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A Sword Without a Hilt: A Song of Ice and Fire/D&D 3.5 Crossover

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I'd just like to take this opportunity to remind everyone that the reason we wanted a tree in Hellven is because the OG have a stated desire to have one there, specifically so that they can keep an eye on the void. We also have word of Bloodraven that growing one the normal way is probably a Bad Idea there, so we should try to move a full grown one instead.
 
I'm not against going to Nirvana, adventuring, diplomacy, and perhaps even claiming territory...eventually.

We have too many other immediately pressing issues for that right now, though. It will be a while before we can justify such a trip, but I look forward to it.
 
Absylon Quilby said:
I'd just like to take this opportunity to remind everyone that the reason we wanted a tree in Hellven is because the OG have a stated desire to have one there, specifically so that they can keep an eye on the void. We also have word of Bloodraven that growing one the normal way is probably a Bad Idea there, so we should try to move a full grown one instead.
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We know.

The thing is it's not currently feasible to bring a tree there. If we brought a tree there we'd need to guard it, and given that Heaven is run by Asmodeus at the moment we're hardly confident we'd be able to keep the tree safe.
 
Duesal said:
Nirvana is relevant to insanely long-term goals, not now.
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Not exactly insanely long-term goals, we are planning to invade Westeros soonish are we not? We should have planted a Heart Tree in a Void damaged plane, at least a few months before that, because the perspective that Heart Tree will give the old gods, will make them likely to either go easier on the Seven, or at least agree to the reparations demanded of the Seven, being something like the Seven, providing a set number of angels for a set number of years, who will assist in the protection of Heart Trees in the Upper planes.
 
Absylon Quilby said:
I'd just like to take this opportunity to remind everyone that the reason we wanted a tree in Hellven is because the OG have a stated desire to have one there, specifically so that they can keep an eye on the void. We also have word of Bloodraven that growing one the normal way is probably a Bad Idea there, so we should try to move a full grown one instead.
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Yeah but you can with 90% certainly substitute Nirvana or Elysium for Hellven, all 3 of those are Upper Planes damaged by the Void, Hellven is the hardest to protect a Heart Tree in, so I'm proposing to grow it in Nirvana instead, where there are Fortress cities populated by Celestials still fighting the Fall, as those cities are already under attack, and so we wont need to provide near as much protection to the Heart Tree, as the Fortress city's protections will protect it too.
 
tarrangar said:
Not exactly insanely long-term goals, we are planning to invade Westeros soonish are we not? We should have planted a Heart Tree in a Void damaged plane, at least a few months before that, because the perspective that Heart Tree will give the old gods, will make them likely to either go easier on the Seven, or at least agree to the reparations demanded of the Seven, being something like the Seven, providing a set number of angels for a set number of years, who will assist in the protection of Heart Trees in the Upper planes.
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The Old Gods already crit on their response to remembering the Void again. Merely planting a tree in a Void-sundered plane is going to have minimal returns at best.

Bottomline, I'd prefer sticking to Prime Material instead of going off on yet another extraplanar jaunt. There's way too much to do here for us to split our attention like that.
 
Duesal said:
The Old Gods already crit on their response to remembering the Void again. Merely planting a tree in a Void-sundered plane is going to have minimal returns at best.

Bottomline, I'd prefer sticking to Prime Material instead of going off on yet another extraplanar jaunt. There's way too much to do here for us to split our attention like that.
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That's not how minds work, the Ravens were great for reminding them of the Void, but they're a temporary look at them, growing a Heart Tree in a void damaged area, is a constant reminder of the damage the Void do.

That's part of what's keeping their hatred of the Seven fresh as well, their Heart Trees grow in areas with the Seven, and so they're reminded of the Seven, growing in an area damaged by the Void, will constantly remind them of their hatred of the Void.

And we have an actual quest from them, that mean it's important to them, at minimum I expect planting that tree will get us a second roll, for how much of their hatred refocuses on the Void.
 
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tarrangar said:
That's not how minds work, the Ravens were great for reminding them of the Void, but they're a temporary look at them, growing a Heart Tree in a void damaged area, is a constant reminder of the damage the Void do.

That's part of what's keeping their hatred of the Seven fresh as well, their Heart Trees grow in areas with the Seven, and so they're reminded of the Seven, growing in an area damaged by the Void, will constantly remind them of their hatred of the Void.

And we have an actual quest from them, that mean it's important to them, at minimum I expect planting that tree will get us a second roll, for how much of their hatred refocuses on the Void.
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That's a bit of a leap, dude. The reason they wanted us to put a Heart Tree near the Void is because they remembered their great enemy and want to keep an eye on it. They don't need to be constantly reminded of it. The memory didn't just fade into the background now that it's resurfaced.

Furthermore, the request wasn't to put a tree into one of the Celestial Planes, it was to put a tree right there in the defiled corpse of Mount Celestia where the Void currently is. Putting a tree in Nirvana by all rights shouldn't fulfill the terms of the request.
 
tarrangar said:
That's not how minds work, the Ravens were great for reminding them of the Void, but they're a temporary look at them, growing a Heart Tree in a void damaged area, is a constant reminder of the damage the Void do.

