So we're just giving up on it?
Attempting to Fulfill the Plan MNKh Edition
- Thread starter Blackstar
- Start date
- Alt. History Users' Choice!
Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
- Location
- The Surface Of A Hostile Planet
Personally I gave up years ago when Gorky imploded, that was pretty much unrecoverable in time to make the growth target unless we really plowed money and free dice into HI. Which, at the time, would have meant an (even worse) unemployment and/or energy crisis, so, probably was never really feasible then and definitely isn't now.
- Location
- Mid-Atlantic
Is this meetable by throwing dice and money at Sevastapol and other Capital Goods projects?
Good thing we went for PWR instead of other designs, this could have been an actual disaster.
I feel like this would make a dent in the sheer amount of General Labour we get each turn now.
It might be a good idea to take this to finally get Heavy Industry a deputy.
If we're taking advantage of the secure economic targets and the election campaign to clean house and de-Voz some more, maybe this is the turn to fire Glushko? We can't time him out based on the term/age limits for a while yet and I doubt he's going to voluntarily go home early.
The thing that's drawing me in particular isn't firing Glushko personally so much as reformatting the space program into a functional single structure instead of feudalised OKBs. Which would require firing Glushko as part of breaking up his fiefdom, but it's not out of personal distaste for the man so much as the fact that he's an inconveniently load-bearing part of a Voz style corruption ring nestled inside our space program.
The thing that's drawing me in particular isn't firing Glushko personally so much as reformatting the space program into a functional single structure instead of feudalised OKBs. Which would require firing Glushko as part of breaking up his fiefdom, but it's not out of personal distaste for the man so much as the fact that he's an inconveniently load-bearing part of a Voz style corruption ring nestled inside our space program.
I'd like to ask a question - are we sure investing one die into Lithography this turn is worth it? As you can see, the budget is rather tight and with addition of a 240 RpD project in it, we have to exclude other important items like trucks, petrochemicals and such. Now, I agree that lithography in general is very worth the investment, but one thing I'd like to point out is that the current project is in large part a production one - we are setting up novel plants to produce domestic equipment. Which means that before it actually completes, it's going to be of limited benefit, unlike research projects that start just from investment. Considering that one die gives only ~10% chance of completion and that next turn our budget is going to be in a much better position, are we not better served by investing two dice next turn instead of one die for two turns? That would allow us to pick a couple of nice projects right now without stretching the budget while not actually hurting domestic lithography much, if at all.
I support this, for what it's worth. It's the end of the plan, I think we should be able to relatively painlessly encourage Glushko to step down/retire together with all the other politicians that are doing so. As time goes and space projects become more and more complex, we'll need a modern system instead of conflicting OKBs lead by primadonnas grabbing everything they can grab - we've all seen the consequences of that during alternative moon proposals debacle.
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If we can't double dice it this turn and thus guarrantee it finishing then we put one dice on it with a tiny hope of finishing it. And how can you assume we would have enough resources to do it next turn/plan? We doing a HI heavy plan (most expensive department) + atomash (most expensive project). So putting 1 dice now is a investment regardless and we would only need need to put 0 (hopefully) or 1 die next turn, which is an expensive die we could use next turn in other things. Also note we are running on 1 year turn and a turn without investing on computer is year(maybe not) we are further behind.
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Because even leaving aside the possibility of increasing our budget, next turn we won't have the debt to pay off, will probably have finished Sevastopol and our economy will grow from various high profit projects we are finishing this turn, and also just in general. Even accounting for Atommash, we will be in a better position to invest into costly things.
As I said, is this really true? It's mainly a production project, and leaving aside the tiny chance of finishing it, I don't think there's much benefit in having it partially completed. Is it worth betting on that tiny chance when there's some hefty opportunity cost?
- Pronouns
- Viewer
Its not only a production project, Blackstar mentioned that its also involves researching how to make the equipment that we are going to use to mass produce it. So its both a research and a production project, which is why its so expensive.
Atommash alone eats up both the resources we freed from debt and Sevastapol plus we have 16 dice of HI which are very expensive so I highly doubt we would even be able to use our all our dice.
Hahah I forgot about autodice into account
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- Location
- Pennslyvania
- Pronouns
- She/They
Lmao NASA doesn't exist. The US doesn't even have a civilian space program, it's all run by I think the Navy, or possibly Air Force. It's utterly hilarious that we are the ones with a highly developed civilian focused space program.
- Location
- The great frozen north
Morning comrades! So where do we stand....
Also I see the political shakeup meant Klimenko was able to free two of his bureaucracy dice. Good for us!
