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With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Twelve)

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I wonder who on Earth is going to be the first person to learn of Paul's little trick to get around his name taboo. I assume we're going to meet someone new that doesn't know his secret identity and I don't remember Paul using the workaround before he left Earth.
 
To completely digress for a moment, I've never been able to keep track of all the discussion, but was there ever a word of god statement on Nabu not influencing the JL to accept his membership/possession? And why did Paul never seem to actually check them for mental influences? Sure, they have J'onn, but he's been beaten before.
 
BrambleThorn said:
But it makes chaoswind uncomfortable, so obviously they are committing an unforgivable sin.
If everyone who thought they should be entitled to make make policy on other people's choices of romantic partner had their genitals removed and lost the right to ever have relations with another person, the world would be a better place. Some parts of Russia, the Middle East, and the American South might end up completely barren, but overall I think the sacrifice would be worth it.
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You are the one bringing up religion, so let me guess you are pissed off because your dad sent you to a religious camp to get the shit beaten out of you, right? Or probably something more pedestrian like simple parental abuse.

I will limit my response to just that and considering the barrage of shit you threw in my direction that should be fair enough, if you wish to dance then drop me a PM.

Anyways, sorry but my motives are neither religious nor sexual, my disdain of religion is well documented and I laugh if you think i give a flying fuck whether someone bones a woman, a man or a pterodactyl, so long all parties have agreed to it (because polygamy is fine too) and no one is withholding information to get an advantage over their partner(s). However, I don't believe there is a magical cut off point in with people can give consent, each person develops at a different rate based on their own experiences as such some can make informed decisions extremely young while others realistically never can, a relationship between an ageless immortal and a plucky young adult is too unbalanced to be tolerable without scrutiny.

I wasn't talking about Joe Doe marrying someone half his age, or Mary Cougar the widower that married the best friend of her son, those are fine*

*So long the relationship involves an honest exchange of information so proper consent can be given.

However this isn't on that level, I remarked several times (as you claim to be annoyed by all of them clearly you read most of them) that this isn't just about someone dating someone half their age, this is an ageless thaumatologist that sees no problem with his eugenics program, that doesn't have the decency to empower one of his previous partners so they can live as long as him and that doesn't have the decency to kill himself and move on and leave the world to the rest of the mortals.

Nugar said:
To completely digress for a moment, I've never been able to keep track of all the discussion, but was there ever a word of god statement on Nabu not influencing the JL to accept his membership/possession? And why did Paul never seem to actually check them for mental influences? Sure, they have J'onn, but he's been beaten before.
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He was allowed to use Zatara vote on himself and also had Zarara argue in favor of his membership. We don't know of Zatara did this in full capacity, if he was being influenced or if Nabu lied about it and only made it look like Zatara was fine with everything.
 
BrambleThorn said:
Dude, let it go. Paul has been gone from Earth for a couple months at most, which means she has had an orange ring for even less time than that. And the weaponeer has already made a blue lantern in that time. You are way to invested in saying "to late to switch" when her sunk time as an orange lantern is miniscule compared to the rest of her career.

If she could be an acceptable orange lantern but could thrive as a blue lantern (which was OL's assessment in story, that Blue would suit her better), she really should switch over.
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Crimson Doom said:
I believe you highly underestimate the way that Orange thinking changes you, or any spectrum color, really. By standard humanoid biology, methods of thinking become ingrained over time. If that were all we were dealing with, you'd be exactly right. But with Orange in particular, there is a powerful metaphysical force encouraging Koriand'r to think that way even more, and furthermore, this metaphysical force is channeled through an Entity that is highly invested in having her plugged in to Orange and who doesn't really understand restraint very well. Without Paul moderating the Ophidian, she'd already be insane, from what we understand of how Orange works; even with Paul's moderation, I sincerely believe that Koriand'r would have a hard time switching to Blue. Not to mention, the ring is what gave her freedom, personal power, and a people free to become what they will. Why would she want to give that up?

