Certain foes are better than questionable allies.

Most of the gods are simply out of his reach, at least for a direct and frank discussion. He doesn't trust his ability to sway them, either. Alchemist has stated multiple times that he's bad with people and he's shown it, too.

Even as Zeus is a Tyrant god of Law, he's still a god of that aspect. Finding tools he doesn't know about is doable. Finding rules he doesn't know about, well, that's a bit harder to pull off. While most of his siblings/children have no love for Zeus, they do respect him (In the whole Fear is Respect kind of way) but Alchemist, while warped and twisted, is a mortal. He's a passing thought, an idle curiosity.

If he can defeat Zeus? That's amazing! If not? He'll be quickly forgotten by the inhabitants of Mount Olympus, like many of the others who've tried and failed at the same task.

It is unwise to pin your hopes on a mayfly. The poor thing might die of old age by the time you blink.
 
Watched and waited to see if he did anything interesting

Look, what she did was the equivalent of "Keep killing people until one doesn't die." that we saw in certain movie and as the goal of more that one villain. And yes I saw villain because even if it works, is just too dumb and wasteful to have any "super" about it.

That is not an experiment, that's being a monster. It is the brute force approach Entities in Worm use and those are both super computers and dumb as fuck.

If you put a soul in a body that's almost dead AFTER removing any ability that soul had that could be used to survive, then they will just die unless some variable you didn't take into account happens.

That's NOT proper science, that's trying random shit until something works by complete accident.

You are making the Chousen as dumb fucks that do the computer equivalent of "Try every possible variable to find the right password" and that's NOT research.

If the Chousen were really like that, then Ryoko would only exist due to sheer dumb luck and the copses of the failed attempts would need more that a galaxy worth of storage.
 
...I literally did that with a gameshark and a copy of Dragon Quest 7.
I'd missed an item in a locked area and there aren't any guides that actually list out which items correspond to their ID's in hex.

So I kept inputting new information in sequence, wrote it down and then reset my game to do a few more. I wish I still had the notebook I was using at the time, that game has something like a few hundred items and I worked through the list, I think, twelve entries at a time.

Al got lucky. He retained the spells he'd mastered. If not? How many variations of a 'Drop in' do you think he could have gone through before he was run as ragged as the magnetic strip in a security camera's video cassette?
 
"Anti-law" sounds a bit silly when he could've just focused on say, chaos and disorder instead, right?



Get enough chaos and disorder going on in one space, it will become ordered all on its own. Just look at the chaotic formations of solar systems, or other examples where what appears to be chaos has a hidden pattern or order to it.

Chaos begets Order and Order begets Chaos, the two are intricately linked.

Furthermore, that's not taking into account the lords of Chaos and Doctor Fate into the equation, Al already has his hands full with Zeus at the moment to deal with Chaos elementals, and the potential angering of an Order spirit for daring to use Chaos.
 
@Mister Ficser have you played or seen Tyranny?

The conceit is some mage ruler figured out how to create a scroll of divine law, and everything comes down to rules-lawyering on how and when* they are triggered/announced by a chosen herald as a proclamation. One of the things is that ruler arranges for the herald to be killed off, since these scrolls/proclamations are a learnable skill from exposure of being the triggering caster.

It is a plot point that overlapping (or conflicting) proclamations are Really Bad(tm) thing for geopolitical welfare.

*The player character is given a proclamation ("everyone in area X, surrender or die") which has an enforcement by a given day/month (without a YEAR). The player can explicitly sleep till past this time, and trigger the proclamation and go from having ~2 days to having ~363 days to work the problem of convincing everyone to surrender. This was reported as a bug, but it was declared a feature instead.
 
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One of the main things I dislike about the Instant Quest system is how, apart from the two Final Fantasy worlds and Skyrim, the quest objectives have all just been 'defeat the big boss' (and then FF7 ended up being that anyway). It's just such a thoroughly disappointing lack of variety and creativity. Where is the quest to nail Kratos in the face with a pie, or to swap Hawkeye's quiver with Green Arrow's?
 
One of the main things I dislike about the Instant Quest system is how, apart from the two Final Fantasy worlds and Skyrim, the quest objectives have all just been 'defeat the big boss' (and then FF7 ended up being that anyway). It's just such a thoroughly disappointing lack of variety and creativity. Where is the quest to nail Kratos in the face with a pie, or to swap Hawkeye's quiver with Green Arrow's?
Probably in the post beta release. It makes sense for the system to be simplified while Alec is testing it.

I think my largest criticism of the way the main fic developed is Player One getting a traditional gaming system. It somewhat trivialized the fact that Alec's version didn't have perks by opening up its own store and instant dungeon whenever he felt like. Obviously it's far too late for this but Gaia empowering her in some other manner probably would have improved the narrative significantly.
 
Yeah, a large detraction to the story is how Alec's access to the Store and Quests combined with his perks and equipment boosts have trivialized any conflict. Especially recently. It's not like we needed to see Alec grind out his levels... but going from 'middling' to 'super level cap' kind of rendered any struggles for mastery meaningless.
 
I am surprised he does not encounter another Zeus, using a Reverse Mirror version.

