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Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest

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Soo, OOC I think we know what the Dwarves are using the energy for, and I'd like to know IC so we can decide whether to pass on the info to Belegar.
Though it raises further questions regarding what we're going to do about asking what everyone else is doing with their energy.
 
guyfromtheplace1 said:
Soo, OOC I think we know what the Dwarves are using the energy for, and I'd like to know IC so we can decide whether to pass on the info to Belegar.
Though it raises further questions regarding what we're going to do about asking what everyone else is doing with their energy.
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The funny thing is that Belegar probably has it figured out IC. He knows magical energy flows throughout the Karaz Ankor to KaK. He knows that Karag Dum knew about it and didn't think they could blackmail KaK about it, so it's probably for a good cause. And then Thorgrim invites him to the opening of the Eyes of Grimnir, an enormously powerful device that just-so-happened to be reactivated after KaK got three new Karaks' worth of energy?
Boney said:
What few remember is that part of the reason it was lost is that an ancient wonder from the time of the Ancestor Gods that watched over the Silver Road was blinded by those tumultuous times.

"But now..." High King Thorgrim Grudgebearer spreads his arms, and each of the jewels inset on the walls begins to glow. "The Eyes of Grimnir will open once more."
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Beleger is smart, he can figure that one out. He doesn't know about the protections of Valaya, of course, but he can guess roughly at the "magical megaprojects from the Golden Age or before" thing. So Karak to Karak has that going for it: he already has strong suspicions about part of the answer.
 
DragonParadox said:
I mean... quotes below. I'm not sure how much clearer 'this is a frosty journeywoman' can be. What you are arguing is the equivalent of 'well the colleges do not specifically say they do not teach their journeymen battle magic and since no one has it in the system they could'
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The fact that it's socially the equivalent of a Journeywoman doesn't mean much? Like, my whole point is that the social structure and the specific way they learn magic can be different. They might not be, but assuming "Oh, that's just the same as Journeyman with a different name." is a bad assumption when dealing with an entirely separate magical tradition.
 
[X] Empire to Empire

DragonParadox said:
I was rereading and I came across something that in retrospect horrified me. This is from the Dum expedition:



There was a chance they would sent Zlata after the Cup, Zlata! What on Malus was she meant to do to fight the Chaos tribe and Khornite Champion? I hope she would have just left the whole thing to Mathilde which would at least mean the latter could sneak, but would an Ice Maiden even be able to contain the cup if we got it? Questions I am very glad will never be definitively answered.
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I don't think anyone other than the Granny we got would have tried to solo an entire tribe.

With Zlata we would have done a stealth run.
 
If we set up the emergency De-Praag-ification equipment, it won't go away after the Praag-ness has subsided. Multiple Waystones with the strongest 'Storm of Magic tanking' options available will loom over the streets. They won't deactivate if their downline stones go off line, either. If one waystone can cleanse thousands of acres of grasslands, then tens of them will make Praag a shining beacon of stability against the decay of the encroaching Chaos Wastes.

Our work shall herald the rise of... Turbo Praag.
 
DeadmanwalkingXI said:
The fact that it's socially the equivalent of a Journeywoman doesn't mean much? Like, my whole point is that the social structure and the specific way they learn magic can be different. They might not be, but assuming "Oh, that's just the same as Journeyman with a different name." is a bad assumption when dealing with an entirely separate magical tradition.
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Then lets look at the statistics. Short of rare Chaos mutations and becoming a vampire there are no ways in the RPG to raise your magic stat other than to advance in a magic career, all that is trait gain and spell learning in this quest is career advancement there
  1. The Apprentice Witch has a magic of +1
  2. The Ice Maiden adds another +2 on top of that
That is a total of +3 for the average Ice Maiden. This quest has doubled the magic statistic way back when it first appeared. That means that under Divided Loyalties statistics the average ice maiden has a magic of 6, not enough to cast battle magic. Even if we assume Zlata got +1 magic from somewhere that would still be barely enough to cast battle magic, not really someone you sent to cast battle magic in the Chaos Wastes.

I hope this is through enough
 
Are the ice witches casting with just their own magic, or are they also getting a power up from their goddess , or the land, or something? They don't seem to run on the same rules that the college wizards do.

Sort of like how the Damsels really look like wizards at first glance, until you find out that they don't age and are using more than one wind of magic.
 
Phalfpipe said:
Are the ice witches casting with just their own magic, or are they also getting a power up from their goddess , or the land, or something? They don't seem to run on the same rules that the college wizards do.

Sort of like how the Damsels really look like wizards at first glance, until you find out that they don't age and are using more than one wind of magic.
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I mean priests have patrons even more than ice witches, high priest with a lot of experience and insight into their god can still cast bigger magic. This is not a matter of the precise metaphysical implications just power and complexity in magic scaling with experience. It is the college battle magic track that is weird because they are hothousing mages into living weapons. They can only do that because they have the large centralized infrastructure of the Colleges. For the past two centuries the Ice witches have not had that first because of Katarin and then Vlad.
 
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Phalfpipe said:
Are the ice witches casting with just their own magic, or are they also getting a power up from their goddess , or the land, or something? They don't seem to run on the same rules that the college wizards do.

