- Location
- United States
Agreed, this would take care of pretty much every crafting problem we have.
That said, the amount of crafting materials we need is going to be monstrous after this.
A Sword Without a Hilt: A Song of Ice and Fire/D&D 3.5 Crossover
- Thread starter DragonParadox
- Start date
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- Tags
- a song of ice and fire a sword without a hilt d&d 3.5 dungeons & dragons 100% high octane dragon fuel ave corvidae battle action dragon diplomacy best sister bureaucromancy delicious soul-stuff dragon dreams come true dragon ta'veren greatest uncle hubris is a coward's word in defiance of gods and men mammon's folly mutually assured mage's disjunction qm murderhobo top tier coatl
That said, the amount of crafting materials we need is going to be monstrous after this.
- Location
- Australia
It shows a lack of planning and forethought, an inability to engage with locals etc.
The request itself is not demeaning, it just speaks poorly of our abilities. If an express request was necessary and the normal way wasn't an option that would be very different.
Where is the urgency IC, all I see if OOC desire for expediency.
- Location
- Germany
If we assume an even 50 people, working a reasonable 25 days a month, we could spend 250,000 IM in crafting materials per turn just with those guys.
- Location
- Australia
I'm not saying we don't need crafters, we definitely do.
I'm saying if we want them that badly maybe we should try doing something other than popping in for 12 hours and going on a blitz. Hire a recruiter, do the market research, find chafing apprentices etc.
- Location
- Germany
Newsflash: I wanted to do exactly that for months, but what you are describing is requiring a permanent presence in the OV and we are hobbled by the logistical issues of having people go back and forth between planes. Since Viserys and the main party pretty much don't have the time to play low-level recruiter.
Once we got the Train Station going, we can do all of these things and I intend to do it anyway, but getting 50+ crafters right now? That's a pretty sweet deal.
You argument is basically: "Why should we be paid in pearls? We could spend a few weeks and dive for oysters ourselves."
You only have so many people equipped to negotiate trans-planar deals and their time is very valuable. In this situation you would be leveraging your favor with the Sultana to minimize the time those valuable emissaries are locked down talking in the Opaline Vault. The opportunity cost is very much IC.
*narrowly avoids falling asleep on keyboard*
Good night again guys.
Crake
I AM THE STORM THAT IS APPROACHING
- Location
- USA
Can we get some solid information on Nettles' stats so her character sheet can be built? Including prior levels.
It would also give some indication of how relevant she could be if we retrained her via the Scholarium.
- Location
- Australia
My argument is that we should have delegated to a local who could work on it over time instead of trying to use valuable PC time in an afternoon. Maybe a member of the friendly Shaitan noble house instead of the Sultana herself.
Why do we need to be planar hopping around when there are people who's job it is to recruit crafters in the OV, I find it very hard to believe talent acquisition a foreign concept. They hired us didn't they?
Why do we need to be planar hopping around when there are people who's job it is to recruit crafters in the OV, I find it very hard to believe talent acquisition a foreign concept. They hired us didn't they?
Crake
I AM THE STORM THAT IS APPROACHING
- Location
- USA
The point is not, and has never been, that we could not get the 50 crafters in a longer period of time. That has been pointed out.
Azel still wants to use the favor for this, because it guarantees essentially 50 crafters right now. He wants them now. To do a bunch of things. Immediately. With no delay.
Or at the least before the end of the month is out (and probably sooner, given how efficient they Shaitan are, and this being a royal favor).
Just saw this.
We could have started using Adjar for this after the Conference, I think? But before then it wouldn't have really been viable.
Azel still wants to use the favor for this, because it guarantees essentially 50 crafters right now. He wants them now. To do a bunch of things. Immediately. With no delay.
Or at the least before the end of the month is out (and probably sooner, given how efficient they Shaitan are, and this being a royal favor).
Just saw this.
We could have started using Adjar for this after the Conference, I think? But before then it wouldn't have really been viable.
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- Location
- florida
Crake
I AM THE STORM THAT IS APPROACHING
- Location
- USA
Yes, we kind of rudely involved ourselves, but then we consistently outdid them at their own job, so to save face they pretended we were invited and showered us with favors.
- Location
- Australia
We assassinated Putin's finance minister to get a handful of entry level Deloitte personnel.
I don't call that a good price.
Crake
I AM THE STORM THAT IS APPROACHING
- Location
- USA
It's more like we killed a low level bureaucrat who's position was invented literally for the amusement of the President, to make them sweat and wonder when black bag would descend over his head and a sound vaguely like a car door slamming would be the last thing he heard.
Or something, I'm honestly not sure how Russians dispose of people who have outlived their usefulness, @egoo?
Or something, I'm honestly not sure how Russians dispose of people who have outlived their usefulness, @egoo?
- Location
- florida
Shaitan: Yep. All part of the plan. This whole alliance with the garden? Planned it from day 1!Yes, we kind of rudely involved ourselves, but then we consistently outdid them at their own job, so to save face they pretended we were invited and showered us with favors.
egoo
Totally Not Creating Problems Where None Existed
- Location
- Russia
They don't.
All the useless peopel get promoted and make laws. And think up where else to waste budget. Or which wars to support intead of doing good.
They are very much CE, but somehow don't destroy themselves.
It's staggering.
*esxistential dread intensifies*
- Location
- Germany
You are blowing things out of proportion here. We murdered the assistant-backup-court-jester and are getting a large number of professional artisans with a very rare skill set for our troubles.
Furthermore, this means we gain 50 man-months per month worth of Solutions. These people can be actually used to achieve things. Things we had thought about doing for years now, but never could due to the lack of manpower.
