@Duesal while it's always fun to induce crisis of faith in the Lords of Westeros maybe we should take it easier on the shoving his face into the terrors that lie in wait? I mean it'd be easy enough to just show him the Frost Dragon and state that we were helping the Wall defend against similar such creatures. I'm worried that if we make him too afraid/aware of whats returning he might support the fey in order to gain some manner of protection closer to home. It's not the correct or logical choice to make as we'd be better to ask, but the fey are closer to home for him so his mind might jump there first.
 
-[X] "If you wish, my Lord, I could show you proof of this. My realm is but a heartbeat away if you would trust my word to keep to responsibilities of a host as you have done for myself, and there is much there that could prove my words more than any oath might."
Sold.

[X] Snowfire
@Duesal while it's always fun to induce crisis of faith in the Lords of Westeros maybe we should take it easier on the shoving his face into the terrors that lie in wait? I mean it'd be easy enough to just show him the Frost Dragon and state that we were helping the Wall defend against similar such creatures. I'm worried that if we make him too afraid/aware of whats returning he might support the fey in order to gain some manner of protection closer to home. It's not the correct or logical choice to make as we'd be better to ask, but the fey are closer to home for him so his mind might jump there first.
That's why I asked specifically about leaving it to Viserys' judgement. His Sense Motive should be capable of picking up on how much the man can take.
 
-[X] "The Reach has needed my attention least so far, both because your most local supernatural entities are rarely accommodating of guests seeking to take what they see as theirs. And you have your own heroes too, in the Green Knight and those who protect Oldtown. This is phrased as a compliment, but there's an edge to it. The Fae might have helped keep the Reach safe, but they never give anything freely.

Small typo

Also sold
[X] Snowfire
 
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We can show that at least we are putting an effort with the Tyrells but frankly the thread wants to split the lordship in twain. At least from what I have been seeing. That and we don't see how he was loyal n the first place.

Snowfire that is a good vote and it neatly side-steps the idea of the fey not knowing because they know who the Children of the Forest are.

[X] Snowfire
 
We do not trust the Tyrells, that Paxter can't see the political connotations, not only behind the Fey, but attached to Tyrell's actions in the rebellion, doesn't speak any better.

Paxter might in fact see the political connotations but is in fact sounding us out. From the outside look in, we funneled a massive bribe to the Watch to get Ned to the table, and we approached Ned in that narrative. "Why not approach the Reach when they're much more powerful in the South and stayed loyal in the rebellion?" is basically the question being asked.

What that question is also saying is that Paxter is sincerely thinking of rebelling against Robert and that Mace would probably be amendable.

Also, how precisely do people know about us talking with Ned?
Maesters or Devils messing around?

It's quite possible that Ned talked to Robert about more support for the Wall and Robert asked why he thinks that's necessary.

At some point we need to at least make an attempt to get Mace and the Tyrell's on our side.

I believe the @Crake explanation is summed as:

"Remove Tyrell."
 
On a side note, to illustrate how dead serious we are about the Long Night, it'd be funny if we just hand Lord Redwyne a Valyrian Steel sword.

I'm not pushing to do this, it's just an amusing thought.
 
Looking back, I think the main issue with the Tyrells is that they're literally and very openly only out for themselves. That's literally all they care for. And that...isn't going to work with the apocalypse scale threats bearing down on us. We need lords that we can trust in the face of those, and Mace just...isn't. I could be wrong, but this feels like the PoV of the thread.
 
On a side note, to illustrate how dead serious we are about the Long Night, it'd be funny if we just hand Lord Redwyne a Valyrian Steel sword.

I'm not pushing to do this, it's just an amusing thought.
Speaking of this did we ever give Stannis a Valyrian sword? Just wondering seeing as Stannis, while infuriating to negotiate with at least believed in our efforts to protect our subjects along with being a good king.
 
Viserys: "You will help me to make a crown for my wife."
Abraxxas: "And why should I do so?"
Viserys: "That was a statement, not a request." *draws a gardening spade*
FTFY
From the way he says it, it's clear the elderly knight has told the tale of facing twin shadowcats afoot very many times indeed
Would you not tell the story of how you beat two gigantic tigers in melee combat, at the same time?

@DragonParadox something I felt lacking in these last updates was the lack of of use of the scenery. The food descriptions were great, but then you left it at that. In a tense dinner debate, you can use things like talking while you slice into your salmon, or taking sips of wine, or banging the cutlery slightly harder than needed, and things like that, as punctuation to the conversation.

In general, it brings a lot of life of the scene.

Also, a question for this vote, would something like this do it:
[X] Sit him down, ironically pour him a stiff drink, and explain the Ice Zombie apocalypse. Get him a copy of Rina's book. You are diplomancing the North because it's hily beneficial that the North be intact for the Long Night.
-[X] We have not forgotten that the Reach answered the call to arms. We are merely disappointed that the ones who Rose highest under the dragon banner chose to wield their loyal bannermen as they did.
--[X] Everyone is inherently failable. Genuinely misinterpreting one's duty can happen, and is forgivable. Willfully doing so, however, is treason. We are still pondering if the Tyrell's undecisiviness was genuine failure or willfull treason, if he catches our drift. It's not as if we've hidden where one might find us to present allegiance and explain themselves, either.
 
