I'd agree that we aren't the typical adherent to the hidden moon, but I definitely don't think that she's not a "Hidden Moon kinda person". Our personal cultivation art Song Seekers Ceremony definitely has very strong hidden themes for instance. As Yinhui says:
I mean in the more mundane sense. Curiosity is a trait we all share as human beings, but for most people isn't a predominant part of their personality. There's definitely a lot more nuance, I am speaking broadly here.
When I say not a Hidden Moon type, I mean (for instance) that the idea of rescuing fragments of records of a merchant's business transactions written in a long dead language from a civilization that has since vanished doesn't exactly get LQ out of bed in the morning. But it might interest Meng on the other hand.
LQ will do it for the phat loot. Hidden Moon will be pleased with the result regardless.
Anyways, LQ (my interpretation ofc) sees knowledge as a means to an end, not an end itself, and that has important implications for which Moon aspect she has affinity for. Emphasis on the word affinity.
Like, she rejected Bloody Moon entirely, but that doesn't mean it's out of her life entirely. She isn't a 'Hidden Moon' type (my words), but that doesn't bar her from Hidden Moon aspected tasks or Arts.
When I say not a Hidden Moon type, I mean (for instance) that the idea of rescuing fragments of records of a merchant's business transactions written in a long dead language from a civilization that has since vanished doesn't exactly get LQ out of bed in the morning. But it might interest Meng on the other hand.
LQ will do it for the phat loot. Hidden Moon will be pleased with the result regardless.
I do think that is too narrow a view of the hidden moon. Yes Ling Qi wouldn't be interested in a thousand year old tax receipt, but she definitely would be interested in a thousand year old song! Jiao is nearly as hidden as a human can get, but he mostly used his pursuit of knowledge as a way to help further his and An's goals as a spy master. To uproot corruption and gain power for himself and An. Saying that you must love knowledge for knowledge's sake and not for the benefits it brings seems like a very narrow definition to me. You can say that we aren't the typical academic with certainty, but Qi does seem to have passion for rediscovering lost works and learning from them which is definitely Hidden even if it's just to become more skilled.
I do think that is too narrow a view of the hidden moon. Yes Ling Qi wouldn't be interested in a thousand year old tax receipt, but she definitely would be interested in a thousand year old song! Jiao is nearly as hidden as a human can get, but he mostly used his pursuit of knowledge as a way to help further his and An's goals as a spy master. To uproot corruption and gain power for himself and An. Saying that you must love knowledge for knowledge's sake and not for the benefits it brings seems like a very narrow definition to me. You can say that we aren't the typical academic with certainty, but Qi does seem to have passion for rediscovering lost works and learning from them which is definitely Hidden even if it's just to become more skilled.
We aren't necessarily in total disagreement. Like I said before, just because I don't consider LQ a Hidden Moon type person doesn't mean it's improbable or impossible in my mind for her to do Hidden Moon activities or learn Hidden Moon aligned Arts. What it does affect is how I vote for certain things and interpret her as a character.
Like if there was a vote between 'LQ goes on a Musical vision quest' and 'LQ hunts for secrets in a Weilu tomb', I'd probably choose the former. I'd also like to think that's what LQ would choose (if she couldn't do both). Both are aligned with Hidden in some way, but the first resonates a lot more imo.
I also don't necessarily disagree my definition of Moon aspects is narrow, but (a) I'm not imposing my view on anyone else nor do I presume anyone shares it, and (b) it's easy for me to understand and use to model LQ. You can disagree with it, as long as you know where I'm standing.
We aren't necessarily in total disagreement. Like I said before, just because I don't consider LQ a Hidden Moon type person doesn't mean it's improbable or impossible in my mind for her to do Hidden Moon activities or learn Hidden Moon aligned Arts. What it does affect is how I vote for certain things and interpret her as a character.
Like if there was a vote between 'LQ goes on a Musical vision quest' and 'LQ hunts for secrets in a Weilu tomb', I'd probably choose the former. I'd also like to think that's what LQ would choose (if she couldn't do both). Both are aligned with Hidden in some way, but the first resonates a lot more imo.
