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Yeah i was editing that in. Imho they could´ve shaken free more. Finuval plains scattered the enemy. They could´ve officially sent someone. They didn´t. That says enough to me.

Im not gonna say them providing new Waystone for Praag is impossible, but i rate it as the far less likely option in comparison to Ice Witches actually knowing how to make a new one, even if its specifically attuned to Widow and thus skipping some important parts due to the nature of its operation.
Mmm. Perhaps. I'll note that canonically, however, there was still a significant amount of Druchii in the country at the time though. Finuval turned the tide because it got Malekith off the field and was the first major Asur victory. Teclis didn't even leave immediately afterwards, he left after the siege of Lothern was lifted (although the Empire's representatives didn't arrive until after). Indeed, Asarnil got in trouble for leaving/not arriving at Finubar's army as it marched to fight a "major Dark Elf force" during this time period, which suggests that at the least Finubar believed he needed all his forces. With Malekith and Morathi gone though, the Asur were probably pretty confident in their caster superiority.

I mean, I'd buy Teclis just doing it himself also. Like, he's pretty evidently practical enough to just go "eh, it's better than an expansion of Chaos".

Probably not, the Asur would have tried to get Kislev's waystone network reattached to the network. As it stands, they already had expended a Monolith of the Old Ones to restore the nexus lost at Almshoven. They wouldn't spend another one for magic they would not even receive.

The Ice Witches also built another Nexus at Castle Alexandronov.
We don't know they built the one at Alexandronov. We know the Castle was built so their network could have four points, but it's possible that was pre-existing network infrastructure, which they converted. It is also possible that they built a new Nexus but frankly I find it unlikely they're capable of building Nexuses but not the simpler Waystones, which the Project has yet to do. There's probably some other factor, that they can't replicate on a wide scale.

It's possible I suppose, that they (or just Teclis even) were willing to rebuild the Nexus, but only with substandard materials. Or that the Nexus at Praag was not actually destroyed, and so didn't require a monolith, just fixing up or re-routing again. Actually that makes me wonder if having the Network be god-based is in some ways a weakness? Like, if one of the gods' Nexuses are captured, they can be easily re-dedicated or something.
 
Mmm. Perhaps. I'll note that canonically, however, there was still a significant amount of Druchii in the country at the time though. Finuval turned the tide because it got Malekith off the field and was the first major Asur victory. Teclis didn't even leave immediately afterwards, he left after the siege of Lothern was lifted (although the Empire's representatives didn't arrive until after). Indeed, Asarnil got in trouble for leaving/not arriving at Finubar's army as it marched to fight a "major Dark Elf force" during this time period, which suggests that at the least Finubar believed he needed all his forces. With Malekith and Morathi gone though, the Asur were probably pretty confident in their caster superiority.

I mean, I'd buy Teclis just doing it himself also. Like, he's pretty evidently practical enough to just go "eh, it's better than an expansion of Chaos".
Even if that were completely true, there would still be the compound in Marienburg.

Hell ,they didn´t even send an honour guard with Teclis. Just nothing, nada. Just him and his two buddies. I mean yeah, Archmages, hella impressive, but surely they could´ve shaken at least one or two more, or at least sent, you know, bodyguards with them.
 
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1) Not sure how we could the second. Sure he will go ham on infrastructure but compounding effects and all that.
2) Not sure why it would unnerve him. No more than Roswita getting the Gromril sword unnerved her. Besides, asking him to prioritize the development of the waystone infrastructure when he has all the other infrastructure to worry about is not really as small an ask as you seem to think it is.
If the Project reaches the point of studying nexus (which will surely be after the point of mass deployment of waystones), the Ice Witches aren't going to throw much of a fit about sharing how they made nexuses. It's easy to just have Zlata ask other Ice Witches for Nexus information. The Ice Witches like Mathilde, if they would rather Zlata not be the one handling the Nexus study they'll do it.

