I find it interesting that Qi shares the stagnation is death insight with the Cai and Xia.
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Threads Of Destiny(Eastern Fantasy, Sequel to Forge of Destiny)
- Thread starter yrsillar
- Start date
- Original Users' Choice!
Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
globalwarmth
ruining the weather.
- Location
- Polar ice caps
Don't lose your way in your mind
We have to be as one
Don't be afraid my sweet heart
This is the way to be more strong
Harbor my deep secret~
- Location
- Third planet from the star named Sol
- Pronouns
- He/They
Wow. The realization that one of her Mother's arts held no lesson for her must have hit deeper than we thought.
Actually it's even worse. When she started cultivating the art it was compatible with her domain. But by the time, she finished it, it was incompatible. According to WOG on discord.
Edit: My memory was wrong. When she started cultivating the art it was compatible with her domain but in the end she got no insight. Either because the art was incompatible at the end or she chose no insight.
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- Location
- All around you.
- Pronouns
- Lord/Master/God
Edited Chapter:
'This exhaustion had become unfamiliar', Cai Renxiang thought.
It was not a thing of the body, borne of a pounding heart and bruised flesh.
The blade resting less than a hair's breadth from her throat withdrew with a soft hiss, it's gleaming blade shimmering blue as it's impossibly sharp edge severed the air.
No, the immaculate weapon that was the Heron General Xia Ren would never need be so crude as to inflict the slightest harm on a student's body.
Cai Renxiang had felt what it was to die three hundred twenty seven times in the last hour. Although the general had limited herself to mere third realm abilities, the difference in skill was too great. Cifeng whispered frustration, her edge yearned to repay humiliation in blood. It was a titanic effort to merely maintain grasp of her hilt.
"Length of time until defeat has improved by two and thirty eight hundreths of a second since we have begun," the general said crisply. Her shining blade vanished into its scabbard with a soft hiss. Unlike Cifeng, it was silent. "A great improvement for a recruit. An acceptable improvement for a scion of Cai."
They stood in the center of General Xia's sparring chamber. Walls of pristine white cloth, unadorned by any decor surrounded them. The mirror shine of the metal beneath their feet reflected them both. Perfectly flat in angle, perfectly round in shape, bereft of the slightest flaw or scuff. Cai Renxiang lowered her saber, and bowed to her instructor. "I am pleased to have improved under your instruction, General Xia."
It was normal, in etiquette to imply that praise was excessive. This was not the case for the General. Only a mad fool would imply Xia Ren was in any way imprecise. Like her Mother, the woman before her was more ideal than flesh. Some wondered why the woman had not claimed or been given the title of sword saint. Cai Renxiang knew that it was because her Mother did not require a mere sword.
Swords did not win wars.
"You have altered the Duchess' forms beyond the adjustments created for your height and frame," the general spoke plainly, without embellishment or accusation. The demand for explanation remained plain.
Cai Renxiang met the thing of fire, steel and numbers that lurked behind the eyes of the armored woman before her despite the black spots in the corners of her vision. "Adjustments to style are necessary for growth."
"You believe your judgement is superior in this matter?" Xia Ren asked.
"My Mother does not waste her effort on managing things beneath her notice, if her chosen subordinates have not failed her," Cai Renxiang replied.
She felt no fear under the general's examination. She had found her certainty. Cai Renxiang was not Cai Shenhua. She wielded the cutting words of Cifeng, not the pitiless Truth that was her mother's saber, Zhenxiang. She could not achieve that perfection. She had not been made for it.
It had hurt her, in a way that she did not think that she could still be damaged to admit that.
However, there was no benefit in maintaining self delusion. Cai Shenhua was the sundering of the past and a new beginning. Cai Renxiang was the ticking hands of progress, taken one step at a time.
"Your efforts remain acceptable," Xia Ren replied inscrutably. "Your continuing collusion and collection of outdated elements is of concern. To preserve the past is stagnation. Stagnation is death."
"The Cai rule the province of the Emerald Seas," Cai Renxiang said. "All of Emerald Seas. In order for all to reach the future, I must understand where they are beginning."
It was true that the ways of the past would change. This was inevitable, but the seeds had been sowed. They would change, one cut and tick of the clock at a time.
"The rot of ages breaks easily with a well aimed blow," Xia Ren said. "But, I have tasted your resolve. You still walk the forward path. Your methods are not yet unacceptable."
Cai Renxiang bowed her head in acknowledgement. Those words were not idle, coming from a woman who was amongst the highest in her Mother's council.
