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[X] Plan Compromise
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Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest
- Thread starter Boney
- Start date
- Fantasy Users' Choice!
Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
Verena is a major goddess of the Empire. Despite being dedicated to Ranald, Mathilde will be very familiar with the public face of the cult and Her worship, same as any other major god.
- Location
- Chicago
- Pronouns
- She/They
Because it gets us leverage.
I strongly suspect that the first thing the venerians are going to start thinking about when they find out there is a giant library run by humans going up in a Karak is how they can get control over it.
The usual way to do that is to get your people into it and the chain of promotion. So I think if we go to early, they will be more than glad to 'help' us- sending a ton of acolytes and minor works, taking over as much of the organization, hiring, scheduling, policy, etc.
They'd have the leverage because we wouldn't even really be a library yet, just a construction project, and so they'd use experience and manpower and the carrot of continuing to share books as leverage to get us to do things the "right" way. Which isn't a problem except that it means Verenians in charge and Verenians policies, regardless of the words on the dedication.
I'm actually pretty fond of the cult as the cults go, but I'm not blind to the fact that in an organization without central structure, creating our taking over your own fief is how you gain power. So I think that unless we want our library to just be another Verenians institution, we need to build it and staff it before we bring them in.
Tl;dr- I think bring them in too early and we lose control as the library suffers divided loyalties.
- Location
- Earth
I wouldn't call it OOC to reach out to Verena. You can reach out to people you only know through reputation—an example of this would be when she went to the Lights and the Amethysts during the Drakenhof campaign—and Verena has no small clout, especially in the southern Empire.
I still prefer Quinsberry for reasons, but I can understand why people would want Verena first.
Ehh, with how we established the library it's a non-starter for the Verenans to try to ursurp our authority. The Dwarfs listen to pretty much only us on anything library related, we have direct control over the granted budget and full backing of the king of the karak. And if the Verenans threaten to "leave" or restrict access to their libraries then even just the threat of doing the same would be a hard hit for them, their scriptures are pretty much in our favor.
I mean if they try that we can just tell them to take a hike. You are painting the Cult of Verena as extraordinarily arrogant here and like the sort of people we really should not trust with our often sensitive lore. Now personally I do not think they are the power mad despot equivalent of a librarian, which you would have to be to try to take over anything in a dwarf Karak, but if they are I fail to see how halfling lore + or - will make much of a difference
- Location
- France
Just to be clear: I don't want to read a story featuring Verenans. They come up a lot in WHFB fanfiction, because they're perceived as the "preserve knowledge" faction. Therefore modern fanfic writers, who are always people who read a lot and value things like technological innovation, tend to love Verenans. I'm simply sick of Verenans, and I don't even read much WHFB fiction!
I also find their depiction in the WFRP supplement about religions to be rather boring. Meanwhile Mathilde's interactions with Halflings have always been fun! They're afterthoughts to her, but she's a Stirlander so I've sometimes been getting the vibe that halflings sometimes think she's avoiding them deliberately due to prejudices, etc. I want to see her interact with a halfling institution that's not park of K8P!
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Codex
Fantasy Addict
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There is no shortage of Verenans and no shortage of different opinions between them. They literally have daily debates over the every single topic they can think of about the general principles of the Cult. I'm sure you'll have cultists who'll want to take control over the library, just as I'm sure there are plenty of cultists who'd be just fine working with us and wouldn't care about power plays. If you're so worried about attempts from them to usurp our authority, you kick out the undesirable factions and bring over ones that are more desirable. There is no central structure to play politics with, every Verenan temple is a separate sect of the Cult.
Mopman43
Mountain-Hermit of Nitpeak
- Location
- Vermont
Stirlander, not Sylvanian.
And now we even have an upside. I do love finding these tiny hidden synergies . . .
Codex
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Mathilde was born and raised for the first ten years of her life in Kelham, a small village in Western Stirland around the County of Worden.