It would unnerve him because Kislev would be willing to pay massive amounts of treasure or diplomatic concessions to get more waystones. Just like every other order faction on the planet. Waystones would be some of the most valuable resources on the planet. Kislev would have been willing to build waystones under Tzar Vladimir. Boris is more than aware enough to know just how valuable waystones are.

If Mathilde had not succeeded, or had been found out, it would have seriously risked war between Kislev and the Empire. Mathilde had a lot to lose by agreeing. You are asking him to do something as payment for killing his father for something he would have eagerly have paid for. Do you see the dichotomy here?

If you're at the point where you're talking about dotting Bretonnia with brand-new Waystones you're not at the point where you need to do favours to bring them to the table, you're at the point where you decide what concessions you're going to wring out of them in exchange for permanently improving their entire country in literally every way.

We don't know they built the one at Alexandronov. We know the Castle was built so their network could have four points, but it's possible that was pre-existing network infrastructure, which they converted. It is also possible that they built a new Nexus but frankly I find it unlikely they're capable of building Nexuses but not the simpler Waystones, which the Project has yet to do. There's probably some other factor, that they can't replicate on a wide scale.

It's possible I suppose, that they (or just Teclis even) were willing to rebuild the Nexus, but only with substandard materials. Or that the Nexus at Praag was not actually destroyed, and so didn't require a monolith, just fixing up or re-routing again. Actually that makes me wonder if having the Network be god-based is in some ways a weakness? Like, if one of the gods' Nexuses are captured, they can be easily re-dedicated or something.
We know there was not a nexus at Alexandronov. There used to only be three nexuses: Kislev City, Praag, and Erengrad. They explicitly raised Alexandronov to house the fourth nexus in Kislev's waystone network. They might have used materials they had to make the nexus, but that is still considerably more experience with building nexuses than anyone outside of Ulthuan or perhaps Araby* would have. Though it does seem to have been a long time ago, it is possible they lost the knowledge.

Teclis would not have had the resources on hand to restore the Praag nexus. I am also extremely skeptical of the idea that he would have been taught how. He was only a century old at the time, favored and brilliant yes. But that is not equivalent to being given insights into some of the most complex of Ulthuan's creations. Ulthuan, as a nation, managed to rebuild a nexus at Fort Solace by using an Old One monolith. Teclis had no where near that kind of resources available to him. And as far as I am aware it seems that Praag was more affected by the Great War Against Chaos than Fort Solace. It still has streets weeping bloods.

*and Nehekhara, and Naggaroth, and Cathay
"That is why Castle Alexandronov was built. There used to be only three, the old cities of Norvard and Dorogo and Srebrograd, but if you have three and lose one it collapses. If you have four, you can lose one and fall back to the others and retake and rebuild later."
 
Pragg is pretty inarguably the location in the Old World most effected by the GWAC.
Looks over at Karak Vlag

If we're talking about ongoing damage/taint, sure. If we're talking about an affected people and culture, then I'd say they're tied with the guys who were stuck in Literally Hell for two-hundred years.
 
Even if that were completely true, there would still be the compound in Marienburg.

Hell ,they didn´t even send an honour guard with Teclis. Just nothing, nada. Just him and his two buddies.
Not sure they went through Marienburg. Or if those forces were available. Marienburg evidently came under attack also based on the fact they lost that Nexus during the Great War.

We know there was not a nexus at Alexandronov. There used to only be three nexuses: Kislev City, Praag, and Erengrad. They explicitly raised Alexandronov to house the fourth nexus in Kislev's waystone network. They might have used materials they had to make the nexus, but that is still considerably more experience with building nexuses than anyone outside of Ulthuan or perhaps Araby* would have. Though it does seem to have been a long time ago, it is possible they lost the knowledge.

