Games Workshop can have a great deal of silliness. There's an inquisitor named Obiwan Sherlock Clousseau. Yes, really.
To be fair, that's from the early days, but personally, I don't think it matters much in the face of Obiwan Sherlock Clousseau.
Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest
- Thread starter Boney
- Start date
- Fantasy Users' Choice!
Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
To be fair, that's from the early days, but personally, I don't think it matters much in the face of Obiwan Sherlock Clousseau.
deathofrats0808
Don’t think of it as dying; just as leaving early
- Location
- Earth
Mathilde destroyed Castle Drakenhof, not Castle Drachenfels. Drakenhof was Vlad's castle, Drachenfels is the castle of a necromancer, that stands within the Grey Mountains.
- Location
- Greece
Also to be fair, something can be both incredibly silly and manage to be taken seriously if the author can pull it off. One Piece has it down to a science. Homestuck and Steven Universe are no slouches either. BoJack Horseman manages it on the reg too. And those are just the extreme examples, stuff like the Dresden Files also do this albeit to a much lesser extent.
Mind you, all I know about WHF is via osmosis, so I am not saying this is true for it.
True. He could be named 'Huggy McSoftbody', and after long enough killing shit, people would consider 'Huggy' a very scary name.
And he's a Slayer. He's muscly suicidal rage with an aggressive hairdo. His free time is spend mourning the fact that he hasn't found anything deadlier than him. His job is stealing from professional soldiers. That's arguably safer than what most Slayers do.
Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if some Slayers went with intentionally silly names just for the chance to pound the face of the drunk or stupid.
- Location
- Europa, Jupiter Orbit
They may eventually be freed. But that may be so long that their freedom is irrelevant to Order-aligned civilizations. For instance because freeing them required worse forces (that may themselves be enemies of the Vampires, like Chaos for instance) to destroy the last or strongest bastion(s) of Order. Or by keeping them just long enough till magic/technology can deal with them more permanently, in a kind of reverse cryonics philosophy.
In other words: Vampires will not have infinite victims if they only awaken after the (near) extinction of victims. And if you are a hopeful person that doesn't believe such a thing to happen anytime soon then you should also hope that a society that beat Chaos, the death of the sun, and all kinds of other disasters will also be either enlightened or effective enough to not consider vampires a notable problem.
Mopman43
Mountain-Hermit of Nitpeak
- Location
- Vermont
I don't believe Boney has said he's ending the vote. Given that a romance vote won't affect the next turn, there's nothing stopping Boney from writing it while the vote is ongoing.
- Location
- Mid-Atlantic
You can't mulltiply one side of an equation by infinity time without doing the same to the other side. By your same logic, any system of pacifying a vampire (aside from permanent destruction) will sooner or later fail some percent of the time, with the vampire deciding to set aside the strictures of normal society and either hurt people for blood and soul energy, or to simply leave the area and find a place where the rules are different and less strict.
At which point that vampire is "free" to do harm indefinitely, and will do harm, so the harm associated with the system will grow to infinity in infinite time.
If you don't have a literally perfectly reliable mind control mechanism that works on vampires, or a method of perma-kills, there will always be 'leakers.' The question is whether you get more leakage from keeping incapacitated vampires sealed away somewhere, or from having all the vampires running around loose but living within a social system that's designed to ensure they cause no serious harm.
In a hypothetical ideal spherical frictionless setting I can't comment as to which approach is correct. In a setting where you get to make the rules and stack the deck in your favor, I'm sure that the correct approach will be whichever side you want it to be. And I'm pretty sure that on Warhammer Fantasy's Mallus... 'incapacitate and store' is the correct answer to the realities they face.
Because of vampires' unusual powers in a setting like Warhammer Fantasy, including exceptional martial prowess and psychic domination of others, make it very difficult to keep them from rising towards the top of any given social structure they want to. They don't even need inhuman malice to start doing this; a perfectly human level of ambition, plus superpowers that can only be obtained by drinking the blood of mortals, will be enough.
Sorry, misremembered.
