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If you go back a few pages, you'll get me giving a whole bunch of IC information that you the players don't also have access to through wiki dives or canon threadmarks. What I'm not going to do is spend tens of hours inventing the name and attributes of literally thousands of Gods and then start letting the thread run SQL queries on the resultant database, which is what answering that particular question would require.
Sorry about that. I wasn't aware that that was the relevant info dump as opposed to a reply to specific questions only. The comprehensiveness didn't quite register with me. I definitely didn't want you to invent tonnes of gods. I just thought that you had more at hand that might be relevant yet unavailable to us players

In case the victorious plan for the next turn doesn't result in us finding one or both sisters, might I request that you add the IC information from that linked post to the Collection of Important Information threadmark for posterior reference?
 
Sooo, looking through the plans I got a concern about bringing egrimm to anything to do with alric. Didn't the man explicitly tell us that he didn't want to get involved in his orders (or probably any orders) politics?
Then why in Sigmar name are we dragging him into it? I understand most think he will be super helpful but I just think he will resent us for it. We help him get his promotion just to then turn around and go "I helped you now you help me spy on your former boss for your probably new boss."

Also if anyone wants to convince me to vote for your plan I want to learn to fly the gyrocopter, not bringing egrimm towards the alric thing and probably not start the project right this turn (I am very for starting next turn though)
my plan, Plan: Jyn lets talk to people does all that.
 
[X] Plan Pickle's Political Protector Proposal
-[X] MAX: Study an artefact: Kurgan enchanted weapons
-[X] EGRIMM: Attempt a Windherder enchantment with Egrimm
--[X] Shadowsteed & Clarity, allowing the user to ride all night without sleep
-[X] WEB-MAT: Investigate Gryphon Wood with one or more members of WEB-MAT (Johann)
-[X] Personally scrutinize a Waystone as thoroughly as you possibly can.
-[X] Explore one of the Wards of Laurelorn: Frost
-[X] Investigate Alric
-[X] EIC: Try to uncover what's going on in Gryphon's Wood.
-[X] LIBRARY: Seek an agreement with a Cult to have access to their libraries (Verenans)
-[X] SERENITY: Write a paper: Observations of Johann's prosthetic arm (FRESH)
-[X] COIN: The Protector

[X] Plan WEB-MAT All-In
[X] Plan Starting up debt free, Windherd Edition
[X] Plan Stacking Advantages, Windherd Edition
[x] Plan: Waystone scrutiny, payments promised and Wind herding
[X] Plan Stacking Advantages

Doing some research with WEBMAT, solving Gryphon Wood & Alric with Protector up for hopeful reputational gains, poking at a Waystone personally to move this project forward a little, and befriending some elves so that we understand the local political situation better. Thanks to @Derpmind for the initial skeleton.

UPDATE: While I still support this plan, I think my favorite plan is Derpmind's. If you want my opinion on what to vote if you can support only one thing, vote for her plan, Stacking Advantages.
 
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I don't quite see the point of giving the Sunken Palace to the Hochlander.
I'm not Jyn, but as someone who also supports this course of action: I believe Boney clarified a while ago that a shadow headquarters will allow the Hochlander to more easily recruit and train new spies, which is the kind of thing we'll need if we want the EIC to expand as an information network.
 
In case the victorious plan for the next turn doesn't result in us finding one or both sisters, might I request that you add the IC information from that linked post to the Collection of Important Information threadmark for posterior reference?

Enshrining a bunch of fun facts about Haletha in that way would be tacitly labelling Her a Goddess of particular relevance, and would too easily be seen as WoG that She's the correct answer. I'll work that information into an update if there's a seamless way to do so, but failing that there are a few people that are paying close attention to information on this subject and will be able to pass it on during discussion on the topic.
 
[X] Personally scrutinize a Waystone as thoroughly as you possibly can.
[X] Lay the foundations: work with the current members of WEB-MAT and the Waystone Project to build a single unified framework for understanding the Waystones.
In theory, the more members there currently are, the more complete this framework will be. Will unlock further investigations. Can be repeated if desired, but will not unlock anything new after the first time, it will just make a new framework incorporating any new recrui ts.
 
