Attempting to Fulfill the Plan MNKh Edition

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I have a question is there any analogue of the cmea in real life compared to the eu or let's say the new silk road in real life how powerful is the cmea.
And how would it work if for example we standardize everything we create a brussels style parliament or leave them full autonomy to our european part.
I want to hear your opinions on where you want to take this political union.
CMEA existed in real life too, though then it was a lot more blatant as an instrument of looting EE. And no, the USSR is an imperial project, and CMEA exists just as OTL as a way to extract value from EE, its just that with more reasonable figures who know how to keep up appearances internationally, we aren't literally requisitioning coal from Poland or anything as hamfisted as that. Instead we just fuck around with currency convertibility, destroy their agriculture with massive agricultural subsidies on our part and brain drain their economies. The Belt and Road Initiative (Silk Road) is something entirely different, and serves as a way to garner soft power, offload China's construction industries to less saturated markets among other things. There is little in the way of political and economic integration in the way the EU or CMEA operates.
 
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Not really, they do have their own economic apparatus' and politics mostly unintegrated from ours, its just that we wield degree a massive amount of influence into into them. We are never going to annex the EE countries into the USSR proper. Though yeah, they aren't going anywhere barring a collapse of the USSR, which isn't too likely.
 
Do you think a Hungarian or Polish revolt is possible?
It is possible for tito hacer to create a counterweight or germany within the cmea.
Unless there's a lot of big fuck ups there's shouldn't be violent revolts, likely to be big protests and stuff but that should just be a good opportunity for us to put in more good policies that will make people happy and stuff?
 
Do you think a Hungarian or Polish revolt is possible?
It is possible for tito hacer to create a counterweight or germany within the cmea.
My thoughts on that matter are: As long as there is discontent and they see themselves as vassals on the periphery of an empire, they'll still try to break away if the moment comes. The health of the USSR itself just forestalls the moment of weakness that allows it to succeed.
 
@Blackstar can you confirm how many excess natural gas projects/units we have available? I believe we have 2 available to do the gas district heating with but want to make sure I'm not forgetting any gas consuming projects we did.

+4 from oil fields, -4 from CCGT power plants, +1 from cracking, -1 from district heating stage 1, should still leave +2 unused from existing oil field modernization unless I'm forgetting another consumer.
That should be correct.

Also, in general even uprisings can happen, its not like a lot of the states you put into power are massively liked, and you are being fairly extractive, if nicer about it then OTL.
 
Cannon Omake: Status Report on the Expenditures for the Second Five Year Plan
Status Report on the Expenditures for the Second Five Year Plan

Expense Chart for the Development of the Second Five Year Plan
InfrastructureHeavy IndustryLCIAgricultureServicesMilitary
1933H1
14,61%​
35,96%​
16,85%​
13,48%​
8,99%​
10,11%​
1933H2
15,79%​
24,21%​
26,32%​
8,42%​
11,58%​
13,68%​
1934H1
11,21%​
22,43%​
24,30%​
11,21%​
9,35%​
21,50%​
1934H2
16,82%​
26,17%​
7,48%​
4,67%​
5,61%​
39,25%​
1935H1
0,00%​
27,03%​
21,62%​
10,81%​
3,38%​
37,16%​
1935H2
10,00%​
25,00%​
6,67%​
15,00%​
0,83%​
42,50%​
1936H1
13,43%​
29,85%​
12,69%​
22,39%​
5,22%​
16,42%​
1936H2
17,91%​
32,84%​
8,96%​
13,43%​
4,48%​
22,39%​
1937H1
13,33%​
20,00%​
22,22%​
14,07%​
8,89%​
21,48%​
1937H2
14,72%​
28,22%​
14,72%​
7,98%​
6,13%​
28,22%​
TOTAL
12,50%​
27,11%​
15,99%​
12,26%​
6,17%​
25,97%​


Authored by Vladimir Bazarov
Published December 21st 1937
Censored and Limited to Commissariat Leadership on January 14th 1938


The development of heavy industry has once again taken priority, though its spending was much reduced compared to our first five year plan. Nonetheless, we have made great strides in this sector, with the massive efforts directed towards the expansion of Magnitogorsk, Gorky and Zlatoust in particular building up a solid base for further industrial development, proving the effectiveness of the new model of planned cities. Much effort was also put into the exploitation of coal to feed our burgeoning industry, allowing expansion to continue unhindered.

With reactionaries taking over in Germany, combined with the imperialists in Japan taking on a much more belligerent tone, an expansion to our military-industrial base was required. Naturally, as with all matters regarding the development of the productive forces, the task to do so fell upon our hands. To this effect we have taken on Aleksandr Vasilevsky as an advisor on such matters, in order to better inform us on the needs of our military.

