Threads Of Destiny(Eastern Fantasy, Sequel to Forge of Destiny)
- Thread starter yrsillar
- Start date
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Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
Oliver_Twister
Idea-Man, He Who Shits Ideas
- Location
- West Africa
- Pronouns
- He/Him
CedeTheBees
Probably high right now
- Location
- Somewhere
- Pronouns
- They/Them
[Insert obligatory doomposting here]
Oliver_Twister
Idea-Man, He Who Shits Ideas
- Location
- West Africa
- Pronouns
- He/Him
I knew something was missing!
I'm the sicko who is fuckin stoked tomorrow for some meetings and consensus building and maybe we'll even get to make committees!?!
Well, I do think we'll be facing more problems now that otherwise. But it's true that gettting to know the other WS factions will help appease them when those problems arise.
So I guess we are just partially doomed. That's still a straight upgrade compared to some of our more "daring" activities.
So I guess we are just partially doomed. That's still a straight upgrade compared to some of our more "daring" activities.
It's true that many times it feels like there is a parallel discussion and that the thread "starts" with plans and objectives already decided, and leading theories already established.
That not to mention the WoG info that is shared there and that may or may not be declared here.
It feels as if thread-exclusive users are left out of the loop, and that can feel alienating.
Oliver_Twister
Idea-Man, He Who Shits Ideas
- Location
- West Africa
- Pronouns
- He/Him
The thing is, it's easier to discuss things on Discord. At least for me. When I come on threads, I feel like I have to type an argument or something substantive to have an impact, but I associate Discord with social media and discussions so it's easier.
And then there's the problem that some people are annoyed if they're quoted on Discord for arguments in the thread, which is completely fair imo. Out of context quotes can make it difficult to defend a point.
I guess I never really thought about it as alienating because I'm pretty sure Yrsillar includes the link to his Discord whenever he posts (in that little section at the bottom) and whenever he updates on RoyalRoad, so people can always join if they want to.
Edit: Adter thinking about it, I guess it's a bit unreasonable to expect some people to create a new social media account just for one book. I mean, I don't get it because I first created an account for a mobile game I deleted like 2 weeks later, but it's a valid reason.
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ElizatronicWarfa
Himejoshi Supreme
- Pronouns
- She/They
I get what you mean, but as someone who finds SV's forum style to be very difficult to digest and keep up with, I likewise find myself alienated from discussions here.
Personally, I find Discord is mainly a very efficient means of getting people tired of my talking points faster. 
Frustration when seemingly wholly formed ideas, plans, mores, objectives, priorities, or fears rise from the depths of apparent nothingness is something I definitely sympathize with. However, skimming my memories, when those pop up they're mostly from the thread itself, not the Discord. They're just from actual years ago. If there's a dumb meme talking point that feels like it's coming from the Discord, chances are the Discord picked it up from the thread itself.
The only exception that jumps to mind is the ritual of trying to guess when the update will drop that Iinflicted on inspired the Discord to. And it is a mercy that remains where it is.
Frustration when seemingly wholly formed ideas, plans, mores, objectives, priorities, or fears rise from the depths of apparent nothingness is something I definitely sympathize with. However, skimming my memories, when those pop up they're mostly from the thread itself, not the Discord. They're just from actual years ago. If there's a dumb meme talking point that feels like it's coming from the Discord, chances are the Discord picked it up from the thread itself.
The only exception that jumps to mind is the ritual of trying to guess when the update will drop that I
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- Location
- South Africa
Personally I prefer the thread discussion to discord discussion.
Oliver_Twister
Idea-Man, He Who Shits Ideas
- Location
- West Africa
- Pronouns
- He/Him
For me at least, Discord is usually for off-tangent conversations or conversations that have we've repeatedly had, but in different forms. Or sometimes, for when I notice new things when rereading RR chapters and want to post my thoughts.
For example, I've brought up before (on the Discord), that I think our TRF insight may eventually clash with our Motion and Endings concepts, and my latest random post was related to that. I'll copy it here though.
I feel like these kind of things would distract the thread from discussing votes (since we're almost always discussing things related to the newest chapter) or build fear because of some vague speculation.
Not sure if any of this makes sense.
For example, I've brought up before (on the Discord), that I think our TRF insight may eventually clash with our Motion and Endings concepts, and my latest random post was related to that. I'll copy it here though.
Okay, after reading the latest RR chapter, I was thinking about the TRF insight yet *again*, since there's a teeny tiny chance that it may cause a heart demon with Motion.
Zhengui and LQ are very different, but what Zhengui said about roots really stuck out to me.
Mainly, roots as something for things to grow from, even if everything is dead and gone
And then looking at our insight, it basically means that we can change things, but we must preserve some core parts to grow new things from. You don't End everything. Endings are new beginnings, so they need something to grow out of. Like how when you cut down a tree, new things can grow from the stump.
This also ties well into our Cycles concept, mainly that each new cycle is not the same as the old.
So I think things will work out, and I'm really looking forward to our eventual Growth concept.
Zhengui and LQ are very different, but what Zhengui said about roots really stuck out to me.