Attempted Subreption
- Location
- Earth
[*]Prepare a surprise party for Panoramia for her birthday.
- [*]Recruit the Ducklings to scout an optimal location. 1 Moderate Favor each.
Spring had arrived in Karak Eight Peaks, and the once barren fields were beginning to awaken as the sun crept its way upwards. Amidst carefully tended patches of crops (Good Morning!) and a few bumbling beardlings chasing after herds of bleating goats (Watch your step, miss!), a young woman in a thick cloak cast her gaze upon the growing greenery. Here and there small clusters of wild flowers shivered in anticipation of the coming light, and she broke out into a cheery hum as she spotted their dew laden forms. As her tune meandered its way through the cool mountain air, a group of robed figures followed at a safe distance, partially shrouded by the evaporating morning mist.
"I'm not sure this is a good idea," muttered the one in the middle. His dark gray garments did little to keep out the morning chill, and he fought the urge to shiver.
"Come on, what's the worst that could happen?" exclaimed the one in the lead. She, too, was dressed in dark robes, but she was noticeably unbothered by the cold. "We've already faced trolls and ratmen, not to mention the giant Waaagh."
"Well, we could get caught by your yapping," the one in the rear replied waspishly. "I've got a pretty coin riding on this task, so let's not mess this up."
"Of all the things you could ask for, you want more money?" Adela asked in surprise.
"Of all the things you could ask for, you picked help on experimental designs?" Gretel parroted.
"Magister Weber offers unique expertise and insight." she sniffed. "That makes sense as a favor. You can get money from any job!"
"Well at least when I burn my money, it doesn't explode!" came the retort.
"Ladies..." Hubert interjected, hoping to stop the bickering. The two journeywomen shared a look.
"Oh? Ladies... now that's an interesting choice. Was Soizic not enough for you?"
"Or was she too much? Hoping for some advice from the Gray Order?"
"T-that's not what I meant! And General Soizic and I are just two warriors with a perfectly normal mutually respectful relationship." he stammered.
"A relationship..." pondered Gretel, drawing out the word.
"A mutually respectful one..." added Adela.
"Oh look, is that Panoramia heading out of sight?" he attempted. Three heads turned back towards their target, who had indeed done as the Celestial Wizard predicted. Much to his relief, their mission took precedence and with a quick round of expletives, the trio of journeymanlings rushed to catch up.
Location marked: The Eastern Fields
---
As sun approached its zenith, the Jade Wizard stood up from where she'd been crouching and stretched before wiping the sweat from her brow. Her morning rounds had begun in the shadow of Karag Nar to the southeast, tracing their way clockwise in crescent shaped swathes of decreasing size, swaddling the center of the halfling settlements like the petals of a rose. By cycling through starting points, her routes would eventually tour the entirety of the Eastern Valley, with plenty of allowance for overlap if any particular spot needed more attention. And if this circuitous path had the added benefit of enabling her to inspect a wider variety of fields (and consequently making an opportunity to befriend their caretakers), well, sometimes things just worked out nicely.
And speaking of working out nicely, there was something... different in the air. It wasn't just the sudden dearth of enemies at the Karak's borders, though that certainly helped. A lot. But it was more than that. A sense of... belonging, perhaps, or liveliness. Progress. It wasn't just King Belegar declaring the defeat of their foes, or the legion of dwarves restoring ancient architecture, or even Mathilde Weber cackling over her Death Tower of Dwarven Hell when she thought nobody was looking, though they were all wonderful things. It was in the return of blooming flowers to the valleys and beardlings to managing goats and halfling scamps to raiding the berry bushes. And if she felt a little pride now that the grains had begun to sprout more readily than they had in the previous harvest, well, it was that too.
A rumbling growl interrupted her idle thoughts, and a quick glance at the sky revealed the hour. Planting her feet, the journeywoman reassessed her surroundings for a final check. No signs of blight, greenskin spores, or wandering livestock. Done, done, done! Now it was time for lunch, and since the day's route had taken her nearby, she knew just the place. It would just be a bit of a walk... (She's headed back this way! What? Scatter! If she sees you, act natural!)
