Threads Of Destiny(Eastern Fantasy, Sequel to Forge of Destiny)
- Thread starter yrsillar
- Start date
- Original Users' Choice!
Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
- Location
- his hidden lair
[X] Plan: Whispering on the Wind
I love the idea of further exploring the mechanics of cultivation and toying with the idea of making Ling Qi's arts uniquely hers. We're almost certainly not going to get something as narratively powerful as Ling Qi starting to shape and define her own path rather than picking and choosing the pieces of it from exploring. A site, some pills, we're not in a position to grab another spirit or a new art- and those are the only things that seem likely to have a similar gravitas.
The actual benefits of the art are kinda chump change compared to the point of actually exploring its modification.
I love the idea of further exploring the mechanics of cultivation and toying with the idea of making Ling Qi's arts uniquely hers. We're almost certainly not going to get something as narratively powerful as Ling Qi starting to shape and define her own path rather than picking and choosing the pieces of it from exploring. A site, some pills, we're not in a position to grab another spirit or a new art- and those are the only things that seem likely to have a similar gravitas.
The actual benefits of the art are kinda chump change compared to the point of actually exploring its modification.
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There are two big narrative beats we could get:
1. A renewed connection to the Hidden Moon, which we sometimes struggle with compared to Grinning and Dreaming.
2. Forming a connection to the Mother Moon.
Given how we are struggling with reconciling our relationship with Zhengui with our self image the latter in particular could be extremely valuable from a narrative perspective.
- Location
- New Brunswick, NJ
- Pronouns
- He/Him/His
Is there any reason to believe that we need Explore AP to accomplish any of that, as opposed to cultivating our Moon-based cultivation art which has been the source of all our moon quests to date?
Even the Bloody Moon one? I thought we just stumbled across it exploring.
- Location
- New Brunswick, NJ
- Pronouns
- He/Him/His
Fair point; I was thinking about the ones where we deliberately forged bonds with a new patron, or solidified our bonds with an existing one. But the King of the Forest trial was a random encounter, yeah.
Arkeus
Crazy cat guy
- Location
- France
From your latter comments it seems you are talking about exploration here, but those connections are much more likely to be done via modding HDW I think? Hidden moon curiosity is a definite there, and HDW themes and Zhengui garding means it's likely to help form a connection with Mother Moon.
- Location
- United States of America
The logic of this argument is really breaking down. SSC is a further stepping stone for dealing with our Moon patrons, a constant source of information and detail that is interwoven in almost every single month. Just this last month we dealt with the Grinning Moon's gift of LFotWT, with an incredibly detailed event and long-reaching implications. To ignore the arts connections to SSC is to break apart the thematic connections that LFotWT has with SSC and the connections regarding the timing and event in which we got such an art. And ignoring all of that, SSC has significantly more presence the story than simply that line or two mentionings we cultivated it and the possibility of Spirit Growth from Alingge. It has pushed Ling Qi further into the dealing with spirits category, so much so that we have collected arts specifically for dealing with other spirits. The mere presence of SSC has been molding Ling Qi's story since she has gotten it, and to dismiss all of that because it hasn't been mentioned directly many times seems bizarre. The Moon patrons certainly have been having a large impact on the story, a large continual impact, and that is what SSC taps into.
As for what Ling Qi has mostly been focusing on, Family matters will never go away given Ling Qi's domain, and the Barbarian/Sect conflict is currently the driving narrative and won't diminish for some time. But Renxiang's orders to get close to Wang? That seems... pretty much resolved. We've set up the group, have forged connections with him that will last with some maintenance. There doesn't seem much more to do on that front. Given that such a task had a sub-plot lasting... months now, it seems entirely appropriate, especially with the cultivation of LFotWT, to reorientate back towards Moon patron matters as the next sub-plot lasting a couple of months. This is especially true if the rumors about Moon Quests in the next couple of months have a basis in reality. It seems perfectly reasonable to start focusing in on that and setting up any such Quest before the Quest actually starts.
