Afaik it's not those runes. Imperial mages have their own system of runecraft in this quest. Can't find the quote quickly though.
Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest
- Thread starter Boney
- Start date
- Fantasy Users' Choice!
Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
- Location
- Memphis, TN
Dwarf Runes are like normal human runes but better in every way basically.
My thoughts on it are basically that its linked to how the College's powers and psychology relate to society:
-Gold College basically adds direct economic value. As such they are encouraged to live fabulously extravagant lifestyles, because a Gold Wizard's best way to make money is to sell their expertise, either in crafting fine goods, improving the economy or proliferating technology. To compound this, the Gold mindset is highly logical, as long as its more effective to earn money legally they would.
-Grey College creates nothing, but it DOES have a lot of ways to TAKE away economic value and political power. Even a Grey Journeyman would be hard to keep from robbing people blind with no resistance or oversight save for other Grey wizards. Thus they are hugely constrained and strongly indoctrinated. The Wind's mentality of suspicion, ambiguity and perspective also means that they interact oddly with rules interpretations from normal peoples' perspective. The ability for the same activity to be considered legal or illegal depending on complex context is a feature, not a bug. It encourages the Grey Wizard to explain themselves a lot.
-Jade and Amber Colleges are druids and tribal shamans respectively, and don't really need much supervision beyond the basics, leaning on a preexisting culture instead, though it helps that they like remote areas with fewer people around. The Jade do produce wealth while the Amber don't however.
-Light and Celestial Colleges are spiritual/academics, who by nature of the Wind they wield, effectively recuse themselves from society. Don't need to control them much, they'd be happy nerding it out over theology or mathematics and not bother people much.
-Bright College are basically dedicated battlemages and their College runs along Do Or Die lines, hammer in discipline and if they can avoid killing themselves they have a long and illustrious career burning the enemies of humanity to death.
-Death College PROBABLY has a bit of a problem with slippage to necromancy, though they, like the Bright College, are a bit on the destructive side(and depressive to boot). Tighter controls probably just to make sure they aren't going to the dark side.
...I could see him do this.
Uh...humans DO learn rune magic. The Dwarfs won't teach it, and you can't steal a Rune by studying an item with it. The concealment and copyright is in the process, and humans can't really spend a few decades spying on an apprentice to learn enough without being caught or getting bored
We're not taking it. We're giving it to Ranald.
GM confirmed that Ranald will take it and do unspecified things with it.
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For me, the choice of grounding the energies is not a moral statement about the Empire but of trusting in 18 years of training and practice. Her experience has been that doing magic the Grey College way works. She knows how to earth.
On the other hand, the last time she had to deal with hostile divine power in a temple, she called in Ranald and that worked albeit at the cost of a priest's life.
Here she has neither heavy duty earthing equipment nor an ordained priest. Which Improvisation has the best chance?
On the other hand, the last time she had to deal with hostile divine power in a temple, she called in Ranald and that worked albeit at the cost of a priest's life.
Here she has neither heavy duty earthing equipment nor an ordained priest. Which Improvisation has the best chance?
To be hair working at the cost of Mathilde's life is acceptable here. She has spares thanks to the seed,
Kornet
Quite possibly a sloth abomination
- Location
- Mother Russia
I suspect Mathilde counts as an ordained priest. The fact she is not sure is she is is a feature, not a bug.
At the very least she counts enough to properly consecrate a shrine to Ranald, which is typically firmly ordained priest territory.
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- Location
- Brazil
You know, the amok option is probably stupid good, mechanically, and fairly safe. I'm betting we'd keep the extra POWAH we got while smashing around Orc's, translating likely to extra WS/S/T.
At the rate we are going...
There's nothing important underground right?
Omake: There's nothing important underground right?
The released energy from the Ork's ritual was swirling all around her. The coruscating green energies whirled faster and faster with increasing speed and power and she knew she had only moments to act or otherwise become a victim to the tremulous storm of power.
With only a few moments to think she defaulted to what she always did when magic ran out of control. She grabbed a firm hold on her greatsword and shoved its point into the ground and began channeling the surrounding magics into the ground. She remembered the wise words Magister Regimand had given her for situations like this, "Push it all into the ground as deep as you can and pray."
She grabbed a hold of the Ulgu in the winds and pushed them into the ground, but it made no difference to the swirling storm and so she instead grabbed a hold of the swirling Ulgu and used it like grasping fingers to gain a grip on the storm. The crackling energies flashed into bright flames as winds mixed and became dhar that was then set alight and the sword she was holding started glowing first a dull red and then slowly into a bright white that hurt to look upon as it lost its shape and became less a sword and more of a dripping steel puddle due to the energies coursing through it.
Eventually the incredible pain of channeling all the energies started to die off and then finally completed. She found herself on her knees and with her hands in a puddle which had once been her sword. She carefully removed her hands from her former sword and brushed the molten drops off on the nearby stonework which now that she looked closely had a number of cracks. She tried to standup but failed to do so, still dizzy from her enormous channeling effort and a few remaining tremors caused from the enormous outpouring of energy into the ground.
At the thought of tremors Mathilde quickly looked around checking to ensure the surrounding mountain wasn't about to cave in on her. "It's a good thing Dwarf craftsmanship is so sturdy," she said out loud in relief at realizing she was safe after a few moments. In the end all was well, she had stopped the terrible ritual, the mountain had suffered no damage and the energies had passed by without causing any damage.
Meanwhile in the underground Skaven Tunnels
"Help Rocks are falling everywhere-where!"
"Everything's on fire!"
"The Mushrooms are attacking!"