Sooo, looking through the plans I got a concern about bringing egrimm to anything to do with alric. Didn't the man explicitly tell us that he didn't want to get involved in his orders (or probably any orders) politics?
Then why in Sigmar name are we dragging him into it? I understand most think he will be super helpful but I just think he will resent us for it. We help him get his promotion just to then turn around and go "I helped you now you help me spy on your former boss for your probably new boss."
The answer to that is these messages:
On the other hand, Mathilde can do the sneaky sneaky while referring back to Egrimm as 'man in the chair', helping us interpret the clues on what what Alric is up to?
That would be possible.
...
My plans are all about prepping for recruiting the Hehdewise, even the one that starts the project now.
Yeahhhh, except most of them have something or other I don't like (no Alric investigation is an immediate no) and the one that comes closest does the Alric investigation with Johann instead of Egrimm and uses The Father which is most likely useless and with those combined the plan is under the Way of Stones one for me.
 
[X] Plan Pickle's Political Protector Proposal
-[X] MAX: Study an artefact: Kurgan enchanted weapons
-[X] EGRIMM: Attempt a Windherder enchantment with Egrimm
--[X] Shadowsteed & Clarity, allowing the user to ride all night without sleep
-[X] WEB-MAT: Investigate Gryphon Wood with one or more members of WEB-MAT (Johann)
-[X] Personally scrutinize a Waystone as thoroughly as you possibly can.
-[X] Explore one of the Wards of Laurelorn: Frost
-[X] Investigate Alric
-[X] EIC: Try to uncover what's going on in Gryphon's Wood.
-[X] LIBRARY: Seek an agreement with a Cult to have access to their libraries (Verenans)
-[X] SERENITY: Write a paper: Windsoak Mushrooms book 1/2
-[X] COIN: The Protector

Doing some research with WEBMAT, solving Gryphon Wood & Alric with Protector up for hopeful reputational gains, poking at a Waystone personally to move this project forward a little, and befriending some elves so that we understand the local political situation better. Thanks to @Derpmind for the initial skeleton.
Three major objections (aside from the fact that it doesn't involve the Father and the Hedgewise and isn't my plan etc etc):
1. Using the protector assumes that not only we will find something that threatens people in our Gryphon Wood or Alric investigations, but also that we will deal with it on the same turn. The first is possible, the second is quite unlikely.
2. The EIC has pretty much zero presence in the vicinity of Gryphon's Wood. If we are going to investigate it ourselves I seriously doubt they will do better than us.
3. I don't think we should seek an agreement with the largest cult of knowledge and books in the old world right now. Our library is not yet impressive enough to play in the big leagues, and especially not with the cult that has a rivalry with our God. The cult of Quinsberry is a good alternative in my opinion.
 
[x] Plan: Waystone scrutiny, payments promised and Wind herding
-[X] Personally scrutinize a Waystone as thoroughly as you possibly can.
--[X] Coin: Gambler
-[X] JOHANN: Learning: Enchanting.
-[X] WEB-MAT: Investigate Gryphon Wood with one or more members of WEB-MAT (Mathilde+Johann) (NEW)
-[X] EIC: Investigate what trade goods the Eonir might be willing to import from the Empire.
-[X] EGRIMM: Attempt a Windherder enchantment with Egrimm (Ring of Sudden Dawn)
-[X] Investigate Alric
-[X] Experiment with integrating the Vitae into enchantments.
-[X] Seek an agreement with a Cult to have access to their libraries (specify which: Cult of Sigmar)

I doubt this will get much traction but I'll throw my hat in the ring. Mathilde needs to scruitinse the waystones before we do the foundational framework action. The whole house of cards is built on the idea that Mathilde personally has knowledge that was used in K8P. She needs to have her A game to hand when she goes for this.

Clear our ledger of debts with the colleges sooner rather than later so it can't present issues in the future and as the waystone action is to important to do it without every bonus possible some low importance side activities like Vitae and Windherding are there.

Wind herding because it's about damn time we poked at it, the Vitae to clear it out and be done with the stuff for good, once we determine there's no actual person uses left we can sell it to the dwarves permanently and use it to get something useful.
 
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The answer to that is these messages:


...

Yeahhhh, except most of them have something or other I don't like (no Alric investigation is an immediate no) and the one that comes closest does the Alric investigation with Johann instead of Egrimm and uses The Father which is most likely useless and with those combined the plan is under the Way of Stones one for me.
If @Boney says it's possible it means you can do it in quest format, it does not mean that all participants are OK with it. And yes we could have egrimm sit in a chair and interpret things but that would still pull him into politics, he would be directly helping one part of his order against another. He doesn't want to do any of that AFAIK. He just wants some peace and quiet.
 
Regarding Egrimm's opinion on Alric. I think the last social involving that matter is pretty informative. While Egrimm doesn't want to blatantly take sides in the matter (I would guess because it's an incredible faux pas to publically campaign against your master). He also clearly does not at all wish for Alric's success. So as long as we keep his involvement discreet I have a hard time thinking he'd be against providing us context and pysch breakdowns on Alric or similar. Considering he's already doing that.