While his focus on the massive expansion of the officer corps drew away resources that could have been better used in the development of industry, this has been somewhat mitigated by his successful push for a smaller preparatory force, with preparations for the fielding of 1 million men instead of the more radical 1.5 and 2 million men proposed by incompetents of the like of Voroshilov. Nevertheless, some of the procurement funding was of use for the development of productive forces, notably the development of processes for the synthetization of rubber have found uses in the civilian economy, and the completion of the GAZ plant has freed up much needed trucks. The sale of military equipment to Spain has also provided us with much needed currency reserves, so something was salvaged from other efforts as well.

Following this, was, of course the Light and Chemical Industries, which though not as foundational as that of the heavy industry, still yielded important projects with good results. Of note was the development of the pharmaceutical industry on the back of previously acquired German expertise, which along with important export income, has allowed us to reduce worker attrition and will doubtlessly have useful military purposes. As will the expansions in the petrochemical industry. The mass production of radios for military and civilian use has also been undertaken, propelled by the development and newly established production of bakelite.

Of fourth most importance to the budget was the development of infrastructure. The start of this plan was promising, with the completion of the Stalingrad Hydroeletric Station not only being under budget and ahead of time, but exceeding all expectations in output, with it being comfortably the largest power station in the world, winning a considerable amount of international prestige and electrifying the entire South Volga Region, which has opened many opportunities for the development of industry in that location. In a related note, great strides were made early on in the expansion of the power grid to all corners of the Union in a decisive effort to electrify the various cities and industrial centers scattered throught. Combined with the build up of more efficient diesel rolling stock and associated infrastructure, as well as the start of the laying up of roads, the Union has never been as connected as it now is.

The ministry has also continued its incorrect focus on increasing expenditures on the peasantry. Though projects such as the distribution of fertilizer, the start of factory farming and statistical land management were steps in the right direction, the continued gross misallocation of funds towards cooperatives and new socialist towns has hindered further industrial development. Furthermore, the ministry's soft hand when managing grain price shifts also diminished the prospects of freed up labor that could be put to more productive uses.

Last and not least were services. Though it received limited funding, this sector performed admirably in most regards, with the education of the worker never having been so comprehensive. We have also continued funding the expansion of the hospital system, which along with efforts in expanding higher learning in the health sector, will improve the health and thus the productivity of the worker. Some resources were wasted in pointless anti-religious campaigns, though not enough to significantly compete with other, more important, projects.

Paper classified by order of Anastas Mikoyan to the departmental level, ordered to not be sent up due to insignificance.
 
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2) Using central government politics to squash local political groups' ability to make impactful economic choices feels like the right move here, but the more we do it, the more of the OTL USSR's problems with central economic planning we're likely to have.

The sort of corruption that happened at Dneprodzerzhinsk was characteristic of the Brezhnev years, and tolerating it was the OTL choice. Its flourishing is not evidence that our alt-USSR is better and more decentralized than the OTL USSR. It is evidence that we have perverse incentives in the system to straighten out.

Can we combine Advanced Earthmoving with Launching Materials/Installations into Space like Orion Nuclear Launches?

Oh? The ministry needs to build the infrastructure to manufacture thousands of miniaturized nukes a year? Well, I am sure the US will take us at our word that this is just for rocket fuel, and none of this infrastructure will be used to radically expand our nuclear stockpile. They'll trust us, I am sure.

(While such civilian bombs would have real differences to weapons designs, the infrastructure to mass produce them would be scary as heck to any military planner. This may be grounds for caution.)

Regards,

fasquardon
 
Because we're talking about mass-producing CNC machine tools for the entire Soviet Union and it's actually a lot of material when you add it all up?" I suspect the only reason it doesn't produce more steel is because the old machine tools were also made out of comparable weights of steel and we're retiring many old varieties from production.

Also, I suspect, because to some extent "Aluminum" may be getting used as a proxy for "all kinds of non-ferrous metals" including stuff we use for alloying.

I could be wrong.
I suppose they make sense. Do CnC machines use a lot of aluminium? I'd figured it was mainly steel. And you seem to be wrong about what Aluminum represents. Perm's flavor text said it was digging a bunch of non-ferrous metals for alloys but we didn't get direct resources form it. Rather, it reduced costs for other things. Man, the machinery would probably be like 175 resources per dice or something if we didn't have it.
Can we combine Advanced Earthmoving with Launching Materials/Installations into Space like Orion Nuclear Launches?
I very much expect we'll get an Orion Drive as an option at some point for our space program. IDK if any of our current rocket guys would endorse the idea though. I'm not a big fan of the design and I'm skeptical you could smooth out the nuclear blasts enough to be practical. But unless the projected cost was extreme, I'd still vote for it on a rule of cool basis. At least we have a whole bunch of mostly-empty arctic we could blast off from without fear of irradiating too many people. Sure it won't be good for the ecology or natives, but we're the USSR, we hardly care. And half the discord started salivating over the Lower Lena dam when it got teased, which would probably do way more damage.
Man, these are going to be some of the most cushy job in USSR: CAD designer, G-code programmer and CNC operator.