Now, one potential idea is to have her dual-wield. Blue and Orange can co-exist, if not easily, and I can definitely see Koriand'r being the one to figure out the necessary mindset to dual-wield effectively. But outright abandoning Orange makes no sense logically or emotionally to me.
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Sinestro switched from Green to Yellow after how many years, and ended up...?

And Alan just switched from Green to Blue after, again, decades of Green.

Starfire's been an Orange Lantern for less than two months? Give her two months of being blue and then she'll have evened out and can go back to being an awesome blue. Or who knows?
 
Obloquy said:
Sinestro switched from Green to Yellow after how many years, and ended up...?

And Alan just switched from Green to Blue after, again, decades of Green.

Starfire's been an Orange Lantern for less than two months? Give her two months of being blue and then she'll have evened out and can go back to being an awesome blue. Or who knows?
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This... is actually a very good point that I had not considered. Very well, I withdraw that particular objection.

On a completely unrelated note, did anyone else see the ratings vanish? I want to rate this post Insightful, but the buttons aren't there.
 
Chaoswind said:
However this isn't on that level, I remarked several times (as you claim to be annoyed by all of them clearly you read most of them) that this isn't just about someone dating someone half their age, this is an ageless thaumatologist that sees no problem with his eugenics program, that doesn't have the decency to empower one of his previous partners so they can live as long as him and that doesn't have the decency to kill himself and move on and leave the world to the rest of the mortals.
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If he doesn't want to die, and the process by which he avoids death doesn't cause harm to anyone else, then why should he have to die? He has just as much a right to live as you or I. Just because a person is old doesn't mean they suddenly are no longer a person.

Why should it matter that he is vastly older than his lovers? Provided everyone is an adult, is mentally capable of consenting, and verbally consents without coercion, there is no foul.

Why does it matter that he hasn't made any of his lovers immortal? He isn't obligated to make people immortal merely because he is capable of doing so. It might be nice, but charity is not a requirement.

If the answer to any of the above is "because it pisses me off" then what you've got is an opinion. That's fine, you're welcome to opinions, but we're just as welcome to tell you that your opinions are bad or ill-formed.
 
APL 123AZ said:
Turns out this new guy Paul recruited is going to rape Zatanna. All in the name of some grand plan about making more magic capable humans.

There, I said it. Now you have to go back and check.
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*types "rape zatanna" into search, puts "Mr Zoat" into the user field, then limits the search to this thread*

I'm finding a story update where Zatanna 50 appears, and Grayven 16 mentions Diana 16 saving Baroness 16 from being gang raped by Russians by bringing her to Themyscira, but I'm not seeing anything about Zoat planning on having this Doctor guy rape Zatanna.
 
APL 123AZ said:
Turns out this new guy Paul recruited is going to rape Zatanna. All in the name of some grand plan about making more magic capable humans.

There, I said it. Now you have to go back and check.
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No, that was already happening. (And we already knew that it was Main Zatanna who is a adult unlike 16 Zatanna who is not.)

If that was all that happened I just want to ask how that took up ?? pages of back and forth.

Ganurath said:
*types "rape zatanna" into search, puts "Mr Zoat" into the user field, then limits the search to this thread*

I'm finding a story update where Zatanna 50 appears, and Grayven 16 mentions Diana 16 saving Baroness 16 from being gang raped by Russians by bringing her to Themyscira, but I'm not seeing anything about Zoat planning on having this Doctor guy rape Zatanna.
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...
 
Ganurath said:
*types "rape zatanna" into search, puts "Mr Zoat" into the user field, then limits the search to this thread*

I'm finding a story update where Zatanna 50 appears, and Grayven 16 mentions Diana 16 saving Baroness 16 from being gang raped by Russians by bringing her to Themyscira, but I'm not seeing anything about Zoat planning on having this Doctor guy rape Zatanna.
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He didn't ask what Zoat said on the subject. Only what yall, the peanut gallery, spent the last five pages talking about. :D

Jcc10 said:
No, that was already happening. (And we already knew that it was Main Zatanna who is a adult unlike 16 Zatanna who is not.)