And I don't see why Blackstar things reaching the CapGood target is impossible. We're only "behind", not super behind. If we build Sevastopol and a truck plant, maybe also some plastics, I think we can do it!
Holy shit we reached the Agricultural target ALREADY? Damn. Good for us, means we can put effort into soil preservation and such this turn instead of rushing meat!
Also I see the political shakeup meant Klimenko was able to free two of his bureaucracy dice. Good for us!
And I don't see why Blackstar things reaching the CapGood target is impossible. We're only "behind", not super behind. If we build Sevastopol and a truck plant, maybe also some plastics, I think we can do it!
CMEA prices are only barely below international and the 40 threshold. We DESPERATELY need more oil this turn.
Could be worth it, but since Klim's foci only get +5 on non service projects their use is limited.
IamtooSleepy
I came here to be an ant
Good news: Anthropogenic climate change seem to be accepted in scientific community in both side of the Cold War.
Bad News: They still think global warming is a good thing, so no one is going to care about greenhouse gas emission for a while.
- Location
- The great frozen north
Yeah no. I am not risking this again. I want a safety margin in CMEA fuel prices and I want it soon.
I haven't gone through bureucracy options yet, but here's a rough plan of mine. The name illustrates the core motive:
[] Plan draft Cap Good? I DIDN'T HEAR ANY BELL
-[]4365/4370 Resources (5 Reserve), 43 Dice Rolled
-[]Infrastructure (9/9 Dice, 720 R)
--[]Ural Regional Roads, 1 Dice (80 R), 81%/96%
--[]Central Asian Regional Roads, 7 Dice (560 R), 74%/80%
--[]Power Grid Expansions, 1 Dice (80 R), 100%/100%
-[]Heavy Industry (6/7 Dice, 1120 R)
--[]Bakchar Deposit Utilization(Stage 2/3), 2 Dice (300 R), 91%/96%
--[]Sevastopol Technical Equipment Plants, 1 Dice (280 R), 60%/75%
--[]Novouralsk Truck Plant, 3 Dice (540 R), 89%/94%
-[]Rocketry (2/2 Dice, 0 R)
--[]Nuclear Drives, 1 Dice
--[]Light Launcher Programs, 1 Dice
-[]Light and Chemical Industry (9/8 Dice, 1130 R)
--[]Caspian Sea Petrochemical Extraction(Stage 2/2), 2 Dice (300 R), 80%/88%
--[]Samotor Field Development(Stage 3/3), 2 Dice (240 R), 89%/95%
--[]Light Home Appliance Plants, 3 Dice (390 R), 89%/94%
--[]Second Generation Furnishings, 2 Dice (200 R), 42%/56%
-[]Agriculture (6/6 Dice, 545 R)
--[]Increasing Mechanization, 1 Dice (100 R), 82%/97%
--[]Water and Waste Grants, 2 Dice (220 R), 83%/91%
--[]Topsoil Preservation Programs, 3 Dice (225 R), 59%/70%
-[]Services (11/10 Dice, 850 R)
--[]Expanded Childcare(Stage 4/6), 6 Dice (420 R), 100%/100%
--[]Technical Training Programs, 3 Dice (270 R), 79%/87%
--[]Expansion of the Store System, 2 Dice (160 R), 61%/73%
-[]Bureaucracy
--TBD
Given how important trucks and machinery are to the economy (and that we DO have a shortage of haulers for our rapidly expanding roads), and how well we're doing with other targets, I decided it was worth it to leave a some free dice unused and (heresy I know) postpone computer chips to next year in order to make SupSov proud and push through that glorious Capital Goods target! Oh yeah, I know SupSov likes cap goods...
Sevastopol Novorurals, and plastics should do it, the latter hopefully with some benefit to consoom too. Hopefully the profit from that and appliances alone will lets us pay for lithographic Equipment next year.
Otherwise, not very different from other plans. I'll fill in Bureau later, but is there anyone here who'll actually vote for this concept?
EDIT: I could potentially take one die off the truck plant to make it a con flip instead of a certainty and reorganize LCI to allow 1 dice on lithography as a compromise. Eh, maybe I'll just make two plans.
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It's not only a production project, but it's a research into the practicalities of mass production of a theoretical project, which, well, needs to actually reach the stage of mass production to really research it, in my opinion. It's not entirely useless before it's finished, but it doesn't do much as far as I can see.
- Pronouns
- Viewer
It's the steel discount I think ,we have a minus 20 to infra but you have to apply it since the projects don't reflect it
10ebbor10
DON'T PANIC
- Location
- Present
Even IRL, Climate change denial only occured after a period of acceptance, when hte fossil fuel industry ran the numbers.