I also don't necessarily disagree my definition of Moon aspects is narrow, but (a) I'm not imposing my view on anyone else nor do I presume anyone shares it, and (b) it's easy for me to understand and use to model LQ. You can disagree with it, as long as you know where I'm standing.
(Edited to add: replying to this as a jumping-off point of thought, rather than to argue against you in particular, I know the reply functionality can make this confusing)
You know, the thing with Ling Qi and the Moons is that she's approached them primarily as tools, rather than as qualities she values or wishes to possess. That's not to say that she's cold and calculating or a manipulator in that relationship (good fucking luck getting one over on Great Spirits), but rather that saying she's a "Grinning Moon/Dreaming Moon/Hidden Moon" type of person is missing the point, because she consistently hasn't approached her relationship with the Moons that way.
That is to say, I believe the Mother Moon, Guiding Moon and Reflective Moons are most reflective of her goals: she wants peace and harmony together with those she values, and she wants to be the kind of person who can continue to pursue that goal even in adversity. However, she doesn't follow those moons because their immediately intuitive methods aren't ones she prizes: she doesn't believe that nurturing, revealing mysteries or fostering harmony will solve her problems. However, cleverness, artistic expression and the pursuit of useful secrets are all weapons she values and seeks to hone further, and that's what guided her Ceremony. If she's more fond of art now, then I'd say that has a lot to do with music's ties to her mother and to Sixiang and to Hanyi, as well as the power it's given her to protect them and others.
Which is basically the opposite of how most people would expect this sort of thing to go, so most conversations on the topic go, "I want Ling Qi to be closer to the Grinning Moon, so we want her to be more of the kind of person who likes clever tricks," and I'm pretty sure that's a dead end. She can enjoy the experience of pulling it off, sure, but that seems most tightly tied to the fact that success means she's closer to the real prize, which is and will remain Mother-Guiding-Reflective.
(It amuses me that this casting of Ling Qi and the Moons totally leaves out Bloody Moon and only Bloody Moon, since the Reflective Moons covers two phases. Fuck you, Waxing Crescent! All my homies hate Waxing Crescent!)
(Edited to add: replying to this as a jumping-off point of thought, rather than to argue against you in particular, I know the reply functionality can make this confusing)
You know, the thing with Ling Qi and the Moons is that she's approached them primarily as tools, rather than as qualities she values or wishes to possess. That's not to say that she's cold and calculating or a manipulator in that relationship (good fucking luck getting one over on Great Spirits), but rather that saying she's a "Grinning Moon/Dreaming Moon/Hidden Moon" type of person is missing the point, because she consistently hasn't approached her relationship with the Moons that way.
That is to say, I believe the Mother Moon, Guiding Moon and Reflective Moons are most reflective of her goals: she wants peace and harmony together with those she values, and she wants to be the kind of person who can continue to pursue that goal even in adversity. However, she doesn't follow those moons because their immediately intuitive methods aren't ones she prizes: she doesn't believe that nurturing, revealing mysteries or fostering harmony will solve her problems. However, cleverness, artistic expression and the pursuit of useful secrets are all weapons she values and seeks to hone further, and that's what guided her Ceremony. If she's more fond of art now, then I'd say that has a lot to do with music's ties to her mother and to Sixiang and to Hanyi, as well as the power it's given her to protect them and others.
Which is basically the opposite of how most people would expect this sort of thing to go, so most conversations on the topic go, "I want Ling Qi to be closer to the Grinning Moon, so we want her to be more of the kind of person who likes clever tricks," and I'm pretty sure that's a dead end. She can enjoy the experience of pulling it off, sure, but that seems most tightly tied to the fact that success means she's closer to the real prize, which is and will remain Mother-Guiding-Reflective.
(It amuses me that this casting of Ling Qi and the Moons totally leaves out Bloody Moon and only Bloody Moon, since the Reflective Moons covers two phases. Fuck you, Waxing Crescent! All my homies hate Waxing Crescent!)