Looking back, I think the main issue with the Tyrells is that they're literally and very openly only out for themselves. That's literally all they care for. And that...isn't going to work with the apocalypse scale threats bearing down on us. We need lords that we can trust in the face of those, and Mace just...isn't. I could be wrong, but this feels like the PoV of the thread.
Fully agree with said viewpoint.
 
People, you're focusing on the Night's Watch when that wasn't quite all of what he'd asked. He wants to know why we aren't making moves in the Reach, the Reach which was(and likely is) loyalist. We've made moves in Dorne, in the Crownlands, in the Stormlands, in the Riverlands and in the North. Heck, we've even made moves in the Iron Islands.

You look at all that and then you look at how we've pretty much ignored our most prominent loyalist base. How could he not be confused?
 
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Speaking of this did we ever give Stannis a Valyrian sword? Just wondering seeing as Stannis, while infuriating to negotiate with at least believed in our efforts to protect our subjects along with being a good king.
We didn't. That was way, way before we figured out how to make Valyrian Steel, and we only had a few of those left over from Mantarys. Unfortunately we couldn't afford to hand them out at the time.
 
On a side note, to illustrate how dead serious we are about the Long Night, it'd be funny if we just hand Lord Redwyne a Valyrian Steel sword.

I'm not pushing to do this, it's just an amusing thought.

I'd be 3000% behind this if he takes up our offer of visiting SD and it goes well. It also proves several points all at once. That we do care, that we do see, but that our greatest focus is on those that would see all of Westeros (and more) wiped of the touch of life. How much VS do we have on hand?
 
On a side note, to illustrate how dead serious we are about the Long Night, it'd be funny if we just hand Lord Redwyne a Valyrian Steel sword.

I'm not pushing to do this, it's just an amusing thought.
I mean, do we have any available? VS is really useful in that we now can make it, while everyone else still considers it priceless. Handing it out to earn significant goodwill is a perfectly valid strat
 
I'd be 3000% behind this if he takes up our offer of visiting SD and it goes well. It also proves several points all at once. That we do care, that we do see, but that our greatest focus is on those that would see all of Westeros (and more) wiped of the touch of life. How much VS do we have on hand?
We have a choice between two Valyrian Steel Longswords or two Valyrian Steel Greatswords that we could outright give him. As for how much raw material? I don't know. Between collecting in our adventures, forging anew, and harvesting in Lyceos we have 1,223 lbs of Valyrian Steel, but we voted to make bannerpoles and DP still hasn't told us how much that used or how many bannerpoles were made.

If we're handing it out, I'd go with the Valyrian Steel Longsword. We need the overall stockpile for the Harbinger, so I'd rather hang onto that for now.
 
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We have a choice between two Valyrian Steel Longswords or two Valyrian Steel Greatswords that we could outright give him. As for how much raw material? I don't know. Between collecting in our adventures, forging anew, and harvesting in Lyceos we have 1,223 lbs of Valyrian Steel, but we voted to make bannerpoles and DP still hasn't told us how much that used or how many bannerpoles were made.

If we're handing it out, I'd go with the Valyrian Steel Longsword. We need the overall stockpile for the Harbinger, so I'd rather hang onto that for now.

It's down to how he reacts to SD, if he comes along. But I'd like to do it if things go well. Make it clear what we're trying to prepare Westeros for.

@Paradosi what would you suggest saying then? As far as I can tell, the general thread opinion is that we just want the Tryells removed. That isn't going to play well here and now.
 
We have a choice between two Valyrian Steel Longswords or two Valyrian Steel Greatswords that we could outright give him. As for how much raw material? I don't know. Between collecting in our adventures, forging anew, and harvesting in Lyceos we have 1,223 lbs of Valyrian Steel, but we voted to make bannerpoles and DP still hasn't told us how much that used or how many bannerpoles were made.

If we're handing it out, I'd go with the Valyrian Steel Longsword. We need the overall stockpile for the Harbinger, so I'd rather hang onto that for now.

Is it just me or is it kinda hilarious that we starting handing out Valyrian swords just around the same time the Lannisters finally get their own? Like it took Tywin so long to find a coveted Valyrian sword and they just start popping up all over the place.
 
People, you're focusing on the Night's Watch when that wasn't quite all of what he'd asked. He wants to know why we aren't making moves in the Reach, the Reach which was(and likely is) loyalist. We've made moves in Dorne, in the Crownlands, in the Stormlands, in the Riverlands and in the North. Heck, we've even made moves in the Iron Islands.

You look at all that and then you look at how we've pretty much ignored our most prominent loyalist base. How could he not be confused?

Am I right on the money here, @DragonParadox?
 
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