Teclis would not have had the resources on hand to restore the Praag nexus. I am also extremely skeptical of the idea that he would have been taught how. He was only a century old at the time, favored and brilliant yes. But that is not equivalent to being given insights into some of the most complex of Ulthuan's creations. Ulthuan, as a nation, managed to rebuild a nexus at Fort Solace by using an Old One monolith. Teclis had no where near that kind of resources available to him. And as far as I am aware it seems that Praag was more affected by the Great War Against Chaos than Fort Solace. It still has streets weeping bloods.

*and Nehekhara, and Naggaroth, and Cathay
No, we know the Ice Vortex didn't used to go through Alexandronov. We don't know that there was no pre-existing Nexus. They raised the Castle, maybe the Nexus, but it's not stated outright one way or the other.

Praag was more corrupted, yes. The Nexus before Fort Solace was demolished though (we know because Fort Solace is explicitly called out as re-routing the Network, not merely fixing the Nexus), which it's certainly possible the Praag one was not, seeing as I'm sure plenty of people would love to mess around with it rather than destroying it. Assuming the Nexus at Praag was not actually destroyed, but only damaged or simply dedicated to Chaos would mean it didn't require the construction of a new Nexus, and may well have been within either Teclis or the ice Witches capabilities without implying they have the knowledge to just do the entire Waystone Project on their own with no outside help and have no reason to actually get involved with it.
 
Not sure they went through Marienburg. Or if those forces were available. Marienburg evidently came under attack also based on the fact they lost that Nexus during the Great War.
Pieter Lazlo sailed to Lothern from Marienburg and they returned to Magnus in Talabheim. I'd be surprised if they didn't pass through Marienburg to get there.
 
No, we know the Ice Vortex didn't used to go through Alexandronov. We don't know that there was no pre-existing Nexus. They raised the Castle, maybe the Nexus, but it's not stated outright one way or the other.

Praag was more corrupted, yes. The Nexus before Fort Solace was demolished though (we know because Fort Solace is explicitly called out as re-routing the Network, not merely fixing the Nexus), which it's certainly possible the Praag one was not, seeing as I'm sure plenty of people would love to mess around with it rather than destroying it. Assuming the Nexus at Praag was not actually destroyed, but only damaged or simply dedicated to Chaos would mean it didn't require the construction of a new Nexus, and may well have been within either Teclis or the ice Witches capabilities without implying they have the knowledge to just do the entire Waystone Project on their own with no outside help and have no reason to actually get involved with it.
If there had been a nexus at Fort Alexandronov they wouldn't have needed to reroute the Ice Vortex through it later on. They would have done it at the start. All of Kislev had pretty much been pacified by 1527 IC, when the Gospodars conquered Norvard (later known as Erengrad). Citadel Journal is dubious in canonicity at best, but what we know of it also suggests there wasn't really much of anything at the site of Castle Alexandronov when Tzar Njevski commissioned its construction in 1602 IC. Leaving a nexus unattended for over seventy years seriously stretches belief.

Honestly I don't think the Ice Witches would have had the resources to start rebuilding the Waystones after the Great War against Chaos. Do you recall where Mathilde met with Boris to talk about implementing tributaries? That was at the former site of Frosthome, an ice witch citadel above the Erengrad nexus. I have no doubt that nexuses are expensive and time-intensive. They lost Frosthome during the reign of Tzarina Kattarin the Bloody. The Ice Witches obviously did not have the resources to build nexuses during her reign. As far as we know, her successors weren't so fond of them either. It should be noted that Kislev only really begun to recover from the war during the reign of Tzar Boris, a hundred and ninety years after the fact in canon.

I agree with you that it doesn't seem likely that the Praag nexus was destroyed. The Ice Witches probably did what everyone else did about Praag. Tried to purge the corruption, then turned it on and hoped for the best. That Praag is still so corrupted suggests that it isn't working as well as it should.

I did mention it was possible they have lost the knowledge over the centuries.