The Grinning Moon was her desire for agency in her own life, of being in control of the world within the reach of her arms. The Hidden Moon was her caution, the desire to build a place of safety, either within or without. The Dreaming Moon was her the desire to grasp for more, seeking always the lights beyond her reach. This was not their whole of course, but Ling Qi was far from being able to embody even one phase. It was what they were to her.
I'd say it's the direct opposite. It is the Dreaming Moon that helps her dream of what she wants, to find a family. It's the Grinning Moon that gives her the confidence to make that dream reality, and it's the Hidden Moon which represents the safety and might integral to protecting it. Mother, Guiding and Reflective are the tools, as we know them. They are what she wants to do like how a thief may pray to the Grinning Moon, but what the Grinning Moon truly is is living life according to ones own will and that's what lays behind the surface of wanting what the other Moons offer.
To be a guiding mother is the path Ling Qi has chosen for herself through understanding who she is and who she wants to be, represented by the Grinning and Dreaming Moons. And the guidance she offers prioritizes the safety of the Hidden Moon and the self realization and expression of the Grinning and Dreaming. Her life goal isn't to be a mother, it's to be who she wants to be, which happens to be being a mother. Ling Qi is to driven to be content with introspection and self-reflection, for it is only through realization that it finds meaning. The parts of Ling Qi that would be, perhaps, better represented by the other Moons are already represented by the patrons she have and the reasons those parts exist is the domain of the Grinning, Dreaming and Hidden Moons.
We could say that the other Moons accurately represent who she wants to be, but I find it more interesting that Ling Qi has found those ideas in her own way. She wishes to be the wise, nurturing guide to those she loves, but she wants them to have the self-assurance, agency and safety her true patrons represent.
[X] To journey and seek knowledge is virtue unto itself
Um, uh, everyone should vote for this option because it's, um, the best. It has all the good parts of everything ever, and no downsides, and the other options are horrible traps actually. For real.
Looking through LQ's current arts and seeing which Moon facet they would be (if they don't have one already), I come up with the following:
PLR => Dreaming
SNR => N/A (kind of Mother, especially given Bai history but nothing is a good fit)
FSS => N/A
HDW => Reflecting
RME => Hidden (but being turned into a weird amalgamation, Grinning maybe?)
ENM => Dreaming
BKSD => Bloody
PMR => Dreaming/Guiding/I don't know. This is specifically Muse emulation rather than that of a facet and Sixiang is extremely Guiding when it comes to our life but is explicitly Dreaming with those related powers
MotSS => Reflecting
LFotWT => Grinning
WHR => Mother
UGM => N/A
MSS => Hidden
Honestly it seems like a pretty good mix? Which makes sense, given that we are talking about a cultivator's full Art suite which will naturally have to handle a diverse set of circumstances.
I would definitely support mixing more explicit Moon into our Arts so as to give LQ the opportunity to further explore what the various facets mean to her. That doesn't really make sense for the very elemental SNR, FSS, and UGM but I think it would be rewarding for the others.
So this is completely off topic but I have to ask what is going on with Xiulan are we writing letters to her off screen because it's been months and not writing would be really out of character
So this is completely off topic but I have to ask what is going on with Xiulan are we writing letters to her off screen because it's been months and not writing woul be really out of character
Ling Qi itched to embrace her, but that could come later, when they weren't standing in the front garden. Somehow, every time she saw the duchess, she found her appreciation for her own mother growing. Following her mother inside Ling Qi cast one more glance out over the house and the town outside.
It wasn't pretty. There were holes in the roof where shingles had been torn away, and several of the upstairs windows were covered by boards. Around them, the garden, once full of flowers had been churned to muddy ruin. Her home seemed to have gotten off fairly lightly though. Outside things were worse, she had seen a handful of buildings which had simply collapsed, and were now being rebuilt by workers from the Sect. The dirt roads outside the city center were still ankle deep muck in places, and outside the town walls she had seen two miniature lakes full of muddy stagnant water. She was sure that some Outer Sect disciples would be earning Sect Points cleansing and removing those soon.