If that was all that happened I just want to ask how that took up ?? pages of back and forth.
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Its SB in a different color scheme. How do you think it happened? :p
 
There is a data point, in regards to Koriand'r's... suitability? to Orange or Blue, that I think has been overlooked on the Debate; and disregarding my own opinion on the subject I would like to share it, precisely because I remembered it.

There is that scene, during the Princesses' training, where Ophidian comes out of the Lantern and imbues Koriand'r's Soul with Orange Light in an effort to make her more like her Agent, Paul, and that did have consequences, the most easily apparent which was her newfound capability to output greater power using her ring. Or at least it was what Paul commented on. Now, her attitude didn't greatly change overall, but we are not privy to her thoughts and so can barely infer in the effects that may have come from being literally touched by the Embodiment of Avarice and directly inyected in her Soul with the Light of the Ring that she didn't remove after the incident, from what I remember, and that she has continued carrying and using pretty effectively.

With all of that said, maybe it affected her, maybe not, but it's something to consider, because being affected by the Emotional Lights physically like Alan, is different than being affected spiritually like Paul or Guy.
 
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Stop: Bring them all and in the darkness infract them
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    • bring them all and in the darkness infract them Right, @BrambleThorn , @Chaoswind you can stop right here. Bramblethorn, I don't care how upset you are, I'm not a huge fan of you telling people to hit themselves in the crotch with a meat tenderizer, or armchair diagnosing them as a sociopath. Take 25 points and three days out under Rule 3, and know that this is your one warning in regards to spaghetti arguing. If you'd had previous offences, it'd be 50.

    Chaoswind, I'm really unimpressed with your general conduct here. For many and varied violations of Rules 2, 3 & 4, I'm awarding you 50 points and a week out from the thread. Talking about how a character should just 'kill themself' is unacceptable, as is intimating that another user may have been abused, and then using that intimation as a weapon in an attempt to score cheap shots. This is neither clever nor impressive. Knock it off.


    wait there's more @Crimson Doom, this post, in dicing up an opponent's post in an argument into tiny little chunks in order to score cheap points rather than addressing the argument holistically, you have violated Sufficient Velocity's Rule 4 in regards to 'spaghetti arguing', and have earnt a Warning for Marginal Behaviour for your efforts, due to no prior offences.
     
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    • I don't know where this weird obsession with what "color they are better suited for" but I wish it would stop. It's like some bizarre min/max crap. "Well you see, she would have plus .04 hopey bonus to her base skills"
     
    Maxx Crowley said:
    I don't know where this weird obsession with what "color they are better suited for" but I wish it would stop. It's like some bizarre min/max crap. "Well you see, she would have plus .04 hopey bonus to her base skills"
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    I think it originates from the dislike of change. Everyone likes Cannon!Starfire and feels that she should be a user of hope. (Ignoring that WTR!Starfire was cut off from that timeline.)
     
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    Resolution (part 10)
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    • 12th September
    19:02 GMT -5

    Solstice Fitness is unusual in Gotham City in that despite having an ominous name, it actually isn't owned by a supervillain or secret society. The owner/manager is a member of the Gotham Business Association, the legitimate successor to the mob-owned Gotham Small Traders Association. A couple of the staff have criminal records, but since one of them is Paula Nguyen I'm not going to throw any stones. Selina and Holly come here too, though when last I asked Artemis didn't.

    But Jade does.