The path back to the more established parts of the Karak was bustling with traffic, from sweaty farmers returning from the fields to teams of grumbling masons heading out to the gates. There was even a pack of human gunnery students stealing an opportunity to feel the sun, eager to escape the trials of trigonometric terror. More than one friendly figure gave her a wave or smile, and Panoramia made sure to reciprocate with small talk.
"Good morning! Oh, I'm fine, thanks. How're the little ones? That's so sweet! I know, I know. Here, take some! It's early yet in the season, but they'll be ripening soon. I insist, as one friend to another! I will if I can! Take care now!"
"Wandar, Master Dwarf? It goes well, thank you!"
"Adela Burgstaller! Been practicing at the ranges again I see? Oh no! Well, keep at it. You should bring it up at the next meeting, I'm sure our Loremaster can shake loose some more lore for you."
"You won't win the next round, you schemer! The next baking contest is mine, you'll see!"
That's some odd attire you've got there, Hubert. What are you doing here? Wait... aren't those the Official EIC Approved Dämmerlichtreiter™ Robes? Did you steal a set? I can't believe you actually bought those! Oh, you lost a bet? Men."
Location marked: The Crossroads
---
The Pint Sized Palace was a partially underground halfling dwelling serving as one part bar, one part home, and one part burgeoning community center. Stairs of polished gray marble led downward to a round red oak door, engraved with scenes from the Expedition and the Reclamation. Inside, a small swarm of servers flitted from table to table, collecting orders from and delivering meals to the packed dining area. In the back, a band of off duty patrolmen were taking bets on bouts of arm wrestling by a stone counter laden with barrels of ale, while a bard entertained a pack of children in the corner with an adventurous tale as he maneuvered his hands to catch the light cast by the lanterns hanging from the ceiling.
The idea had begun when a halfling scout, having found himself stuck between a rock and a hard place during the Battle of Karag Nar, was saved by a member of the Undumgi. In gratitude, the halfling had offered his hospitality and brew to the manling, who had shared it with his squad, who had liked it well enough to propose a joint business venture, to be funded by their shares of the Expedition. With dwarven decor, halfling vittles, and manling enthusiasm, the new establishment found itself host to a steadily growing stream of customers.
Spotting an open table, Panoramia wearily made her way to claim it with a sigh of relief and settled in to wait.
"What can I get for you, Magister?"
"Oh, stop. You know I'm still a Journeywoman, and I've been around enough for you to know my usual."
"With the state of those fields, one of these days I'll say that and you won't be able to correct me on it! One chicken pot pie, coming right up."
Waving the chuckling proprietor away, Panoramia buried her head in her arms on the table, cradling her cool complimentary pint with her fingers.
"So, come here often?"
"Gah!" Looking up from her brief rest, Panoramia squinted at the intruder. "Don't sneak up on me like that!"
"I'll have one of what she's having, thanks." Nodding to her server, Gretel turned back to her new lunch partner. "I have to admit, I didn't expect a place like this."
"I know, right? It seems like just yesterday when we were still on campaign rations for the Expedition." Panoramia responded wistfully.
"I wasn't around for that. What was it like?"
"Eugh. We didn't run out of supplies, but let's just say that it's a good thing we had the halflings to manage things, and spiders don't make for an appetizing smell at the firepits, even if you don't eat them. And there was this one time I tried to show Magister Weber how to bake a pie...
Location marked: The Pint Sized Palace
---
After the two journeywomen finished their pies, Gretel went to meet with her covert partners.
"You TALKED to her?" Adela demanded.
"Well, both of you did, too." Gretel pointed out.
"She's not wrong." Hubert mused.
"Two minutes of small talk isn't the same as a lunch date!"
"She still doesn't suspect anything, so let's just hand in the report. We're all agreed on the Pint Sized Palace?"