Would something like that work?
 
@Mister Ficser have you played or seen Tyranny?

The conceit is some mage ruler figured out how to create a scroll of divine law, and everything comes down to rules-lawyering on how and when* they are triggered/announced by a chosen herald as a proclamation. One of the things is that ruler arranges for the herald to be killed off, since these scrolls/proclamations are a learnable skill from exposure of being the triggering caster.

It is a plot point that overlapping (or conflicting) proclamations are Really Bad(tm) thing for geopolitical welfare.

*The player character is given a proclamation ("everyone in area X, surrender or die") which has an enforcement by a given day/month (without a YEAR). The player can explicitly sleep till past this time, and trigger the proclamation and go from having ~2 days to having ~363 days to work the problem of convincing everyone to surrender. This was reported as a bug, but it was declared a feature instead.

I have! I especially enjoyed the magic system in-game. The artifacts growing greater with use and exposure was also a cool mechanic. That your skills grow by use, barring skill trainers, was a nice touch but I felt that the perk system was fairly limited and didn't really show off the mastery you were implied to develop.

Turning the Archon of Law to your side and against the overlord that they'd previously served by use of basic logic really had me laughing during the scene.

It's been a few years since I've played it and I never did finish the DLC. I think I ended up missing a key item and getting stuck midway in.

Yeah, a large detraction to the story is how Alec's access to the Store and Quests combined with his perks and equipment boosts have trivialized any conflict. Especially recently. It's not like we needed to see Alec grind out his levels... but going from 'middling' to 'super level cap' kind of rendered any struggles for mastery meaningless.

Yep. Power, power, power. It offers a lot of options but it's not a real band-aid.

Infinite growth? Interesting idea. The actual execution creates a character that lacks the narrative ability to struggle in certain situations.

Al isn't into One Punch Man levels of that but we are reaching the point that any power ups just seem additive rather than significant.

I am surprised he does not encounter another Zeus, using a Reverse Mirror version.

Would something like that work?

There are a few versions out there. SMT has a couple different Zeus(es?) to be met. Hades will have its own.

I saw one conversation during the choosing of boons that Alchemist needs to comment on, drawing the ire of one god in particular when he agrees with them... In a way they really wouldn't like.

Probably in the post beta release. It makes sense for the system to be simplified while Alec is testing it.

I think my largest criticism of the way the main fic developed is Player One getting a traditional gaming system. It somewhat trivialized the fact that Alec's version didn't have perks by opening up its own store and instant dungeon whenever he felt like. Obviously it's far too late for this but Gaia empowering her in some other manner probably would have improved the narrative significantly.

Those would be hilarious! There really should be more Quests like that in the shop.

Alchemist has typically been pretty desperate until recently and he's been picking options which offer high risk but high reward. Unfortunately, he never really considered the fact that post-game protagonists probably need all of the therapy.

Player One was meant to be a narrative foil while also being a connection to Leslie, forcing Alchemist to remember that he's just borrowing the body and to not get too comfortable. If Player One had been saddled with the typical abilities of a Druid, I think that might have also been a good method of accomplishing the same thing without making her into a direct gamer.

She has, however, been useful in showing the Justice League and kids that Alchemist's power isn't the (Direct) reason that he seems to be unhinged.
 
a copy of Dragon Quest 7.

And the better option would have been using an older save file and just get the Item without cheating.

Cheats can completely destroy a game, more so if you have no clue what you are doing.

The Chousen are scientists so they have to act like it, not like Worm Entities.

By your logic, there is billions of versions of Tenchi that were put into deadly situations in hope of awakening his God like powers and only the version that had quite a normal life for most of his life and ended freeing Ryuko succeeded.

They have Empirical evidence that the best way to make someone a God is to give them a mostly normal life with Harem shenanigans and super powered women and yet they act like some idiot throwing rocks at a wall in hopes one suddenly becomes a God.

Are you sure Alchemist wasn't picked by Aqua instead? Because that does seem more like her kind of thing instead of the Chousen.

Like Aqua bought a super computer on sale and put it to run many simulations and the AIs in the computer believe they are the Chousen but they are actually dumb like AI that act like Worm Entities?

Because yes that's how out of character this whole thing is.
 
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And the better option would have been using an older save file and just get the Item without cheating.
Telling someone the way they played a single player game is wrong is never really looked on well. Cheating in multiplayer games can destroy any and all balance it's supposed to have. Cheating in a single player game where it has no impact on anyone but the person playing it is fine.
 
It is the brute force approach Entities in Worm use and those are both super computers and dumb as fuck.

Literally all super computers are dumb as fuck - I work with/on them as my day job. I never understood why people think saying someone is like a super computer is a compliment. Frankly, the worm Entities are getting a lot of mileage out of those supercomputer brains, and are probably overheating them near their failure points as it is.