- Location
- The great frozen north
OK I've realized that with one-year turns, putting off lithography is NOT a good idea. My bad.
HOWEVER, I am still convinced that the politicians will be miffed if we do not appear to make serious attempts at fixing the CapGoods goal and Resolving the ongoing truck shortage. Therefore, a compromise plan that leaves a few dice idle in order to allow a coin flip on the Novouralsk Truck Plant.
EDIT: I forgot we can put free dice on rocketry. Here we go!
[] Plan Diesel Trucks and Atomic Rockets
-[]4355/4370 Resources (15 Reserve), 50 Dice Rolled
-[]Infrastructure (9/9 Dice, 720 R)
--[]Ural Regional Roads, 1 Dice (80 R), 81%/96%
--[]Central Asian Regional Roads, 7 Dice (560 R), 74%/80%
--[]Power Grid Expansions, 1 Dice (80 R), 100%/100%
-[]Heavy Industry (5/7 Dice, 940 R)
--[]Bakchar Deposit Utilization(Stage 2/3), 2 Dice (300 R), 91%/96%
--[]Sevastopol Technical Equipment Plants, 1 Dice (280 R), 60%/75%
--[]Novouralsk Truck Plant, 2 Dice (360 R), 42%/56%
-[]Rocketry (4/2 Dice, 0 R)
--[]Nuclear Drives, 1 Dice
--[]Light Launcher Programs, 1 Dice
--[]Increased Commercialization, 1 Dice
--[]Intercosmos, 1 Dice
-[]Light and Chemical Industry (10/8 Dice, 1370 R)
--[]Caspian Sea Petrochemical Extraction(Stage 2/2), 2 Dice (300 R), 80%/88%
--[]Samotor Field Development(Stage 3/3), 2 Dice (240 R), 89%/95%
--[]Light Home Appliance Plants, 3 Dice (390 R), 89%/94%
--[]Second Generation Furnishings, 2 Dice (200 R), 42%/56%
--[]Domestic Lithographic Equipment, 1 Dice (240 R), 0%/11%
-[]Agriculture (6/6 Dice, 545 R)
--[]Increasing Mechanization, 1 Dice (100 R), 82%/97%
--[]Water and Waste Grants, 2 Dice (220 R), 83%/91%
--[]Topsoil Preservation Programs, 3 Dice (225 R), 59%/70%
-[]Services (10/10 Dice, 780 R)
--[]Expanded Childcare(Stage 4/6), 5 Dice (350 R), 100%/100%
--[]Technical Training Programs, 3 Dice (270 R), 79%/87%
--[]Expansion of the Store System, 2 Dice (160 R), 61%/73%
-[]Bureaucracy (6/6 Dice, 0 R)
--[]Authorize Farmer-Programs, 1 Dice
--[]Rework the Agricultural Tax Code, 1 Dice
--[]Back Comprehensive Tax Reform, 1 Dice
--[]Formalize Patent Purchases, 1 Dice
--[]Expand Student Recruitment, 1 Dice
Bureucracy is my weak point. It's a mix of stuff for the little folk and time-sensitive political stuff including perfunctory campaigning to remind people we do stuff. And patent purchases in hope of placating the enterprises. But I am very open to changing it if y'all think the economics are good but the politics are broke.
I realize I could drop Home Furnishings and move two dice to Services instead (probably Town-Market). Both consumer goods and services are ahead of the profitability targets. If someone thinks making that switch will convince them to vote for this plan, please let me know.
HOWEVER, I am still convinced that the politicians will be miffed if we do not appear to make serious attempts at fixing the CapGoods goal and Resolving the ongoing truck shortage. Therefore, a compromise plan that leaves a few dice idle in order to allow a coin flip on the Novouralsk Truck Plant.
EDIT: I forgot we can put free dice on rocketry. Here we go!