"Oh, no need for that," Mathilde chimed in. "I've been keeping an eye on the three of you for a while now. Got to keep in practice somehow, you know. Adela, good plan of action, but you'll need to take into account unexpected circumstances better in the future. Hubert, work on your improvising. A bet, really? I'm disappointed. And not just because they make me money. Gretel, I'll have you know that pie wasn't half as bad as she was making it out to be. Good initiative! Now, if you'll excuse me, I'm going to have a nice chat with the owners."
Amused at her ducklings' stunned faces, Mathilde barely managed to hold her laughter as she ran off to summon her Shadowsteed.
- [*]Recruit the Ducklings to scout an optimal location. 1 Moderate Favor each.
Spring had arrived in Karak Eight Peaks, and the once barren fields were beginning to awaken as the sun crept its way upwards. Amidst carefully tended patches of crops (Good Morning!) and a few bumbling beardlings chasing after herds of bleating goats (Watch your step, miss!), a young woman in a thick cloak cast her gaze upon the growing greenery. Here and there small clusters of wild flowers shivered in anticipation of the coming light, and she broke out into a cheery hum as she spotted their dew laden forms. As her tune meandered its way through the cool mountain air, a group of robed figures followed at a safe distance, partially shrouded by the evaporating morning mist.
"I'm not sure this is a good idea," muttered the one in the middle. His dark gray garments did little to keep out the morning chill, and he fought the urge to shiver.
"Come on, what's the worst that could happen?" exclaimed the one in the lead. She, too, was dressed in dark robes, but she was noticeably unbothered by the cold. "We've already faced trolls and ratmen, not to mention the giant Waaagh."
"Well, we could get caught by your yapping," the one in the rear replied waspishly. "I've got a pretty coin riding on this task, so let's not mess this up."
"Of all the things you could ask for, you want more money?" Adela asked in surprise.
"Of all the things you could ask for, you picked help on experimental designs?" Gretel parroted.
"Magister Weber offers unique expertise and insight." she sniffed. "That makes sense as a favor. You can get money from any job!"
"Well at least when I burn my money, it doesn't explode!" came the retort.
"Ladies..." Hubert interjected, hoping to stop the bickering. The two journeywomen shared a look.
"Oh? Ladies... now that's an interesting choice. Was Soizic not enough for you?"
"Or was she too much? Hoping for some advice from the Gray Order?"
"T-that's not what I meant! And General Soizic and I are just two warriors with a perfectly normal mutually respectful relationship." he stammered.
"A relationship..." pondered Gretel, drawing out the word.
"A mutually respectful one..." added Adela.
"Oh look, is that Panoramia heading out of sight?" he attempted. Three heads turned back towards their target, who had indeed done as the Celestial Wizard predicted. Much to his relief, their mission took precedence and with a quick round of expletives, the trio of journeymanlings rushed to catch up.
Location marked: The Eastern Fields
---
As sun approached its zenith, the Jade Wizard stood up from where she'd been crouching and stretched before wiping the sweat from her brow. Her morning rounds had begun in the shadow of Karag Nar to the southeast, tracing their way clockwise in crescent shaped swathes of decreasing size, swaddling the center of the halfling settlements like the petals of a rose. By cycling through starting points, her routes would eventually tour the entirety of the Eastern Valley, with plenty of allowance for overlap if any particular spot needed more attention. And if this circuitous path had the added benefit of enabling her to inspect a wider variety of fields (and consequently making an opportunity to befriend their caretakers), well, sometimes things just worked out nicely.
And speaking of working out nicely, there was something... different in the air. It wasn't just the sudden dearth of enemies at the Karak's borders, though that certainly helped. A lot. But it was more than that. A sense of... belonging, perhaps, or liveliness. Progress. It wasn't just King Belegar declaring the defeat of their foes, or the legion of dwarves restoring ancient architecture, or even Mathilde Weber cackling over her Death Tower of Dwarven Hell when she thought nobody was looking, though they were all wonderful things. It was in the return of blooming flowers to the valleys and beardlings to managing goats and halfling scamps to raiding the berry bushes. And if she felt a little pride now that the grains had begun to sprout more readily than they had in the previous harvest, well, it was that too.
