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A Sword Without a Hilt: A Song of Ice and Fire/D&D 3.5 Crossover

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Duesal said:
Ignoring Xue from this point forward is actually how we best snub her. Our goal here isn't to recruit Pol Ning, so if the girl doesn't take our offer then that's on her.
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Yeah, except that's not obvious from Xue's perspective. It specially won't be so if we do what has been proposed, which will be regarded as basically a huge gamble because that's how this ridiculous people would see insulting someone with political importance to their face.

From their PoV, we are making an enormous effort over this. It is effortless for us, but no everyone can be us.
 
065tdsa said:
Yeah, except that's not obvious from Xue's perspective. It specially won't be so if we do what has been proposed, which will be regarded as basically a huge gamble because that's how this ridiculous people would see insulting someone with political importance to their face.

From their PoV, we are making an enormous effort over this. It is effortless for us, but no everyone can be us.
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I'm not seeing how this is perceived as particularly hard for us? We're a Mythic Dragon Sorcerer King and we haven't been hiding the fact, and we just annihilated the Golden Company which Trader Town was having a lot of trouble with. How then would bypassing Xue's agents to speak with Pol Ning be seen as difficult for us?

Either way, how Xue perceives us genuinely isn't our problem. What she wanted was official diplomatic ties in some capacity, and then when we shot that down she at least wanted acknowledgement. She's not getting anything.
 
Hmm, could she be lying?

Iirc Xue and Pol Ning had more than a few scrapes on the Orange court, so could it ve possible the Emperor hasnt agreed to shit yet?

I also remember something about Orange wanting a heir and about Xue helping with that? Could she be angling to split off the brothers, kill Emperor Orange and become the Regent?

#ParanoiaGang
 
[X] Azel


People, Lady Xue is not actually bad at diplomacy. She's just used to being a big fish in a medium-sized pond having all the advantages; More potent magic, better connections, the weight of tradition.. This is merely the desperate flailing which results from trying to apply her usual (very probably effective!) methods in a rather grander scale. For example, Pol Ning is warded against divination and indeed far enough away that visiting would be troublesome. We just casually burned an 8th level spell to power through it and planning to burn several 7th ones to merely make an offer to someone she considers unimportant.

Even if she does refuse, she can leverage said offer for a better situation. More, there's a distinct difference mentally between 'I do this because it is my duty' and 'I do my duty freely, despite attractive offers to get out of it'.
 
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TalonofAnathrax said:
I am saddened to hear that we care more about pwning Xue than helping Pol Ning out of the hole we stuck her into.
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Seconding Crake, I'd like to help her, but I don't think we have any way to beyond what we are offering?
She's loyal to her family, and to her culture.
She's supremely unlikely to take our offer of course, any offer for that matter, when her brother will be acting in his official position by sending her away/removing her powers/somesuch thing.

...That's pretty much the dilemma of Lana, now that I think about it.
Otherwise decent person, bound by extreme loyalty to something we can't/don't want to deal with.

Xue is acting like a little shitgoblin though, and the "ignore her" is the most reasonable approach to counter-insulting her.
 
Duesal said:
I'm not seeing how this is perceived as particularly hard for us? We're a Mythic Dragon Sorcerer King and we haven't been hiding the fact, and we just annihilated the Golden Company which Trader Town was having a lot of trouble with. How then would bypassing Xue's agents to speak with Pol Ning be seen as difficult for us?

Either way, how Xue perceives us genuinely isn't our problem. What she wanted was official diplomatic ties in some capacity, and then when we shot that down she at least wanted acknowledgement. She's not getting anything.
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She wanted a good deal more then merely diplomatic ties. Marriage alliance is the biggest tie possible.

Had she tried to salvage this by, say, proposing to have Pol Ning act as an envoy at our court to restore her honour or something, I'd be all ears. She didn't. So... the Draconic middle finger it is.
 
egoo said:
Xue is acting like a little shitgoblin though, and the "ignore her" is the most reasonable approach to counter-insulting her.
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The unreasonable one would be to burn several 9th level spells in order to reshape her into a carbonized statue and then compress that down into a tiny diamond and send it back to Orange Justice in a box made of lead.
 
Nickan said:
[X] Azel


People, Lady Xue is not actually bad at diplomacy. She's just used to being a big fish in a medium-sized pond having all the advantages; More potent magic, better connections, the weight of tradition.. This is merely the desperate flailing which results from trying to apply her usual (very probably effective!) methods in a rather grander scale. For example, Pol Ning is warded against divination and indeed far enough away that visiting would be troublesome. We just casually burned an 8th level spell to power through it and planning to burn several 7th ones to merely make an offer to someone she considers unimportant.

Even if she does refuse, she can leverage said offer for a better situation. More, there's a distinct difference mentally between 'I do this because it is my duty' and 'I do my duty freely, despite attractive offers to get out of it'.
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Mind, grossly misjudging your bargaining position and the personality of your opposition is a pretty clear indicator of being bad at diplomacy or at very least dropping the ball something fierce this time.
 
[X] Plan LOOT
-[X] Telepathically and verbally ask Daenerys, Lya, Vee and Rina to visit Pol Ning in her chambers to make our offer and report on her state and situation. Offer Ning a job as our unofficial means of communication, coordinating with us against Tiamat or Devils, and if needed carrying messages between the Emperor and us. Official recognition is inconvenient for now, but that could change in a few months. Otherwise, offer her a job for us on the other side of the world.
-[X] Also let Richard, Garin and Malarys get ready to reinforce either of the groups in case of trouble.
-[X] "My Lady, I find myself in an odd situation. I have come here with no intention to offend you, but apparently I am not offered the same courtesy. I feel this is most disharmonious."
-[X] Take a good sip of tea.
-[X] "I wonder how our relationship would be if we were to meet at the court in Yin in the future. The prospect seems unpleasant."