Material science's going to be quite important to keep us up to date with these new CNC's cutting tools.
Thanks for the cool videos on CNC history! It's interesting how I can see similarities between that beastie from 1960 and the 3D printer I got to work with last year.
CMEA existed in real life too, though then it was a lot more blatant as an instrument of looting EE. And no, the USSR is an imperial project, and CMEA exists just as OTL as a way to extract value from EE, its just that with more reasonable figures who know how to keep up appearances internationally, we aren't literally requisitioning coal from Poland or anything as hamfisted as that. Instead we just fuck around with currency convertibility, destroy their agriculture with massive agricultural subsidies on our part and brain drain their economies. The Belt and Road Initiative (Silk Road) is something entirely different, and serves as a way to garner soft power, offload China's construction industries to less saturated markets among other things. There is little in the way of political and economic integration in the way the EU or CMEA operates.
So not great, not terrible ^_^ Sounds like that without explicit plundering there's decent chance of staying on good terms. I admit I hope that eventually we can federalize the CMEA to create the GLORIOUS SOCIALIST (part of the) WORLD REPUBLIC. Probably a pipe dream, but who knows. Perhaps some day they'll be begging to get in on our planning, if we avoid being outright abusive.

One serious disagreement with you though: I ain't a fan of that "[developed economy] is using agricultural subsidies to keep the little guy down" argument. We subsidized agriculture after the Great Patriotic War because 1) we wanted to keep food prices low during the post-war chaos and 2)because we absolutely do not want the rural economy to collapse the moment somebody else starts exporting cheaper food, which it would if Soviet agriculture suddenly became unprofitable. Not even The Voz disregards the country folk that much anymore.

Status Report on the Expenditures for the Second Five Year Plan
Holy fric 42.5 percent military expenditure in the second half of 1935 what were we doing that half-annum? Anyways, thank for making these plan summaries!
(While such civilian bombs would have real differences to weapons designs, the infrastructure to mass produce them would be scary as heck to any military planner. This may be grounds for caution.)
Would they? I'd like to know more about what the engineering differences between a military and "civilian" nuke are. They both need to get a fuckton of uranium to fission after all. And I'm surprised OTL's projects got so far to even consider such design factors.
 
Would they? I'd like to know more about what the engineering differences between a military and "civilian" nuke are. They both need to get a fuckton of uranium to fission after all. And I'm surprised OTL's projects got so far to even consider such design factors.
They did, for a propulsion version you're thinking about ways to make sure you get the most acceleration you can out of each nuke you set off. For instance a shaped nuclear charge can help with that, and I believe typically you'd want sufficient matter on the outside for some extra impulse as well as x-ray and neutron radiation aren't the best at propelling a spacecraft.

But regardless of these modifications, they are at the end of the day still fully operational and live nukes which you are basically giving in job lots of thousands to a small number of people who will launch to orbit and be very out of reach of consequences. But they will surely be completely 100% reliable and would never consider alternate uses for thousands of live nuclear weapons that they can activate at will. Surely surely.


In any case, there are some issues with the original Orion proposal as such. Just not that much in its technical feasibility and nearly everything in things like security and environment. And especially on the state security side of things where the challenges are... substantial.
The ecological and health impact is overall not even remotely as bad in a statistical sense. But there is for instance a small global ecological impact which probably would be measurable enough to at least get quite a few people some what annoyed at you. To illustrate this just a little, the open air test nukes have left radioactive lines globally in the soil that scientists these days now use to check and calibrate their radiological dating methods. Admittedly it's not super high or anything... but it illustrates how the material gets literally everywhere with open air blasts. The PR on that would be challenging, it certainly did cause challenges for open air nuclear tests after all.


In any case in our world the solution to these issues has been sought by looking at things like inertial confinement fusion technology, where you basically create small nuclear fusion explosions. There these require a sophisticated system to create and otherwise can not work at all, as well as being explosions at a far far smaller scale, this resolves any state security concerns. And being far smaller, it might be possible to launch a full system to space, or otherwise to build such a system in orbit with but a limited number of modules. Being more pure fusion and not being run on Earth at all anymore, environmental concerns or most other PR issues would become moot. Of course such technology is only now starting to become some what functional at all, so it's a bit of a long burn. But if one really wanted such a thing one could presumably with a more focused effort accelerate the pace a bit. Not sure how worth it it would be considering there are some other options one could use instead as a high efficiency space drive.
 