A rumbling growl interrupted her idle thoughts, and a quick glance at the sky revealed the hour. Planting her feet, the journeywoman reassessed her surroundings for a final check. No signs of blight, greenskin spores, or wandering livestock. Done, done, done! Now it was time for lunch, and since the day's route had taken her nearby, she knew just the place. It would just be a bit of a walk... (She's headed back this way! What? Scatter! If she sees you, act natural!)
The path back to the more established parts of the Karak was bustling with traffic, from sweaty farmers returning from the fields to teams of grumbling masons heading out to the gates. There was even a pack of human gunnery students stealing an opportunity to feel the sun, eager to escape the trials of trigonometric terror. More than one friendly figure gave her a wave or smile, and Panoramia made sure to reciprocate with small talk.
"Good morning! Oh, I'm fine, thanks. How're the little ones? That's so sweet! I know, I know. Here, take some! It's early yet in the season, but they'll be ripening soon. I insist, as one friend to another! I will if I can! Take care now!"
"Wandar, Master Dwarf? It goes well, thank you!"
"Adela Burgstaller! Been practicing at the ranges again I see? Oh no! Well, keep at it. You should bring it up at the next meeting, I'm sure our Loremaster can shake loose some more lore for you."
"You won't win the next round, you schemer! The next baking contest is mine, you'll see!"
That's some odd attire you've got there, Hubert. What are you doing here? Wait... aren't those the Official EIC Approved Dämmerlichtreiter™ Robes? Did you steal a set? I can't believe you actually bought those! Oh, you lost a bet? Men."
Location marked: The Crossroads
---
The Pint Sized Palace was a partially underground halfling dwelling serving as one part bar, one part home, and one part burgeoning community center. Stairs of polished gray marble led downward to a round red oak door, engraved with scenes from the Expedition and the Reclamation. Inside, a small swarm of servers flitted from table to table, collecting orders from and delivering meals to the packed dining area. In the back, a band of off duty patrolmen were taking bets on bouts of arm wrestling by a stone counter laden with barrels of ale, while a bard entertained a pack of children in the corner with an adventurous tale as he maneuvered his hands to catch the light cast by the lanterns hanging from the ceiling.
The idea had begun when a halfling scout, having found himself stuck between a rock and a hard place during the Battle of Karag Nar, was saved by a member of the Undumgi. In gratitude, the halfling had offered his hospitality and brew to the manling, who had shared it with his squad, who had liked it well enough to propose a joint business venture, to be funded by their shares of the Expedition. With dwarven decor, halfling vittles, and manling enthusiasm, the new establishment found itself host to a steadily growing stream of customers.
Spotting an open table, Panoramia wearily made her way to claim it with a sigh of relief and settled in to wait.
"What can I get for you, Magister?"
"Oh, stop. You know I'm still a Journeywoman, and I've been around enough for you to know my usual."
"With the state of those fields, one of these days I'll say that and you won't be able to correct me on it! One chicken pot pie, coming right up."
Waving the chuckling proprietor away, Panoramia buried her head in her arms on the table, cradling her cool complimentary pint with her fingers.
"So, come here often?"
"Gah!" Looking up from her brief rest, Panoramia squinted at the intruder. "Don't sneak up on me like that!"
"I'll have one of what she's having, thanks." Nodding to her server, Gretel turned back to her new lunch partner. "I have to admit, I didn't expect a place like this."
"I know, right? It seems like just yesterday when we were still on campaign rations for the Expedition." Panoramia responded wistfully.
"I wasn't around for that. What was it like?"
"Eugh. We didn't run out of supplies, but let's just say that it's a good thing we had the halflings to manage things, and spiders don't make for an appetizing smell at the firepits, even if you don't eat them. And there was this one time I tried to show Magister Weber how to bake a pie...
Location marked: The Pint Sized Palace
---
After the two journeywomen finished their pies, Gretel went to meet with her covert partners.
"You TALKED to her?" Adela demanded.
