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A Sword Without a Hilt: A Song of Ice and Fire/D&D 3.5 Crossover

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Duesal said:
At this stage there's no such thing as too many notes. @egoo may have been initially joking when he said it, but 15-20K words of notes for background worldbuilding and character (especially villain) motivations seems low for what this quest probably needs.
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I wasn't.
I can write out ~3-5k words of background on SD alone, right now, without any need to re-read the quest.
And my memory is near to Goldfish's in it's shittyness.

If we ever wanted to make, ah, a "setting book" for the quest?
It'd be around 100k words, imma wager.
There is just that much stuff in it.

@DragonParadox, I won't trust that you have enough background written out and planned down, until you can honestly say that every "villain of the week" currently active on PoB and beyond has at least one sensible plan and methods to achieve it written down.
Until every political entity out there had some manner of a plan going for them.

[] Non-CoS Fey. What's Ymeri doing? What other powerful Fey are planning in the background?

[] Devils. Asmodeus aside, what every other Archdevil is planning?
Mammon for one, should have a pretty big hate-on with how we screwed him over.
But we also took in Siduri, and that got us direct enmity of one more CR22(?) Devil there.
What the Free Artificer Uniila doing now, the last time her acting against us being with the brooches during the Tourney?

[] Demons. 'Nuff said, we took a really big dump on one of the biggest of them by taking Mantrays and Shadow Tower and heard next to nothing since.
What are they doing?

[] Daemons. Moonpale Maiden may not be Void-aligned, but she's a bitch still, and, well, we fucked her over in Tyrosh, Lys, and more.
Hell, by reading that translation in Russian (for ahit and giggles) I found that she had her runes carved on some stones back in the Braavos swamps, which Lya recognized b/c she went to the House of Black to adk for magic.

[] Sseth. 'Nuff said?

[] All of the Valyrian Gods. We lack the fluff written out for them, DP.
We know stuff IC, but not OOC.
We don't need much, but at least their tenets and domains would be good enough.

[] Is Blind God of Lorath staying as passive as ever?

[] Are any of the canon minor Deities doing anything?

[] Whatever stuff almost attacked the party in the Dreamlands so long ago. Is it still a thing?

[] Anything happening to the remaining Essarian Sleepers (yes, another plate up in the air... unless we let Inquisition handle it. And they can.)?

[] That witch Valaena not!killed during her Summer Isles trip.
Is she planning still to take the throne?

[] What Tiamat is planning now that her pawns had been mostly wiped out?

[] Is Bag of dicks Bahamut doing anything?

[] What's the plans of the remaining non-aligned Undead in Sarnor, if any? (we'll be having some people sent to cull them overtime)

[] That mysterious "rainbow fog" we had a few rumor posts about, is it being active still in Ibbenise seas?

[] The lost Snek-cities of Sothoryos, are they posed to explode any time soon? What's brewing in them?

[] Hell, Sothoryos in general needs some rolls done I feel.
It is not just all death-jungle.

[] Where's Aberi?
Shitshow as he was for thread's morale back then, you should at least have internally consistent justification for him dropping off the face of the earth.

[] What happened to the Char-Serpent(s) on PoF, since we will not be following up IC by now?

[] Are Coatls of the Jazzirian's doing anything? We knew (very) rough directions to 3 of them.

[] Are the Dragons we learned of on Plane of Earth doing anything?
That Necromancer-dragon might have some effect on Efreeti War, and the one focused on 'ascwnding' societies might be doing whatever.
But they were brought up IC, so they probably should be considered a part of the background to roll for.

[] What Bloodstone Emperor's endgame is?
How is he going about it right now?
And The Yellow Emperor?

That we know jack shit IC about some people is no reason for you to not roll for them and write out background.


There are also more "current" things to handle:
[] The Efreeti War Fronts. If we are taking the sensible approach and saying they are now in deep stalemate and we dont have to worry about the war for about half a year at least, we need also justifications for said stalling happening.
-[] Also, what all Salamander clans are doing? The rebels, the loyalists?

[] The Illithid staying in their waters so far makes them seem uninterested in PoB-matters.
I see little need to retcon that, DP, if only so we can all breathe easier with fewer plates up there.
But decide what they are doing if they aren't going to dedicate their time fucking with us.



I hope I made my point. There's always more, ofc.

Please keep planning and fluffing.