It is not so much propulsion I am after, more a very powerful/efficient lifting method to get stuff up in orbit.

Use normal fuels or Ion Thrusters for stuff in space.
 
I suppose they make sense. Do CnC machines use a lot of aluminium? I'd figured it was mainly steel.

Aluminum is a common machined metal, it is not a very good drill bit, that is almost exclusively grades of steel, titanium, cobalt, and for the super fancy diamond. A large part of the frames could be made of it though, and that would reduce the weight of already very heavy machines.

I admit I hope that eventually we can federalize the CMEA to create the GLORIOUS SOCIALIST (part of the) WORLD REPUBLIC.

Technically speaking the USSR is a union of soviet socialist republics, a soviet is a council, so if a socialist country wanted to join the proper USSR instead of just the CMEA nothing jumps out beyond how unlikely it'd be for even a puppet government to willingly suborn itself. Possible, but its unlikely until we get to the point where the MNKh is investing in CMEA members ala 'Belt and Road' and members of those countries see more direct benefits of closer ties. It still strikes me as very unlikely for the short term, maybe if we can hold things together for a lifetime.

Holy fric 42.5 percent military expenditure in the second half of 1935 what were we doing that half-annum?

Note the year, WW2 lead up.
 
So not great, not terrible ^_^ Sounds like that without explicit plundering there's decent chance of staying on good terms. I admit I hope that eventually we can federalize the CMEA to create the GLORIOUS SOCIALIST (part of the) WORLD REPUBLIC. Probably a pipe dream, but who knows. Perhaps some day they'll be begging to get in on our planning, if we avoid being outright abusive.

One serious disagreement with you though: I ain't a fan of that "[developed economy] is using agricultural subsidies to keep the little guy down" argument. We subsidized agriculture after the Great Patriotic War because 1) we wanted to keep food prices low during the post-war chaos and 2)because we absolutely do not want the rural economy to collapse the moment somebody else starts exporting cheaper food, which it would if Soviet agriculture suddenly became unprofitable. Not even The Voz disregards the country folk that much anymore
Nah, it is kinda terrible, its like a more dickish version of the EU, where if Germany does not like the stuff you're doing and you don't walk back they will roll in tanks into your country. It is better than OTL, but well, that's our motto at this point lol

And yeah, the agricultural subsidies are important for political reasons, but we do undermine the CMEA rural economies by doing so, remember that they can't exactly decide to suddenly put tariffs on Soviet grain in order to protect their own farmers.
Holy fric 42.5 percent military expenditure in the second half of 1935 what were we doing that half-annum? Anyways, thank for making these plan summaries!
We were starting up production for rifles, expanding officer academies and setting up tools production dedicated to military factories, which were big expenses

Military 6 Dice (+4 Free Dice)
-[] Alternative Basic Manufacturing, 6 Military Dice (180 Resources)
-[] Production Line-Shift to SVT-34, 3 Free Dice (60 Resources)
-[] Construct Officer Academies (Stage 4), 1 Free Dice (15 Resources)

Thanks! It was a lot of work manually compiling all the plans for every single turn, the data crunching took a lot less time thankfully, since notgreat made a handy spreadsheet.

When doing these reports I have been re-reading the early turns quite a bit to see the projects that were funded, which also took some time, but is no bother at all at the end of the day. Anyway, I have the data all the way up to 1957, so expect more of them!
 
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Because we're talking about mass-producing CNC machine tools for the entire Soviet Union and it's actually a lot of material when you add it all up?" I suspect the only reason it doesn't produce more steel is because the old machine tools were also made out of comparable weights of steel and we're retiring many old varieties from production.

Also, I suspect, because to some extent "Aluminum" may be getting used as a proxy for "all kinds of non-ferrous metals" including stuff we use for alloying.
I can solve that mystery of increased aluminium need. The CNC machines are specifically requested by the defense industry, with significant use in the aerospace industry. My assumption would be the military is using those to increase industrial throughput in factories via automation, hence a greater consumption of inputs, especially for aluminium in aircraft production. So I don't think the production of CNC machines themselves consumes a noticeable amount of aluminium.
 
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Ahhh.

Well that would make a lot of sense.

It would probably also be a good thing if we can make better stuff for the defense industry instead of just more, so that adds another facet to "why we want these upgrades."
 
Ahhh.

Well that would make a lot of sense.

It would probably also be a good thing if we can make better stuff for the defense industry instead of just more, so that adds another facet to "why we want these upgrades."
Yeah, increasing machining precision cuts down on waste, and it changes the borders of what could reasonably be built. You get more parts per labour-hour and you can build more complicated parts, so that constructions that were too expensive become affordable. In other words, every rubel spent on defense buys more bang, hence the great interest in machinery.
 
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