"Well, both of you did, too." Gretel pointed out.
"She's not wrong." Hubert mused.
"Two minutes of small talk isn't the same as a lunch date!"
"She still doesn't suspect anything, so let's just hand in the report. We're all agreed on the Pint Sized Palace?"
"Oh, no need for that," Mathilde chimed in. "I've been keeping an eye on the three of you for a while now. Got to keep in practice somehow, you know. Adela, good plan of action, but you'll need to take into account unexpected circumstances better in the future. Hubert, work on your improvising. A bet, really? I'm disappointed. And not just because they make me money. Gretel, I'll have you know that pie wasn't half as bad as she was making it out to be. Good initiative! Now, if you'll excuse me, I'm going to have a nice chat with the owners."
Amused at her ducklings' stunned faces, Mathilde barely managed to hold her laughter as she ran off to summon her Shadowsteed.
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- Location
- Chicago
- Pronouns
- She/They
Thank you I love it! You write character voice well, and I liked the sense of the valley.
- Location
- Aotearoa
Agreed, it was lovely, and had some charming details and gave a sense of a bustling outdoors community, which we don't often see.
But I confess I wasn't sure what the ducklings are doing here? Tailing Panoramia, it seems, and for Mathilde- but is there any purpose in mind? Are they... scoping out a date site?
But I confess I wasn't sure what the ducklings are doing here? Tailing Panoramia, it seems, and for Mathilde- but is there any purpose in mind? Are they... scoping out a date site?
Mopman43
Mountain-Hermit of Nitpeak
- Location
- Vermont
I don't think they know that's what they're doing, but I'm pretty sure that's what they're doing.
That, or Mathilde is building up her knowledge of Panoramia's preferences.
Shinji117
Endless Troller
- Location
- Rokkenjima (Sydney)
- Pronouns
- He/Him
- Location
- Aotearoa
That's not like Mathilde at all, to meticulously research all the fundamental properties at length before getting to the fun parts.
Aha, thanks.
- Location
- Earth
Hehe, I'm particularly proud of that paragraph. Glad you approve!
That's not like Mathilde at all, to meticulously research all the fundamental properties at length before getting to the fun parts.
Maybe the Zhufokri Magister Weber does things in such a haphazard and shoddy manner, but Thane Mathilde Weber is clearly the spitting image of a model dwarf with all that implies.
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Omegahugger
Inattentive Idiot
Indeed, I have it on good authority that 'Huggy' can be a very scary name.
Well, everything that implies except the beard.Maybe the Zhufokri Magister Weber does things in such a haphazard and shoddy manner, but Thane Mathilde Weber is clearly the spitting image of a model dwarf with all that implies.
We are still working on that part.
- Location
- Greece
I am multiplying one side only because the other side is the status quo, ie the definite result of inaction (gressive vampires), and as thus only bears relevance as a worse thing relative to action, not as a fail state.
Also, if a vampire is unredeemable, killing itis a decent patch solution, it means it'll kill infinite people slower. I am arguing based on the hypothesis that redemption is possile, however, not whether it is or not. What I said is that itis worth any amount of deaths because it averts infinite deaths, but if its as impossible as permakilling, the whole point is moot, I agree.
A system that kills will also always eventually have all vampires as leakers, because mistakes and disasters happen. A system that redeems may at least have some that do not regress. And as leaking is the status quo, that is net profit.
I do agree, however, that rehabilitation (rather than mind control) is currently impractical due to constrains.
- Location
- Mid-Atlantic
Note that it is unrealistic to project problems forward for infinite time, even if vampires are immortal. Civilization itself has a finite life expectancy, and other things are constantly going wrong. Either people will learn how to roll back the darkness by amassing power and resources (in which case a truly effective way of permanently dealing with a vampire becomes fairly likely)... or people will be overwhelmed by the darkness in which case the risk of vampires breaking out of a vault once every ten thousand years isn't a serious problem even if in principle it would mean infinite deaths.