Mainly, roots as something for things to grow from, even if everything is dead and gone
And then looking at our insight, it basically means that we can change things, but we must preserve some core parts to grow new things from. You don't End everything. Endings are new beginnings, so they need something to grow out of. Like how when you cut down a tree, new things can grow from the stump.
This also ties well into our Cycles concept, mainly that each new cycle is not the same as the old.
So I think things will work out, and I'm really looking forward to our eventual Growth concept.
I feel like these kind of things would distract the thread from discussing votes (since we're almost always discussing things related to the newest chapter) or build fear because of some vague speculation.
Not sure if any of this makes sense.
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Turn 16: End
There was so much Ling Qi wished she could cover, so much information she was yet lacking. She had only two short months to prepare for the admittedly month long summit, and so very many things to do. This was her first meeting with these representatives of the White Sky however, and so, with much thought, she decided it would be best to focus on cultural topics. Going after material ones might come across as more probing than she might like at this point.
With that decided, Ling Qi broke the brief but comfortable silence in which they had been walking.
"If it isn't overreaching, may I ask what Emissary Jaromila is occupied with?" Ling Qi asked. "I will happily speak with whatever representatives you choose of course. But we parted well, and I hope that she is in good health."
"Emissary Jaromila is still occupied in the homeland, speaking to and organizing those who are involved," Emissary Khadne replied, walking behind her. "As I imagine you have been."
"Yes," Ling Qi agreed. Though much had gone over her head. It was troubling being stuck in this liminal space where she was a child or an adult as it suited. She knew Cai Renxiang had been working in the background, and had only just succeeded in getting them fully involved. It made things more difficult, they were in charge but not, a tangle of unclear authority. "There are always difficulties in organizing people. This is universal I'm sure."
"Hah, one could say that. Everyone always wants their say, even when they've got not the slightest idea what they're talking about," chuckled Rostam.
"It is our duty as Emissaries to ensure that those who speak do have an accurate idea of what is being debated," Dzintara said sourly
"We may speak, but it is the listener's choice if they hear," said Inzhu, calmly.
Ling Qi glanced back, in time to see Khadne make a subtle gesture, and the others to fall silent. It seemed there was a desire to not seem argumentative in front of her.
They arrived at the clearing beside the road Ling Qi had been leading them too, and Ling Qi noticed some raising of eyebrows and tilting of heads. But, Ling Qi had learned from Cai Renxiang. She gestured, and the construct she had stored in her spatial ring appeared. There was a rush of displaced air, a creak of settling stone and wood, and the small stone pavilion shimmered a little as it fully materialized.
Instantly there was the scent of food and spiced wine in the air, the table and benches set under the tiled roof coming into being at the same time. It required a little formation work, and mostly emptying the rest of her nonessential possessions from the ring, but she could afford this kind of thing now.
"Please, seat yourselves. My apologies that you will have to serve yourselves," Ling Qi said.
There was a beat of silence, before Emissary Dzintara swept past. "A strange thing to apologize for."
"Hoh, what a nice trick," chortled Rostam, taking his wife's hand, he ascended the few steps as well. "A fine bit of runecraft."
"It is very fine, your craftsmen are skilled," Inzhu said, and Ling Qi noted a sharpness in her eyes and tone that had not been there before. "Such a trivial use of spatial effects."
It was a marked departure from the women's previous demure demeanor.
"A fine meal, Emissary Ling Qi. I hope we may put that matter behind us then," Khadne agreed, nodding to her.
Ling Qi nodded back and ascended after her, taking note of the seating. The couple had taken the bench on the right, but Khadne and Dzintara had taken the left one. Ling Qi was troubled, she had assumed she would be talking to three people at most and had assumed they would sit on opposite sides. She dithered a moment, and took a seat beside Khadne.
"Given that trouble, I feel I should ask. Was the delivery of weregild satisfactory?" Ling Qi asked, "Please serve yourselves as you wish here, as friends"
"As friends then, please take the first selection. As the host it's only polite," Rostam said cheerfully.
Ling Qi nodded, reaching to pour herself a cup of dark tea, then began selecting a few items for her plate. Once she had taken her first sip, the others began to serve themselves.
"To answer your question, the delivery was acceptable. Exchange of weregild is always tense and unhappy," Khadne said. "The amount and quality of timber were both unimpeachable."
Dzintara frowned a little, looking down at the aromatic black tea, poured from the same pot as Ling Qi's, as if it had personally offended her.
"I am pleased," Ling Qi said.
"So, Emissary Ling Qi, I have a question I feel can't be put off," said Rostam, he had pushed his odd floppy hat back off of his head, letting it dangle on his back by a rawhide string around his neck. "What's the order among your people, who is it appropriate for us to speak too."
"You are only one woman after all," Khadne agreed. "And like Emissary Jaromila, you are busy conducting negotiations with your own people as well."
Ling Qi inclined her head. This was a question which could not be avoided, not really. "When they are present, my Lady Cai Renxiang will speak, as will my companion in her service, Sir Gan Guangli."
She put a hint of qi into her words, a little emphasis, and subsonic hum that conveyed an impression of auras and appearances. "On the matter of the work crews Lady Wang Lian will be appropriate."
She'd have to talk to the woman after this, but she had no doubts about her cooperation.