Sort of like how the Damsels really look like wizards at first glance, until you find out that they don't age and are using more than one wind of magic.
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The Ice Witches are the priestesses of the Ancient Widow, this much is fact. They channel the power of the Ancient Widow. It's just that the Ancient Widow's status is itself very ambiguous - she may either be the Land of Kislev itself, or is trapped underneath, and we also know that the original Ice Witches of the Gospodars could use some of her power before they arrived to Kislev proper. Supposedly upon arriving, they realized that it was full of ice magic, as had been promised by the Widow.
 
Mechanically, we know that Ice Witches treat magic outside of Kislev as a reagent dependant Witch Lore that varies in power based on Latitude (a lore that takes up both a wind and a dark magic lore slot -- normal wizards are capable of picking up both, say, Gold magic and necromancy, although it's unclear to what degree that dual capacity is a separation from the way knowing multiple magical disciples is portrayed in other story material).

(Personally, I think it's better for the story if normal wizards can be concealing dark secrets, so I'm okay with the way 2E let you go about that. Purple Wizards are uniquely dangerous necromancers because they get to combine spells that let them dunk on the undead with spells that let them control undead if they can dunk on them, so they're still special, but anyone can do necromancy technically).
 
Phalfpipe said:
Are the ice witches casting with just their own magic, or are they also getting a power up from their goddess , or the land, or something? They don't seem to run on the same rules that the college wizards do.

Sort of like how the Damsels really look like wizards at first glance, until you find out that they don't age and are using more than one wind of magic.
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As far as mechanics go- on tabletop, Ice Magic worked identically to every other branch of magic.

In 2e Roleplay, Ice Magic used in Kislev uses a different Miscast table and automatically gets the benefits you would get from using ingredients for spells, but those are the main benefits.
 
DragonParadox said:
I was rereading and I came across something that in retrospect horrified me. This is from the Dum expedition:

There was a chance they would sent Zlata after the Cup, Zlata! What on Malus was she meant to do to fight the Chaos tribe and Khornite Champion? I hope she would have just left the whole thing to Mathilde which would at least mean the latter could sneak, but would an Ice Maiden even be able to contain the cup if we got it? Questions I am very glad will never be definitively answered.
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I think you've got things backwards. Doylistically, the mission to retrieve the Cup may not have even been an idea Boney had before rolling that die. It was likely something Boney figured out afterwards, or even while writing the Expedition. Watsonionally, Ljiljana may have been the one chosen to go with the Expedition because of the mission to grab the Cup. Or, alternatively, if the Ice Court had only able to send Zlata with the Expedition, she may have been given an easier and less dangerous mission.

Either way, I extremely doubt that we were a 1d4 roll away from seeing an Ice Witch sent on a suicide mission.
 
Derpmind said:
I think you've got things backwards. Doylistically, the mission to retrieve the Cup may not have even been an idea Boney had before rolling that die. It was likely something Boney figured out afterwards, or even while writing the Expedition. Watsonionally, Ljiljana may have been the one chosen to go with the Expedition because of the mission to grab the Cup. Or, alternatively, if the Ice Court had only able to send Zlata with the Expedition, she may have been given an easier and less dangerous mission.

Either way, I extremely doubt that we were a 1d4 roll away from seeing an Ice Witch sent on a suicide mission.
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Fair point, but I think the Goblet was decided at the hidden roll when we asked them to open the High Pass. If that is the case I think we would have just had to be a lot more careful of goblet and witch both. It's not like having journeymen on the expedition would be that extraordinary on its own, we had several of them.. She just would have been there mostly as a messenger and a bit more firepower with the wagons.
 
[X] Runesmith to Runesmith
[X] Okri to Okri


Empire to Empire imo is very likely to not get meaningful answer and Karak to Karak is playing with fire.
 
Chopak said:
[X] Runesmith to Runesmith
[X] Okri to Okri


Empire to Empire imo is very likely to not get meaningful answer and Karak to Karak is playing with fire.
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The problem with both of the above is... they might not know, even Kragg. As far as Thorgrim knows per his interlude he is the only one who is in possession of the secret. Now he could be wrong, that interlude was from his perspective and this is dwarfs, it would not be beyond the realm of possibility for the secret to be kept by guild and king not even knowing that the other knows, but that is a rather large supposition to be hanging any success at all by.
 
One last reason to vote Karak is the implication of who Mathilde is and who Thorgrim is:
  1. She is the Loremaster who got the 'die well' note and then went on to reconquer a Karak and then gut a Waagh with a doom mountain, allwoing power into the network for the first time since Vlag and Dum was lost. Mathilde is the one who made the claxons stop
  2. More than that, she is the one who then went on an expedidion to Hell and not only found out the fate of Dum, but also brought Vlag back with 20K dwarfs still inside it and enough power in the network to power the Eyes of Grimnir, pivotal for Thorgrim's plans for the Silver Road
  3. Last but not least he knows what she has been doing all this time, investigating Waystones. It would be shocking to me if he is not expecting something like this conversation
  4. Finally on the other side if the High King snonewalls us we can do what no dwarf in good standing would do and point out the ways in which this would alienate Belegar. 'I need proof you are not a thief', coached in more diplomatic language perhaps, but that is the jist of it. At that point, what is he going to do, cause civil war over the person who canceled the extinction of his people wanting to know about the same mechanism she restored? I think he would literally no joke choose to go slayer over that being his legacy is that is what telling the truth requires. That said I do not think it is very likely. Dum knew about the flow and odds are good they knew how important it was given the length to which they were willing to go to keep things running
Recall that spice trade, well Karak to Karak is that on steroids, plot a straight course and change the world.
 
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