    Doctor Balewa said that he wanted to contact the Justice League on his own, so I took the hint and left the runner-up in the Oldest Living Human competition to get some sleep. That's the thing about using wards: while they do protect you from minor magics, from the point of view of an ancient magician all they do is shout 'there's something interesting here' really loudly. Doubly so if you're using one in a location where hardly anyone uses wards, like Gotham City. I assume that Batman…

    Should I still be calling him that? He isn't my controller any longer. I mean, obviously I'd call him that when we're on duty or on a mission, but in a secure environment or in my own head… What should I call him? I guess.. 'Mister Wayne' being three syllables means that 'Batman' wins out over it. Calling him 'Bruce' would just be weird. Or is it? I mean, I'm pretty sure that's what Lex calls him and Lex has tried to kill him at least once. As Bruce Wayne. I wonder if he'd call Batman 'Bruce' to his face just to needle him? No, of course he would, but 'as a matter of course' or 'if it were useful in a specific case'? Oh, I'll just stick to calling him 'Batman'. I doubt that I'll be spending any time with him socially.

    Anyway, Bruceman-.

    …

    Anyway, Batman has almost certainly realised that, and then gone on to realise that a magic user powerful enough to do that isn't going to find it all that hard to work out that Batman = Bruce Wayne anyway, so he might as well encourage them to teleport into somewhere with automated defences.

    But enough of work. I'm here for something personal. Jade doesn't work Mondays, and at this time of day she's usually having a post-exercise massage, and.. she's there now. While her masseur is currently heading home early because an orange-glowing stranger offered him $2000 to go home early. After I got my ring to record his vocal cadence and the pattern of his footfalls.

    This is either a really great idea, or a terrible idea.

    I push open the door to the massage room. Jade doesn't even bother looking up. I can barely imagine the Jade I first met not carefully watching the door of any room she found herself in. "Hi there, Jade."

    "Hey Todd."

    Or disarm hers-. No, she hasn't locked her locker and there's a knife-. Under the towel she's laying on. She's still wearing her knickers, but aside from them and the towel covering them she's naked.

    My word, she's beautiful.

    "Anything in particular you want me to work today?"

    "My neck."

    "Sure, I can manage that." I stick my right hand under the spout of the industrial massage ointment bottle next to the bench and squirt a blob onto my fingers. Then I approach the right side of the massage bed, rubbing my hands together to spread it over both of them. "Tough workout session?"

    "Too much time on the uneven bars."

    Too much time parkouring across Gotham with Selina, more like. Rolling might deal with momentum without breaking your legs, but it doesn't do much for your spine. I lay my hands on her shoulders for a moment, then gently begin spreading-.

    And there's a knife against my throat and Jade's glaring at me, towel held over her breasts. "Did you th-?!" She stills, staring into my eyes. "Paul?"

    Ring, dismiss mimicry program.

    Program dismissed.

    I smile, ignoring the knife. "Good evening."

    "You're back."

    "Yes, yes I am."

    "What happened to Todd?"

    "Went home early. I thought I'd surprise you. How'd I do?"

    "Somewhat surprised." She lowers the knife. Slightly. "Todd's been my masseur for a while. Your hands feel different from his."

    "I'll bear that in mind should I feel the need to masquerade as your masseur in the future."

    She leans lack slightly, shifting her legs into a more comfortable sitting position and raising her eyebrows. "Did you want to surprise me, or did you just want an excuse to put your hands on my naked body?"

    I smile. "Why can't it be both? I like to think that I've made no secret of my interest in you, naked or otherwise."

    "All finished in space?"

    "More… I annoyed my boss so much that he sent me home. But I'm going to be able to stay on Earth for a while."

    The ghost of a smile appears, which she does her best to conceal. "And all the green-skinned space girls could bear to let you go?"

    "While I have met green humanoid females, I didn't.. become involved with any of them."

    "Are you going to make me guess the colour?"

    "One or two orange-skinned Tamaranians expressed an interest. I.. turned them down. Oh, and a blue-skinned Okaaran with a fairly impressive set of-" I make a curving gesture with both hands. "-tusks."

    Jade tilts her head downwards slightly and raises her eyebrows. "Tusks?"