It seemed even so far from the front, the effects of a seventh realm cultivators power would be felt. The air still tingled with electricity and grief, and she was sure that weight wasn't helping with the more mundane problems.
"Were you and Biyu well while I was gone," Ling Qi asked quietly as they entered the front hall.
"We persevered," Ling Qingge replied. "It was easier for Biyu, once I understood that the room that young man installed blocked out what was happening outside, she was able to sleep again. She did become a little agitated with the enclosure as time wore on."
"Well I'm glad some value has already come from it," she relaxed a little, if her Mother was talking about such a small problem then there weren't any greater ones. "But how were you?"
"I was able to keep myself busy, between the neighbors and our household. I invited those who lived outside to stay during the storm," Ling Qingge said. "I hope you don't believe that was a misstep."
Ling Qi shook her head slightly. Anyone who had a problem with that wasn't going to be someone she could really be friendly with anyway."That's fine. How… were they, it was probably frightening."
They were her mother's friends and acquaintances, so it was only polite to ask.
"It shook some of them," her mother admitted. "But it was not so bad for adults, who could understand what was happening."
Ling Qi hummed in agreement as her mother continued speaking.It was good hearing her talk about others, with the implication that she was doing more than just huddling down and focusing on herself. She was a little surprised to learn that her Mother suspected that they might be losing one or two of the younger girls brought from Tonghou, it seemed they had found men they were interested in staying with in the village.
Ling Qi made a silent note to herself to send a wisp or two out for a wandering while she cultivated tonight.
"Of course that would be your first thought," Sixiang sighed.
It was only reasonable, she trusted her mother to have done the same, but there were tools only she had.
Before Sixiang could respond further though, her Mother turned her head to look at her. "Ah, are your spirits present? I do not want to be rude by not greeting them as well."
"Hanyi decided to visit her Mother's old home, and Zhengui is taking a nap. Being awake for so long at a stretch really tired him out," Ling Qi explained.
"Don't worry 'bout me momma Ling, just focus on this troublesome daughter of yours," Sixiang said aloud, letting their voice carry on the wind. At the far end of the hall, Ling Qi saw a cleaning girl who had been looking at them out of the corner of her eye startle.
She saw her Mother's shoulders stiffen a little, but she didn't jump this time. Progress. "I will try to do so," she said.
They passed into the dining room then, it was a bit of a mess. Materials for repair were stacked about the edges of the room, but the table was clear, and Ling Qi was able to see the traces of dirt from workman's boots still spotting the cracks in the floorboards.
"Ling Qi, how did your… trip go," her mother asked, turning to face her as they approached the table.
"Better than could reasonably be expected," Ling Qi said wryly. "That reminds me, I brought back gifts!"
She gestured, and the air above the table shimmered along with a faint puff of air as objects materialized and settled on the table. They were small things, painting, vases, a folded tapestry, and other bits of decor. She still wasn't completely sure of Meng Dan's words, but she had accepted his help in picking out a few pieces to keep anyway.
"Beautiful," Ling Qingge murmured, leaning over the nearest painting. It was a simple thing, depicting a winding stream that pooled in a pond, filled with swimming ducks and sparkling fish, wispy wind and water spirits gave the piece a more mystical feel, and the water of the pond and stream shimmered like real water. The positions of the animals and fish seemed to change a little when you looked at them from different angles as well. "Where in the world did you acquire these?"
"We came upon a cache of art and artifacts, after defeating a hidden traitor," Ling Qi replied easily, she might explain more clearly later, but she would rather let her Mother enjoy the gifts for now. "I'm selling most of it, but it seemed a shame not to keep a few and these…"
She paused, long enough for her Mother to look up from her examination with a frown. "These what, Ling Qi?"
"Well one of my companions helped me do a genealogy, technically the makers of these are ancestors, even if it's really distant and they're not really acknowledgeable," Ling Qi said, her eyes wandering over the spread. It was a small thing, but she supposed she understood Meng Dan's words.
She didn't put any great stock in ancestry still, but maybe future Ling's would find them inspiring. She didn't think that would be a bad thing. "Not a bad little foundation, right Mother?"