[] Plan Diesel Trucks and Atomic Rockets
-[]4355/4370 Resources (15 Reserve), 50 Dice Rolled
-[]Infrastructure (9/9 Dice, 720 R)
--[]Ural Regional Roads, 1 Dice (80 R), 81%/96%
--[]Central Asian Regional Roads, 7 Dice (560 R), 74%/80%
--[]Power Grid Expansions, 1 Dice (80 R), 100%/100%
-[]Heavy Industry (5/7 Dice, 940 R)
--[]Bakchar Deposit Utilization(Stage 2/3), 2 Dice (300 R), 91%/96%
--[]Sevastopol Technical Equipment Plants, 1 Dice (280 R), 60%/75%
--[]Novouralsk Truck Plant, 2 Dice (360 R), 42%/56%
-[]Rocketry (4/2 Dice, 0 R)
--[]Nuclear Drives, 1 Dice
--[]Light Launcher Programs, 1 Dice
--[]Increased Commercialization, 1 Dice
--[]Intercosmos, 1 Dice
-[]Light and Chemical Industry (10/8 Dice, 1370 R)
--[]Caspian Sea Petrochemical Extraction(Stage 2/2), 2 Dice (300 R), 80%/88%
--[]Samotor Field Development(Stage 3/3), 2 Dice (240 R), 89%/95%
--[]Light Home Appliance Plants, 3 Dice (390 R), 89%/94%
--[]Second Generation Furnishings, 2 Dice (200 R), 42%/56%
--[]Domestic Lithographic Equipment, 1 Dice (240 R), 0%/11%
-[]Agriculture (6/6 Dice, 545 R)
--[]Increasing Mechanization, 1 Dice (100 R), 82%/97%
--[]Water and Waste Grants, 2 Dice (220 R), 83%/91%
--[]Topsoil Preservation Programs, 3 Dice (225 R), 59%/70%
-[]Services (10/10 Dice, 780 R)
--[]Expanded Childcare(Stage 4/6), 5 Dice (350 R), 100%/100%
--[]Technical Training Programs, 3 Dice (270 R), 79%/87%
--[]Expansion of the Store System, 2 Dice (160 R), 61%/73%
-[]Bureaucracy (6/6 Dice, 0 R)
--[]Authorize Farmer-Programs, 1 Dice
--[]Rework the Agricultural Tax Code, 1 Dice
--[]Back Comprehensive Tax Reform, 1 Dice
--[]Formalize Patent Purchases, 1 Dice
--[]Expand Student Recruitment, 1 Dice
Bureucracy is my weak point. It's a mix of stuff for the little folk and time-sensitive political stuff including perfunctory campaigning to remind people we do stuff. And patent purchases in hope of placating the enterprises. But I am very open to changing it if y'all think the economics are good but the politics are broke.
I realize I could drop Home Furnishings and move two dice to Services instead (probably Town-Market). Both consumer goods and services are ahead of the profitability targets. If someone thinks making that switch will convince them to vote for this plan, please let me know.
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[]Plan Touring kindergartens
-[]Infrastructure (10/9 dice) 800 Resources
--[]Ural Regional Roads: 355/400, 1 die (80R) 81%
--[]Central Asian High Capacity Roads: 114/500, 1 die (80R) 0%
--[]Central Asian Regional Roads: 22/500, 7 dice (560R) 75%
--[]Power Grid Expansions: 251/275, 1 die (80R) 100%
-[]Heavy Industry (7/7 dice) 1180 Resources
--[]Bakchar Deposit Utilization(Stage 2/3): 116/200, 2 dice (300R) 91%
--[]Mangyshlak Arc-Mills, 2 dice (360 R) 8%
--[]Sevastopol Technical Equipment Plants: 89/150, 1 die (280R) 60%
--[]Kansk-Achinsk Basin Exploitation(Stage 1/5) 0/150, 2 dice (240R) 41%
-[]Rocketry (4/2 dice) 0 Resources
--[]Nuclear Drives, 1 die
--[]Light Launcher Programs, 1 die
--[]Increased Commercialization, 1 die
--[]Intercosmos, 1 die
-[]Light and Chemical Industry (8/8 dice) 1220 Resources
--[]Caspian Sea Petrochemical Extraction(Stage 2/2): 45/150, 2 dice (300R) 80%
--[]Samotor Field Development(Stage 3/3): 37/125, 2 dice (240R) 89%
--[]Second Generation Furnishings: 0/150, 2 dice (200R) 42%
--[]Domestic Lithographic Equipment: 0/125, 2 dice (480R) 65%
-[]Agriculture (5/6 dice) 470 Resources
--[]Increasing Mechanization: 161/200, 1 die (100R) 82%
--[]Water and Waste Grants: 0/100, 2 dice (220R) 83%
--[]Topsoil Preservation Programs: 0/200, 2 dice (150R) 8.6%
-[]Services (8/10 dice) 700 Resources
--[]Expanded Childcare(Stage 4/6): 14/250, 4 dice (280R) 99%
--[]Technical Training Programs: 0/200, 2 dice (180R) 19%
--[]State Insurance Enterprises: 67/200, 2 dice (240R) 74%
-[]Bureaucracy (8/8 dice) 0 Resources
--[]Legal Enforcement, 1 die (SupSov)
--[]Formalization of Hiring Practices, 1 die (SupSov)
--[]Dedicate Focus Towards a Project(): Expanded Childcare(Stage 4/6), 1 die
--[]Authorize Farmer-Programs, 1 die
--[]Back Comprehensive Tax Reform, 1 die
--[]Expanded Education for Adults, 1 die
--[]Directly Campaign, 1 die
--[]Reorganize a Department (Agriculture), 1 die
-[]Total Cost: 4370/4370 Resources, 49 dice rolled
I don't care enough about topsoil preservation to throw more than minimum viable amount of dice at it this turn; That, combined with personal attention on kindergartens and no home appliance factories, allows for both 2 dice on lithography machines and for rolling on Mangyshlak for moar steel - even if Novouralsk would probably be a better investment.