They have Empirical evidence that the best way to make someone a God is to give them a mostly normal life with Harem shenanigans and super powered women and yet they act like some idiot throwing rocks at a wall in hopes one suddenly becomes a God.
But... that's not what made him ascend... stress did. Very specific stress that was only stress because he had developed attachments, but it wasn't the comfy life that caused that, if all they did was comfy life, he'd have continued with the status quo. He ascended because the universe was getting ripped apart by the other Jurian who also ascended - and she ascended because of RAGE - specifically at the Chousin for all of the crap they were doing. And she never had the comfy life Tenchi had, so they have empirical evidence that comfy life isn't needed for making someone a god - just for making someone a god that maybe won't try to do a murder on you as soon as they ascend.
 
Cheating in a single player game where it has no impact on anyone but the person playing it is fine

You can literally destroy a game and make it unplayable forever as people messing around with Gameshark on Gameboy, Gameboy Color and GBA games found out the hard way. The Playstation 1 and 2 was safer as the cheats only affected the memory card and even in the worst case you just lost all the data in the memory card and had to format it.

So no, playing wack a mole with random generared cheat codes is not harmeless.

Nowadays with more and more games being digital only, hope you have a backup because you can totally destroy a game by playing "Using random cheat codes to see what happens."

And that's not taking into account all the nasty stuff that can happen if someone downloads the wrong thing thinking it will help them to cheat at a game only to end in tears.

So no, you really have to be careful with stuff like this.

You may not think downloading a cheating program for a videogame can end with your computer being unusable or even damaged but that's the reality we live in.

But... that's not what made him ascend... stress did.

But the attachments made it so he didn't you know nuke the universe, something shit like they pulled in Alchemist is likely to end with as seen with prior sample data. Heck Aqua method is the main reason there is so many Demon Lords in that stupid Plane/World.

Again, why are the Chousen acting like Aqua?
 
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Again, why are the Chousen acting like Aqua?
Because they clearly haven't reached the end of the Tenchi timeline where they learned that "doing this is a bad idea" and retired from their stupid plan of "kick the universe until God falls out of it".

Also, the Chousen's involvement here seems to be limited to yoinking Al into the body of a dying Deku - ie: "This universe is already totally ^@$%'d due to protagonist loss, I wonder if there's a loose protagonist we can truck-kun into it to patch it up? What's available ... aha! YOINK!" Poorly thought out, but not quite on the same level as the crap they're pulling in Tenchi and Photon, and in the far past of War on Geminar (which Tenchi's little brother had to go clean up).
 
Because they clearly haven't reached the end of the Tenchi timeline where they learned that "doing this is a bad idea" and retired from their stupid plan of "kick the universe until God falls out of it".

I really want someone to literally throw a book a them, specifically "The scientific method for dummies".
 
I really want someone to literally throw a book a them, specifically "The scientific method for dummies".
Ah, I don't think they'd read it. I mean, of the three of them:
1) Tsunami is basically what you'd get if you gave "ultimate cosmic power expressed through trees" to the Voice Actress for Azula from Avatar the Last Airbender (she's a crazy person with an incest fetish)
2) Tokimi is that kid on the playground who discovered that you can make ants pop with a magnifying glass, so now she's chasing the other kids around with one threatening to pop them, and
3) Washu, the supposedly smart one, deliberately gave herself total amnesia, and left the multiverse in the hands of her two sisters - whom she had met and knew about points 1 and 2...
We are not dealing with people who can out-smart Aqua here. Frankly, they belong in her adventuring party.
 

Washu did that to have a clean start and it worked quite well, even way better that she expected. Is as if all they needed to find the supreme being was to stop throwing shit at the wall and give Tenchi a Harem and some stress.

One reason change is harder the older you get is the tendency to fall back into old habits, Washu wiped out her past memories specifically to avoid that.

And since she made a DemiGoddess and found the supreme being, you can't argue with the results.
 
Washu did that to have a clean start and it worked quite well, even way better that she expected. Is as if all they needed to find the supreme being was to stop throwing shit at the wall and give Tenchi a Harem and some stress.

But that happened despite her plans, not because of them. Her plan was "Let my two obviously mentally handicapped sisters run things while I faff off and re-learn everything from scratch, then get sealed away for a thousand years or so by my own student". That was her whole plan. It accomplished nothing. Tenchi got his harem because of Tsunami's incest fetish. Then he got stress because of Tokimi chasing people with her magnifying glass and popping them. Washu didn't even get all of her memories back until Tenchi's grandmother went all apocalypse and tried to do a murder on the Chousin. Grandma literally reached into the projector and tore up the film strip their universe was playing on due to the plan that Washu was totally okay with. Finding Tenchi was literally the result of random luck after millennia of throwing shit at the wall and watching it not stick. Or in Washu's case, not even knowing it was being thrown, because she'd amnesia'd herself and then gotten locked up in suspended animation while the whole thing was going on due to her difficulty with understanding how to people.

And since she made a DemiGoddess and found the supreme being, you can't argue with the results.

It was two supreme beings, and she wasn't the one who did that, it was her crazy sisters, and they only survived success by accident. Tenchi didn't overpower his grandmother, he talked her into calming down, and it worked because of Tsunami's incest fetish being inflicted on all of her pet Jurains. The demi-goddess was an accident as well, and Ryouko is constantly mad at her mom about that.

Also, isn't arguing with their results the whole reason you're complaining that they're acting like Aqua? They have pretty much always acted like her.
 
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