Threads Of Destiny(Eastern Fantasy, Sequel to Forge of Destiny)

Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
"If I may ask my own question," Ling Qi said. "May I ask a little of the differences in your confederations, where you split or joined and if there are any particular matters where offense could be given without meaning?"

"All fought at the walls of the world when the World Tree was withered by the artifice of the giants," Dzintara said. "We the people of Ice descend all from those who fought when the world's shape was changed. Though we were scattered, broken and left upon both sides of the Polar Gates."
What does "both sides of the Polar Gates" mean in this context?
This side vs beyond?
Or their positions around this side of the Gates?

To clarify, the baseline question was regarding the confederations of the "Polar Nation" which live in a circle around said pole. So my first assumption was the latter.
However, the "both sides" part makes me think it is the former. Which would imply that the confederations are a result of the New Peoples arrival.
 
The big question is how we represent the Sun to them. The problems are
1. We don't really know what's going on
2. The Sun are our foes (through the Bai)
3. The imperial observers will be pissed if try to ally with the Tangled Pines against the Sun.
There's a great spirit severing direct jungle influence over Tangled Pines, so hopefully there's no active conflict there on the horizon and we can focus on the PR of it all. Hopefully.

In terms of selling it, we do have a very long history of conflict with the jungle to point to. Killed our first Emperor. Thousand Lakes has been fighting incursions since forever. The tricky part's the Sun, yeah. We don't really want to legitimize them by selling them as conquerors of the jungle, and that's probably spooky as heck anyway. But going "Yeah, I dunno, the invaded and now they're heavily influenced by the jungle" doesn't win a lot of confidence. We also can't really police shit Western Territories does at its southern border either. So.
 
What does "both sides of the Polar Gates" mean in this context?
This side vs beyond?
Or their positions around this side of the Gates?

To clarify, the baseline question was regarding the confederations of the "Polar Nation" which live in a circle around said pole. So my first assumption was the latter.
However, the "both sides" part makes me think it is the former. Which would imply that the confederations are a result of the New Peoples arrival.
I believe the withered World Tree referenced in this chapter was near the North Pole, so this chapter in my mind is confirming that the "two sides" of the Polar Gates are at or near the North and South poles, with Void demons coming from... the Void between the stars, apparently.
 
Hello! I just binged the books, then found out royalroad was a thing, and then just as I thought I was finally caught up, I find out this place exists haha

Where does royalroad leave off?
 
Hello! I just binged the books, then found out royalroad was a thing, and then just as I thought I was finally caught up, I find out this place exists haha

Where does royalroad leave off?
Welcome!

This should be the update RR is on:
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Threads Of Destiny(Eastern Fantasy, Sequel to Forge of Destiny) Original - Users' Choice!

“Thank you Big Sister,” Zhengui said to her. “I wasn’t going to refuse something so simple after spending most of the morning with Hanyi,” Ling Qi said aloud. She walked along a wide and brightly lit boulevard. It was quieter than other parts of the district, no blaringly bright signs or...
 
What does "both sides of the Polar Gates" mean in this context?
This side vs beyond?
Or their positions around this side of the Gates?

To clarify, the baseline question was regarding the confederations of the "Polar Nation" which live in a circle around said pole. So my first assumption was the latter.
However, the "both sides" part makes me think it is the former. Which would imply that the confederations are a result of the New Peoples arrival.
If I'm remembering some of the lore and implications we received previously, combined with this, I think the rough timeline is something like this:

People -> big cataclysmic upheaval which creates the gates -> gates are sealed, with people on either side -> some time later, the seal weakens or is lifted for a time and people from the north pole cross through the Gates -> Sudica unites the lost peoples, creating the Glittering City and the institution of the Emissary.

At least, that's the story. The first part where they were originally one people could be true, but it would also be a convenient story to allow the adoption of newcomers into the fold. Sudica would know for sure, but if it's a fib she made up, she probably won't talk.
 
I believe the withered World Tree referenced in this chapter was near the North Pole, so this chapter in my mind is confirming that the "two sides" of the Polar Gates are at or near the North and South poles, with Void demons coming from... the Void between the stars, apparently.
My question was more on how this relates to "the differences between the confederations", who we know live tangentially around the South Pole.
But it seems that paragraph is just meant as a general primer for what unifies all peoples of Ice. With the subsequent dialog addressing the differences themselves.

If I'm remembering some of the lore and implications we received previously, combined with this, I think the rough timeline is something like this:

People -> big cataclysmic upheaval which creates the gates -> gates are sealed, with people on either side -> some time later, the seal weakens or is lifted for a time and people from the north pole cross through the Gates -> Sudica unites the lost peoples, creating the Glittering City and the institution of the Emissary.