And, of course, free dice thrown at Glushko to make him build rockets.
-[]Infrastructure (10/9 dice) 800 Resources
--[]Ural Regional Roads: 355/400, 1 die (80R) 81%
--[]Central Asian High Capacity Roads: 114/500, 1 die (80R) 0%
--[]Central Asian Regional Roads: 22/500, 7 dice (560R) 75%
--[]Power Grid Expansions: 251/275, 1 die (80R) 100%
-[]Heavy Industry (7/7 dice) 1180 Resources
--[]Bakchar Deposit Utilization(Stage 2/3): 116/200, 2 dice (300R) 91%
--[]Mangyshlak Arc-Mills, 2 dice (360 R) 8%
--[]Sevastopol Technical Equipment Plants: 89/150, 1 die (280R) 60%
--[]Kansk-Achinsk Basin Exploitation(Stage 1/5) 0/150, 2 dice (240R) 41%
-[]Rocketry (4/2 dice) 0 Resources
--[]Nuclear Drives, 1 die
--[]Light Launcher Programs, 1 die
--[]Increased Commercialization, 1 die
--[]Intercosmos, 1 die
-[]Light and Chemical Industry (8/8 dice) 1220 Resources
--[]Caspian Sea Petrochemical Extraction(Stage 2/2): 45/150, 2 dice (300R) 80%
--[]Samotor Field Development(Stage 3/3): 37/125, 2 dice (240R) 89%
--[]Second Generation Furnishings: 0/150, 2 dice (200R) 42%
--[]Domestic Lithographic Equipment: 0/125, 2 dice (480R) 65%
-[]Agriculture (5/6 dice) 470 Resources
--[]Increasing Mechanization: 161/200, 1 die (100R) 82%
--[]Water and Waste Grants: 0/100, 2 dice (220R) 83%
--[]Topsoil Preservation Programs: 0/200, 2 dice (150R) 8.6%
-[]Services (8/10 dice) 700 Resources
--[]Expanded Childcare(Stage 4/6): 14/250, 4 dice (280R) 99%
--[]Technical Training Programs: 0/200, 2 dice (180R) 19%
--[]State Insurance Enterprises: 67/200, 2 dice (240R) 74%
-[]Bureaucracy (8/8 dice) 0 Resources
--[]Legal Enforcement, 1 die (SupSov)
--[]Formalization of Hiring Practices, 1 die (SupSov)
--[]Dedicate Focus Towards a Project(): Expanded Childcare(Stage 4/6), 1 die
--[]Authorize Farmer-Programs, 1 die
--[]Back Comprehensive Tax Reform, 1 die
--[]Expanded Education for Adults, 1 die
--[]Directly Campaign, 1 die
--[]Reorganize a Department (Agriculture), 1 die
-[]Total Cost: 4370/4370 Resources, 49 dice rolled
I don't care enough about topsoil preservation to throw more than minimum viable amount of dice at it this turn; That, combined with personal attention on kindergartens and no home appliance factories, allows for both 2 dice on lithography machines and for rolling on Mangyshlak for moar steel - even if Novouralsk would probably be a better investment.
And, of course, free dice thrown at Glushko to make him build rockets.
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- Location
- The great frozen north
Given we don't particularly benefit from having more steel so long as we keep below 40 price, and that Novouralsk both has High Profitability and helps fix a specific known problem (insufficient haulage for our expanding road network which we make up with imports from the west) along with helping the CapGoods target, I do not see the logic behind building Mangyshlak rather than the trucks.
Sure, it helps develop central asia. But that's pretty low priority compared to everything else.
Thanks for the reminder to feed spare free dice to Glushko though! :3
Just moar steel, really.
Though what I'm pondering now is how attached are we to finishing state insurance enterprises, as swapping those resources and technical education programs over to more kindergartens would yield 10 dice with a personal focus... Would it just, idk, provide a final solution to the question of where children go?