Mate, that I joined Lonelywolf's quest doesn't mean I have any idea what those CKs are like, I never played those.
:/

And you are assuming much, I think.
Dragons.
Do I need to say more? Their genetics are as likely to stay transfixed as to scatter, simply because, again, Dragons.

We really should get DPs ruling on this if we can IC, Imo.

If we can't know that IC, fine, let's do that regardless - I'm just distrustful off the bullshit that can spawn Time and Prismatic Dragons in a random clutch of Chromatics if chances fall just right (like, one in several hundred thousand or so, iirc, but it's still a fucking possibility) in 3.5.
 
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And you are assuming much, I think.
Dragons.
Do I need to say more? Their genetics are as likely to stay transfixed as to scatter, simply because, again, Dragons.
Well, I have to go with some kind of baseline and while it's sensibly possible for a species to be as ludicrously inbreeding resistant as Dragons, no species is immune to genetic recombination.

And if we assume all those traits to be recessive, or merely a rare stacking of beneficial genes, they should all become rare pretty quickly.


On a related note, I'm already having a 5 Kobold party / Five-Kobold Band mentally ready. Yet more characters come forth. Bloody muse. :facepalm:

For the record:
- Magus - Teamleader
- Rogue - The Lancer
- Sorcerer - The Smart Guy
- Barbarian - The Big Guy
- Bard - The Chick
 
Would the Kobold names be like dragon names (and Valyrian/Latin and Greek sounding for the most part), or like "Shatterscale" or something?
 
I'm an idiot that put in the wrong name because I'm rushing on my cell.

While I thank you for the answer, what I meant to ask is what does Elia Martell think of the subjects I brought up? We've heard little to nothing from someone that should be finding their balance, for lack of better words.

Oh I see, you are right she's been a touch under-exposed. I'll see if I can get and interlude in to do her justice rather than answering in a few lines OOC.
 
The Moonchaser would not fit. The point of bringing the ship is that is is impressive and that might help with negotiations.
We can carry the Moonchaser, and so we can teleport the Moonchaser, the shadow tower is for teleporting the crew, with them not on the Moonchaser, teleporting the Moonchaser is easy.
With all the dragons we keep meeting, we are eventually going to end up with an uncontrollable, drunk dragon party night sooner or latter. With hundreds of worried servants running around after their masters.

I don't drink, but it feels like something funny if we defeat a big enemy and forget who we are celebrating with.
I'm not sure if dragons can get drunk, poison immunity don't play well with getting drunk, and dragons are immune to nearly all ingested poisons.

So if dragons want to be drunk, they probably have to polymorph into a human body.
 
We can carry the Moonchaser, and so we can teleport the Moonchaser, the shadow tower is for teleporting the crew, with them not on the Moonchaser, teleporting the Moonchaser is easy.
I consider it highly unlikely that Viserys could haul something around that weights more then 25,000 metric tons.

Also, it's warded against translocation with only it's own planar drive being able to bypass that.
 
1. However lomg it takes.
2. No Good indoctrination of the entire species. Thank you.
3. I really don't share this interpretation
-a) See above. I don't share your worries.
-b) The species would advance entirely by class level, so thus shouldn't be possible.
-c) This us genuinely odd, as I could have sworn I picked it from the Forge post.
-d) That one isn't helping. They need higher mentals first and foremost to learn faster and lead later on.
4. I'm not sure why Viserys couldn't have the idea on his own.
2) Wasn't thinking about alignment at all, just effectiveness as teachers. No biggy if we don't use them.

3) To me the template reads like Super Alexander the Great In A Bottle (™). There are going to be too many supernaturally effective leaders among them and far too few followers, IMO. Maybe keep the mental attribute and skill bonuses and other abilities, but lose everything else, or at least the Born to Lead and Enchanting Presence abilities? Enchanting Presence is especially problematic, since it is an automatic Mind-Affecting effect which is applied to everyone who comes within 30 feet of them. The effect itself is relatively mild, thankfully, but it's still something that requires a Will save and could cause issues. The more I look at this template, the more I think it should be at least +2 CR, maybe even +3 if applied to Bards, Sorcerers, or anything else with a modified Charisma attribute of 16+.
c) Nope, we haven't encountered it anywhere, yet.
d) Half-Dragon would be a very nice substitute, too. Despite being a +2 CR template and costing a bit more, it's actually quite reasonable. Combined with the Advanced template, it would make the G1s exceptionally strong and tough, and their mental attributes would be very high. Flight is always great to have, too.