Khadne frowned a little as the impression of Wang Lian's power washed over the table.
"You will allow us to speak directly to a Voice unattended?" Dzintara asked, her tea cup was empty, but she still frowned at Ling Qi.
Ling Qi pursed her lips. Ultimately there was no avoiding this. "Our higher realm cultivators are more mobile and active than yours. I assure you Lady Wang is reasonable and should require no interpretation."
There was some whispering back and forth, which Ling Qi deliberately shut her ears too, though she felt their screening. She took a moment to drink, and pick at the food on her plate, making an extra effort to be formal and proper with her utensils. She knew they would probably be using her as an example to copy.
"And ain't that stressful," Sixiang drawled.
"I understand this, some Voices and traditions are more mobile. What Divine does this Wang Lian speak for?"
Ling Qi pursed her lips. She drew on the memory Wang Lian herself had showed her, the power that sat in the center of their lands, original companion of the Duchess herself. It took a moment to find the right combination of sound and qi to convey something so much larger than herself. "The Builder."
Heads tilted back, fingers tapped on the table. It was Inzhu who responded. "A worthy role indeed," she said with a smile. "If you all will agree. I will take the role of communion on this."
"Agreed," Dzintara said tightly.
"Hah, indulging your hobbies even here," Rostam chuckled. "There is the matter of the Great Soul you have roving about though, miss, the one who cut the mountain."
"The General Xia is best left alone by outsiders," Ling Qi said flatly. "My Lady and I will conduct any negotiations in that regard."
"Sensible, it is not as if we will give you access to our implements of war," Khadne said, glancing to the others. It was clearly an uncomfortable point.
"If I may ask my own question," Ling Qi said. "May I ask a little of the differences in your confederations, where you split or joined and if there are any particular matters where offense could be given without meaning?"
"All fought at the walls of the world when the World Tree was withered by the artifice of the giants," Dzintara said. "We the people of Ice descend all from those who fought when the world's shape was changed. Though we were scattered, broken and left upon both sides of the Polar Gates."
"Hah, yes, that is the old legend. In truth we were apart for very long, and lived in very different places." Rostam said. "We of the seared land, my beautiful home of killing bogs, buzzing marsh and burning badlands must operate a little differently."
"It is from our brothers in the Seared Lands which we took inspiration for union with the Cloud men," Khadne offered.
"Really," Ling Qi asked neutrally.
"When the Day of the Black Sun and the Great Burning came, many Cloud men fled their mountains south, and joined the old blood of my land by one method or another. There have always been a trickle, after that," Rostam said. "More still came some half a thousand years back, fleeing a lost war. Hah, I suppose now we know what they were fleeing!"
Ling Qi inclined her head. She accepted that without apology or explanation. "And they integrated well?"
"They can't practice their mountain ways down in our bogs and mud, some try anyway and become bandits, and these we kill, but others make new ways out of their old ways," Rostam shrugged. "But we have always been a crossroad land. Why my wife, Inzhu, she is named for her great grandmother, who came to us from the cities of light across the eastern sea."
"That's fascinating, there are even more peoples beyond even your lands," Ling Qi said. Picturing maps in her mind she supposed these people would be somewhere far beyond the Grave of the Sun."
"There are people everywhere, humans are like a mold, yes? Creeping in wherever there is a bit of heat and wet, and even sometimes where there is not," Rostam chuckled.
She laughed politely at his joke.
"Being more serious, it is very rude among our people to not offer some level of food or drink for any serious meeting," Inzhu cut in. "This is the sort of 'obvious' thing which you seek, yes, Emissary?"
"That would be an example," Ling Qi acknowledged.
"The armors some of your folk wear everywhere. To our eyes, it is a threat when worn to a meeting of peace," Dzintara said shortly.
"Also helpful," Ling Qi said, swiftly thinking of an example. "Among us it is rude not to leave a little on your plate at the end of a meal, as it implies your host has not provided enough food."
"Small bits of strangeness we will all have to learn and prepare any who will be speaking or meeting for," Khadne said.
"I notice you have not spoken of your home yet though, Emissary Dzintara," Ling Qi said.
"The lands of the Tangled Pine lie west, and are rich but dangerous. Our beasts and spirits are savage and unmerciful. Our woods are dense but cursed with malevolence," Dzintara said. Her words were short and clipped. "Much of the Polar Nation relies upon our strength and the materials we pry from the land. It was Mother Fryja who we give the greatest obeisance, for her axes slew the demon of flowers which once ruled us, after the closing of the gates."
That confirmed the sneaking suspicion that Ling Qi had felt since their confederation was named. Even if it was probably only rumor to them, the Emerald Seas riches were probably seen as a threat.
Also, demon of flowers? Ling Qi felt a sinking sensation, remembering the arts of Sun Liling. That was from the Western Territories. A native art if she remembered. That could be…. Delicate.
"Thank you," Ling Qi said, bowing her head. "Lets move on too other items. Please no matter how obvious it seems, speak up on what your people find polite or insulting…"
"A Zheng," Cai Renxiang said tiredly, rubbing her fingers against her temples. "That is troublesome."