Egrimm, you have learned, keeps close ties with many of his Light Order contemporaries, and you often find him sorting through and sending out correspondence to them. It takes little nudging for him to open up about the topic of most of them: the internal politics of his Order, particularly the power struggle at the top. Alric, it seems, is ousted from the Magister Patriarch position in all but name, with Mira assuming control of everything but the external-facing branches of its infrastructure. It becomes routine that every few days Egrimm catches you up on the latest developments, half venting at the chaos this is causing within his Order and half exulting in the misfortune he feels his former Master deserves. Mira seems to be trying to execute a takeover in a way that leaves Alric with his dignity and doesn't embarrass the Light Order, while Alric and his few remaining loyalists seem determined to fight to the last. And one unfortunate side-effect of Mira's early success is that now she and her supporters are left to keep the College operating normally while Alric is freed from those responsibilities and able to spend all his efforts and attention on seeking support.

Through Egrimm's reports and corroborated by a letter here and there to the Provostry to confirm what few details could be confirmed from the outside, you hear of Alric quickly learning that Mira's preparations for this takeover have been extensive and long-running, and there are no friendly ears left to him in Altdorf. A more sensible Wizard might have accepted defeat at this point, but at his core Alric seems to be incapable of knowing when to quit, and he starts looking further afield. You hear of his talks with Grand Count Konstantin of Wissenland, and how they sputter to a halt after Mira tips off her hopefully soon-to-be counterpart of the Amethyst Order, and Elspeth von Draken needs only exert a fraction of her influence for Alric to find that Wissenland is no longer interested in the Light Order's partnership in certain sensitive matters. You hear of him trying to insert himself into the Sylvania situation and being politely but firmly evicted after he demonstrates he's more interested in digging into the fate of the late Magister Patriarch Hexensohen than he is on making any sort of contribution to the ongoing campaign. And then he starts worming his way into Talabecland, and though the Jade and Ambers stand ready to repulse any attempts by him to gain influence within the Royal Academy, he seems to be working instead on some sort of internal matter amongst Talabecland's nobility that neither Egrimm nor the Provostry seem to be able to give you any insight into. News dries up, and you find yourself feeling like you've read half of a story only to find that the rest of it is missing.

"This is what he does," Egrimm says to you. "He's a mediocre administrator but, for all his faults, he is still an extremely potent Wizard with keen insight, and extremely good at burnishing any deed into a legend. He's looking for another Apesto so he can ride it back into power."

"I think I may be noticing a pattern," you say. "He's thwarted in Nuln by the Lady Matriarch of the Amethysts, so he starts poking around the fate of her predecessor. He's thwarted by Roswita, and then he turns his attention to Talabecland, where she tracked the peat smuggling to."

"Roswita? Van Hal?" You nod. "That's right, you worked with her father. Did you get to know her then?"

"No, I never knew she existed until she inherited. I got to know her later, as part of being Loremaster to Karak Eight Peaks."

"You didn't continue on after she inherited?" Egrimm asks, his voice carefully neutral but his eyes searching.

"It was her decision." You consider leaving it at that, but think better of it. "She had something of a phobia of magic - understandable, given her family history. I've worked with her since then, and don't hold any ill will towards her." That wasn't always the case, but Egrimm doesn't need to know the inner thoughts of your younger self.

"Ah. Yes, well, you could be right. I don't think Alric would go out of his way to outright sabotage figures that prominent over being slighted, but if there's a way for him to get what he wants while also getting his own back, he'll take it."

"Well, he's unlikely to succeed in Talabecland if that's what he's after. The Elector Countess used those merchants as the exemplar for The Neglected Front, and in the process of gathering the information for that she uncovered enough evidence to damn them a dozen times over."

"In any case, he seems to have found something there to keep him busy," Egrimm says, flipping through a handful of letters. "I don't like that I'm not hearing any more of it. It would be just like him to manage some last-minute comeback and yank all his puppets back into line."

"If it comes to that, I can make it more trouble than it's worth to pull you away from the project. We've got one of the most prominent Runelords of the Karaz Ankor personally involved, as well as an Elven Archmage who was old when Sigmar was young. Nobody's going to want to uproot such a promising tree before it bears fruit."

"Mm," Egrimm says, clearly unconvinced. "Let's hope it doesn't come to that."
 