We can live without updates for some time perfectly fine if it means more consistent and better story later.
...And I'm pretty sure you know it deep inside already :p
 
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egoo said:
I wasn't.
I can write out ~3-5k words of background on SD alone, right now, without any need to re-read the quest.
And my memory is near to Goldfish's in it's shittyness.

If we ever wanted to make, ah, a "setting book" for the quest?
It'd be around 100k words, imma wager.
There is just that much stuff in it.

@DragonParadox, I won't trust that you have enough background written out and planned down, until you can honestly say that every "villain of the week" currently active on PoB and beyond has at least one sensible plan and methods to achieve it written down.
Until every political entity out there had some manner of a plan going for them.

[] Non-CoS Fey. What's Ymeri doing? What other powerful Fey are planning in the background?

[] Devils. Asmodeus aside, what every other Archdevil is planning?
Mammon for one, should have a pretty big hate-on with how we screwed him over.
But we also took in Siduri, and that got us direct enmity of one more CR22(?) Devil there.
What the Free Artificer Uniila doing now, the last time her acting against us being with the brooches during the Tourney?

[] Demons. 'Nuff said, we took a really big dump on one of the biggest of them by taking Mantrays and Shadow Tower and heard next to nothing since.
What are they doing?

[] Daemons. Moonpale Maiden may not be Void-aligned, but she's a bitch still, and, well, we fucked her over in Tyrosh, Lys, and more.
Hell, by reading that translation in Russian (for ahit and giggles) I found that she had her runes carved on some stones back in the Braavos swamps, which Lya recognized b/c she went to the House of Black to adk for magic.

[] Sseth. 'Nuff said?

[] All of the Valyrian Gods. We lack the fluff written out for them, DP.
We know stuff IC, but not OOC.
We don't need much, but at least their tenets and domains would be good enough.

[] Is Blind God of Lorath staying as passive as ever?

[] Are any of the canon minor Deities doing anything?

[] Whatever stuff almost attacked the party in the Dreamlands so long ago. Is it still a thing?

[] Anything happening to the remaining Essarian Sleepers (yes, another plate up in the air... unless we let Inquisition handle it. And they can.)?

[] That witch Valaena not!killed during her Summer Isles trip.
Is she planning still to take the throne?

[] What Tiamat is planning now that her pawns had been mostly wiped out?

[] Is Bag of dicks Bahamut doing anything?

[] What's the plans of the remaining non-aligned Undead in Sarnor, if any? (we'll be having some people sent to cull them overtime)

[] That mysterious "rainbow fog" we had a few rumor posts about, is it being active still in Ibbenise seas?

[] The lost Snek-cities of Sothoryos, are they posed to explode any time soon? What's brewing in them?

[] Hell, Sothoryos in general needs some rolls done I feel.
It is not just all death-jungle.

[] Where's Aberi?
Shitshow as he was for thread's morale back then, you should at least have internally consistent justification for him dropping off the face of the earth.

[] What happened to the Char-Serpent(s) on PoF, since we will not be following up IC by now?

[] Are Coatls of the Jazzirian's doing anything? We knew (very) rough directions to 3 of them.

[] Are the Dragons we learned of on Plane of Earth doing anything?
That Necromancer-dragon might have some effect on Efreeti War, and the one focused on 'ascwnding' societies might be doing whatever.
But they were brought up IC, so they probably should be considered a part of the background to roll for.

[] What Bloodstone Emperor's endgame is?
How is he going about it right now?
And The Yellow Emperor?

That we know jack shit IC about some people is no reason for you to not roll for them and write out background.


There are also more "current" things to handle:
[] The Efreeti War Fronts. If we are taking the sensible approach and saying they are now in deep stalemate and we dont have to worry about the war for about half a year at least, we need also justifications for said stalling happening.
-[] Also, what all Salamander clans are doing? The rebels, the loyalists?

[] The Illithid staying in their waters so far makes them seem uninterested in PoB-matters.
I see little need to retcon that, DP, if only so we can all breathe easier with fewer plates up there.
But decide what they are doing if they aren't going to dedicate their time fucking with us.



I hope I made my point. There's always more, ofc.

Please keep planning and fluffing.

We can live without updates for some time perfectly fine if it means more consistent and better story later.
...And I'm pretty sure you know it deep inside already :p
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Click to shrink...
Seconded. Each of these need their own tailored backstories, tools, and motivations. Not just a vague "Well I think this is what they'd probably do." Otherwise they will inevitably come across as caricatures of themselves rather than fully realized characters, because rather than planning around the villain we'll end up planning around single encounters while the villain does jack shit outside of that.