At least, that's the story. The first part where they were originally one people could be true, but it would also be a convenient story to allow the adoption of newcomers into the fold. Sudica would know for sure, but if it's a fib she made up, she probably won't talk.
Hmm laying out the timeline like that makes me speculate how this relates to their Gods.
Sudica lived during the "reopening" and Fryja was active during the closed period. With whoever became the original Crone then presumably related to the "sealing" of the Gates. Of course we don't have much to go on here.
 
We of the seared land, my beautiful home of killing bogs, buzzing marsh and burning badlands must operate a little differently."

"It is from our brothers in the Seared Lands which we took inspiration for union with the Cloud men," Khadne offered.

"Really," Ling Qi asked neutrally.

"When the Day of the Black Sun and the Great Burning came, many Cloud men fled their mountains south, and joined the old blood of my land by one method or another.

"The lands of the Tangled Pine lie west, and are rich but dangerous. Our beasts and spirits are savage and unmerciful. Our woods are dense but cursed with malevolence," Dzintara said. Her words were short and clipped. "Much of the Polar Nation relies upon our strength and the materials we pry from the land. It was Mother Fryja who we give the greatest obeisance, for her axes slew the demon of flowers which once ruled us, after the closing of the gates."


Uuummmm... and White Sky's specialty/characteristic? Ice and metals?
 
The imperial observers will be pissed if try to ally with the Tangled Pines against the Sun.
But also note that the Sun are waning in favor in the Imperial Court because the Bai is no longer in decline. Another point to that would be that nobody really wants the Red Garden to spread. The Imperial Court already lost an emperor to it, I doubt they'd want to play nuclear hot potato with it.
 
"To answer your question, the delivery was acceptable. Exchange of weregild is always tense and unhappy," Khadne said. "The amount and quality of timber were both unimpeachable."

Dzintara frowned a little, looking down at the aromatic black tea, poured from the same pot as Ling Qi's, as if it had personally offended her.

"The lands of the Tangled Pine lie west, and are rich but dangerous. Our beasts and spirits are savage and unmerciful. Our woods are dense but cursed with malevolence," Dzintara said. Her words were short and clipped. "Much of the Polar Nation relies upon our strength and the materials we pry from the land. It was Mother Fryja who we give the greatest obeisance, for her axes slew the demon of flowers which once ruled us, after the closing of the gates."

That confirmed the sneaking suspicion that Ling Qi had felt since their confederation was named. Even if it was probably only rumor to them, the Emerald Seas riches were probably seen as a threat.
I freaking knew Dzintara came to check out the competition :V
 
Tangled Pines be mad yo. -2 rep and we haven't even interacted yet. If the Emerald Seas starts actually selling wood on any significant scale I imagine it'll get worse.
 
Huh. Are giants dragons? Or dragon relatives? We know that one of the Heavenly Pillars got killed by them, and they say that World Tree got withered by the giants' artifice.
 
We also have giants on Not!Ireland, who survived via sanctuary as "the worms" were cast down from the sky as the sun turned black. And the jotun of Norse mythology, erroneously translated as 'giant' for so long that it's become part of the canon by now, were very diverse and had many different forms.
 
Well, this was an interesting updated alright.

I find it extremely amusing that a lot of the Polar Gates's territory and culture are a consequence of the tail end of the Empire's various disasters. The Twilight King and the Cataclysm on the east, and the Death Jungle on the west. And of course, all the Cloud Nomads fleeing south an incorporating into the Polar Gates.
Speaking of which, we would need more details but the core philosophy of the Seared Land's integration policy doesn't seem so different from the Wang's: take the reasonable ones, the ones that stop practicing their ways, and kill the troublemakers and bandits.

The people across the eastern sea must be the ones from that interlude with a human and a seafolk. They were trying to reclaim the Grave and commented how the ash-zombies were becoming smarter the further in they went.
Those people are also in contact with the Jing's descendents. How fun will it be when the Empire at large and the Jin in particular find out about that.

I'm a bit confused about the timeline of the Polar Gates's lore. We know from the mural at the IronMountain Man that the Sun Priests and people of Jaromila's race came through the Polar Gates from the North Pole fleeing some kinda disaster (Jing related? They did reach the North Pole). Then they joined together with the Ice Ladies and fought off the starbeasts and/or void demons.
I'm not sure if that would be before or after the Giants and the World Tree age. I think it's after though. First they got separated when the World Tree withered and "the world's shape changed", each group ending in one pole. Then they got reunited in the South Pole. The lose of the World Tree probably also meant less protection from the sky's malevolence (that is the purpose of the World Trees), so it makes more sense that the starbeast and void demons appeared after it was gone.