"I don't think his intent is malicious," Ling Qi said slowly. The whole conversation was strange, he jumped from playful flirtation to mockery to blunt seriousness and back. It felt vaguely like a duelist throwing out a flurry of feints to test defenses. It put her on edge. "I wasn't able to accurately gauge him, my apologies, Lady Renxiang."
"He likely isn't a foe, but he may cause problems regardless," Cai Renxiang said sourly.
Gan Guangli coughed into his hand. "I have told you of the news I have heard about Ebon Rivers, Lady Cai."
"Mm, I had expected them to install some in Xiangmen, perhaps to join our army as allied auxiliaries, not this," Cai Renxiang sighed. "Let us not overfocus, the Meng's desires are not something we can accomplish here, past the level of making promises."
"Promises do have weight. If the border can be further secured, the Cloud Tribes are convinced to go south and accept the White Sky in protection from our forces, is that not just as good as marching ourselves?" Gan Guangli asked.
"The choices of dozens or hundreds of individual chiefs are an uncontrollable variable, but yes, some agreement which at least addresses their concern will have to be reached," Cai Renxiang said.
"Reaching an agreement with the tribes ourselves would be good," Ling Qi frowned. "But probably impossible. Neither the Empire, nor the Cloud Tribes desire such a thing."
Gan Guangli looked pained. "I agree that, in a perfect world, that would be true. But if I must choose, I must reach to protect our own people."
"Any such thing will be an immense undertaking," Cai Renxiang said. "Gan Guangli, you're own report?"
"The Jia family is riven with argumentation on this," Gan Guangli admitted. "Since the retirement of the Patriarch, they have sought closer ties with the Diao, an influence among the counts. However, I believe that there is still a strong vein of what you might call 'Cai Loyalists.' They are distinct from the usual Imperial leaning folk of the province. In the Jia they are strong enough to form a block of their own."
"My mother's most devoted supporters," Cai Renxiang considered. "I have met such individuals. They will support anything which grants more power to the ducal seat. They follow the footsteps of my mothers companion most closely. However, that loyalty does not transfer to me."
"I am afraid it does not," Gan Guangli agreed. "However my tutor has said that they do not know what to think of this. On one hand such negotiations can be seen as weakness. On the other, in doing this, your Mother is asserting provincial authority, both against the Empress and the Counts. I believe as long as our negotiations do not make a show of ceding any authority or making unrewarded concessions, they will not be too upset."
"And the rest of the Jia, what is it they seek?" Cai Renxiang asked.
"The Jia lands are not as heavily raided, not bordering the mountains directly, but it is also the center of the former Chu lands, which suffered the most under their lord's abandonment during Ogodei's invasion," Gan Guangli said, resting his chin on his hand. The firelight of the hearth that they had placed their chairs around cast his features in sharp relief. "They are frankly difficult to separate from the Rushing Cloud Sect, the whole region is highly militarized."
Ling Qi knew Gan Guangli was speaking from experience. That region was his original home. Of course given she knew that his meeting with Cai Renxiang had been the result of the young heiress exercising authority over some matter of corruption, she knew that the regions reputation for discipline obviously had its cracks.
"What the Jia will want, I think, is a chance for prominence. They will want a place of honor among whatever forces we place to patrol the new borders that are set. Even a piece of land perhaps, for an outpost," Gan Guangli said.
"That is not something I can grant without Mothers approval," Cai Renxiang said. "Of course some force will have to defend the taken lands. Do you think they will be able to interact with foreigners positively?"
"...Perhaps," Gan Guangli said. "Not tribesman, but the regular soldiers of White Sky I have seen fit their conception of good order."
"Perhaps something like road wardens could be organized. I will look into this," Cai Renxiang said. "You're other targets?"
"The Blue Mountain is simple, if there can be any exchange of historical documentation arranged they will be pleased," Gan Guangli said. "Our own Argent Peak Sect… I am not sure they can be satisfied for less than the head of the man who slew Elder Zhou."
"As expected," Ling Qi said.
"Yes," Cai Renxiang said. "However nothing said here will stop that war. It is out of our responsibility for the moment."
"Gan Guangli nodded. "As long as the security of the border and war effort is not undermined, I don't forsee trouble. As to the Luo Miss Ling witnessed a bit. Their primary desire is that any agreement be backed by material collateral. Whether that is an exchange of highborne hostages, a marriage, or spiritually binding oaths, they will not give their support to an agreement which is only ink and paper. Lord Luo was willing to consider the idea of a small population under joint authority…."
"The foreign quarter idea," Ling Qi said.
"Just so," Gan Guangli agreed. "Obviously he will need a more concrete presentation to give a real answer.
"That is much more in line with expectations," Cai Renxiang said. "I doubt marriages are on the negotiation table. There are none high ranking enough who can afford to destroy their own respectability among the Empire in that way. And while they clearly have prominent families who control the apparatus of government, I have suspicions about the foreigners organization in that regard."
Ling Qi nodded there.
"But, the rest are viable options," Cai Renxiang said, steepling her fingers. "As to my own findings, the Diao are frustratingly vague of course. They desire to appear above this, and so only a few low ranking observers have come. Luckily some are my Father's relatives, they clearly wish to be close to me based upon that, and so long as they do not expect considerations beyond the bounds of law, I can accept that. The Diao will be satisfied so long as we do not bring down too much imperial scrutiny on the province. This summit does not otherwise effect their interest."