Honestly I'm not even sure how there was a nexus in Praag. It was never inhabited by elves. I guess the elves might have just built one, but it seems extremely weird to leave such an important structure without anything nearby. Realms of the Ice Queen says that Erengrad was as far as Ulthuan got, no matter Mathilde's speculation that Praag might have been connected to Vlag. (Edit: It does say that the Dwarfs had settlements along the Lynsk and Urskoy)

"It is said that in the era of the Khan-Queens, and in other times that the Ice Witches were in favour, a tower the equal of the Ice Wing of the Bokha Palace grew from this hill," Tsarevich Boris says to you as you approach. "But this, as with so much else, has faded into legend."

"I can feel the Ice Witch magic in its roots," you reply. "Is there an entrance that leads into it?"

"There were once many. They were sealed during the time of the Tzarina, either at her command or to keep her out of it. Sometimes I think she left more scars on this land than the horde of Asavar Kul."
And Erengrad and Kislev City are on the very fringe of what Elves were familiar with, meaning a good 80% of Kislev is off the edge of Elven maps.
 
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Not sure they went through Marienburg. Or if those forces were available. Marienburg evidently came under attack also based on the fact they lost that Nexus during the Great War.
Its literally one of the places Magnus the Pious hit up when trying to unite the Empire against Chaos.

Triton showed up.

Them not being available is a possibility i guess but it all just rings hollow to me.
 
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Setting aside the sources where they did send more than three people since Boney doesn't seem to be using those, Realms of Sorcery is pretty clear:

The Elven pilot that came on board to guide them through the mightily fortified Emerald Gates told Lazlo that Lothern had survived a great siege, broken but days before. The Dark Elves, said the grim-faced pilot, had returned to Ulthuan once more and their armies and Daemonic allies even now ravaged the towns and countryside further inland.
Though King Finubar knew the dangers that would face Ulthuan if the Old World fell to the Powers and Dominions of Chaos, he knew he could not spare any troops to send back with Lazlo. The Dark Elves had almost overrun Ulthuan, and if they were not expelled, his people would fall.
Ulthuan was still in danger of falling. Druchii and daemons were ravaging the countryside of Ulthuan.

I fucking dare you to find a polity that would send large expeditionary forces to the other side of the planet to support another polity that it has no alliance with while its own core provinces are under serious threat of falling to the enemy (which, I would remind you, runs a high risk of the entire planet going tits-up) and its own citizens are being slaughtered and tortured.

And yet they did send substantial help. Help that was explicitly and directly responsible for saving Kislev.

Remember that the aid of only three High Elf mages in the Great War Against Chaos was a priceless gift to Magnus the Pious and absolutely crucial in the enemy's defeat.

But no, people will still find the time to bitch and moan about the Asur not doing even more, that they should have prioritized Kislev over their own people.
 
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If kislev city and erengard are as far as the elves were familiar with, and yet there's definitely a waystone in erengard, does kinda sound like the default assumption would be its dwarf work. Possibly it wasn't a full on nexus cause it doesn't sound like the dwarves wanted full on nexuses that weren't in their holds, but strictly speaking we don't know that the three point spin actually needs three nexuses instead of at least one of them being a waystone (and Castle Alexandronov being new but trusted to hold things up strongly implies to me otherwise)
 
If there had been a nexus at Fort Alexandronov they wouldn't have needed to reroute the Ice Vortex through it later on. They would have done it at the start. All of Kislev had pretty much been pacified by 1527 IC, when the Gospodars conquered Norvard (later known as Erengrad). Citadel Journal is dubious in canonicity at best, but what we know of it also suggests there wasn't really much of anything at the site of Castle Alexandronov when Tzar Njevski commissioned its construction in 1602 IC. Leaving a nexus unattended for over seventy years seriously stretches belief.

Honestly I don't think the Ice Witches would have had the resources to start rebuilding the Waystones after the Great War against Chaos. Do you recall where Mathilde met with Boris to talk about implementing tributaries? That was at the former site of Frosthome, an ice witch citadel above the Erengrad nexus. I have no doubt that nexuses are expensive and time-intensive. They lost Frosthome during the reign of Tzarina Kattarin the Bloody. The Ice Witches obviously did not have the resources to build nexuses during her reign. As far as we know, her successors weren't so fond of them either. It should be noted that Kislev only really begun to recover from the war during the reign of Tzar Boris, a hundred and ninety years after the fact in canon.