In Worden, there is a tradition. Warning for depictions of a hate crime:
The Warhammer books go over some seriously uncomfortable stuff in a very offhand manner.
In Worden, there is a tradition. Warning for depictions of a hate crime:
"Stirlanders in the central portion of the province are known for their dislike of Halflings, for they still resent the 1500-year-old decision that tore away their best farmlands and gave them to "the Shorties." Although this resentment rarely breaks out in violence, the belief that Halflings are thieves at heart is stronger here than in any other part of the Empire. In Wördern there is a tradition, when celebrating a child's birthday, to make a straw-man the size of a Halfling and stuff it with candies and treats he "stole" from the children. Then it is hung from a branch and the blindfolded children whack at it with sticks until it breaks and "gives them back" their candy. Locals deny that drunks have occasionally instead tied up a real Halfling." Page 87 Sigmar's Heirs 2nd Edition WFRP
Mathilde references this particular tradition here:
Mathilde references this particular tradition here:
TaliesinSkye
Occasional Editor
- Location
- Northeast Ohio, United States
In small quests if I have to change a plan in a substantial manner I try to privately notify the people who've voted for it via PM, but that stops being viable after a point and I think it's just a technical limitation of the voting system as it is.
- Location
- Actually pretty lost
So I hadn't read the votes as closely as I should have, as a result of being at work. Why are the leading votes no longer Laying the Foundations, after being essentially poked by Mathile's inner monologue to get started already?
Because we could not finagle the gambler on it and cover Alaric the way people wanted so we dropped it to be done next turn. Look at it this way:
- The elves and dwarfs will hardly notice 6 months, it is like a few days delay to the span of their lives
- The human wizards would, but for them we can pull out 'I do not want the project to run on credit', since we are doing both their payment actions at once
Also the human wizards are waiting in effect 6 months, the elfs and the Dwarfs are waiting longer but as it said, they really don't notice the time. (also telling th dwarfs that we need to make thorough preparations actually might get us more brownie points with them. Dwarfs do nothing new fast, they test and prepare for decades before starting shit.)
I honestly have no idea why this isn't a bigger issue. One of the leading plans didn't have lay the foundations, the two others did, and then the compromise plan didn't lay the foundations and there was barely any discussion of it.
I'm fine with it - I think waiting one more turn is fine, and I still want to turn the coin to the Father and recruit the Hedgewise - but it really is strange that this issue was barely discussed.
I'm fine with it - I think waiting one more turn is fine, and I still want to turn the coin to the Father and recruit the Hedgewise - but it really is strange that this issue was barely discussed.
dinomannitro6
all your gender is belong to us
- Location
- The Land Where The Sunflowers Bloom
The thread wanted to do before or at the same time as laying foundations: recruiting ward of frost, personally scrutinize waystone, learn rituals, pay off debts to recruited colleges. This would leave zero AP left over for non waystone project related things if foundations were laid this turn.
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- Location
- Actually pretty lost
I don't see why this would be a problem, given that several of those are self-improvement actions and by waiting we've crammed in a Windherder enchantment we won't even be able to use, but okay.
Codex
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We can't use the enchantment, but Horstmann can.
- Location
- Manchester, UK
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- He/They
The nature of compromise is that things other people care about - like windherding, and soloing the Alric spying - end up in the Plan.
[X] Plan Compromise
because adding a halfling god really soon is heartwarming and nice.
We should help the We develop writing so they can write books we can add to the library. Some South American people had a knot based language, that would be cool. Also attract more We so we can have Spooder librarians.
(In all seriousness, I think the interaction of We and writing would be fascinating, given how important the concept of Echo is to them. I want some Xenofiction, dammit)
because adding a halfling god really soon is heartwarming and nice.
We should help the We develop writing so they can write books we can add to the library. Some South American people had a knot based language, that would be cool. Also attract more We so we can have Spooder librarians.
(In all seriousness, I think the interaction of We and writing would be fascinating, given how important the concept of Echo is to them. I want some Xenofiction, dammit)