"Two in one, that's something. I'd like to avoid angering the ministry too," Ling Qi said dryly.
"Indeed," Gan Guangli chuckled.
"As too the Bao… as always, the Lord Bao looks far into the future. They will clearly angle for special rights for their tradesmen, the expansion of travel infrastructure and access to new goods. In the immediate terms, they will most want an agreement that such infrastructure will be built."
"The devils will be in the details," Gan Guangli said.
"But it won't be hard to reach the minimum of buy in, I think," Ling Qi said.
"Yes, large land surveys will be needed for maps regardless. Working in an agreement for the construction of a road seems possible," Cai Renxiang considered. "Our harshest opposition will likely be the general and ministry…"
"But a single road in such rough terrain is an easily defendable choke point against a ground bound force," Gan Guangli pointed out.
"And it will have no effect on the nomads, independent or auxiliary," Ling Qi said. "We can argue practicality all day though."
"It is only the beginning, yes," Cai Renxiang said, leaning forward. "It seems that that our best interests align around performing a great survey of the wall, and the establishment of a semi permanent meeting location."
"That would satisfy the most people, I think," Ling Qi said. "But it some ways it will be the most difficult for our people to accept. The White Sky are not without isolationist elements themselves either."
"But, it what must be accomplished I think," Gan Guangli said.
"Without regular contact, it will only be like past attempts to make deals with the regions tribes," Cai Renxiang said. "To call this a success and be able to hold it up for the province. There must be a sturdy foundation which can be built upon."
"It will be a lot of work, but what's new?" Ling Qi said. "Let's get down to details."
Chapter End
With that decided, Ling Qi broke the brief but comfortable silence in which they had been walking.
"If it isn't overreaching, may I ask what Emissary Jaromila is occupied with?" Ling Qi asked. "I will happily speak with whatever representatives you choose of course. But we parted well, and I hope that she is in good health."
"Emissary Jaromila is still occupied in the homeland, speaking to and organizing those who are involved," Emissary Khadne replied, walking behind her. "As I imagine you have been."
"Yes," Ling Qi agreed. Though much had gone over her head. It was troubling being stuck in this liminal space where she was a child or an adult as it suited. She knew Cai Renxiang had been working in the background, and had only just succeeded in getting them fully involved. It made things more difficult, they were in charge but not, a tangle of unclear authority. "There are always difficulties in organizing people. This is universal I'm sure."
"Hah, one could say that. Everyone always wants their say, even when they've got not the slightest idea what they're talking about," chuckled Rostam.
"It is our duty as Emissaries to ensure that those who speak do have an accurate idea of what is being debated," Dzintara said sourly
"We may speak, but it is the listener's choice if they hear," said Inzhu, calmly.
Ling Qi glanced back, in time to see Khadne make a subtle gesture, and the others to fall silent. It seemed there was a desire to not seem argumentative in front of her.
They arrived at the clearing beside the road Ling Qi had been leading them too, and Ling Qi noticed some raising of eyebrows and tilting of heads. But, Ling Qi had learned from Cai Renxiang. She gestured, and the construct she had stored in her spatial ring appeared. There was a rush of displaced air, a creak of settling stone and wood, and the small stone pavilion shimmered a little as it fully materialized.
Instantly there was the scent of food and spiced wine in the air, the table and benches set under the tiled roof coming into being at the same time. It required a little formation work, and mostly emptying the rest of her nonessential possessions from the ring, but she could afford this kind of thing now.
"Please, seat yourselves. My apologies that you will have to serve yourselves," Ling Qi said.
There was a beat of silence, before Emissary Dzintara swept past. "A strange thing to apologize for."
"Hoh, what a nice trick," chortled Rostam, taking his wife's hand, he ascended the few steps as well. "A fine bit of runecraft."
"It is very fine, your craftsmen are skilled," Inzhu said, and Ling Qi noted a sharpness in her eyes and tone that had not been there before. "Such a trivial use of spatial effects."
It was a marked departure from the women's previous demure demeanor.
"A fine meal, Emissary Ling Qi. I hope we may put that matter behind us then," Khadne agreed, nodding to her.
Ling Qi nodded back and ascended after her, taking note of the seating. The couple had taken the bench on the right, but Khadne and Dzintara had taken the left one. Ling Qi was troubled, she had assumed she would be talking to three people at most and had assumed they would sit on opposite sides. She dithered a moment, and took a seat beside Khadne.
"Given that trouble, I feel I should ask. Was the delivery of weregild satisfactory?" Ling Qi asked, "Please serve yourselves as you wish here, as friends"
"As friends then, please take the first selection. As the host it's only polite," Rostam said cheerfully.
Ling Qi nodded, reaching to pour herself a cup of dark tea, then began selecting a few items for her plate. Once she had taken her first sip, the others began to serve themselves.
"To answer your question, the delivery was acceptable. Exchange of weregild is always tense and unhappy," Khadne said. "The amount and quality of timber were both unimpeachable."
Dzintara frowned a little, looking down at the aromatic black tea, poured from the same pot as Ling Qi's, as if it had personally offended her.