4) Viserys could come up with it, and I won't argue against him when the time comes to kick the project into motion, but it just fits Lady Saenena better IMO. Regaining lost and forbidden knowledge, including the existence and creation of Kobolds by ancient Valyrians, was her life's work prior to the Doom. It was completely forbidden and would have seen her put to death, at a minimum, if the authorities had learned what she was doing. Then after we restored her humanity and helped Resurrect her children, one of the first things she did with her new life was to complete her previous research, which allowed us to grow Kobolds once more. It makes sense that she would go one or two steps further and work out how to introduce a new species of Kobolds to the world. Viserys does amazing stuff all the time, so it's nice to see our other people pull off cool shit, too.
 
I consider it highly unlikely that Viserys could haul something around that weights more then 25,000 metric tons.

Also, it's warded against translocation with only it's own planar drive being able to bypass that.
Didn't the Inn have at least 10% of that weight? And we have gotten a lot more carry capacity since then, combining that with the fact that the Moonchaser is currently underwater, which should increase our carry capacity quite a bit, as things effective weights, are lessened by their 1 kilo for every liter of water they displace, and I think we should easily be able to lift it, the ward is a good point though, unless we can temporarily turn that off, we can't teleport the Moonchaser.
 
Didn't the Inn have at least 10% of that weight? And we have gotten a lot more carry capacity since then, combining that with the fact that the Moonchaser is currently underwater, which should increase our carry capacity quite a bit, as things effective weights, are lessened by their 1 kilo for every liter of water they displace, and I think we should easily be able to lift it, the ward is a good point though, unless we can temporarily turn that off, we can't teleport the Moonchaser.
The buoyancy shouldn't affect anything for sanity reasons. Trust me, that no exploit you want to work, unless you enjoy getting colony-dropped all the time.

d) Half-Dragon would be a very nice substitute, too. Despite being a +2 CR template and costing a bit more, it's actually quite reasonable. Combined with the Advanced template, it would make the G1s exceptionally strong and tough, and their mental attributes would be very high. Flight is always great to have, too.
My issue with this compromise is that it doesn't boost mentals that much compared to the tremendous physical bonuses.
 
We can carry the Moonchaser, and so we can teleport the Moonchaser, the shadow tower is for teleporting the crew, with them not on the Moonchaser, teleporting the Moonchaser is easy.
That's really convoluted and silly, dude.

If we're going to do that, there's no reason to use a ship at all. We could just build an immobile fortified structure lined with guns, transport it to a destination, then portal Gate everyone in to man it.
Didn't the Inn have at least 10% of that weight? And we have gotten a lot more carry capacity since then, combining that with the fact that the Moonchaser is currently underwater, which should increase our carry capacity quite a bit, as things effective weights, are lessened by their 1 kilo for every liter of water they displace, and I think we should easily be able to lift it, the ward is a good point though, unless we can temporarily turn that off, we can't teleport the Moonchaser.
Not even close. That inn was just a small building of wood, stone, and miscellaneous stuff. Heavy, but just a tiny fraction of a Moonchaser.

25,000 tons is 50,000,000 pounds. Using every buff spell and carrying capacity enhancing effect I can think of off the top of my head, we can push Viserys' capacity to around 15,000,000 for a very short time frame, and it would require several high level spells to accomplish even that.
 
25,000 tons is 50,000,000 pounds. Using every buff spell and carrying capacity enhancing effect I can think of off the top of my head, we can push Viserys' capacity to around 15,000,000 for a very short time frame, and it would require several high level spells to accomplish even that.
Metric tons.

That's 25,000 metric tons = 55,115,566 pounds.
 
My issue with this compromise is that it doesn't boost mentals that much compared to the tremendous physical bonuses.
Their overall attributes would still be amazing, though.

With Half-Dragon and Advanced, they're looking at:
+12 Strength
+10 Constitution
+4 Dexterity
+6 Intelligence
+4 Wisdom
+6 Charisma
+6 Natural Armor

Add that to their natural attribute bonuses and penalties and you end up with this, along with another +2 to assign somewhere:
+8 Strength
+8 Constitution
+6 Dexterity
+6 Intelligence
+4 Wisdom
+6 Charisma
+7 Natural Armor

That works out to a very even spread of bonuses.

Assuming they start with the non-Elite Array (13, 12, 11, 10, 9, 8), there's no way to shuffle their stats and the bonuses which can be applied to them that doesn't result in a superhuman being.

Here's an example, emphasizing mental attributes over physical, with the extra +2 assigned to Intelligence.
16 Strength
18 Constitution
17 Dexterity
21 Intelligence
16 Wisdom
17 Charisma

EDIT: Even with an emphasis on mental over physical attributes, one of these guys would have a base starting AC of 21, which is higher than an average Human in fullplate armor, never mind that they would be better in every other way, too.
 
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@Goldfish, I'm just leery of giving G1 absolutely superhuman bodies and G2 just... regular human quality bodies.