@DragonParadox, I also don't trust that you have enough background notes written out after only a day of doing it. If you absolutely can't stand not writing for a bit then fine, but don't abandon your notes in the process. You yourself admitted it was nearly impossible to keep them all straight in your head.
 
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The Political System of Slaver's Bay
  • Informational
    • The Political of Slaver's Bay​

    At its heart the political system prevalent in Slaver's Bay is meant to echo that of Old Ghis which is no more, but many of its institutions have grown hollow with the shift in social dynamics and cultural pressures following first the defeat at the hands of Valyria, then the domination of the economy by the slave trade.

    The Assembly of the City
    At the foundation of every city's rule is the Assembly, the gathering of all citizens above the age of thirty who each initially voted in their own name and by their own conscience. It used to be called every six months to deliberate for a full month, though the times have grown longer and longer and its role more and more formal as power slipped to the more aristocratic institutions.

    The Preators of the People
    Ten in number are then elected by the Assembly effectively for life, and in modern times they are generally those who offer the most lavish feasts and most extravagant games out of pocket since it is a position of the Assembly any citizen who can vote in the institution can also run for election as Preator. The Great Families tend to put their younger sons up for election. The Mob seemingly appreciates youth and vigor, some of the more notorious Preators over the year have even taken to the Fighting Pits themselves to prove their mettle 'as their ancestors did'.

    The Council of the Elect, or the Highborn
    The term is more literal than in other places since it is literally the council of families who have erected a pyramid, for their own prestige and power, given permission following some military triumph or act of great piety. Though the number of families that qualify ranges from 54 in Meereen to 69 in Yunkai to an impressive 116 in Astapor the actual membership of the council is set to an auspicious 33. The composition is decided on the basis of 'deeds and character of note' by the most senior religious personage in the city, the Green Grace and the Preators of the People.

    In days of old that involved military victories, grand building programs, and even 'bringing more earth under the plow' which is widely supposed to have involved magic as much as irrigation. Not long after the region was conquered by Valyria a motion was raised and passed in the assembly that slaves be brought into the city with silver or born locally should count as much towards a family's prestige as those gained in foreign wars. Institutionalized slavery thus became not only economically but politically advantageous.

    No member of the Council may be younger than 40. Proxies may be named in the case of a younger or female heir. While women cannot hold political office by Ghiscari law they can pass on the family name and property to their heirs as well as naming proxies.

    The mandate of the Elect is twenty years, but some accounts go up from just three years in Old Ghis.

    The Tribunes
    Sometimes called simply 'the Blooded' for the crimson tokrar of office the three Tribunes, any of which can veto the actions of the others and therefore must act in unison, are technically the ones who make peace and war, settle wide scale trade deals, and negotiate with foreign powers. After the Century of Blood the latter has usually meant Dothraki khalasars. They are elected by the Council from among its number for a period of five years, though there is no limit to the number of successive terms one might hold as Tribune and some have ruled as kings in all but name, limited by no power save their own ultimate mortality

    OOC: Surprise informational post since this is all stuff you guys should know in character so I saw no reason to keep it out of the thread. Devils also now have their own agendas and the Sons of the Harpy have factions, though of course that is opaque to Viserys and company.
     
    Last edited:
  • Informational
    • Perhaps, one might say, as ironically opaque as Viserys' own motivations to others. :V

    What would they think if they knew we rescued cats with the same gravitas as we made life altering decisions...
     
    Duesal said:
    That's the spot reserved for a temple dedicated to the Imperial Pantheon as a whole once we get the gods to sit down and agree to unity against common enemies. They've only just started working together.
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    It's actually being build right now. Work was started in parallel with the palace, so it should be almost completed already, what with being a lot smaller then the palace.
     
    Duesal said:
    That's the spot reserved for a temple dedicated to the Imperial Pantheon as a whole once we get the gods to sit down and agree to unity against common enemies. They've only just started working together.
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    Do we want to spend time and actively induct into our Main Pantheon such Deities as:
    1) Drunken God
    2) Blind God
    3) Beard-God of Norvos
    ?

    We can probably come to a fine enough arrangement with all but the last one, and get more firepower against...
    Well, the 15th is the next target on the list of "using the Elements of Harmony Well Of Eternity to melt the face off" afaik?