Since it looks like grounding the energies out isn't going to win I'd hate to see us miss what could have happened. So here's one possible amusing result.
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Part of the issue I see is that Mathilde doesn't need to invent sorcery, which as I understand it involves a priest using their soul as a bridge to allow their god* to influence the material world using the undifferentiated power of the warp which gods are made of, and rather than using that power directly to create an effect as a normal divine lore does, using that divine power to manipulate the Winds of Magic to produce a spell. Sorcery is like reverse necromancy in that way. Now that works for Necromancy as the True Dhar it manipulates is present in the material world where the necromancer can touch it with their magic. The same applies to the hypothetical not-Necromancy that Elsbeth Von Draken may perform on the ashes of dead god she has, or whatever Mathilde can do it the snake juice with Ulgu. It wouldn't work with Ranald's divine power though, as Ranald's power is in the Aethyr, and without channeling it through her soul Mathilde has no way to get it to the real world. The other issue is that the reason people do sorcery is because the divine miracles of priests are generally significantly weaker than what can be done with the Winds.
Now, Mathilde could probably work with a circle of Ranald's priests to use Ulgu to gather and direct the divine energy they've channeled into the material plane to accomplish things in collaboration with them, but I'm not sure what that will do.
* or, as the high elves might have it, the part of you which is part of/overlaps with the god in question, which is arguably why they don't see arcane magic as being different to divine magic.
According to Realms of Sorcery, dwarven runecraft is quite different to the human (elven derived runecraft?), but is used when they try to make permanent/long lasting magic items that don't incorporate powerstones.
NeonLights
Formerly Reliable_2IC
- Location
- In shambles
[X] You are a faithful of Ranald, being in the right place at the right time to unbalance the scales. Try to steal the energies.
[X] You are a Magister of the Grey Order, and follow the traditions laid down by Teclis and Magnus the Pious. Try to ground the energies.
At this point all that one can do is pray, and hope one can scrape together enough luck to pull of a heist of this magnitude.
[X] You are a Magister of the Grey Order, and follow the traditions laid down by Teclis and Magnus the Pious. Try to ground the energies.
At this point all that one can do is pray, and hope one can scrape together enough luck to pull of a heist of this magnitude.
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- Location
- England
To be clear, there's absolutely no reason to believe it works this way. Not in RAW, not in lore.
The closest thing to an actual statement on the viability of using both divine lores and arcane lores together that I know of comes from Magister Volans, who said -
With that said, the fact that it could work, doesn't mean that it would work. Arcane and divine lores require different attitudes and mentalities, in general, and using them both at the same time would be difficult unless you'd reached some kind of transcendental understanding.
Tome of Salvation says ' Arcane Lore and the Divine Lore are mutually exclusive; the study, focus, and mindset required by any Lore Talent is such that you may only use one at a time. For example, an Anointed Priest of Morr who joins the Amethyst Order effectively abandons his faith in favour of scholarly learning, and thus loses access to the Lore of Morr in favour of the Lore of Death. Conversely, an Amethyst Wizard who chooses to become a servant of Morr would set aside his academic approach to working with magic and embrace his faith—using Divine Lore rather than Arcane Lore. '
Volans seems to be talking about sorcery there, note the reference to using divine assistance to avoid miscasts.
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Interesting thought and a good point on divine magic being weaker than the arcane equivalent, but it's also more diverse, what Mathilde could use from Ranald would not be his power but his knowledge his themes, his capacity to do something a little outside the themes of Ulgu. So in that paradigm Ranald could show Mathilde what his spells look like making it much easier for her to design arcane Ulgu variants.
Alternatively if say a chunk of that former idol of Gork would fall to the ground invested with the power of Ranald for perhaps an enterprising wizard to use as a focus well I would not say no.
- Location
- Brazil
This is, by far, the best interpretation of it.
I don't feel like just making an offering, and trying to eat it whole by ourselves sounds highly unwise.
Fencing it to Ranald so we can get our cut, tho, is perfect. There's an inherent greed and ambition to being a thief that "just shove it all to Ranald" is missing.
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- Location
- United States of America
I will note, though, that we may have prevented a whole Waaagh from forming, which is fantastic. We really don't need a Waaagh empowered Greenskin horde from the citadel hitting the expedition's defensive lines.
Once again, Mathilde is accidentally going above and beyond the call of duty.
Once again, Mathilde is accidentally going above and beyond the call of duty.
- Location
- Actually pretty lost
They said this:
Which I don't think confirms or denies anything, really.
I think you'll find it's Chad Ranald > Virgin Mork.
Orcs are asexual, whereas Ranald got so deep into Shallya's pants he drank from her "chalice" and became a God himself!
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- Location
- England
Yes. Different attitudes are required, I'm aware, and said as much. We're talking about fundamental incompatibility.
It should be noted that you can switch between Divine Lore based careers and Arcane Lore based careers without ill effects. You can spend however long you like racking up shyish marks as a journeyman, and then become a priest of Morr, rack up Morr's marks, and then switch back to become a magister of shyish. Though this would be silly, and probably not the intention of the rules.
The fact remains that there is no reason to believe that arcane marks would clash in the way you described.
- Location
- Earth
This. This is good. Don't forget the part where even trying to steal it is gambling with our very soul.
- Location
- Austria
Yeah, but I don't think that people want Mathilde to become Divine Loremasters of Ranald if it means losing out on spellcasting. Even those who are voting to fence off the stuff to Ranald in hopes of getting a cut would rather not lose out on arcane magic, I bet.
I dimly recall BoneyM saying something to that effect, although I can't currently find it.