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A Sword Without a Hilt: A Song of Ice and Fire/D&D 3.5 Crossover

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Snowfire said:
Let's slow down a little there, cowboy. If Cersei kills Robert (likely) and we can prove it, she dies. Jamie is a difficult case, given we know why he did what he did. Tywin is executed. Just executed. There's no need to draw it out beyond wanting to be gratuitous. Gerion and Lanna are entirely flippable, mainly on the basis of their children and how Lanna has had it up to here with Tywin's desperate belief that he's a threat to us. And probably also his use of charm magic to influence the nobles of Lannisport. Ditto Tyrion.

But if you could step the hell away from forced sterilisation of children, that would be great.
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I mean the more traditional means to eliminate the potential claimants that have plagued royal families in the past, and specifically Targaryen with the distant descendants of one legitimized bastard going on to become literally a Tiamat-scale threat...

...would be to execute them all, or send them to the Wall, which is just an elaborate form of execution considering the threats they will be facing.
 
Crake said:
I mean the more traditional means to eliminate the potential claimants that have plagued royal families in the past, and specifically Targaryen with the distant descendants of one legitimized bastard going on to become literally a Tiamat-scale threat...

...would be to execute them all, or send them to the Wall, which is just an elaborate form of execution considering the threats they will be facing.
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Precisely why I advocate sterilization. That's better than lopping the childrens heads off.
 
Crake said:
I mean the more traditional means to eliminate the potential claimants that have plagued royal families in the past, and specifically Targaryen with the distant descendants of one legitimized bastard going on to become literally a Tiamat-scale threat...

...would be to execute them all, or send them to the Wall, which is just an elaborate form of execution considering the threats they will be facing.
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Which is part of the reason I want the Rock turned into a airforce base. It clearly voids any claims to the place, as it will cease to exist as a feudal keep.
 
If we do send Jaime and Joffrey to the wall, I have so many omake ideas there.

Bonus, if we defeat the white walkers, they might not actually end up as ice zombies or crowfood in the end. That and their watch would have ended.
 
@DragonParadox, how many Little Birds have we collected? After they're healed and given regenerated tongues, what do we do with them? Do we just give them to the Lesser Phoenixes?
 
Azel said:
I don't get the obsession with making people infertile all the time. What are we? Canadians?

Joffrey Waters - Wall, no questions here. Either he shapes up or Alliser will arrange an accident for him.
Tommen Waters - Too young for the Wall, so he is now pretty much a no-name street urchin. Given his temperament and personality, I would look into giving him a healers education or a place in a temple.
Myrcella Waters - Same as Tommen, though if she has magic, she might have a shot at a marriage to minor Essosi nobility.
Jaime Lannister - Probably making him a Hill and then throwing him at the Wall.
Cersei Lannister - You are now a Hill and a Silent Sister. Though I consider it vastly more likely that she will do something that gets her either the gallows or the tree.
Kevan Lannister - Takes on a new name, cutting all ties with the name Lannister. He is currently landless, so I would maybe give him some minor Lannister holding to administrate, otherwise we got many places where he could be useful.
Gerion and Lanna Lannister - They are now the new Reynes of Castamere. Maybe they become Dukes of the Traitorlands if they flip early enough.
Tyrion Lannister - Maybe he would like the name Tarbeck, with the keep to go with it? Otherwise, Gerion and Lanna can fully adopt him as a Reyne if they want.
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I agree with everything exept Myrcella.

She is one of the 4 people that could have been the true PC, the guy or gal that eventually has to stop the Long Night, has to grow in power until challenging him/her is no longer entertaining for writer and readers, the person this world is about.

I do believe given the chance she can likely become great enough that nobody will bring up that her parents won't matter.
 
Forced sterilization of children would seem pretty extreme to Viserys too if not precisely for the same reasons it might to us. Family (in the sense of blood not just name) is immensely important to westerosi nobles.
 
Artemis1992 said:
I agree with everything exept Myrcella.

She is one of the 4 people that could have been the true PC, the guy or gal that eventually has to stop the Long Night, has to grow in power until challenging him/her is no longer entertaining for writer and readers, the person this world is about.

I do believe given the chance she can likely become great enough that nobody will bring up that her parents won't matter.
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I'm iffy on that, due to her being a Warlock, a PC that is explicitly powered by another entity.

But hey, like Tommen, I want to keep her close and offer her a decent education. If she shows great promise as a mage, great. If not, also fine.
 
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Part MMDCXLII: Of Scars and Swords
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    • Of Scars and Swords​

    Twentieth Day of the Eighth Month 293 AC

    The sight of a warrior in utterly mundane if well crafted armor, bearing a sword that broke in his hand besting a Fury in battle is not one you will soon forget. Thus you take the time to look into the House of Mirrors, seeking the answers that had not yet made it onto your desk. Moonsong is not usually in the habit of uttering portents after all.