So, what we have obtained during this meeting? Well, mechanically we have
Chance of Success on actions related to cultural understanding increased by 10%

This kinda makes me wish material had won. As others had said, Ling Qi is better at Cultural than Material, so the bonus would be more valuable there. Though that depends if one values more a 90% Cultural plus a 60% Material than a 80% plus a 70%. *Disclaimer: made up numbers
On the other had, learning our rep with the different factions is pretty neat. That's the part I actually liked about the culture option. So, what did we learn about them and what can we do to improve our standing? What material needs can we infere?

The Seared Lands are neutral toward us. They are the lands with the greatest number of integrated Cloud Nomads. They aren't a frozen tundra but neither are they wealthy in wooden materials. A bit like the western Golden Fields but more bog than desert.
The lady was really interested in both building (her "hobby") and spatial talismans. That's very good news.
If she manages to build a good rapport with Wang Lian, the Seared Land's rep could rise up pretty quickly. Wang Lian could also learn more about their Nomad assimilation methods. Two birds with one stone.
The Emissary is probably interested in these topics because they likely dedicate a lot of effort to reclaim their own blasted lands. Basic spatial talismans are pretty common even among low nobility. And, even though rarer and more expensive, there are specialized spatial talismans for bulk material transport as well as for storing delicate reagents or other complex talismans.
If they think they can obtain them through us (hello, Bao Qian!) they will be far more supportive of the summit.

The Pines are more problematic. They probably enjoy a privilaged position as the sole provider of wood in high quantites, and we are a new actor that could end their monopoly. The fact that they get their wood from the southern Red Jungle is actually good for us.
We don't need to ally with them against Sun Shao or anything like that. The Bai and the Meng have been working in pushing back the Jungle since before Sun and haven't stopped because of him. The Throne has no problem with that.
So, if we can get Uncle War Crimes (Suzhen's husband) to share some of their studies against the Jungle with the Pines, the increased wood yield and safety of the Pine's people may offset their wariness of us as competitors. If they learned our allies are also figthing the "Flower Demon", that could create sympathy and a sense of kinship.
It wouldn't so hard to convince the Bai either. They would get to push the Jungle from another front, and they also get to contribute to their allies project which they are already involved in through Meizhen.

And we finally got the break down on the other Count Clans's rep. It was about time.

The situation with the Jia it's actually better than what I had feared. The Imperial Conservatives are the only one we have a problem with, or rather they have a problem with us. The Moderates, while they likely won't be enthusiastic about our proposals, can be convinced of supporting them as long as they are objectively benefitial and don't hurt the Empire's sensibilities.
The Cai Loyalist are a double edged sword. They can be our greatest supporter or our biggest detractors depending if they judge that our actions strengthen or weaken the Ducal Throne.

The Bao has a pleastly surprising high percentage of Moderates. It's likely very different for the region's minor nobles, but this is still good for us.
I do wonder about the ???. It may be the faction more involved with the subterrain Ia in Bao's land. Or it may be the faction that agreed with the plan of breaking off from the ES and joining the Celestial Peaks.

Finally, it seems the squad has decided in their main objective for the summit: to establish the foundations of a joint foreign quarters. The personnel appointed there will work in cooperation to survey and map the Wall and, to a lesser degree, pacify the region of Cloud Nomads. Or at least reach a pact of assimilation or non-agresion with the different Khans.

The Wang will get their maps and frontiers. The Meng will suffer less raids. The Jia can get glory by being commanding officers. The road connecting the place to both sides will serve as a trade route for the Bao. The personnel and infrastructure themselves will be the "hostages" for the Luo. The Diao "don't care" (yeah, sure).
We still need to know if the Polar Gates would be interested in such a thing, and if not, convince them otherwise.
Likewise, we need the MoI to approve of it. Which will imply a tight surveyance of the whole operation. The hard part is to allow that without stiffling progress on the project or straining our relationship witht the WS.

The plan is solid, but we certainly have quite busy months ahead of us.
 
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The Wang will get their maps and frontiers. The Meng will suffer less raids. The Jia can get glory by being commanding officers. The road connecting the place to both sides will serve as a trade route for the Bao. The personnel and infrastructure themselves will be the "hostages" for the Luo. The Diao "don't care" (yeah, sure).
We still need to know if the Polar Gates would be interested in such a thing, and if not, convince them otherwise.
Likewise, we need the MoI to appove of it. Which will imply a tight surveyance of the whole operation. The hard part is to allow that without stiffling progress on the project or straining our relationship witht the WS.

If we're going for a foreign quarter design, then it's good we have Xuan Shi too since the Xuan have already implemented such an idea. And then, by using the Xuan's imperial-approved method, the MoI will hopefully be satisfied, and we won't get on additional scrutiny from the throne. So the Diao will be happy since they want less scrutiny from the Peaks and more autonomy for the ES.
 
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