"I am pleased," Ling Qi said.
"So, Emissary Ling Qi, I have a question I feel can't be put off," said Rostam, he had pushed his odd floppy hat back off of his head, letting it dangle on his back by a rawhide string around his neck. "What's the order among your people, who is it appropriate for us to speak too."
"You are only one woman after all," Khadne agreed. "And like Emissary Jaromila, you are busy conducting negotiations with your own people as well."
Ling Qi inclined her head. This was a question which could not be avoided, not really. "When they are present, my Lady Cai Renxiang will speak, as will my companion in her service, Sir Gan Guangli."
She put a hint of qi into her words, a little emphasis, and subsonic hum that conveyed an impression of auras and appearances. "On the matter of the work crews Lady Wang Lian will be appropriate."
She'd have to talk to the woman after this, but she had no doubts about her cooperation.
Khadne frowned a little as the impression of Wang Lian's power washed over the table.
"You will allow us to speak directly to a Voice unattended?" Dzintara asked, her tea cup was empty, but she still frowned at Ling Qi.
Ling Qi pursed her lips. Ultimately there was no avoiding this. "Our higher realm cultivators are more mobile and active than yours. I assure you Lady Wang is reasonable and should require no interpretation."
There was some whispering back and forth, which Ling Qi deliberately shut her ears too, though she felt their screening. She took a moment to drink, and pick at the food on her plate, making an extra effort to be formal and proper with her utensils. She knew they would probably be using her as an example to copy.
"And ain't that stressful," Sixiang drawled.
"I understand this, some Voices and traditions are more mobile. What Divine does this Wang Lian speak for?"
Ling Qi pursed her lips. She drew on the memory Wang Lian herself had showed her, the power that sat in the center of their lands, original companion of the Duchess herself. It took a moment to find the right combination of sound and qi to convey something so much larger than herself. "The Builder."
Heads tilted back, fingers tapped on the table. It was Inzhu who responded. "A worthy role indeed," she said with a smile. "If you all will agree. I will take the role of communion on this."
"Agreed," Dzintara said tightly.
"Hah, indulging your hobbies even here," Rostam chuckled. "There is the matter of the Great Soul you have roving about though, miss, the one who cut the mountain."
"The General Xia is best left alone by outsiders," Ling Qi said flatly. "My Lady and I will conduct any negotiations in that regard."
"Sensible, it is not as if we will give you access to our implements of war," Khadne said, glancing to the others. It was clearly an uncomfortable point.
"If I may ask my own question," Ling Qi said. "May I ask a little of the differences in your confederations, where you split or joined and if there are any particular matters where offense could be given without meaning?"
"All fought at the walls of the world when the World Tree was withered by the artifice of the giants," Dzintara said. "We the people of Ice descend all from those who fought when the world's shape was changed. Though we were scattered, broken and left upon both sides of the Polar Gates."
"Hah, yes, that is the old legend. In truth we were apart for very long, and lived in very different places." Rostam said. "We of the seared land, my beautiful home of killing bogs, buzzing marsh and burning badlands must operate a little differently."
"It is from our brothers in the Seared Lands which we took inspiration for union with the Cloud men," Khadne offered.
"Really," Ling Qi asked neutrally.
"When the Day of the Black Sun and the Great Burning came, many Cloud men fled their mountains south, and joined the old blood of my land by one method or another. There have always been a trickle, after that," Rostam said. "More still came some half a thousand years back, fleeing a lost war. Hah, I suppose now we know what they were fleeing!"
Ling Qi inclined her head. She accepted that without apology or explanation. "And they integrated well?"
"They can't practice their mountain ways down in our bogs and mud, some try anyway and become bandits, and these we kill, but others make new ways out of their old ways," Rostam shrugged. "But we have always been a crossroad land. Why my wife, Inzhu, she is named for her great grandmother, who came to us from the cities of light across the eastern sea."
"That's fascinating, there are even more peoples beyond even your lands," Ling Qi said. Picturing maps in her mind she supposed these people would be somewhere far beyond the Grave of the Sun."
"There are people everywhere, humans are like a mold, yes? Creeping in wherever there is a bit of heat and wet, and even sometimes where there is not," Rostam chuckled.
She laughed politely at his joke.
"Being more serious, it is very rude among our people to not offer some level of food or drink for any serious meeting," Inzhu cut in. "This is the sort of 'obvious' thing which you seek, yes, Emissary?"
"That would be an example," Ling Qi acknowledged.
"The armors some of your folk wear everywhere. To our eyes, it is a threat when worn to a meeting of peace," Dzintara said shortly.
"Also helpful," Ling Qi said, swiftly thinking of an example. "Among us it is rude not to leave a little on your plate at the end of a meal, as it implies your host has not provided enough food."
"Small bits of strangeness we will all have to learn and prepare any who will be speaking or meeting for," Khadne said.
"I notice you have not spoken of your home yet though, Emissary Dzintara," Ling Qi said.
"The lands of the Tangled Pine lie west, and are rich but dangerous. Our beasts and spirits are savage and unmerciful. Our woods are dense but cursed with malevolence," Dzintara said. Her words were short and clipped. "Much of the Polar Nation relies upon our strength and the materials we pry from the land. It was Mother Fryja who we give the greatest obeisance, for her axes slew the demon of flowers which once ruled us, after the closing of the gates."