And if you want intent from Ling Qi, then, really, I'm going to point back to SSC and our Moon patrons. It seems perfectly reasonable that Ling Qi would intend to go out and explore to continue what SSC drives at. But again, if that doesn't scratch the itch of intent, then connecting SSC, Zhengui (like you've mentioned has been done before), exploring, and our promise to work with him on a Garden seems like a perfectly reasonable intention. If we are going to be working on gardening with Zhengui for the next couple of months, finding a suitable place to begin work seems like it would also fall under exploration. At the very least exploration will tie into such commitments a lot better than just going around and asking the Sect for a suitable place. It would show drive and commitment to her promises as well as connecting deeper into SSC.
So no, I strongly disagree with the claim that Ling Qi exploring is not desirable or not justifiable given the current circumstances. I think it is very much desirable and completely justified even if we discover literally nothing from it.
I disagree quite profoundly. The quest that gave us SSC involved traveling somewhere else and finding what was already there, not making an original composition. Similarly the Mother Moon currently is not paying attention to us and so won't care about us modding HDW. It's also not a terribly mother-y art in the first place, the proposed changes make is arguably less so, and it involves no moon qi.
On the other hand following the moon map is expressly placing our trust in the moon and at least has the possibility of attracting the interest of facets that currently do not notice us. On a religious level a moon priestess struggling with the idea of having a son and looking for a moon quest is likely to find themselves confronting the part of her goddess that is associated with motherhood.
- Location
- Computer Desk
[X] Plan: Whispering on the Wind
Varder
Tired Cultist
- Location
- Hell
The difference between realms grows bigger the higher you go. Difference between green Liling and mortal CRX is utterly insignificant in the face of "White vs Ascended" abyss. There's also the fact that Liling willingly gave her consent while CRX most likely didn't. Shenhua had it much harder.
Exploring using the moon map for a place to build a garden is silly. Nothing about the project of the garden requires any special location. This is missing the point of the project, and Zhengui's goals, completely. An entirely mundane garden achieves what Zhengui wants just fine. In fact, considering he wants a place that the entire family can hang out in and enjoy, some location off in the depths of the wilderness is actively counterproductive because of the difficulty it adds for Qingge and Biyu getting to visit.
Ling Qi's cultivation of Wind Thief was concretely available to her as something she could approach and dedicate time towards. Flouncing about in the woods was a means to the end of cultivating the art that ended up having value on its own thematically. The same relationship does not exist here for exploration, and nothing about the Wind Thief scene opened up any narrative doors or laid hooks for further moon intrigue.
As it stands, there's just no real objective in exploring. It's not clear what Ling Qi would search for, she does not have established habits as exploring for exploration's sake, and nothing in recent narrative presents any motivation towards starting at this moment. Flatly, you're wrong, SSC does not motivate Ling Qi, because it never has. There isn't a single instance of that being true, anywhere in the story. You're fixated on an ought, one I happen to agree with you on, rather than what is.
Yes, Ling Qi's behaviour should match the themes of SSC more, but it doesn't. And because it doesn't, it hasn't, I don't find SSC's existence as a convincing argument for a certain course of action. Yes, we learned MSS in part because it matches the aspirations inherent to SSC. But this hasn't come to anything, and the specific way it didn't was Ling Qi being close-minded and incurious when there was an opportunity for spiritual exploration. Given that, it doesn't make sense to me that she'd suddenly attain an urgent sympathy to repeat the exercise.
The whole thing can sit on a shelf until there's a proper opportunity to start living up to basic character concepts, in my opinion. I'm not in a big rush to disappoint ourselves again.
Can we just actually engage with Zhengui instead of constantly injecting third parties into everything? Actually tapping into Mother Moon juice would just throw everything off track. It wouldn't improve the arc at all.
Liling did no such thing.
We are? It's just that putting our anxieties about motherhood onto his shoulders is really unfair to him while helping people (and especially their faithful) through difficult personal realizations is very much gods' jobs.