"I-" her mother began.
Ling Qi's eyes darted to the side as she heard a high pitched cry, and she turned in time to catch a small form bounding into the room to embrace her legs. The blanket of the Sect heads qi really was intense, Ling Qi thought wryly, if she had missed her sister's approach.
Ling Qi crouched down, and embraced her little sister back. "Missed you Biyu," she said, tousling the girl's hair.
The little girl squealed happily, grabbing at her hand. "Missed Sis-y! Bad air goes away!"
Ling Qi glanced up to see a red faced older woman huffing and puffing her way up the hall where Biyu had come from. She felt a little bad for her, she had a feeling the power of her domain gave Biyu a certain energy that made her hard to keep up with for a mortal. The staff had probably noticed this too, given the lack of surprise on the woman's face as she stopped near the entrance to the room.
"Ling Qi, bane of nannies," Sixiang chuckled.
Behind her, Ling Qingge gestured to the other woman, who briefly bowed and took her leave. "Biyu, please don't run in the house," she chided gently.
"But Sis-y," Biyu pouted, peering past Ling Qi.
"Listen to Mother," Ling Qi chuckled. "I'll be here for a few days this time."
The little girl's eyes went wide, and she babbled happily at the news, but her Mother gave her a concerned look. "Is that truly alright?"
"I've earned a little break," Ling Qi said, laying her hand on Biyu's head. "Unless there's a real emergency, it's fine."
"Dance!" Biyu blurted out before her mother could reply. "Wanna show!"
Ling Qi blinked and shot her Mother a questioning look.
"One of the younger girls was once a ritual dancer at the Temple of the Bountiful Earth, before her circumstances changed. Lessons helped distract Biyu from confinement," Ling Qingge explained.
"Lei-Lei is nice," Biyu affirmed. "Show Sis-y?"
Ling Qi felt a slight pang, she'd intended to be the one who showed Biyu some basics of dance as a bonding thing, but it seemed she'd been beaten too it. She didn't regret her trip but…
"Hey, not like you don't still have plenty to show her, just be happy and let the girl learn," Sixiang huffed.
"Sure, I don't mind, if it's fine with you Mother," Ling Qi said aloud, not letting her thoughts show.
"I discarded the days schedule the moment I felt your presence," Ling Qingge said with a small smile.
***
Ling Qi leaned back on the soft couch in the 'panic' room. Her Mother had seen it furnished since she had been here last, with things likely commissioned from the village, wall hangings concealed the faintly humming formation arrays, still partially active from keeping the atmosphere outside out, and in addition to the couch she sat on there were a few other chairs and small tables, along with a pair of small but well appointed cots in one corner.
Laying in her lap, Biyu turned over, murmuring in her sleep. They'd spent a few hours letting her show off the first halting steps she'd learned from 'Lei-lei' and then Ling Qi coaching her further. It was less about deliberate routines at this point than simply instilling balance and rhythm. It was fun though, even if Biyu was too young to really get it yet.
"I am so glad you made it home safely," her mother murmured, from her seat beside Ling Qi.
Carefully, Ling Qi wrapped an arm around her Mother's shoulders. It still struck her sometimes, how much taller she was than the older woman, and how very frail she seemed. "I've gotten pretty tough you know?"
"Maybe," her Mother chuckled weakly. "But having felt the storm, I could not help but worry."
Ling Qi was silent, letting her eyes drift shut. "...That's fair. I try to stay in my own league though. Were you really okay while worrying about everyone else though Mother?"
"I was as well as I could be," Ling Qingge admitted. "But I am glad that the campaign has halted for the moment."
"So am I," Ling Qi said. But there was some trepidation there. The Duchess was coming south, if what she had felt in the air was the mere distant echo of the Sect Heads actions, then she dearly hoped that Cai Shenhua never had cause to so much as lift a finger. "I notice though, your cultivation has advanced."
"Has it?" Ling Qingge asked, looking down at her hands. "I merely found it good for focusing my mind."