That confirmed the sneaking suspicion that Ling Qi had felt since their confederation was named. Even if it was probably only rumor to them, the Emerald Seas riches were probably seen as a threat.
Also, demon of flowers? Ling Qi felt a sinking sensation, remembering the arts of Sun Liling. That was from the Western Territories. A native art if she remembered. That could be…. Delicate.
"Thank you," Ling Qi said, bowing her head. "Lets move on too other items. Please no matter how obvious it seems, speak up on what your people find polite or insulting…"
White Sky: 1
Seared Lands: 0
Tangled Pines: -2
Chance of Success on actions related to cultural understanding increased by 10%
Seared Lands: 0
Tangled Pines: -2
Chance of Success on actions related to cultural understanding increased by 10%
***
"-And that is what I was able to get from out countrymen today," Ling Qi said, bowing at the waist as she finished her recitation and returned to her seat. Together with Cai Renxiang and Gan Guangli, she was in a large warm tent set out near to the partially built embassy."A Zheng," Cai Renxiang said tiredly, rubbing her fingers against her temples. "That is troublesome."
"I don't think his intent is malicious," Ling Qi said slowly. The whole conversation was strange, he jumped from playful flirtation to mockery to blunt seriousness and back. It felt vaguely like a duelist throwing out a flurry of feints to test defenses. It put her on edge. "I wasn't able to accurately gauge him, my apologies, Lady Renxiang."
"He likely isn't a foe, but he may cause problems regardless," Cai Renxiang said sourly.
Gan Guangli coughed into his hand. "I have told you of the news I have heard about Ebon Rivers, Lady Cai."
"Mm, I had expected them to install some in Xiangmen, perhaps to join our army as allied auxiliaries, not this," Cai Renxiang sighed. "Let us not overfocus, the Meng's desires are not something we can accomplish here, past the level of making promises."
"Promises do have weight. If the border can be further secured, the Cloud Tribes are convinced to go south and accept the White Sky in protection from our forces, is that not just as good as marching ourselves?" Gan Guangli asked.
"The choices of dozens or hundreds of individual chiefs are an uncontrollable variable, but yes, some agreement which at least addresses their concern will have to be reached," Cai Renxiang said.
"Reaching an agreement with the tribes ourselves would be good," Ling Qi frowned. "But probably impossible. Neither the Empire, nor the Cloud Tribes desire such a thing."
Gan Guangli looked pained. "I agree that, in a perfect world, that would be true. But if I must choose, I must reach to protect our own people."
"Any such thing will be an immense undertaking," Cai Renxiang said. "Gan Guangli, you're own report?"
"The Jia family is riven with argumentation on this," Gan Guangli admitted. "Since the retirement of the Patriarch, they have sought closer ties with the Diao, an influence among the counts. However, I believe that there is still a strong vein of what you might call 'Cai Loyalists.' They are distinct from the usual Imperial leaning folk of the province. In the Jia they are strong enough to form a block of their own."
"My mother's most devoted supporters," Cai Renxiang considered. "I have met such individuals. They will support anything which grants more power to the ducal seat. They follow the footsteps of my mothers companion most closely. However, that loyalty does not transfer to me."
"I am afraid it does not," Gan Guangli agreed. "However my tutor has said that they do not know what to think of this. On one hand such negotiations can be seen as weakness. On the other, in doing this, your Mother is asserting provincial authority, both against the Empress and the Counts. I believe as long as our negotiations do not make a show of ceding any authority or making unrewarded concessions, they will not be too upset."
"And the rest of the Jia, what is it they seek?" Cai Renxiang asked.
"The Jia lands are not as heavily raided, not bordering the mountains directly, but it is also the center of the former Chu lands, which suffered the most under their lord's abandonment during Ogodei's invasion," Gan Guangli said, resting his chin on his hand. The firelight of the hearth that they had placed their chairs around cast his features in sharp relief. "They are frankly difficult to separate from the Rushing Cloud Sect, the whole region is highly militarized."
Ling Qi knew Gan Guangli was speaking from experience. That region was his original home. Of course given she knew that his meeting with Cai Renxiang had been the result of the young heiress exercising authority over some matter of corruption, she knew that the regions reputation for discipline obviously had its cracks.
"What the Jia will want, I think, is a chance for prominence. They will want a place of honor among whatever forces we place to patrol the new borders that are set. Even a piece of land perhaps, for an outpost," Gan Guangli said.
"That is not something I can grant without Mothers approval," Cai Renxiang said. "Of course some force will have to defend the taken lands. Do you think they will be able to interact with foreigners positively?"
"...Perhaps," Gan Guangli said. "Not tribesman, but the regular soldiers of White Sky I have seen fit their conception of good order."
"Perhaps something like road wardens could be organized. I will look into this," Cai Renxiang said. "You're other targets?"
Imperial Moderate-30%
Imperial Conservative-40%
Cai Loyalist-30%
Imperial Conservative-40%
Cai Loyalist-30%
"The Blue Mountain is simple, if there can be any exchange of historical documentation arranged they will be pleased," Gan Guangli said. "Our own Argent Peak Sect… I am not sure they can be satisfied for less than the head of the man who slew Elder Zhou."