What kind of parent says "I love you but I'm worried that being your mother will ruin my life" to their kid?
Inserted tally
Damn, poor Liling. Alexa, play despacito.
- Location
- The Space Between
we don't know Lu metal boy's family situation, and if Lilling was going to express trepdiation, discomfort, or trauma associated with the spirit blooding she has to keep it in the family. But I'm not sure Sun Shao is going to tell the family at large that it was anything but a tribulation outcome anyway. The way he talked about some of the Sun straying from the path . . .
I don't believe he is only a sockpuppet, but because the Goddess is apparently pretty generally "pro bloodshed" the path carved by Sun Shao is probably something that she really appreciated. It would not surprise me if she decided to nudge the warriors towards certain outcomes and "ways" and I mean. "Family Is Everything" is very much a Way that the Sunflower would love to see.
I would actually be inclined to believe that some of the "barbarians" of the old Red Kingdom had found their way into integration with some of the conquerors now that the Goddess is clearly favoring Sun Shao. It would assist the replacement rate of his armies to have barb levies, and they would likely attrition less and be more able to assist in teaching others to attrition less.
Additionally, it was made clear that part of the Red Kingdom's adaptation to the endless war was some very intense surgeries and mendings that allowed typically crippled "casualties" to be re-fielded. There are a lot of quiet ways for Sun Shao to be "resourceful" in the Jungle that ultimately have the end result of him being totally subservient and vassalized to the Goddess. This Marriage is unequal, and even if he were to ascend I would expect him to be the Goddess' plaything to a certain extent. It is clear that "The Butcher" isn't just a euphemism, he literally butchers bodies for parts and useful items and. Well.
To ascend as the Goddess' husband. The Butcher. Resourceful. Romantic. Cruel. Always crafting trophies and corpses into aids for his kin, but also forced to craft aids for the jungle out of his kin. Perpetually tormented, but it's "what's best for his family".
it's the kind of sadistic hell of his own creation that the goddess would thrill over. Even if he dies at White I'm sure the Goddess would love to have him around, tending that garden space as her trophy husband. trying to help his kin survive and watching as they become the new red kingdom raiders, incentivized to raid due to his crafting of aids out of trophies and corpses.
I duno. Whatever happens to Sun Shao, I believe it will all be of his own choices and will likely end up with him in a similar position as his screaming blade of Bai. Just the cutting edge of a tool wielded by the goddess for her own designs. The tool in this case being the Sun bloodline, and the goddess being able to wield them through the arm of Lilling's bloodline
I changed my vote to art mod. It doesn't feel like the right time to go exploring.
Caveat though, I would like to go exploring later. Feel like we haven't made enough use of the map. Also, I think it would do LQ good to do some 'light' exploring for exploring's sake. Not sure where, but I remember Ling Qi mentioning indulging her curiosity (when picking hidden moon?), and I think exploring like that could help that narrative hook move forward.
Caveat though, I would like to go exploring later. Feel like we haven't made enough use of the map. Also, I think it would do LQ good to do some 'light' exploring for exploring's sake. Not sure where, but I remember Ling Qi mentioning indulging her curiosity (when picking hidden moon?), and I think exploring like that could help that narrative hook move forward.
- Location
- Fabulously Rainbow Ireland
We can't go exploring later because there isn't any spare AP to do it in the next few in-universe months, we only got this chance to do it here because we were rolling better than expected on our cultivation this month.
And frankly, if it's not the right time to go exploring now why would waiting a few months change that when the war is only going to get worse?
EDIT: If the argument is that it's not the right time to explore at the moment then it follows that it's also not the right time to mod an Art and that we should instead be voting for the plan that has us do Sect duties related to the war.
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With Art Modding we are doing something that has the potential to be really useful to the sect (with Ling Qi potentially creating a communication art), which matters in a time of war. Meanwhile exploration is just a selfish option. We could have done that while recovering, but now is the time for action, not diddling our thumbs. The war is already going on, the sect is on war footing, we cant be playing around anymore.
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