General Xia turned toward the side of the sparring chamber, and its walls shimmered, the privacy formations fading. "Sergeant Lin, escort the Young Mistress to her tent. She requires spiritual recovery."
The cloth wall of the chamber rustled, and the younger Xia entered, her hands clasped and her head bowed. "Yes, General!"
Cai Renxiang took a deep breath, and allowed Cifeng's sheath to be respun. The General was not wrong, she could recognize the fatigue clouding her mind. Naturally the spar had stopped before it could become damaging exhaustion.
Her boots clicked faintly on the mirrored floor as she marched out, following Xia Lin.
The General remained, still and silent, as an array of lights mapping the region bloomed on the wall before her.
"Is there anything you might require, Lady Cai?" Xia Lin asked crisply as the tent flap fell shut behind them.
"Just rest, as the general said," Cai Renxiang replied. Around her was the White Plume camp, where her Mother's finest soldiers were drilling and performing their camp duties.
Each piece in its place. She watched the men and women performing their duties with confidence and pride, recognizable to her even through her Mother's artifice. It was the pride of those who were working for something more inclusive than the self or the family. This, Cai Renxiang thought, was a small part of what might be, if she continued her Mother's work.
At least on the surface.
"Lady Cai?" Xia Lin asked.
She blinked, realizing that she had stopped to observe. It seemed she required rest more urgently than expected. "Just passing thoughts," she dismissed, resuming her walk.
"I am at my Lady's disposal," Xia Lin replied, resuming as she did.
Cai Renxiang considered Xia Lin. Scion of the generals clan, among the youngest of the White Plumes proper. It was difficult to judge her. That in itself was troubling.
Her martial skill and behavior were exemplary in almost all aspects. She stood as an example of what could be accomplished by the training of the White Plumes. Yet Cai Renxiang found herself troubled in her judgement.
"I have not asked before," Cai Renxiang said conversationally. "What are your thoughts on our mission?"
"I am certain that Lady Cai will live up to expectations," Xia Lin replied.
Despite herself, Cai Renxiang frowned. It was an honest answer, she was not being placated, and yet, it rang hollow. Perhaps she had spent too long in the company of her other retainers. "I would prefer your opinion on the mission itself and its efficacy."
Xia Lin paused briefly. "Multi-front conflicts are suboptimal in almost all cases. I…"
She trailed off, and Cai Renxiang watched her out of the corner of her eye. There it was, the reticence that hid beneath discipline. A flaw in the steel.
"I believe that achieving a ceasefire with the barbarians is a reasonable choice of action, but the pretext does seem thin," Xia Lin finished.
She sounded uncertain. Cai Renxiang understood.
Xia Ren had said it herself, a strong blow could shatter tradition well enough. In forging the Xia from the ruin of the Sadala, the General had struck many strong blows. Cai Renxiang thought of the General, and the girl before her. The engine of war and the rootless soldier, hiding within her armor. How many of the other White Plumes were such beneath their helms?
Could plans which produced such things be perfect?
Cai Renxiang dismissed that traitorous and errant thought. Even perfection had to contend with reality and flawed tools. That was the nature of the impure world.
"I do not believe it is as thin as you believe, such arguments may be more convincing than any recounting of facts," Cai Renxiang said quietly. The spots in her vision were getting worse. "Let us say that you are correct however. The logical reasons remain. Peace is more beneficial than war when interests are not in conflict. Exchange of goods produces more value than theft. Is it wrong then to craft a story which presents a foundation on which to build those things?"
"I suppose not," Xia Lin said. "I will bow to your greater expertise."
Cai Renxiang closed her eyes for a moment as they arrived at her tent. She wished that Xia Lin would disagree. Xia Lin reminded her far too much of herself, a doll who once arrogantly believed that she could clearly see her own strings.
"You are dismissed to your other duties," Cai Renxiang said coolly, not allowing her thoughts to show.
"As you say, Lady Cai," Xia Lin said, a faint crease in her brow. She had likely noticed Cai Renxiang's dissatisfaction. Another sign that she needed her rest.
Tomorrow they would depart the main force. She would need to be at her peak.
Oh, I caught the chapter just on time this once it seems. Nice :Ü™
»'This exhaustion had become unfamiliar', Cai Renxiang thought.«, »"This exhaustion had become unfamiliar", Cai Renxiang thought.« or »This exhaustion had become unfamiliar, Cai Renxiang thought.«
Yes, General!
Xia
Plumes
aspects
Plumes
Plumes
coolly
'This exhaustion had become unfamiliar', Cai Renxiang thought.
It was not a thing of the body, borne of a pounding heart and bruised flesh.