-[X] MAX: Receive dictation: The Black Orc Warboss' worship of Only Gork, and what you saw of the Rogue Idol ritual (FADED)
-[X] Write a paper: Observations of Johann's prosthetic arm (FRESH)
I think these two would make more sense if they were essentially swapped around. Something like this:

-[] WEB-MAT: Write a paper with Egrimm and Johann: Observations of Johann's prosthetic arm (FRESH)
-[] Serenity: The Black Orc Warboss' worship of Only Gork, and what you saw of the Rogue Idol ritual (FADED)
I'm not Jyn, but as someone who also supports this course of action: I believe Boney clarified a while ago that a shadow headquarters will allow the Hochlander to more easily recruit and train new spies, which is the kind of thing we'll need if we want the EIC to expand as an information network.
I have nothing against giving him an HQ. I don't however like the idea of giving a Taalite the run of a quite special shrine to Ranald.
[X] Personally scrutinize a Waystone as thoroughly as you possibly can.
[X] Lay the foundations: work with the current members of WEB-MAT and the Waystone Project to build a single unified framework for understanding the Waystones.
In theory, the more members there currently are, the more complete this framework will be. Will unlock further investigations. Can be repeated if desired, but will not unlock anything new after the first time, it will just make a new framework incorporating any new recrui ts.
The voting phase we are in right now works by plan format. You either write up a whole plan in the format below or you vote for a plan someone else proposed by voting for the title.

Plan format:

[><] A Plan
-[><] Action 1
-[><] Action 2
-[><] Action 3
-[><] Action 4
-[><] Action 5
+ one more action for each two actions from the WEB-MAT sub-categories (i.e. those involving Max, Johann or Egrimm or recruiting a new WEB-MAT member)
-[><] EIC: Action from that shortlist
-[><] Library: Action from that shortlist
-[><] Serenity: Paper subject
-[><] Coin: One of the five faces (Gambler, Deceiver, Night Prowler, Protector, Father). If you choose Gambler, specify one of the above actions. If you choose Deceiver, write in what you want to lie about and how. If you choose Protector you are allowed to specify a cover identity if gou want.

@SuperSonicSound your plan is formatted wrongly as well. If you don't include the "-" lines in front of the "[X]" then the vote tallying system will consider each line as a new plan instead of a sub-clause afaik.
 
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[X] Personally scrutinize a Waystone as thoroughly as you possibly can.
[X] Lay the foundations: work with the current members of WEB-MAT and the Waystone Project to build a single unified framework for understanding the Waystones.
In theory, the more members there currently are, the more complete this framework will be. Will unlock further investigations. Can be repeated if desired, but will not unlock anything new after the first time, it will just make a new framework incorporating any new recrui ts.
Turn votes are in plan format. You'll need to assign Mathilde's 5 AP and the freebies into a Plan, and then convince people to vote for that plan. Or you could vote for one of the existing plans that includes both those actions, like @Thomasfoolery's [ ] Starting up debt free, with Webmat field trip
 
Three major objections (aside from the fact that it doesn't involve the Father and the Hedgewise and isn't my plan etc etc):
1. Using the protector assumes that not only we will find something that threatens people in our Gryphon Wood or Alric investigations, but also that we will deal with it on the same turn. The first is possible, the second is quite unlikely.
2. The EIC has pretty much zero presence in the vicinity of Gryphon's Wood. If we are going to investigate it ourselves I seriously doubt they will do better than us.
3. I don't think we should seek an agreement with the largest cult of knowledge and books in the old world right now. Our library is not yet impressive enough to play in the big leagues, and especially not with the cult that has a rivalry with our God. The cult of Quinsberry is a good alternative in my opinion.
WRT the Father and the Hedgewise, it's more efficient to use the Father on a turn where we have free Overwork available because that lets us full-court-press recruitment more easily, which is why I've been advocating for doing that next turn.
1) We regularly encounter and defeat threats in the same action, cf. taking down Dharmstrang and murdering Alka-Seltzer in a single night, and I'm happy to roll the dice on it when the upside is so high
2) We have the Hochlander, who is an expert woodsman, to scout for us. Not just merchant networks.
3) I don't understand what we hope to gain by establishing library relations with halfling bureaucratic records. We don't need genealogical accounts of the Halflings. If getting in good with the Verenans seems like too big a reach at this point, then let's go to Bretonnia instead, because Bretonnian books are at least useful.
I doubt this will get much traction but I'll throw my hat in the ring. Mathilde needs to scruitinse the waystones before we do the foundational framework action. The whole house of cards is built on the idea that Mathilde personally has knowledge that was used in K8P. She needs to have her A game to hand when she goes for this.
I'll vote for this, but you need to specify what cult we're reaching out to in the library action.
 