I agree with you that it doesn't seem likely that the Praag nexus was destroyed. The Ice Witches probably did what everyone else did about Praag. Tried to purge the corruption, then turned it on and hoped for the best. That Praag is still so corrupted suggests that it isn't working as well as it should.

I did mention it was possible they have lost the knowledge over the centuries.

Honestly I'm not even sure how there was a nexus in Praag. It was never inhabited by elves. I guess the elves might have just built one, but it seems extremely weird to leave such an important structure without anything nearby. Realms of the Ice Queen says that Erengrad was as far as Ulthuan got, no matter Mathilde's speculation that Praag might have been connected to Vlag. (Edit: It does say that the Dwarfs had settlements along the Lynsk and Urskoy)
Pretty much everything about how the Network actually works is Quest canon, and actual canon can barely be relied upon for it, so whether it says anything was there or not really doesn't matter.

Why? Even assuming they knew it was there (and there's no guarantee) people have left Nexuses unattended for longer. The one in Reikland was unattended for literal millennia and the Eonir knew it existed, as presumably did Ulthuan and possibly the Karaz Ankor. But they didn't need it for anything, so no one looked for it. Plus, Alexandronov is in Troll Country, a part of Kislev that is all but uninhabited.

But if they actually have that knowledge, why the hell would they bother participating in the Project at all? They would want resources to just build Waystones, not to actually collaborate on an experiment to recreate them at all.

Sure, but the fact that the Nexus at Praag wasn't destroyed means the Ice Witches didn't build a new one. No one did. They just fixed up teh current one. So it's not proof they can build Nexuses.

It's possible they've lost the knowledge, but the question of how would be pretty prominent, seeing as the Ice Witches do actually write stuff down and don't have the Dwarfish aversion to sharing knowledge. Like, the Asur have actually retained the knowledge of how to build Nexuses, they just lack materials for their way of doing so. The Dwrafs lost it due to how their system of passign knowledge down works. And no one else involved in the Project ever knew. So the Ice Witches knowing and then somehow losing teh knowledge would be a pretty big deal. And I frankly find it more likely that Alexandronov was a Nexus that was either reclaimed from Chaos or added to the Ice system later when they got worried about losing one of the otehr points.

If kislev city and erengard are as far as the elves were familiar with, and yet there's definitely a waystone in erengard, does kinda sound like the default assumption would be its dwarf work. Possibly it wasn't a full on nexus cause it doesn't sound like the dwarves wanted full on nexuses that weren't in their holds, but strictly speaking we don't know that the three point spin actually needs three nexuses instead of at least one of them being a waystone (and Castle Alexandronov being new but trusted to hold things up strongly implies to me otherwise)
We've been told Erengrad, Kislev City, Praag and Alexandronov are all full on Nexuses. Although I wouldn't say the Elves not living somewhere is necessarily an indicator of Nexuses being built somewhere. The Dwarfs don't seem to have wnated Nexuses connected to their Network to be outside of the Holds, but I'd be surprised if they objected to building any at all, even if the magic was going to Ulthuan.
 
It's possible they've lost the knowledge, but the question of how would be pretty prominent, seeing as the Ice Witches do actually write stuff down and don't have the Dwarfish aversion to sharing knowledge. Like, the Asur have actually retained the knowledge of how to build Nexuses, they just lack materials for their way of doing so. The Dwrafs lost it due to how their system of passign knowledge down works. And no one else involved in the Project ever knew. So the Ice Witches knowing and then somehow losing teh knowledge would be a pretty big deal
To be fair, the quest has emphasized a number of times that the Ice Witches as an organization basically didn't survive the reign of Kattarin the Bloody. Zlata said that being literate was a specific mark in her favor among the Witches. Their stronghold in Erengrad is entirely gone.