    It is somewhat "bogging down" again however, and although pretty major entities, they had been near-inconsequential in the story so far, and it would seem no different from pointless MAs we've been doing as recently as a year ago OOC.
     
    egoo said:
    Do we want to spend time and actively induct into our Main Pantheon such Deities as:
    1) Drunken God
    2) Blind God
    3) Beard-God of Norvos
    ?

    We can probably come to a fine enough arrangement with all but the last one, and get more firepower against...
    Well, the 15th is the next target on the list of "using the Elements of Harmony Well Of Eternity to melt the face off" afaik?

    It is somewhat "bogging down" again however, and although pretty major entities, they had been near-inconsequential in the story so far, and it would seem no different from pointless MAs we've been doing as recently as a year ago OOC.
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    1) I'm hesitant given how easy it was for some random alchemist to infiltrate that religion and wreck havoc. I'd consider it if they got their affairs in order, but they've only ever presented themselves as a drunken mess.
    2) It depends on how his priests interact with us.
    3) The priesthood is currently hostile towards us. That needs to calm down before we consider it.

    As far as the next target for the Well of Eternity I genuinely don't know. We should probably clear out the other Valyrian ruins before moving on Valyria proper itself, though.
     
    Azel said:
    I'd rather ignore the minor gods entirely and Valyria for a good long while.
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    Seconded, especially on Valyria. Way too many plates spinning as is. We need to conquer Qohor and Norvos simultaneously, then we need to subjugate the western provinces and deal with that political mess for a few months at least, and in the middle of all this we need to keep up the intrigue battle against Asmodeus in Slaver's Bay.

    After that's done we can turn our attention elsewhere.
     
    DragonParadox said:
    The Political System of Slaver's Bay​

    At its heart, the political system prevalent in Slaver's Bay is meant to echo that of Old Ghis which is no more, but many of its institutions have grown hollow with the shift in social dynamics and cultural pressures following first the defeat at the hands of Valyria, then the domination of the economy by the slave trade.

    The Assembly of the City
    At the foundation of every city's rule is the Assembly, the gathering of all citizens above the age of thirty who each initially voted in their own name and by their own conscience. It used to be called every six months to deliberate for a full month, though the times have grown longer and longer and its role more and more formal as power slipped to the more aristocratic institutions.

    The Preators of the People
    Ten in number, they are elected by the Assembly effectively for life in modern times. They are generally those who offer the most lavish feasts and most extravagant games out of pocket. Since it is a position of the Assembly, any citizen who can vote in the institution can also run for election as Preator. The Great Families tend to put their younger sons up for election. The Mob seemingly appreciates youth and vigor, and some of the more notorious Preators over the year have even taken to the fighting Pits themselves to prove their mettle 'as their ancestors did'.

    The Council of the Elect, or the Highborn
    The term is more literal than in other places, since it is literally the council of families who have erected a pyramid for their own prestige and power, given permission following some military triumph or act of great piety. Though the number of families that qualify ranges from 54 in Mereen and 69 in Yunkai, to an impressive 116 in Astapor, the actual membership of the council is set to an auspicious 33. The composition is decided on the basis of 'deeds and character of note' by the most senior religious personage in the city, the Green Grace, and the Preators of the People.

    In days of old, that involved military victories, grand building programs, and even 'bringing more earth under the plow', which is widely supposed to have involved magic as much as irrigation. Not long after the region was conquered by Valyria, a motion was raised and passed in the assembly that slaves brought into the city with silver or born locally should count as much towards a family's prestige as those gained in foreign wars. Institutionalized slavery thus became not only economically but also politically advantageous.

    No member of the Council may be younger than 40. Proxies may be named in the case of a younger or female heir. While women cannot hold political office by Ghiscari law, they can pass on the family name and property to their heirs as well as naming proxies.

    The mandate of the Elect is twenty years, by some accounts up from just three years in Old Ghis.

    The Tribunes
    Sometimes called simply 'the Blooded' for their crimson tokrar of office, the three tribunes, any of which can veto the actions of the others and therefore must act in unison, are technically the ones who make peace and war, settle wide-scale trade deals, and negotiate with foreign powers. After the Century of Blood, the latter has usually meant dealing with Dothraki Khalassars. They are elected by the Council from among its number for a period of five years, though there is no limit to the number of successive terms one might hold as tribune. Some have ruled as kings in all but name limited by no power save their own ultimate mortality.