That's part of what's keeping their hatred of the Seven fresh as well, their Heart Trees grow in areas with the Seven, and so they're reminded of the Seven, growing in an area damaged by the Void, will constantly remind them of their hatred of the Void.

And we have an actual quest from them, that mean it's important to them, at minimum I expect planting that tree will get us a second roll, for how much of their hatred refocuses on the Void.
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If you want the Old Gods to be more merciful towards the Seven we should either get more Andal lords convert or start more diplomatic talks with the Chosen.
 
I wouldn't be against some scouting in Nirvana, to find potential allies or trade opportunities, but it'd have to be a short trip. A more involved mission there could wait until we've decided what to do with the information we gathered previously.

[X] Yes, the knowledge will serve him well
 
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065tdsa said:
I wouldn't be against some scouting in Nirvana, to find potential allies or trade opportunities, but it'd have to be a short trip.
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By the very nature of where it is and how much time would need to be spend world-building, setting up the entire place, introducing new characters and/or enemies, and DP doing a whole lot of background rolls, there's no way in hell a scouting trip would be short. We've got dozens of extraplanar arcs that show this. They are never short.
 
Just for the record, there is no real Void related damage to Nirvana and Elysium.

The main issue for Nirvana is a few millennia worth of Warring States Periods between the Angels, Petitioner Factions, Illithids, Daemons, Demons and other, minor groups, all caught up in shifting alliances and conflicts.

Elysium on the other hand has 'merely' an issue with dissolving back into primordial chaos, being subsumed by Limbo and the Abyss while beings basically a lawless nowhere in political terms, baring the occasionally city-state.

The only place with a lot of Void taint is Heaven. Which is a good thing, because otherwise the state of the universe would be significantly worse.
 
silvanknight said:
If you want the Old Gods to be more merciful towards the Seven we should either get more Andal lords convert or start more diplomatic talks with the Chosen.
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The way I see it is that some of us want to make it so that it is all hunky-dory and a light slap on the wrist is going to solve the pissed off Old Gods who had their sacred groves defiled and destroyed. It is honestly a tad aggravating.
 
One Autumn Leaf said:
The way I see it is that some of us want to make it so that it is all hunky-dory and a light slap on the wrist is going to solve the pissed off Old Gods who had their sacred groves defiled and destroyed. It is honestly a tad aggravating.
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I'm entirely with you on that, but the thread has a habit of things like this.

I for one still thing a High Septon and a few Chosen are a good step towards revenge. Especially as the thread hates Lucan with a passion and that makes conflict with the other Chosen pretty inevitable.
 
I dont have the best memory but didnt the Father explicitly warn Lucian about us when he awakened as a cleric?

Not the Others, not Fiends, not the rage of the Old Gods, hell not even magic itself awakening that will tempt poor pious souls from their Light?

Us.
 
silvanknight said:
I dont have the best memory but didnt the Father explicitly warn Lucian about us when he awakened as a cleric?

Not the Others, not Fiends, not the rage of the Old Gods, hell not even magic itself awakening that will tempt poor pious souls from their Light?

Us.
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Yep.

Look at how much blood sacrifice we've been getting up to.

And our flesh forged, fungus forged, and undead abominations.

And courting lots and lots of foreign gods.

And our plans to subvert the Faith of the Seven.

We're arguably a bigger threat to them than actual Devils.
 
Azel said:
Just for the record, there is no real Void related damage to Nirvana and Elysium.

The main issue for Nirvana is a few millennia worth of Warring States Periods between the Angels, Petitioner Factions, Illithids, Daemons, Demons and other, minor groups, all caught up in shifting alliances and conflicts.

Elysium on the other hand has 'merely' an issue with dissolving back into primordial chaos, being subsumed by Limbo and the Abyss while beings basically a lawless nowhere in political terms, baring the occasionally city-state.

The only place with a lot of Void taint is Heaven. Which is a good thing, because otherwise the state of the universe would be significantly worse.
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Well that make Nirvana a good deal less urgent I guess.
 
Honestly, I'm not sure if any Planar trip will happen in the foreseeable future.

[] Hellven waited for millenia and haven't broken further yet.
[] Nirvana's wars lasted for even longer.
[] Axis we can send our minions to, in order to assess the situation.
[] Turning Marid against the Efreeti... well, we won't be able to get more than 3-4 of the states off the bat, and it'd be a waste of our time to do their errands for that little.
[] Waging war with Efreeti our minions do well enough. The Raid on the Mint being the only exception, really.
[] Trying to grab the Hex-Dragon/personally diplomance the Lich-Salamander/to loot "the sundered Divine Forge" our Hadhayosh spoke of/to fish in the depths of PoW/to look into the Char-Serpents is a pure pokemon'ing with little to no narrative reason for us to focus on those.


The latest PoW trip has shown, that focusing on minor stuff like that really gets us... ah, off the path of the decent narrative, and stretches out beyond any reasonable comprehension.

Even trips to Sothoryos/Valyria are kinda bad with how they stretch meanderingly - and unlike our first go to either, we currently have next to no plothooks to go into the ancient cities of snek (we were looking for eggs the first time), nor to ancient cities of Valyrians (we were fulfilling Syrax's prophecy the first time).
 
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