It's entirely possible that written sources dating back to Miska and Shoika have been lost entirely.
 
To be fair, the quest has emphasized a number of times that the Ice Witches as an organization basically didn't survive the reign of Kattarin the Bloody. Zlata said that being literate was a specific mark in her favor among the Witches. Their stronghold in Erengrad is entirely gone.

It's entirely possible that written sources dating back to Miska and Shoika have been lost entirely.
I'll be honest, I don't remember that being said. I know they lost influence and basically all ability to affect national policy, but didn't have the impression that Kattarin was like, killing them off or anything. Their stronghold isn't actually gone. Much like the Ice Wing, it just only exists at certain times. Probably because when teh ice Witches aren't in favour with the Tzar building a castle is the sort of thing that makes the Tzar think the Witches are actively working against him. Or possibly its a matter of magical power and there's no currently an ice Witch alive with that level of might. Either way, I'm not sure I'd take that as a definite sign that they've declined in knowledge.

That's because Ice Witches are largely non-noble though, and reading is probably not generally a vital skill for beign an Ice Witch. It does argue against them havign like a library or anything though.

Possibly, but I'd find it very unlikely that the cornerstone of their power wouldn't be one of the highest priorities to preserve. Like, I can't see there being much more important to keep than the ability to build Nexuses.
 
I'll be honest, I don't remember that being said. I know they lost influence and basically all ability to affect national policy, but didn't have the impression that Kattarin was like, killing them off or anything. Their stronghold isn't actually gone. Much like the Ice Wing, it just only exists at certain times. Probably because when teh ice Witches aren't in favour with the Tzar building a castle is the sort of thing that makes the Tzar think the Witches are actively working against him. Or possibly its a matter of magical power and there's no currently an ice Witch alive with that level of might. Either way, I'm not sure I'd take that as a definite sign that they've declined in knowledge.

That's because Ice Witches are largely non-noble though, and reading is probably not generally a vital skill for beign an Ice Witch. It does argue against them havign like a library or anything though.

Possibly, but I'd find it very unlikely that the cornerstone of their power wouldn't be one of the highest priorities to preserve. Like, I can't see there being much more important to keep than the ability to build Nexuses.
The tower on top of the mound only existed in times that the Ice Witches were in ascendancy, but all the entrances into the stronghold itself were sealed in the time of Kattarin and haven't been opened even though she's been sealed for nearly 3 decades.
"It is said that in the era of the Khan-Queens, and in other times that the Ice Witches were in favour, a tower the equal of the Ice Wing of the Bokha Palace grew from this hill," Tsarevich Boris says to you as you approach. "But this, as with so much else, has faded into legend."

"I can feel the Ice Witch magic in its roots," you reply. "Is there an entrance that leads into it?"

"There were once many. They were sealed during the time of the Tzarina, either at her command or to keep her out of it. Sometimes I think she left more scars on this land than the horde of Asavar Kul."

Per canon, they're mostly nobles, actually. Or at least a plurality of them are. Whether that's true in this Quest's era is a bit less clear.
They're apparently mostly peasants right now.
"The reading more than the Reikspiel. Most Ice Witches are from peasant families. Some say because they are closer to winter and the land, others say it's just a matter of most Kislevites being peasants. So most are only really taught the secrets of Ice Magic and the doctrines of the Ancient Widow. I've heard things were different before Kattarin, back when we had a proper Ice Court and the Ice Witches shaped the bloodlines of the Boyars, but for now the only Ice Witches that can read are the ones that were taught to as children. My parents were traders in Kislev City, so I was one of them."
 
Pretty much everything about how the Network actually works is Quest canon, and actual canon can barely be relied upon for it, so whether it says anything was there or not really doesn't matter.

Why? Even assuming they knew it was there (and there's no guarantee) people have left Nexuses unattended for longer. The one in Reikland was unattended for literal millennia and the Eonir knew it existed, as presumably did Ulthuan and possibly the Karaz Ankor. But they didn't need it for anything, so no one looked for it. Plus, Alexandronov is in Troll Country, a part of Kislev that is all but uninhabited.