    OOC: Surprise informational post since this is all stuff you guys should know in character, so I saw no reason to keep it out of the thread. Devils also now have their own agendas and the Sons of the Harpy have factions, though of course that is opaque to Viserys and company. Not yet edited
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    Here's an edited version of the infopost, DP.
     
    Azel said:
    It's actually being build right now. Work was started in parallel with the palace, so it should be almost completed already, what with being a lot smaller then the palace.
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    So we're building a temple before checking if any Gods will want it?

    Well then. Daenerys' views on religion really do boil down to "Ankh-Morpok with more hubris".
     
    TalonofAnathrax said:
    So we're building a temple before checking if any Gods will want it?

    Well then. Daenerys' views on religion really do boil down to "Ankh-Morpok with more hubris".
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    In fairness I'm pretty confident we should be able to convince the core deities to cooperate, and that seeing them benefit will prompt the other gods to throw their lot in. They already had a taste of victory through unity against Tiamat and benefited a lot from it. The promise of more should have them drooling.
     
    @Azel, @Duesal, I agree.
    I wouldn't have asked about minor Gods if I cared too much, I would've just slapped that into MAs, since no one ever cares about those.
    Mwha. Ha. Ha.
    [:V]

    If we assume DP takes the side if reason and we can take Squids and Efreeti off our immediate threat-to-handle-list, it seems our priorities are like this:

    1) CoS, so we dont have to fight them as well during Reconquest.
    2) Norvos/Quohor, because shit's be going down, yo.

    3) Reconquest proper.
    3.1) Lannisters are the only actual opponent, though?
    3.2) Some time gotta be taken to consolidate Westeros too.

    4) Slavers' Bay actual.

    5) Grabbing the rest of Essos/doing dungeon-delves in Sothoryos and Valyria/looking into dealing with Drow, Underdark and Llolth/

    6) ---Here--- we can start planning delving into Valyria's heart and killing the 15th, unless Warlocks of Quarth shape up to be an apocalyptic threat as well.

    7) Squids and Efreeti and prepping for the Long Night and dealing with Yi-Ti and the Blood Emperor.

    ...It really gets confusing after Slavers' Bay, yea.
     
    TalonofAnathrax said:
    So we're building a temple before checking if any Gods will want it?

    Well then. Daenerys' views on religion really do boil down to "Ankh-Morpok with more hubris".
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    Ironically enough, the place is kinda inspired by the Temple of Small Gods.

    Also, the gods don't object to Braavos having a group-temple, so if anyone complains, we will city precedent and that is that.
     
    Duesal said:
    In fairness I'm pretty confident we should be able to convince the core deities to cooperate, and that seeing them benefit will prompt the other gods to throw their lot in. They already had a taste of victory through unity against Tiamat and benefited a lot from it. The promise of more should have them drooling.
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    Our plans:
    1. Make alliances with a bunch of disparate Gods with completely different personalities and goals (the OG and Jazirian don't exactly share a moral code, for example)
    2. Build a divine, nonsentient Road-God-thing in the dreamworld. It'll gather divine power and will have passive beneficial effects on the dreamworld (and possibly Feywild too, by metaphysically beefing up our road system). We can then hand out this divine power as a sort of Divine Carrot when negotiating with gods.
      • We hope to eventually use this as an afterlife of sorts, but we haven't even seen the first rung of the research ladder to achieve that. Long-term goal. I'd call it a stretch goal if we weren't so committed to achieving it.
    3. Convince them to make a shared pantheon for PR purposes, which basically means combining commandments and pooling prayers (this helps the weaker Gods more than the stronger ones, and will require them to discuss things between themselves before creating new prophets or commandments). Our only arguments are "we have shared enemies" and "check out this amazing carrot I'm offering!"
    4. Build temples for this Pantheon and advertise it
    And we're doing step 4 before step 2?
    Amazing. Truly, our hubris known no bounds.

    Azel said:
    Ironically enough, the place is kinda inspired by the Temple of Small Gods.
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    Ankh-Morpok has a temple that was built before finding a God for it, and in the end no God wanted it despite how nice the building was.

    Azel said:
    Also, the gods don't object to Braavos having a group-temple, so if anyone complains, we will city precedent and that is that.
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    Braavos has a group temple for Gods that actually matter?
    Aside from the Faceless stuff, but that's the result of some sort of age-old pact that we doesn't seem easy to replicate.
     
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