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I do not believe that this is playing it safe. Sticking your head in the sand might be comforting, but it's not safe.

The best-case scenario is that whatever hostile is here thinks it's better off letting us go than ambushing us, and you're staking a whole lot on the belief that it's wrong.
Well, we're not alone here. We've got Snorri and a bunch of rangers with us, and the greatest security they (if there indeed are anyone around) have is that no one can see through their memetic field. I'm betting that "they" might just let us leave if we act calmly about it.
 
I. e., they think they're better off letting us go. Yes, I quite follow your logic.

I just think even in the case your suppositions are correct, you're still making a big gamble. Nothing safe about it.
It's not like suddenly assaulting them would make things safer.
 
It's not like suddenly assaulting them would make things safer.
Depending on what they're doing and what forces they have present, it not only might, it's likely to.

We're not the only ones who get the benefits of reorganizing and calling in backup. And giving whoever's here time to think means they have time to decide whatever their ritual is intended for will need to be written off, in which case they have a whole lot of magical power on tap that could be redirected to more immediate uses.
 
Honestly, this is the thing that makes me doubt myself most and second-guess my call. Did we just get advice on the right course of action right there?

Or he could be a chaos plant, sent along on the expedition to remind us that stone is an excellent insulator of magic.
As I see it there are three options.
1. As you say, she's sensing a real threat.
2. She's Mathilde Weber, professionally paranoid.
3. It's an effect from the infohazard that unnerves her.

I've personally said my point that I think we should play it safe, head back to base, and speak with the others. Karag Vlag, despite what others have said, doesn't seem to be going anywhere.
in the case of 1, standing our ground is the best option
in the case of 2 standing our ground costs us nothing
and I find the third case unlikely, as an infohazard of "be scared" would work against an infohazard of "stone is an excellent insulator of magic", since you can't be alarmed about the magic thing and ignorant about the magic thing at the same time.
 
It's not like suddenly assaulting them would make things safer.
The first option unlike the second and third leave Snorri and the rangers blind.

Them being aware that there is active something ongoing will have them on guard.
An instant can be all it takes in combat as many of Mathilde's enemies can't attest to any more.
 
@BoneyM, speaking of infohazard and things thought and known 'out of nowhere' - did Mathilde actually read description of Karak Vlag detailed enough to know placement of gates and what was drawn on them? Or is it something that she 'just happened' to think about?
While the notion that we're staring right at Karak Vlag but due to an antimemetic shield we don't realize it is cool as hell, I would point out that it is highly likely we have in fact read that-detailed a description of Karak Vlag. Stone is an excellent insulator of magic.
The Karaz Ankor +12 - Extensive and Esoteric Imperial / Extensive Bretonnian / Extensive and Esoteric Dwarven
We made sure to invest in the most detailed books possible about the Karaz Ankor so that we would be prepared for the Karag Dum expedition with all the background knowledge about the holds we could possibly get. The odds that Mathilde would also brush up on Karak Vlag, the other lost Hold that lies along the way, are very good, and so it is totally reasonable for her to know this off the top of her head. Stone is an excellent insulator of magic.
 
Eh, agreed about the rest of your post but not this.

Being directly overwhelmed (and consumed) is a greater danger for this expedition than it dying from a thousand cuts.

In any case, I have confidence (faith?) in the Expedition, and in Mathilde.
constering we are already going to lose a few rangers if it is a fight? good luck with that.

I came into this knowing that not everyone is coming back even in the best scenarios.
 
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The first option unlike the second and third leave Snorri and the rangers blind.

Them being aware that there is active something ongoing will have them on guard.
An instant can be all it takes in combat as many of Mathilde's enemies can't attest to any more.
They're dwarven rangers, I sincerely doubt they have let their guard down for a moment while we're here, and will be able to react just as well if we shout an alert while heading away as they would be by standing our grown now.
 
While the notion that we're staring right at Karak Vlag but due to an antimemetic shield we don't realize it is cool as hell, I would point out that it is highly likely we have in fact read that-detailed a description of Karak Vlag. [c olor=transparent]Stone is an excellent insulator of magic.[/color]

We made sure to invest in the most detailed books possible about the Karaz Ankor so that we would be prepared for the Karag Dum expedition with all the background knowledge about the holds we could possibly get. The odds that Mathilde would also brush up on Karak Vlag, the other lost Hold that lies along the way, are very good, and so it is totally reasonable for her to know this off the top of her head. [c olor=transparent]Stone is an excellent insulator of magic.[/color]

Nice.

Damn, damn, damn. I mean, you have a point, but....

When you finally reach your destination, you can see why the Dwarves would have chosen this place for one of their original Holds. The peaks that frame the approach would have been trivial to carve watchtowers into and the sheer cliff-face that the path terminates at would have been the natural place to carve an entrance and, eventually, to place its famous outer gates, which had been inscribed with scenes of the founding Dwarves exterminating the terrible beasts that made their homes in nearby caves. Instead of that great entrance, there's a single sad excavation barely tall enough to admit a Dwarf that gives up barely a few meters in. You wonder if this was an aborted attempt to start from scratch, or someone desperately hoping that Karak Vlag still existed under an external layer of rock.

But that paragraph is so suspicious. It's like she can see it. I mean, the details of what was inscribed on the doors of a hold that completely disappeared 185 years ago? There's extensive and esoteric and then there's being able to accurately describe carvings on doors like you were looking at them.
 