The blade resting less than a hair's breadth from her throat withdrew with a soft hiss, it's gleaming blade shimmering blue as it's impossibly sharp edge severed the air.
No, the immaculate weapon that was the Heron General Xia Ren would never need be so crude as to inflict the slightest harm on a student's body.
Cai Renxiang had felt what it was to die three hundred twenty seven times in the last hour. Although the general had limited herself to mere third realm abilities, the difference in skill was too great. Cifeng whispered frustration, her edge yearned to repay humiliation in blood. It was a titanic effort to merely maintain grasp of her hilt.
"Length of time until defeat has improved by two and thirty eight hundreths of a second since we have begun," the general said crisply. Her shining blade vanished into its scabbard with a soft hiss. Unlike Cifeng, it was silent. "A great improvement for a recruit. An acceptable improvement for a scion of Cai."
They stood in the center of General Xia's sparring chamber. Walls of pristine white cloth, unadorned by any decor surrounded them. The mirror shine of the metal beneath their feet reflected them both. Perfectly flat in angle, perfectly round in shape, bereft of the slightest flaw or scuff. Cai Renxiang lowered her saber, and bowed to her instructor. "I am pleased to have improved under your instruction, General Xia."
It was normal, in etiquette to imply that praise was excessive. This was not the case for the General. Only a mad fool would imply Xia Ren was in any way imprecise. Like her Mother, the woman before her was more ideal than flesh. Some wondered why the woman had not claimed or been given the title of sword saint. Cai Renxiang knew that it was because her Mother did not require a mere sword.
Swords did not win wars.
"You have altered the Duchess' forms beyond the adjustments created for your height and frame," the general spoke plainly, without embellishment or accusation. The demand for explanation remained plain.
Cai Renxiang met the thing of fire, steel and numbers that lurked behind the eyes of the armored woman before her despite the black spots in the corners of her vision. "Adjustments to style are necessary for growth."
"You believe your judgement is superior in this matter?" Xia Ren asked.
"My Mother does not waste her effort on managing things beneath her notice, if her chosen subordinates have not failed her," Cai Renxiang replied.
She felt no fear under the general's examination. She had found her certainty. Cai Renxiang was not Cai Shenhua. She wielded the cutting words of Cifeng, not the pitiless Truth that was her mother's saber, Zhenxiang. She could not achieve that perfection. She had not been made for it.
It had hurt her, in a way that she did not think that she could still be damaged to admit that.
However, there was no benefit in maintaining self delusion. Cai Shenhua was the sundering of the past and a new beginning. Cai Renxiang was the ticking hands of progress, taken one step at a time.
"Your efforts remain acceptable," Xia Ren replied inscrutably. "Your continuing collusion and collection of outdated elements is of concern. To preserve the past is stagnation. Stagnation is death."
"The Cai rule the province of the Emerald Seas," Cai Renxiang said. "All of Emerald Seas. In order for all to reach the future, I must understand where they are beginning."
It was true that the ways of the past would change. This was inevitable, but the seeds had been sowed. They would change, one cut and tick of the clock at a time.
"The rot of ages breaks easily with a well aimed blow," Xia Ren said. "But, I have tasted your resolve. You still walk the forward path. Your methods are not yet unacceptable."
Cai Renxiang bowed her head in acknowledgement. Those words were not idle, coming from a woman who was amongst the highest in her Mother's council.
General Xia turned toward the side of the sparring chamber, and its walls shimmered, the privacy formations fading. "Sergeant Lin, escort the Young Mistress to her tent. She requires spiritual recovery."
The cloth wall of the chamber rustled, and the younger Xia entered, her hands clasped and her head bowed. "Yes, General!"
Cai Renxiang took a deep breath, and allowed Cifeng's sheath to be respun. The General was not wrong, she could recognize the fatigue clouding her mind. Naturally the spar had stopped before it could become damaging exhaustion.
Her boots clicked faintly on the mirrored floor as she marched out, following Xia Lin.
The General remained, still and silent, as an array of lights mapping the region bloomed on the wall before her.
"Is there anything you might require, Lady Cai?" Xia Lin asked crisply as the tent flap fell shut behind them.
"Just rest, as the general said," Cai Renxiang replied. Around her was the White Plume camp, where her Mother's finest soldiers were drilling and performing their camp duties.
Each piece in its place. She watched the men and women performing their duties with confidence and pride, recognizable to her even through her Mother's artifice. It was the pride of those who were working for something more inclusive than the self or the family. This, Cai Renxiang thought, was a small part of what might be, if she continued her Mother's work.
