are not the only ones flinging accusations like candy and it's Christmas out there. Taking out Budenny does not magically save Egorov, or Blyukher, or Tukhachevsky. It might help, but it is not certain.

Now, if we had an option to go for Yezhov, and install Beria early... And then, 2-3 years later, go for Beria and install, for example, Malenkov (He was Stalin's favorite for NKVD head at some point during the purges)...
That would have been ideal. Two consequent internal purges of NKVD would have meant they wouldn't have had time for anyone else
 
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Blackstar said:
State of Second Five Year Plan
The targets are:
150% Increases in MFPG: Near Target
150% Increases in Capital Goods: Target Met
150% Increases in Consumer Goods: Near Target
50% increase in food production: Behind Target
Military Production Targets
Size Increase to 1 Million Personel: At the target
Construction of Stage 5 Academies: Ahead of target
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Production targets have been updated.
 
[X]Sign the List and Direct Yezhov: With the current reasonably famous falling out of the military staff between Voroshilov and Budyonny, and the brewing discontent of the establishment towards the military. It would be prudent to discuss a few of the more regressive officers with Yezhov. They have tried their best to hurt production by favoring cavalry, and with the likely upcoming trails of the military, it would be the perfect time to dispose of them. (-5 Party Influence per Turn till the end of Purge) (-20 Party Influence) (Loss of five actions)
 
[X]Sign the List and Direct Yezhov
Honestly leaning on this. We could wait and try to save the competent officers on the block, but that would help shape the dialogue in a bad way. Because well, the whole trials was because we would be defending 'saboteurs' going by the logic of the trials, which would probably be harder and more expensive than potentially kicking it off in another direction to try and preserve the competent officers.
 
[X]Sign the List and Direct Yezhov: With the current reasonably famous falling out of the military staff between Voroshilov and Budyonny, and the brewing discontent of the establishment towards the military. It would be prudent to discuss a few of the more regressive officers with Yezhov. They have tried their best to hurt production by favoring cavalry, and with the likely upcoming trails of the military, it would be the perfect time to dispose of them. (-5 Party Influence per Turn till the end of Purge) (-20 Party Influence) (Loss of five actions)

Death to the wreckers! (This time, they're even real wreckers!)
 
[X]Sign the List and Direct Yezhov: With the current reasonably famous falling out of the military staff between Voroshilov and Budyonny, and the brewing discontent of the establishment towards the military. It would be prudent to discuss a few of the more regressive officers with Yezhov. They have tried their best to hurt production by favoring cavalry, and with the likely upcoming trails of the military, it would be the perfect time to dispose of them. (-5 Party Influence per Turn till the end of Purge) (-20 Party Influence) (Loss of five actions)

We will need to produce a shitload of trucks to ensure nothing terrible happens after we do this to our mobility, but other than that it's fine.
 
[X]Sign the List and Direct Yezhov
[X]Sign the List
 
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[X]Sign the List and Direct Yezhov: With the current reasonably famous falling out of the military staff between Voroshilov and Budyonny, and the brewing discontent of the establishment towards the military. It would be prudent to discuss a few of the more regressive officers with Yezhov. They have tried their best to hurt production by favoring cavalry, and with the likely upcoming trails of the military, it would be the perfect time to dispose of them. (-5 Party Influence per Turn till the end of Purge) (-20 Party Influence) (Loss of five actions)
 
Azurath said:
[X]Sign the List and Direct Yezhov

You know, would we be perpetuating evil if our efforts helped the Soviets conquer Finland?
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Comrade, how can it be evil to liberate the Finnish proletariat from their bourgeois slave-drivers?
Shard of Victory said:
Note that ULAG populaton increased by 139 thousands. And Purge just started.

[X]Sign the List and Direct Yezhov
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Gulag population was something like 1.5 million in '39, so....
 
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