"I think you're close to reaching Gold Physique," Ling Qi said. "Would you like my help tomorrow morning, giving it the last push?"
Her mother closed her eyes, letting out a breath. "...I think I should like that, yes."
AN: Now the final part of the Successor options. This will be different from last time, because things are going to be changing soon. At the end of turn 13 at latest, the quest is going to be receiving a mechanics overhaul, stripping out most of the fiddly little numbers and simplifying the character sheet. To that end, I am going to give you a few thematic options with a clear singular mechanical point to choose from. The point of this is to make arts be less about numbers and more about a clear picture of what it does when used in a scene. Neither option reduces or removes the current functionality of the wisps. For the new Songseeker's Eye Art...
[] Moonlight Accompaniment: Transforms the wisps from pure observation to focal points. This will allow centering an aoe music techniques origin on a wisp. Combines Inquisitive study, Seeking Moon's Eye and Watchful Moon Analysis.
[] Auditorium of Secrets: Transforms wisps into focal points for a modular zone around the user enabling limited combat precog within. Combines Inquisitive study, Seeking Moon's Eye and Watchful Moon Analysis.
Both choices will alter the fluff of Initiates Viewing Pool
1082x3.2=3462 Successesmean: 3409.92 standard deviation: 99.1
3562/600
2962/900
2062/1200
Overflow 86 to Physical cultivation
Roaming Moon's Eye Mastered
890 successes to physical cultivation
Passive Effects:
+20 to Combat Perception
+15 to Social Perception
+20 to both Perceptions when using remote viewing techniques
+15 to Spiritual Avoid
+15 to Formations when deciphering arrays
+15 to Academics
Inquisitive Study: D
Duration: Persistent or Upkeep 2
The user's eyes gleam briefly with a silver sheen as they study the object of their curiosity. The users perception increases greatly for up to two tests in a single scene, allowing them to discern many details that they might otherwise miss.
Seeking Moon's Eyes: C
Duration: Persistent
Conjures five reflective silver wisps the size of a coin. Expressions of the Diviner's curiosity, these wisps seek their parents' interest eagerly. The wisps ignore wholly physical obstacles and spiritual ones below the techniques rank adjusted for potency, but cannot travel further than Very Far distance from their creator. The creator may see from the wisp's position as if they stood there themselves, though only in one direction at a time. This greatly increases their combat perception and grants a bonus to avoid in the areas within which this sight overlaps.
Statblock
Health: C
Speed: A, Initiative: B
Avoid: A, Armor F
Watchful Moon Analysis: C
Duration: Immediate
Used in tandem with an damaging art, allows the users thoughts to far outspeed their limbs, greatly slowing their perception of the world, and allowing the user to pick out minute details that might otherwise be missed in the flows of an enemy or obstacles qi, and adjust the course of their blow. Through this the user ignores the effects of a single defensive technique of C rank or lower, or if none are active, penalizes the targets armor or avoid at the users discretion.
Initiate's Viewing Pool: B
[Non-Combat]
Requiring a surface of calm water or a mirror at least two handspans wide, the user concentrates on a familiar person or place within fifteen kilometers of their current position. The user is able to view the person or location in clear detail with both sight and hearing with perception equivalent to their own base Perception. This viewing may be opposed by arts or talismans of various types, in which case the user's combat perception is used to determine success. With sufficient surfaces, the use may view up to three targets with a single use of this technique. The user may attempt to look upon an unfamiliar location or person(such as one merely described or seen in passing to the user), however the user receives one ranks down on their Perception when doing this, and only receives visual information even on success. Targets are not considered familiar until seen in person.
Alternatively the user may generate a surface of their own to use on the fly, but using the technique this way causes all perception checks to be made at one rank down.
[] Auditorium of Secrets: Transforms wisps into focal points for a modular zone around the user enabling limited combat precog within. Combines Inquisitive study, Seeking Moon's Eye and Watchful Moon Analysis.
"The future changes with every step, never be certain you know what is coming."
"...you literally have combat precognition, Ling Qi."
"Yes. Never be certain that you know what's coming. I know what's coming perfectly well, thank you."