At least on the surface.
"Lady Cai?" Xia Lin asked.
She blinked, realizing that she had stopped to observe. It seemed she required rest more urgently than expected. "Just passing thoughts," she dismissed, resuming her walk.
"I am at my Lady's disposal," Xia Lin replied, resuming as she did.
Cai Renxiang considered Xia Lin. Scion of the generals clan, among the youngest of the White Plumes proper. It was difficult to judge her. That in itself was troubling.
Her martial skill and behavior were exemplary in almost all aspects. She stood as an example of what could be accomplished by the training of the White Plumes. Yet Cai Renxiang found herself troubled in her judgement.
"I have not asked before," Cai Renxiang said conversationally. "What are your thoughts on our mission?"
"I am certain that Lady Cai will live up to expectations," Xia Lin replied.
Despite herself, Cai Renxiang frowned. It was an honest answer, she was not being placated, and yet, it rang hollow. Perhaps she had spent too long in the company of her other retainers. "I would prefer your opinion on the mission itself and its efficacy."
Xia Lin paused briefly. "Multi-front conflicts are suboptimal in almost all cases. I…"
She trailed off, and Cai Renxiang watched her out of the corner of her eye. There it was, the reticence that hid beneath discipline. A flaw in the steel.
"I believe that achieving a ceasefire with the barbarians is a reasonable choice of action, but the pretext does seem thin," Xia Lin finished.
She sounded uncertain. Cai Renxiang understood.
Xia Ren had said it herself, a strong blow could shatter tradition well enough. In forging the Xia from the ruin of the Sadala, the General had struck many strong blows. Cai Renxiang thought of the General, and the girl before her. The engine of war and the rootless soldier, hiding within her armor. How many of the other White Plumes were such beneath their helms?
Could plans which produced such things be perfect?
Cai Renxiang dismissed that traitorous and errant thought. Even perfection had to contend with reality and flawed tools. That was the nature of the impure world.
"I do not believe it is as thin as you believe, such arguments may be more convincing than any recounting of facts," Cai Renxiang said quietly. The spots in her vision were getting worse. "Let us say that you are correct however. The logical reasons remain. Peace is more beneficial than war when interests are not in conflict. Exchange of goods produces more value than theft. Is it wrong then to craft a story which presents a foundation on which to build those things?"
"I suppose not," Xia Lin said. "I will bow to your greater expertise."
Cai Renxiang closed her eyes for a moment as they arrived at her tent. She wished that Xia Lin would disagree. Xia Lin reminded her far too much of herself, a doll who once arrogantly believed that she could clearly see her own strings.
"You are dismissed to your other duties," Cai Renxiang said coolly, not allowing her thoughts to show.
"As you say, Lady Cai," Xia Lin said, a faint crease in her brow. She had likely noticed Cai Renxiang's dissatisfaction. Another sign that she needed her rest.
Tomorrow they would depart the main force. She would need to be at her peak.
- Location
- UK
Yo, did we nearly die?
Cause it looks like we might have walked straight into conflict with the Way of an upper tier cultivator. Yikes.
Or maybe Xia Ren locked onto possible targets for some 'stagnation removal'. Also yikes.
Also, not a fan at all of that insight. To forget the lessons of the past is to be doomed to repeat them, which is it's own form of stagnation. I wonder if Xia Ren would ever be able to understand this, and what it would do to her Way. More Zeqing than Jiao I suspect.
Although Renxiang wasn't the type of person in the first place it's great to see her recognizing she doesn't want to be surrounded by yes men. Wonder if she might internalise that as part of her Way, a bit of individualism to oppose/work with Shenhua's uniformity if you want to make a functional and stable society.
Sirrocco
Pedantic
The interesting thing about Shenhua... the monster of efficiency is her exterior - that pitiliess light of truth that carves away all else. Those that she has crafted with it are shaped and cleansed and simplified in ways that she herself is not. She is the avatar of such things, but not their exemplar. She has romantic entanglements and wry humor and whims in ways that Renxiang and the General do not.
Renxiang's inside resembles the Shenhua's outside, but with some moderating influences of patience and understanding... but the difference at the core is also a reason why their Way are not the same. At her core, Shenhua is still in some ways the same girl driven by offense at the forces that murdered her family.
...and in some ways, there's a thematic tie-in with Zhengui here. Shenhua is the cleansing. Renxiang is learning how to be the regrowth.
Renxiang's inside resembles the Shenhua's outside, but with some moderating influences of patience and understanding... but the difference at the core is also a reason why their Way are not the same. At her core, Shenhua is still in some ways the same girl driven by offense at the forces that murdered her family.