When you finally reach your destination, you can see why the Dwarves would have chosen this place for one of their original Holds. The peaks that frame the approach would have been trivial to carve watchtowers into and the sheer cliff-face that the path terminates at would have been the natural place to carve an entrance and, eventually, to place its famous outer gates, which had been inscribed with scenes of the founding Dwarves exterminating the terrible beasts that made their homes in nearby caves.

Can I just comment on this by the way? I don't think there is one paragraph that shows just how much Mathilde understands Dwarves more than this. One glance and she saw probably exactly what the founders of Vlag saw when they came upon it. It's kind of easy to just get caught up in the inevitable evil threat, but this is a really good insight in Mathilde's character and her knowledge and relationship with the Dwarves.
 
But that paragraph is so suspicious. It's like she can see it. I mean, the details of what was inscribed on the doors of a hold that completely disappeared 185 years ago? There's extensive and esoteric and then there's being able to accurately describe carvings on doors like you were looking at them.
I mean, expecting Dwarfs to have a fancily carved gate (so fancy it's described as famous) and not include a textual description of just exactly what the carving is supposed to depict in the same breath as they mention the gate exists is not a common position for people familiar with dwarfs.

As far as actual detail is given, Mathilde just lists what the carving is supposed to be a scene of like she's reading it out of a guidebook - no commentary on the actual artwork whatsoever.
 
But that paragraph is so suspicious. It's like she can see it. I mean, the details of what was inscribed on the doors of a hold that completely disappeared 185 years ago? There's extensive and esoteric and then there's being able to accurately describe carvings on doors like you were looking at them.

Considering the gates were famous even by dwarf standards there's bound to be sketches and artwork along with exquisitely accurate descriptions in Dawi books.

If Vlag is some day reclaim I'd expect the Dawi to be capable of making a near perfect replica of the door carvings.
 
There is also another aspect of it - Mathilde seen stream of magic flowing in and 'ending', and stated that it had to be used. But if is was being gathered and shaped into ritual, then this enormous amount of energy gathered over centuries would be much easier to spot than merely incoming stream of magic. A hell waiting to be unleashed. She sees nothing... but is still on verge of panic, convinced of a danger.
I mean, if they were just dumping it into the magical equivalent of a big open-top pool of glowing radioactive goop, probably it would be super visible, sure. But the reason that Mathilde cites in the text for concluding this is a ritual is that she thinks the only way there wouldn't be the magical equivalent of a hyper-irradiated nuclear meltdown site that would be clearly visible even though stone is an excellent insulator of magic is if the magic is not just pooling there/radiating out randomly.

I.e., her conclusion is that this torrent of magic has been actively channeled into something for this entire time. To use an analogy, she thinks the reason that there isn't a big pool of toxic magic down there is that something has been burning it for fuel as quickly as it pours in ever since Karak Vlag got stoneified. And even if it is being stockpiled, there's no reason to think that they wouldn't be storing it in something that's got the magical equivalent of lead lining (whether that be in the form of special materials or specialized wards) to tamp down the radiation leakage drastically, and hence limiting its visibility to Windsight commensurately.

Also, y'know, it's hard to see what anybody would get out of magically convincing somebody who sees through the first layer of obfuscation (stone is an excellent insulator of magic) that there's actually a dire threat when actually nothing important is happening down there. Like... what's the motive supposed to be there, exactly? Do you think Ranald is gonna pop out, yell "psych! lol gotcha noob" and then scarper off back to the divine realm snickering to himself because it was all one enormous practical joke?

Infohazards are spooky by nature, but I don't think we need to go out of our way to invent reasons why this one is spookier than it already seems.
The best-case scenario is that whatever hostile is here thinks it's better off letting us go than ambushing us, and you're staking a whole lot on the belief that it's wrong.
The first implicit assumption underlying this is that they've already noticed us. Which has definitely not been established. The second implicit assumption there is that the only way they wouldn't attack immediately is if they've decided to not attack us at all. Which has also definitely not been established.

They could (easily) have failed to notice us, as we've done very, very little to draw attention; we literally haven't even cast a spell up here, we just used our Windsight which is the magical equivalent of passive sensors. Channeling Ulgu to cast a spell and using that spell to summon a dragon and a bunch of knights, on the other hand, is attention-getting as all sweet fuck.

Likewise, if they're prepping an ambush, it rather likely is not meant to be for this exact moment. Which would mean if we don't show our hand, we can get back to the Expedition and give them forewarning without letting on that we know it's coming, which is a significantly stronger position to be in.
 
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[X] Stand your ground.

A snake observed is much less dangerous than one you do not see, and I believe the same can be said for whatever we are dealing with.
 
1: Lord of Change
2: Tzeentch Sorcerer circle
3: Chaos dwarfs mini throng.
4: Tzeentch Sorcerer and Chosen bodyguards
5: Chaos Warband of Tzeentch (no Chosen)
6: Ulgu Dragon.


roll your fate!

Ok, but I am a Ranaldite, so...

Edit: Ulgu dragon it is, seemingly... but, since a 1 is impossible, I have to bump everything up by 1, so I guess its the chaos warband.
storryeater threw 2 4-faced dice. Reason: Fate Total: 6
4 4 2 2
 
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