The drop in STR and CON is extremely sharp.
 
Ah, screw it. Gonna have to trust the Leshies to beat some sense into the G1s if necessary.

The only other solution I can think of would be to nail Draconic onto G2 and G3 while making a G4 batch after all.
 
@Goldfish, I'm just leery of giving G1 absolutely superhuman bodies and G2 just... regular human quality bodies.

The drop in STR and CON is extremely sharp.
The drop in physical attributes is sharp, but they would still be much better than an average Human, despite being much smaller.

Using the same stat spread as my example above, a mental-focused level one G2 would look like this:
8 Strength
12 Constitution
15 Dexterity
19 Intelligence
15 Wisdom
16 Charisma

8 Strength on a Small-sized creature is actually really good. And there's nothing that says the dump stat has to be applied to Strength. It could go to Dexterity and they would still have a Dexterity bonus, or to a mental attribute and that attribute would still be above Human average.

A combat-focused level one G2 could go for something like this and be a deadly little monster while still being mentally superior to 95%+ of humanity;
11 Strength
14 Constitution
21 Dexterity
13 Intelligence
14 Wisdom
12 Charisma
 
Come to think of...
Add that to their natural attribute bonuses and penalties and you end up with this, along with another +2 to assign somewhere:
+8 Strength
+8 Constitution
+6 Dexterity
+6 Intelligence
+4 Wisdom
+6 Charisma
+7 Natural Armor
With the alternate race features Sturdy and Giant, this becomes:
+2 to any one score
+14 Strength
+12 Constitution
+4 Dexterity
+4 Intelligence
+2 Wisdom
+4 Charisma
+7 Natural Armor

Sweet Dragonjeebus, that's one killy chassis for a martial class.
 
Come to think of...

With the alternate race features Sturdy and Giant, this becomes:
+2 to any one score
+14 Strength
+12 Constitution
+4 Dexterity
+4 Intelligence
+2 Wisdom
+4 Charisma
+7 Natural Armor

Sweet Dragonjeebus, that's one killy chassis for a martial class.
I don't have any issues with killy Imperial Kobolds, but I don't think we should let any major genetic variations like that creep into the G1s or G2s. Those are the Kobolds coming out of the Forges, so we should expect more stability and uniformity in them. Only in the natural born G3s and later should that sort of variation be possible.

EDIT: Updated the Imperial Kobold link in the Forge Mechanics page, BTW. It now points to the full post.

EDIT #2: Actually, looking over the various alternate racial traits available to Imperial Kobolds, it makes even more sense for the G1s to have the Half-Dragon template. That's provides a very neat and clean explanation for the draconic traits that can express in G3s and later generations.
 
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I don't have any issues with killy Imperial Kobolds, but I don't think we should let any major genetic variations like that creep into the G1s or G2s. Those are the Kobolds coming out of the Forges, so we should expect more stability and uniformity in them. Only in the natural born G3s and later should that sort of variation be possible.

EDIT: Updated the Imperial Kobold link in the Forge Mechanics page, BTW. It now points to the full post.
If we want these variations, they need to be introduced into the forge-made batches, as they won't be occurring naturally. Unless we messed up the genepool somehow.
 
If we want these variations, they need to be introduced into the forge-made batches, as they won't be occurring naturally. Unless we messed up the genepool somehow.
Added this to my previous post, but too late for you to see it before replying:
EDIT #2: Actually, looking over the various alternate racial traits available to Imperial Kobolds, it makes even more sense for the G1s to have the Half-Dragon template. That's provides a very neat and clean explanation for the draconic traits that can express in G3s and later generations.
 
Added this to my previous post, but too late for you to see it before replying:
Yeah, I've come around to Half-Dragon instead of Suzerain. Especially since it could be reasonably said that the odd Kobold in later generations might win the full Half-Dragon template in the genetic lottery and I like myself some Chosen One material in my created species.

As for the other ARFs, I'd only apply Sturdy in G1 and G2 to not intentionally make idiots, but I think Giant should be available in all generations.

Mind. A lot if ARFs make little to no sense on G1 due to being entirely superseded by Half-Dragon. The main exception being Emperor Blessed.
 
What happens if two half-dragons create offspring?
Guaranteed Half-Dragon offspring. If the two Half-Dragon parents are of different types, though, such as a Red and a Brine, the resulting offspring could come out as any type of Half-Dragon.

D(ragon)NA is weird.
 
Hey @Azel , since these Imperial Kobolds have a bunch of different templates for the G1, G2, and G3. I'm assuming their age-span is quite different to each other as well. (Considering that some of them would have Half-Dragon template).

My Question is: What is the estimated life-span of these creatures for each of the G1, G2, and G3 provided that they died of natural cause and no exposure to violence?
 
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