    "Fire and his brother..." you muse aloud, looking down at the answers scribbled on the page.

    "The scars? Do you think they might come together?" Dany asks after a moment. "Those do not look like the markings of intentional torture exactly, but..."

    "It is said the Mountain-that-Rides is prone to fits of rage," you finish tightly. Once you might have winced at how quickly your sister's thoughts turned to torture and other dark doings, but now you are happy for the aid, though there might be something to be said for gaining yet another helper.

    ***​

    "You wish to gain his allegiance?" Leto asks as soon as you mention the Hound.

    "Yes," you nod. "It seems the wisest course." Would she resent it? you wonder, wary of the Fury's abrupt manner. He did best her in a challenge of arms, a mere mortal against undying skill.

    "Good," the Fallen One surprises you again. "He has too much skill, too much fire in him to use such base and poorly forged workings. He might as well wear a tunic and pants so as not to die sweating."

    "He seems skillful enough to best most mortal foes," Dany interjects, trying to tease out whatever insights of the Hound Leto may possess.

    "It is not them he seeks to challenge," the Fury replies, the surety of aeons lived for bloodshed in her words. "One does not rise so swiftly to such heights without yearning for greater triumphs, be it for hate or greed or some other passion."

    So it is that the three of you find yourselves looking at the stone facade of an inn near the public baths, chosen you suspect for the stables attached, for Sandor had come with a horse—not a knight's destrier, only a courser from your spies' reports, but still a fine beast and well cared for.

    After passing by the innkeeper with a bit of sliver and a request to ignore any noise he may hearing the next few minutes, you hurry up the stairs and knock on the Hound's door... with predictable results.

    "Fuck off!" comes the rough voice from within, accompanied by the faint clank of metal. All of you could have gone through the door of course, but that would harm your ultimate goals far more than it would help.

    Leto speaks before you can. "Was my showing truly so poor on the sands that I am not worth opening the door for?"

    More clanking, then the door slams open, and Sandor Clegane shows himself still carrying a greave with its leather straps still cut from the fight.

    "What?" he rumbles before he even notices Dany or you, though if anything the expression on his mangled face only grows darker as he notices you, not a glimmer of fear in his eye. He does manage not to curse at you, possibly because not cursing royalty is a lesson in etiquette not even he could have failed to learn at court.

    "I wished to commend you on your showing, Clegane," you answer the question still hanging in the air. "Few would have made it past that fight. In recognition of that and the fact that your sword looked a great deal less salvageable than that," you motion to the piece of armor in his hand. "I wish to loan you a better blade."

    At the last word you reach into the folds of your cloak to produce an Adamantine greatsword, identical in heft and length to the one he had lost today. "I expect you won't be needing it once the melee is done, for you shall bear a better one." You finish holding out the sword.

    "Why are you really here?" he asks suspiciously.

    "I could pose the same question of you," you shrug. "Why are you on this island rather than being Cersei Baratheon's lapdog?"

    The willfully provocative words hang between you, the door creeks as his fingers tighten around it, but before the Hound can make up his mind to slam it in your face Dany speaks: "It can't be for the glory. I've ears sharp enough to hear what you shouted today at a cheering crowd, and if it is only gold or arms you seek then you have a strange way of showing it." She glances meaningfully at the still outstretched hilt of the sword.

    For a long moment the Hound scowls at her, at first thinking to scare her you imagine, then in simple bemusement of her clear inquiring gaze. Finally blurts out: "It isn't the first time I wore witch-work, but I left it all in the Red Keep. I've enough curses to my name without being called a thief besides."

    "Well you are obviously not stealing this one, Clegane," you allow a note of frustration to enter your voice. "Take it or leave it, don't leave me standing here like a servant with a plate of stuffed quail and a cup of wine."

    The absurd image you had conjured draws a rumble of what might be described as amusement from him. He slowly takes the blade, testing its balance. "This is good work," he says, and for a long moment you think that is all the thanks you can get. Then he sighs. "Thank you." Steeping back from the doorway he adds: "You can come in if you like."

    With that he returns to the bed and the task of fixing his armor, not precisely welcoming your company, but not resentful of it either.

    Leto does not seem particularly concerned with upsetting that equilibrium. "You didn't answer His Grace's question. Why are you here?"

    For a long moment there is silence, then it seems Clegane replies with you suspect intentionally shocking honesty: "I was looking for my brother in a place no one would give a shit if I killed him." He carefully searches each of your faces in turn, looking for something, though you could not say precisely what. Perhaps even he does not know.

    What do you say?

    [] Write in

    OOC: That went pretty well. Sandor is more confused than hostile right now, though that could obviously change. If there is one thing the Hound does not lack for it's anger.
     
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    • Surely there is a way to do it with no mutilation or detection. This is entirely pragmatic. No killing kids. They just conveniently never have heirs. Good luck proving anything. Better safe than sorry.
     