I did this during my commute, so it's low-effort. Thanks Azel.
I wanted to include "Pol Ning may be too busy to marry", but it didn't quite fit.
 
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TalonofAnathrax said:
[X] Plan LOOT
-[X] Telepathically and verbally ask Daenerys, Lya, Vee and Rina to visit Pol Ning in her chambers to make our offer and report on her state and situation. Offer Ning a job as our unofficial means of communication, coordinating with us against Tiamat or Devils, and if needed carrying messages between the Emperor and us. Official recognition is inconvenient for now, but that could change in a few months. Otherwise, offer her a job for us on the other side of the world.
-[X] Also let Richard, Garin and Malarys get ready to reinforce either of the groups in case of trouble.
-[X] "My Lady, I find myself in an odd situation. I have come here with no intention to offend you, but apparently I am not offered the same courtesy. I feel this is most disharmonious."
-[X] Take a good sip of tea.
-[X] "I wonder how our relationship would be if we were to meet at the court in Yin in the future. The prospect seems unpleasant."
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You are offering her a position we don't have the authority to offer her unilaterally if we aren't willing to recognize Pol Qo. It's a non-offer.
 
Crake said:
You are offering her a position we don't have the authority to offer her unilaterally if we aren't willing to recognize Pol Qo. It's a non-offer.
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What? We absolutely can. We'll refuse contact from other people, but we'll take it from her if she's discreet.

This is something we can do. The other Emperor can refuse to send us any messages, but that's why I didn't explicitly rule out polite contact in the future.
 
Crake said:
The unreasonable one would be to burn several 9th level spells in order to reshape her into a carbonized statue and then compress that down into a tiny diamond and send it back to Orange Justice in a box made of lead.
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So Polymorph any object, but more lethal and not dispellable?

Also now you made me think about orange guy in terms of an overutilized Fortnite dance
 
I'm just wondering how she's going to be able to spin this when she get's back to the Court.

It's clear to me (though I must admit I might be wrong on this score) that she was sent here to try and worm an alliance out of us. Something to make the maniac with firebreathing dragons on tap to be on their side and not a free agent flapping in the wind to be picked up by any asshole with enough wit.

Essentially if this was the Three Kingdom's era we're currently Lu Bu but without the whole treachery nonsense. Having us on board is great, having us on board with someone else is a disaster.

Hell just getting an agreement to keep our scaly ass in our proverbial lane could have been seen as a win. What the actual fuck is she playing at here?

I've seen at least 3 ways she could have scored an easy win, and yet she seems convinced we're some kind of low brow barbarian that can be cowed with enough big confusing words and a fall back of "it's our culture you see, it will be diplomatic if you believe everything that's currently coming out of my mouth about it."

What I'm saying is either she's not the sharpest tool in the shed, our performance on the battlefield rattled her something fierce, or she sucks at diplomacy harder than she apparently sucks off Pol Ning's brother (which considering how high she currently is at court I find rather hard to believe.)

I'd be more intrigued at figuring out what it was if she wasn't such a huge bitch, as it is? Nah.

[X] Azel
 
Evaunit02mark1 said:
I'm just wondering how she's going to be able to spin this when she get's back to the Court.

It's clear to me (though I must admit I might be wrong on this score) that she was sent here to try and worm an alliance out of us. Something to make the maniac with firebreathing dragons on tap to be on their side and not a free agent flapping in the wind to be picked up by any asshole with enough wit.

Essentially if this was the Three Kingdom's era we're currently Lu Bu but without the whole treachery nonsense. Having us on board is great, having us on board with someone else is a disaster.

Hell just getting an agreement to keep our scaly ass in our proverbial lane could have been seen as a win. What the actual fuck is she playing at here?

I've seen at least 3 ways she could have scored an easy win, and yet she seems convinced we're some kind of low brow barbarian that can be cowed with enough big confusing words and a fall back of "it's our culture you see, it will be diplomatic if you believe everything that's currently coming out of my mouth about it."

What I'm saying is either she's not the sharpest tool in the shed, our performance on the battlefield rattled her something fierce, or she sucks at diplomacy harder than she apparently sucks off Pol Ning's brother (which considering how high she currently is at court I find rather hard to believe.)

I'd be more intrigued at figuring out what it was if she wasn't such a huge bitch, as it is? Nah.

[X] Azel
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Speaking of her being rattled by the battle, @DragonParadox, can we assume Lady Xue watched our entire fight with f!Aegon and the Avatar of Tiamat?
 
Azel said:
I am very tempted to say these exact words to her.

I know I said that I don't care about all of this, but Xue is getting increasingly irksome with her refusal to give so much as an inch, or in this case, a disgraced sister she wants to get rid of.

...

I think I am beginning to care about this.
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You are channeling the awakening red dragon mindset fabulously.
//
[X] Azel
And the 'you are starting to annoy me' chat fits. 'So you got a ritual prepared with the local Kami. I just annihilated your little problem, helped my god coalition nomm the mother of all dragons, and did take five minutes to take care of some annyoing unruly undead. And took the time to gratuitously talk to you. To get snubbed.' with a lot less words.
 
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That was more like an elaborate holding action to be fair, still it is rather impressive to stand before an avatar of a God only slightly less powerful than a physical manifestation upon the Material Plane would be with all her untapped power, and thwart her repeatedly, and then murder her for power while she was down wrestled to the ground by a giant construct.
 
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