...and in some ways, there's a thematic tie-in with Zhengui here. Shenhua is the cleansing. Renxiang is learning how to be the regrowth.
Aranfan
Team Plasma Grunt
No idea. If I had to take a guess, maybe the insight at the end of bandit attack. But there's not much evidence for any option.
- Location
- New Brunswick, NJ
- Pronouns
- He/Him/His
Echki is mistaken. Here is what we know:
So we do not know enough to distinguish "became incompatible" and "she chose to take no insight, the way we've taken no insight from a couple of arts that were still compatible with us." I'd guess the latter.
Hah sorry. I will edit my post then.
My understanding is that it was the "YOU WILL OBEY ME!" art. Trying to fit us into her order certainly didn't help but it was actually probably Ji Rong that made her realize that forcing obedience is a bad idea.
- Location
- All around you.
- Pronouns
- Lord/Master/God
I'm feeling very validated, in my opinion of liking Shenhua more than Renxiang, right now 💖 :Ü™
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- Location
- CA
Well, this update contained both my worst fears and my best hopes. If Truth-synonymous-with-perfection is a key part of Cai Shenhua's Domain, then she isn't just focused on creating a system that works well, she's concerned with creating the Best System, which means absolutely everything has to be in its Correct Place rather than one that's just good enough. Which was always likely to be the case, given that she's a White, but it also makes conflict inevitable instead of merely very likely.
But on the other hand, CRX's personal growth is outstripping my expectations by a pretty damn big margin. The thing I find most interesting is this:
Not new beginnings, a new beginning; not sunderings of corruption, but sundering of the past. CRX is implicitly thinking of her mother as an element that has to be removed eventually rather than simply channeled to new ends--chemotherapy, not medicine. Her "traitorous and errant thought" goes a lot further than she's willing to acknowledge at the moment, I think... And given that, I'm thinking the art she took no insight from may have been straight-up incompatible, not just a case of declined insights.
But on the other hand, CRX's personal growth is outstripping my expectations by a pretty damn big margin. The thing I find most interesting is this:
Not new beginnings, a new beginning; not sunderings of corruption, but sundering of the past. CRX is implicitly thinking of her mother as an element that has to be removed eventually rather than simply channeled to new ends--chemotherapy, not medicine. Her "traitorous and errant thought" goes a lot further than she's willing to acknowledge at the moment, I think... And given that, I'm thinking the art she took no insight from may have been straight-up incompatible, not just a case of declined insights.
Aranfan
Team Plasma Grunt
... When have we chosen to take no insights?
We didn't take an insight from Ephemeral Nights Memory.
- Location
- New Brunswick, NJ
- Pronouns
- He/Him/His
- Location
- The Star Kingdom of Manticore
Several times. Our memory art was the latest.
Varder
Tired Cultist
- Location
- Hell
At first I thought that Sun Shao was something like this, only taken to its extreme, at White. But it's not it. While Sun Shao is War as well, his is much more personal. Xia Ren fights wars for other people, Sun Shao fights wars for himself. Xia Ren is merely an instrument.
EternalObserver
eYe Gaze baCk
- Location
- The Void
Well, him and his family, but yes, very personal
Varder
Tired Cultist
- Location
- Hell
Was there a WoG about it? I remember her becoming spirit blooded, not a puppet.
TimEd
Meteor maker
Ehhh. She wont be a complete puppet I assume, just like I assume CRX wont be a complete puppet of Shenhua if she met a Bad End.
Its just that I have SERIOUS doubts of Liling still having 100% autonomy, especially since the spirit bonding was forced upon her.
- Location
- The Temple of the Winds
The next big blow will be when she realizes that for all her "perfection" her mother can still be wrong. And that there are better paths than the ones she picked.
Cecylene
Eternal Idea Engine
- Location
- Massachusetts
- Pronouns
- He/They
It is interesting, as CRX has become used to being given not only honest, but full and intended answers from Ling Qi to any and all questions. Ling Qi is open to a fault with CRX, such that apparently it bothers CRX when she is denied the full truth from someone she wants to hear the opinions of.
Ling Qi hasn't been a spectacular social operative, though has improved greatly so far, but rather she is exactly the sounding board that CRX desires because Ling Qi has absolutely never withheld her full opinions or thoughts when asked for them. I love that CRX is not longer content with "grudging acceptance" or "willing obeisance" from her subordinates but rather wants to at least have everyone understand the what and why of her plans so that those subordinates can truly accept and participate even if they are not precisely pleased with them.