The relevant statistic isn't just total body count between now and the heat death of the universe, it's deaths per year too. I suspect that trying to rehabilitate all vampires for a year would result in a lot of dead guards right now and leakers constantly as some vampires decompensated and went back to being evil. Whereas trying to imprison all vampires may actually be easier at avoiding deaths in any single year.
Vampires that leak can be recaptured. Only a small minority of vampires would ever be 'leaked' at a given time, if society is actually doing well against vampires. Because then they don't get to concentrate in territories like Mousillon or Sylvania, don't get a constant stream of easily taken human prey, and don't get centuries to amass magical and physical power.
But it is precisely the risk of some area ending up like Mousillon or Sylvania that makes it undesirable to have lots of stray vampires running around restrained only by whatever cultural practices make them show moderation.
If you had a way to assuredly incapacitate (not kill, obviously) every vampire who isn't trustworthy, and then make all remaining vampires trustworthy and humane, that would be great. But that isn't especially realistic.
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Simon_Jester your position seems to be getting more extreme since the discussion started. Of course not all vampire are trustworthy and humane, they are just human plus freaky spell shit and not all humans are trustworthy and humane. I cannot agree that just because a subset, or even a majority, of a population could cause harm that we should kill/imprison forever without trial or parole the entire group.
Your original argument, or what I interpreted your original argument to be, that vampire cannot rule over a population of humans due to advantages and dietery restrictions inevatably leading to an oppresive, abusive and preditory state I agree with but I think your taking your stance to far.
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- Location
- Mid-Atlantic
My honest opinion is that while I am prepared to make case-by-case exceptions for individual vampires in a setting like Warhammer Fantasy, the bulk of vampires as a whole simply, empirically, does not stop being terrible. Trying to socially engineer a way to ensure that they stop being terrible is infeasible, and any such socially engineered system will tend to collapse on time scales much shorter than the probable life expectancy of a vampire.
Given the constraints they operate under, I honestly believe that the core approach of incapacitating vampires and keeping them locked away is correct in context, simply because it's not worth the endless cost in lives that would result from giving every vampire "a chance," including those who already have a track record of enslaving or eating people.
- Pronouns
- She/Her
If they already have such a track record then they have had their chance and should be punished approprately. I just don't want to assume such a track record based purely on the basis that they are vampires at all.
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- Location
- Mid-Atlantic
OK but the vast majority of living vampires in the setting have had their chance, and new vampires aren't usually discovered until they've already killed and eaten people.
Ericwinter
Definitely not a Skaven Infiltrator
- Location
- America
So I've got a random question, and it might be stupid, but the Great Vortex is basically a giant drain for magic, right? Dumping it out of reality and into the Warp? Meanwhile, Warpstone can't be destroyed, but there are ways to move it, safely even, since the dwarves have to do so whenever they're doing... whatever it is they do to get rid of it. So my question is, has anyone ever tried dumping warpstone into the Vortex so it gets carried into the Warp? Or would that, like, corrupt the Vortex and be bad for absolutely everybody? I'm not really clear enough on the mechanics.
- Location
- Chicago
- Pronouns
- She/They
I guess I just don't get what incentives vampires have to be good. They'll never be judged as they are immortal, the worst situation they can get into is basically a nap until they get another chance, and with psychic dominance/physical power they really don't need to respect or even consider the individuality of almost everyone around them. What anchors them to humanity and empathy? What keeps them looking at people and going 'oh, they are like me"?
It's basically handing a ton of power with no accountability and no end to a person, and I do believe that makes people cruel and evil eventually, regardless of how they start.
It's the myth of a benevolent strongman that is my real problem here, not vampires per se, but they seem super vunerable to it.
It's basically handing a ton of power with no accountability and no end to a person, and I do believe that makes people cruel and evil eventually, regardless of how they start.
It's the myth of a benevolent strongman that is my real problem here, not vampires per se, but they seem super vunerable to it.
No, there are really awful and permanent things you can do to vampires.
They're just less than helpful to any plan for making vampires less monsters.
That said, I'd agree with you on the benevolent strongman thing.
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