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I have nothing against giving him an HQ. I don't however like the idea of giving a Taalite the run of a quite special shrine to Ranald.
Is the Hochlander being a Taalite even canon? I think it's just from Redshirts negaverse posts (which are fantastic, Hochlander negaverse 4 when)
In any case, giving a place sacred to Ranald to a spying network makes perfect sense to me.
 
I like Pickle's plan:
[X] Plan Pickle's Political Protector Proposal

But I also want to suggest the all-in WEB-MAT experience. It loses the "Explore the frost ward" action, but in exchange allows writing an additional paper, and having Max and Mathilde learn to pilot gyrocopters - and it brings back-up along on the two investigation missions, making it more likely that things that might ping the Protector side of the coin will go well.

[X] Plan WEB-MAT All-In
-[X] MAX: Study an artefact: Kurgan enchanted weapons
-[X] MAX: Learn to pilot the Gyrocopter along with Mathilde
-[X] EGRIMM: Attempt a Windherder enchantment with Egrimm
--[X] Shadowsteed & Clarity, allowing the user to ride all night without sleep
-[X] WEB-MAT: Investigate Gryphon Wood with one or more members of WEB-MAT (JOHANN)
-[X] WEB-MAT: Investigate Alric with one or more members of WEB-MAT (Egrimm) (NEW)
-[X] WEB-MAT: Write a paper: Observations of Johann's prosthetic arm (FRESH) (Johann, Egrimm)
-[X] Personally scrutinize a Waystone as thoroughly as you possibly can.
-[X] EIC: Investigate what trade goods the Eonir might be willing to import from the Empire. (NEW)
-[X] Library: Seek an agreement with a Cult to have access to their libraries (Verenans)
-[X] SERENITY: The Black Orc Warboss' worship of Only Gork, and what you saw of the Rogue Idol ritual
-[X] COIN: The Protector

Yes, that's right, THREE WEB-MAT actions with Egrimm, 2 with Max and 2 with Johann.

And approval voting, because it also windherds:
[x] Plan: Hugo Bann is the man.
 
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WRT the Father and the Hedgewise, it's more efficient to use the Father on a turn where we have free Overwork available because that lets us full-court-press recruitment more easily, which is why I've been advocating for doing that next turn.
More efficent in the sense that we're more likely to proc The Father? This made sense way back when we had a bunch of somewhat plausible theories, but I'll be honest, I don't see how anyone can argue that any theory but Halétha and maybe The Lady are anywhere close to likely. The Hekarti theory recieved something close to death blow with the new books, and what's left? What other theories are you considering right now?
1) We regularly encounter and defeat threats in the same action, cf. taking down Dharmstrang and murdering Alka-Seltzer in a single night, and I'm happy to roll the dice on it when the upside is so high
Far be it for me to object to rolling the dice on a use of the coin, considering my stance on The Father. I disagree with the particular risk assestment in this case, but sure, I guess.
2) We have the Hochlander, who is an expert woodsman, to scout for us. Not just merchant networks.
Is the Hochlander's personal attention a good enough use of the EIC action? Will he do a better job than Mathilde Weber, Lady Magister of the Grey Order? The Hochlander is a decent manager, not a hero, and the EIC network is useful because it's a network and not because the Hochlander personally is a super spy.
3) I don't understand what we hope to gain by establishing library relations with halfling bureaucratic records. We don't need genealogical accounts of the Halflings. If getting in good with the Verenans seems like too big a reach at this point, then let's go to Bretonnia instead, because Bretonnian books are at least useful.
Quinsberry is the God of halfling scholarship in general. He's basically the halfling Verena. Bretonnia is also good, btw, and is my personal choice, but if you're going for a cult go for Quinsberry.
 
I'll vote for this, but you need to specify what cult we're reaching out to in the library action.

I thought I did, I specified the Cult of Sigmar. I know it's a little unusual, but given how the Cult of Sigmar has made it's self the primary cult of the Empire in many ways I suspect they've picked up a lot of lore and such now granted they've probably burned a lot to but I figure it's still worth a punt.
 
I thought I did, I specified the Cult of Sigmar. I know it's a little unusual, but given how the Cult of Sigmar has made it's self the primary cult of the Empire in many ways I suspect they've picked up a lot of lore and such now granted they've probably burned a lot to but I figure it's still worth a punt.
You've left the "eg" in, which leads to it reading as "Cult of Sigmar" just being an example, rather than being the choice you're specifying.

You'd be better putting it as either: -[ ] Seek an agreement with a Cult to have access to their libraries (specify which: Cult of Sigmar)
or -[ ] Seek an agreement with a Cult to have access to their libraries (Cult of Sigmar)
 
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