    Azel said:
    I'm iffy on that, due to her being a Warlock, a PC that is explicitly powered by another entity.

    But hey, like Tommen, I want to keep her close and offer her a decent education. If she shows great promise as a mage, great. If not, also fine.
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    It's more that the potential for greatness is in there. She doesn't have to be a warlock.

    I'm all for taking her under our wing and letting her make something of herself -- all as a loyal subject who owes everything to us, of course.
     
    Mister Phantom said:
    Surely there is a way to do it with no mutilation or detection. This is entirely pragmatic. No killing kids. They just conveniently never have heirs. Good luck proving anything. Better safe than sorry.
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    That is not really the issue, you are basically cutting off what should be a very major part of their lives and for what? Is the line of Joffrey, Myrcella and Tommen Waters really going to be such a threat to the dragon Emperor whose power stretches far beyond Westeros?
     
    DragonParadox said:
    That is not really the issue, you are basically cutting off what should be a very major part of their lives and for what? Is the line of Joffrey, Myrcella and Tommen Waters really going to be such a threat to the dragon Emperor whose power stretches far beyond Westeros?
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    What of Daemon's, who never lusted after the Throne but was driven to it, perhaps out of some twisted form of responsibility and a fire stoked by the grasping men around him?

    You don't need to desire in your heart of hearts that which is not yours, you only have to be convinced that it is not only your right, but your Destiny. See F!Aegon.
     
    For the record, I am not advocating forced sterilization, but we should be... careful... with all of them. Threats are not to be underestimated, they are to be eliminated or turned into assets, even friends.
     
    DragonParadox said:
    For a long moment there is silence, then it seems Clegane replies with you suspect intentionally shocking honesty: "I was looking for my brother in place no one would give a shit if I killed him." He carefully searches each of your faces in turn, looking for something, though you could not say precisely what. Perhaps even he does not know.
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    Oberyn would be so pissed.
    At least one person here would care.

    Though Clegane can say the Mountain killed his sister first, older rights count first.
     
    Mister Phantom said:
    No. The line of Cersei however is something not to gamble on.
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    What, the somewhat vicious obviously incompetent queen stupid enough not to have any trueborn children? Because that's what Viserys knows her as.

    Crake said:
    What of Daemon's, who never lusted after the Throne but was driven to it, perhaps out of some twisted form of responsibility and a fire stoked by the grasping men around him?

    You don't need to desire in your heart of hearts that which is not yours, you only have to be convinced that it is not only your right, but your Destiny. See F!Aegon.
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    The problem with Aegon is not really him wanting or expecting the throne, it's that other people, other powers are willing to facilitate that and to be honest there will be far better candidates for puppets than the 'children' of Robert Baratheon for that.
     
    Mister Phantom said:
    Jokes aside, what will actually be done with Cersei? Joffrey and Tommen infertilized and house arrested, Myrcella married off to Quentyn Martell or someone already loyal like him and Cersei infertilized and house arrest for life seems decent enough. The wall or forced disinheritance for Jaime. Slow, painful death for Tywin. Gerion and his wife may be recruited. Undecided on Kevan, his kids and Tyrion. Genna is married to a Frey so she is fine.
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    Please don't take this personally.

    Jesus Christ, they're children! They haven't done anything wrong! Their innate incestness means they'll never be considered legitimate by the Westerosi and could never be a threat to us!

    Build a keep in SD, fill it with Forbidance and Hallow-linked-Invisibility Purges, guard it with Inquisition and Erinyes.

    Cersei gets house arrest and is able to see her children. Jaime gets the wall or is under house arrest with Cersei and is able to see his children. The children become our wards akin to those Essosi Magister Children, having a small trust fund and getting royal sponsored education, and are able to see their parents.

    What the children want to make of themselves from there is up to them.

    Part of the point of this is to be a decisive PR move to the effects of "Seriously, stop trying to placate us with child murder", "We are worlds better than our most hated enemy, even to his own family", and possibly "Hey look, Robert's children aren't his so he doesn't have any legitimate children to he his heirs, so you all who might look for a rallying point can quietly fuck off, eh?"

    I feel like Joffery being sent to the Wall while so young isn't quite necessary, but if we don't reveal the Lannister incest then I can see the poltical necessity of it.
     
    Crake said:
    What of Daemon's, who never lusted after the Throne but was driven to it, perhaps out of some twisted form of responsibility and a fire stoked by the grasping men around him?

    You don't need to desire in your heart of hearts that which is not yours, you only have to be convinced that it is not only your right, but your Destiny. See F!Aegon.
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    Someone who has been manoeuvred into position via a grand conspiracy, supported by the vengeance complex of an angry deity. Suggesting that we equivocate F!Aegon to Joffery or Tommen given that context, and the fact that they'll be growing up in under the watchful eye of our security apparatus, is unreasonable at best.
     
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