But if they actually have that knowledge, why the hell would they bother participating in the Project at all? They would want resources to just build Waystones, not to actually collaborate on an experiment to recreate them at all.

Sure, but the fact that the Nexus at Praag wasn't destroyed means the Ice Witches didn't build a new one. No one did. They just fixed up teh current one. So it's not proof they can build Nexuses.

It's possible they've lost the knowledge, but the question of how would be pretty prominent, seeing as the Ice Witches do actually write stuff down and don't have the Dwarfish aversion to sharing knowledge. Like, the Asur have actually retained the knowledge of how to build Nexuses, they just lack materials for their way of doing so. The Dwrafs lost it due to how their system of passign knowledge down works. And no one else involved in the Project ever knew. So the Ice Witches knowing and then somehow losing teh knowledge would be a pretty big deal. And I frankly find it more likely that Alexandronov was a Nexus that was either reclaimed from Chaos or added to the Ice system later when they got worried about losing one of the otehr points.
Actual canon can be relied on basic facts such as "were there elves in Kislev beyond Erengrad", to which the answer is no. That is something Boney mostly affirmed in the second quote I quoted. Castle Alexandronov is well beyond Erengrad. If Castle Alexandronov had had a nexus, Erengrad would not be the "very fringe" of what elves were aware of. With a good 80% of Kislev not being on elven maps.

Comparing Athel Yenlui to Castle Alexandronov is very dishonest. The Eonir were isolationists who have little ability to project power that far. Ulthuan had been thrown out of the continent by the Karaz Ankor. The Karaz Ankor was busy with the War of Vengeance, then it was facing extinction and had no ability to project power. The War of Vengeance seems to have destroyed much of their knowledge of the Waystone network. The Belthani migrated to the Reik basin and put Athel Yenlui to use. The following occupiers were very magic-phobic, and Athel Yenlui is very hard to access.

Castle Alexandronov is on the border of troll country. It is not in it. It would be extremely easy to notice. It is possible that the nexus was uncovered during the efforts to build the fort, and it was then integrated into the Ice Vortex. I could see how the Ice Witches would come to believe that history. But that does not match elven settlement patterns. And neither is it what you are arguing.

Let us compare the Unberogen and the Empire to Tzarina Shoika. Shoika was an Ice Witch, and a devotee of the Ancient Widow. Magic is written in the bones of Kislev's leadership, and the Ice Witches are very interested in the nexuses and leylines. If there was a nexus at Castle Alexandronov, there is no reason for them not to have activated in the initial set-up of the Ice Vortex. The Ice Witches would have noticed that all the leylines fed by oghams and waystones in the region were acting weirdly compared to the ones in Praag, Kislev, and Erengrad.

I think it is extremely likely that the knowledge that the Ice Witches have preserved is fragmentary. The Great War against Chaos severely hurt their numbers, though less so in comparison to just about every other Kislevite institution. The reign of Tzarina Kattarin ensured that their repositories of knowledge suffered and that they could not recover from those losses. Kislev did not begin to recover from the Great War against Chaos until Boris succeeded his father in canon. It was absolutely devastating.

Being able to fix nexuses is about 100% more than what just about every other power on the continent can do, which is nothing.
 
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i think we should trade our kislevite favors for 1 or 2 very important things.

1: instruction/hints on how the ice witches combine the winds of magic with divine power. we could likely do something similar, combine Ulgu and Ranaldite miracles, if we only knew how. they are the best instructors on the theory and mechanics (if not the specifics, we do worship different deities/use different winds) of combining the winds with miracle. including the the damsels. this is because the damsels are catty and we dont have many favors with bretonnia and while kislev cares more about fighting chaos than anyone and so we always have that common ground/incentive to build off of with them, the bretts are further away and have other concerns like us belonging to the miliary of a rival neighboring power their country has ongoing border disputes with so our relationships with them (as long as we remain a magister is capped at businesslike at best. ice witches are best best. also, they're cool, i wanna know their lore, and being more like them seems like an absolute win.