"As expected," Ling Qi said.
"Yes," Cai Renxiang said. "However nothing said here will stop that war. It is out of our responsibility for the moment."
"Gan Guangli nodded. "As long as the security of the border and war effort is not undermined, I don't forsee trouble. As to the Luo Miss Ling witnessed a bit. Their primary desire is that any agreement be backed by material collateral. Whether that is an exchange of highborne hostages, a marriage, or spiritually binding oaths, they will not give their support to an agreement which is only ink and paper. Lord Luo was willing to consider the idea of a small population under joint authority…."
"The foreign quarter idea," Ling Qi said.
"Just so," Gan Guangli agreed. "Obviously he will need a more concrete presentation to give a real answer.
"That is much more in line with expectations," Cai Renxiang said. "I doubt marriages are on the negotiation table. There are none high ranking enough who can afford to destroy their own respectability among the Empire in that way. And while they clearly have prominent families who control the apparatus of government, I have suspicions about the foreigners organization in that regard."
Ling Qi nodded there.
"But, the rest are viable options," Cai Renxiang said, steepling her fingers. "As to my own findings, the Diao are frustratingly vague of course. They desire to appear above this, and so only a few low ranking observers have come. Luckily some are my Father's relatives, they clearly wish to be close to me based upon that, and so long as they do not expect considerations beyond the bounds of law, I can accept that. The Diao will be satisfied so long as we do not bring down too much imperial scrutiny on the province. This summit does not otherwise effect their interest."
"Two in one, that's something. I'd like to avoid angering the ministry too," Ling Qi said dryly.
"Indeed," Gan Guangli chuckled.
"As too the Bao… as always, the Lord Bao looks far into the future. They will clearly angle for special rights for their tradesmen, the expansion of travel infrastructure and access to new goods. In the immediate terms, they will most want an agreement that such infrastructure will be built."
"The devils will be in the details," Gan Guangli said.
"But it won't be hard to reach the minimum of buy in, I think," Ling Qi said.
Imperial Moderate- 60%
Imperial Conservative- 20%
???- 20%
Imperial Conservative- 20%
???- 20%
"Yes, large land surveys will be needed for maps regardless. Working in an agreement for the construction of a road seems possible," Cai Renxiang considered. "Our harshest opposition will likely be the general and ministry…"
"But a single road in such rough terrain is an easily defendable choke point against a ground bound force," Gan Guangli pointed out.
"And it will have no effect on the nomads, independent or auxiliary," Ling Qi said. "We can argue practicality all day though."
"It is only the beginning, yes," Cai Renxiang said, leaning forward. "It seems that that our best interests align around performing a great survey of the wall, and the establishment of a semi permanent meeting location."
"That would satisfy the most people, I think," Ling Qi said. "But it some ways it will be the most difficult for our people to accept. The White Sky are not without isolationist elements themselves either."
"But, it what must be accomplished I think," Gan Guangli said.
"Without regular contact, it will only be like past attempts to make deals with the regions tribes," Cai Renxiang said. "To call this a success and be able to hold it up for the province. There must be a sturdy foundation which can be built upon."
"It will be a lot of work, but what's new?" Ling Qi said. "Let's get down to details."
Chapter End
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I like the emissaries. We should have an emissary club. All the history is super cool! I wonder what they will do when they find out our capital is in a perfectly healthy world tree.
Sun Shao is gonna fuck with the tangled pines isn't he?
Also interesting that the polar gates knows about Not!Persia and stuff too! World is getting bigger!
Sun Shao is gonna fuck with the tangled pines isn't he?
Also interesting that the polar gates knows about Not!Persia and stuff too! World is getting bigger!
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- Pronouns
- He/Him
I believe GG was cut off at the end there.
Clearly Weilu Revolutionaries that believe in Horned Supremacy as much as we do!
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Probably remnants from the whole infighting incident the Bao had before Shenhua took power.
- Location
- E
- Location
- the internet
Hmmm. We gotta do the Bao Project you guys.
- Pronouns
- He/Him
They might have a connection to our newish underground 'friends', whether for good or ill. From stuff Bao Qian said, they were aware of those people, at least as a threat to stay away from, from their mining expeditions.
Hmm, yes, my initial estimations have been proven 100% correct. Emissary Dzintara is a cutie. I wanna go to the Tangled Pines! It sounds fun!
Of course, in the more immediate term, it occurs that we might have an unexpectedly useful asset in dealing with them. The Bai have also struggled against encroaching plantlife since the start of their civilization. It's not out of the realm of possibilities that some Bai methods could be usefully applied to push back plant-based "malevolence".
Of course, in the more immediate term, it occurs that we might have an unexpectedly useful asset in dealing with them. The Bai have also struggled against encroaching plantlife since the start of their civilization. It's not out of the realm of possibilities that some Bai methods could be usefully applied to push back plant-based "malevolence".
The big question is how we represent the Sun to them. The problems are
1. We don't really know what's going on
2. The Sun are our foes (through the Bai)
3. The imperial observers will be pissed if try to ally with the Tangled Pines against the Sun.