What you want are a few man-months worth of Problems. Lore that we need to research first, then invest more time and effort into applying it to something useful. That is, if there is something useful in the first place instead of it being just theoretical works with little to no practical applications.
Your option is strictly worse from a utility standpoint.
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Goldfish
Friendly Spider-Fish Abomination
- Location
- Formerly of the Far Realm
If we could get 50 low-to-mid level crafters, or even just 25, a lot of really nice options open up for us, and I'm not talking about from the mega-project standpoint that @Azel wants to start them on.
This month, we're crafting three of the MirrorVision mirrors. Each of them costs 2,880 IM and even with her discounts, that uses 26 days of Valeria's crafting time. If we could assign another five crafters to producing those, even without any discounts, that would be another eight Mirrors. We could have one in every city, settlement, and Scholarium branch in the Imperium in just a few months.
A few weapon crafters would let us start stockpiling enchanted projectiles. A single such crafter could produce 300 or more +1 Bane crossbow bolts (Evil Outsiders, Aberrations, Undead, Fey, whatever the fuck the Others are, etc) per month. Scale that up by five and we could produce 1500 or more projectiles per month. This is how you wage wide scale warfare against an enemy as entrenched and powerful as the Others or the Deep Ones. You make it so that even the least of your forces are a threat to them.
A single additional crafter capable of creating Constructs would let us put 266+ Lesser False Ravens into service each month.
@Azel What would it do to the cost of maintaining the Legion if we crafted enchanted items that provided all of their food and water without any need for the complex logistics involved in feeding so many soldiers? Or even if we were only able to reduce it by 25%?
In just two or three months every important official in our government, every Inquisitor, Legion officer, Scholarium Initiate, etc., could have a PfE item and Healing Belt.
TL;DR 50 crafters ready to work would be amazing.
This month, we're crafting three of the MirrorVision mirrors. Each of them costs 2,880 IM and even with her discounts, that uses 26 days of Valeria's crafting time. If we could assign another five crafters to producing those, even without any discounts, that would be another eight Mirrors. We could have one in every city, settlement, and Scholarium branch in the Imperium in just a few months.
A few weapon crafters would let us start stockpiling enchanted projectiles. A single such crafter could produce 300 or more +1 Bane crossbow bolts (Evil Outsiders, Aberrations, Undead, Fey, whatever the fuck the Others are, etc) per month. Scale that up by five and we could produce 1500 or more projectiles per month. This is how you wage wide scale warfare against an enemy as entrenched and powerful as the Others or the Deep Ones. You make it so that even the least of your forces are a threat to them.
A single additional crafter capable of creating Constructs would let us put 266+ Lesser False Ravens into service each month.
@Azel What would it do to the cost of maintaining the Legion if we crafted enchanted items that provided all of their food and water without any need for the complex logistics involved in feeding so many soldiers? Or even if we were only able to reduce it by 25%?
In just two or three months every important official in our government, every Inquisitor, Legion officer, Scholarium Initiate, etc., could have a PfE item and Healing Belt.
TL;DR 50 crafters ready to work would be amazing.
- Location
- Germany
The new system isn't tracking upkeep by army, but by general force size.
And frankly, I refuse to go back down to this level of detail in the calculations since that was a ton of work for me to maintain and nobody in the thread appreciated the sprawling jungle of obtuse spreadsheets.
Just assume that this would greatly diminish the size and thus vulnerability of their supply train and leave it at that.
As for your assessment that I want megaprojects and you don't I see this differently. What you are describing are decentralized megaprojects, while the Moonchaser would be a monolithic megaproject. They still both have huge impact on our military capabilities and a huge price-tag.
That being said, all those things you mentioned? I'm all for it.
Goldfish
Friendly Spider-Fish Abomination
- Location
- Formerly of the Far Realm
Don't get me wrong, I'm not opposed to the Moonchaser at all. I was just presenting a few uses for a large stable of crafters other than putting them to work on a single large project not everyone is enthusiastic about.
I do believe, however, that the first AG vessel we build shouldn't be something so large and resource intensive as the Moonchaser. No one goes straight from the drawing board to a final project of such incredible complexity without there being some significant intermediate steps. I think it would be more reasonable to first produce a smaller version, maybe to 1/10th scale and lightly armed, if it is armed at all, as a proof of concept and tes tbed for the new magitech we are developing. Only producing one such prototype would still be cutting it uncomfortably close, but I won't get my hopes up for a series of more advanced and functional prototypes before we actually build the Moonchaser. The cost and time to build the prototypes would be much, much shorter if we don't include things like heavily enchanted armor, Plane Shift capabilities, incredible amounts of firepower, etc.
- Location
- Germany
Actually, the Moonchaser is as small as it gets, unless you want to build purposefully wasteful AG-Engines.
We need at least 2 engines to get the vessel stable and the Moonchaser is using the provided lift by 2 full-scale engines sensibly.
Which reminds me that I needed to a little adjustment to it...
Edit: Also, I'm not planning to throw all enchanters at the Moonchaser anyway. The bottleneck will be higher-level enchanters we need for the armor, leaving room to assign the low-level guys to many other projects without impacting total construction time.
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Goldfish
Friendly Spider-Fish Abomination
- Location
- Formerly of the Far Realm
Still doesn't make sense to go directly from drawing board to massive AG battleship. Even if we have to suffer through less effective prototyping, or simply building and refining the engines while testing the other magitech before the full vessel is assembled, it would be worth it, IMO, to maintain some degree of SOD.
One has already been added. Depending on how the crafting schedule looks when finalized, there might be one or two more.
ryuan
From Zero to Hero!
Bag of Greed? Where I can find the stats for it?