2: the other thing we could consider is a branch college. its been an option for a while but i think the primary benefit is increased contact/cooperation with a local community. we could build one in K8P, the border princes, sylvania, ect. but bringing the colleges and kislev closer together to study/combat chaos seems prudent. especially if combined with the above option. having devout college mages learn to mix in divine power from a patron like sigmar or morr to give them extra control or oomph or chaos resistance? 10/10. we could set up in the old fire spire and get around the "any man who practices magic in kislev threatens to fulfil a doom prophecy and is executed" thing by only bringing women. (this is not a thinly veiled attempt at a harem plot, i promise)
 
i think we should trade our kislevite favors for 1 or 2 very important things.
I think that's basically asking the Ice Witches for nothing less than their very deepest secrets, and I doubt that that's something in Boris's power to give.

The Ice Witches weren't a party to the assassination, there's a limited amount that Boris can compel them to do only on the basis on cooperation or such.
 
i think we should trade our kislevite favors for 1 or 2 very important things.

1: instruction/hints on how the ice witches combine the winds of magic with divine power. we could likely do something similar, combine Ulgu and Ranaldite miracles, if we only knew how. they are the best instructors on the theory and mechanics (if not the specifics, we do worship different deities/use different winds) of combining the winds with miracle. including the the damsels. this is because the damsels are catty and we dont have many favors with bretonnia and while kislev cares more about fighting chaos than anyone and so we always have that common ground/incentive to build off of with them, the bretts are further away and have other concerns like us belonging to the miliary of a rival neighboring power their country has ongoing border disputes with so our relationships with them (as long as we remain a magister is capped at businesslike at best. ice witches are best best. also, they're cool, i wanna know their lore, and being more like them seems like an absolute win.

2: the other thing we could consider is a branch college. its been an option for a while but i think the primary benefit is increased contact/cooperation with a local community. we could build one in K8P, the border princes, sylvania, ect. but bringing the colleges and kislev closer together to study/combat chaos seems prudent. especially if combined with the above option. having devout college mages learn to mix in divine power from a patron like sigmar or morr to give them extra control or oomph or chaos resistance? 10/10. we could set up in the old fire spire and get around the "any man who practices magic in kislev threatens to fulfil a doom prophecy and is executed" thing by only bringing women. (this is not a thinly veiled attempt at a harem plot, i promise)
IIRC the most popular plan was to get Boris to give KAU copying rights for every library in Kislev, in exchange for copying rights that they could use to rebuild their libraries whenever Chaos rolls in and deletes another city. It's a benefit to both polities, though moreso for KAU.
 
How does Kislev have an economy able to fight Chaos? It's only got three cities, which Reikland alone exceeds.

For that matter, how can Chaos fight Kislev? Norsca has only one city.

EDIT: Reikland only has two cities: Altdorf and Bögenhafen.
 
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How does Kislev have an economy able to fight Chaos? It's only got three cities, which Reikland alone exceeds.

For that matter, how can Chaos fight Kislev? Norsca has only one city.
A lot of Kislev's population consists of hardy rural sorts who are good at fighting (the whole being at the edge of civilization thing seems to give them a deathworlder bonus, on top of whatever they already have by living in that world instead of Earth).

As for Norsca, Chaos logistics cheats.
 
How does Kislev have an economy able to fight Chaos? It's only got three cities, which Reikland alone exceeds.

For that matter, how can Chaos fight Kislev? Norsca has only one city.
Kislev has a large population where all males legally required to learn how to use a weapon so they can be drafted if needed, and even then the last time they fought Chaos they needed their allies to swoop in and help them to prevent their nation from falling. As for how Chaos has so many troops, that's a genuine mystery and the answer probably involves magic-fuckery.
 
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