    "And she was seven feet tall and five feet wide. I mean…" I shrug. "Perfectly attractive by Okaaran standards-" I lean towards her slightly. "-but not really my thing. How about you? Meet any nice Earth boys?"

    "None worth more than two dates. Hm."

    "What?"

    "I just thought half the reason why you said 'no' before you left was so you could have some fun before you came back. And the other half was that you didn't know how long it would be. But you didn't, and it's only been two months."

    "If I'd known it would only be two months…"

    "You really didn't have any sex at all?"

    Uum. I pull away slightly. "What..? Exactly counts?"

    She raises her eyebrows. "If you have to ask, it probably counts."

    "Uuugh." I look away for a moment. "Well it… It didn't… Do anything for me, but…"

    "Now I'm curious." Jade looks amused by my discomfort. "What didn't do anything for you?"

    I avert my eyes for a moment. "She said they were spiracles."

    Jade blinks, then frowns. "Spiracles?"

    "They're what.. insects breathe through. Spider Guilders don't really-. They're not exactly spiracles, but that was the closest translation. And… She needed anti-chafing cream applied-. And the back one was okay, because that actually was a spiracle-."

    Jade's expression has sort of frozen. "Uh-huh."

    "But then I got to the gap between her second and third sets of legs, and the hole looked a little different? But she didn't say anything?"

    "Oh God."

    "So I thought, 'okay, just carry on', and... Now all of Vega thinks I'm a macroarachnophile."

    Jade's mouth sort of opens and closes a few times. "Oh-h…"

    "But that was it, and like I said, it didn't do anything for me and I didn't even realise it was sexual at the time. Moving-"

    She nods. "Yes."

    "-swiftly on, I am a fully trained humanoid masseur, so would you like me to finish your session? And then.. we could.. go and have dinner somewhere?"

    "Are you actually asking me out?"

    I lean further forwards, and kiss her lightly on the lips. "Yes. I am. So?"

    She puts her knife down, and twists so that she's lying face down again. "My neck could use some attention."

    "Ok-."

    "And my inner thighs."

    I grin. "Happy to be of service."
     
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    • Mr Zoat said:
    Should I still be calling him that? He isn't my controller any longer. I mean, obviously I'd call him that when we're on duty or on a mission, but in a secure environment or in my own head… What should I call him? I guess.. 'Mister Wayne' being three syllables means that 'Batman' wins out over it. Calling him 'Bruce' would just be weird. Or is it? I mean, I'm pretty sure that's what Lex calls him and Lex has tried to kill him at least once. As Bruce Wayne. I wonder if he'd call Batman 'Bruce' to his face just to needle him? No, of course he would, but 'as a matter of course' or 'if it were useful in a specific case'? Oh, I'll just stick to calling him 'Batman'. I doubt that I'll be spending any time with him socially.

    Anyway, Bruceman-.

    …

    Anyway, Batman has almost certainly realised that, and then gone onto realise that a magic user powerful enough to do that isn't going to find it all that hard to work out that Batman = Bruce Wayne anyway, so he might as well encourage them to teleport into somewhere with automated defences.
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    Best thing in the update!
    Mr Zoat said:
    "Are you actually asking me out?"

    I lean further forwards, and kiss her lightly on the lips. "Yes. I am. So?"

    She puts her knife down, and twists so that she's lying face down again. "My neck could use some attention."

    "Ok-."

    "And my inner thighs."

    I grin. "Happy to be of service."
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    Finally!!
    Also, yay. I'm happy for them.
     
    This is either a really great idea, or a terrible idea.
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    ...I feel like that really shouldn't have worked.
    Not in a "wow that's so ballsy" or "way to go" way or whatever, I mean that really shouldn't have worked and is legitimately creepy.

    Like normally I give Paul a pass on some awkward missing the point stuff, but this is super serious actually shouldn't do that sort of territory.
    Eugh.
     
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