For example:
Striving for the future = Planning ahead to ensure that the future turns out favourably for you.
Thinking in the present = Make wise decision now because you can't change the past.
Seizing both your own future and whatever you want = Taking action to secure your own future and not being at the mercy of the whims of others.
So in other words, this promotes forward thinking at its core......
Why is it emulating Christianity, and it's habit of going the complete opposite of what it preaches?
The head priests have a nasty habit of crusading every opportunity, even when not really practical.
The vote is still open for now, but I'm planning to close it later. Vote Tally : Chronicles of Nations Redux - Civ Quest Original | Page 47 | Sufficient Velocity [Posts: 1170-1226] ##### NetTally 2.2.0
So in other words, this promotes forward thinking at its core......
Why is it emulating Christianity, and it's habit of going the complete opposite of what it preaches?
The head priests have a nasty habit of crusading every opportunity, even when not really practical.
The thing is with Zarannism, both that version and the current mainstream are equally valid ways of interpreting the tenets of Zaranna. It isn't at all comparable to Christianity and Christians going against the bible and teachings of Jesus because Zarannism allows for being both kind and cruel and has the potential to both be a good thing and a bad thing.
The non-mainstream one has no presence outside of a few individuals who subscribe to it. I only brought it up as an example of a non-bad version of Zarannism not because it is has a meaningful presence.
The non-mainstream one has no presence outside of a few individuals who subscribe to it. I only brought it up as an example of a non-bad version of Zarannism not because it is has a meaningful presence.
Any text can be interpreted in varying ways. The only ways that matter are those that are actively followed. The theoretical existence of a hypothetical Zarranist heresy doesn't really change anything about the reality of Zarranism.
It's the difference between the Zarranist tenets as a text, and the Zarranist tenets as the cultural concept. As the cultural concept, the tenet clearly is "backstab as soon as you can", even if the written words can be interpreted differently.
Any text can be interpreted in varying ways. The only ways that matter are those that are actively followed. The theoretical existence of a hypothetical Zarranist heresy doesn't really change anything about the reality of Zarranism.
It's the difference between the Zarranist tenets as a text, and the Zarranist tenets as the cultural concept. As the cultural concept, the tenet clearly is "backstab as soon as you can", even if the written words can be interpreted differently.
The relevancy is that the religious tenets aren't directly responsible for the bad things done by the mainstream Zarannists. While the current mainstream interpretation is a real piece of work, it is possible to reform the religion into something better because the problem isn't the foundation, but what has been built upon that foundation.
The relevancy is that the religious tenets aren't directly responsible for the bad things done by the mainstream Zarannists. While the current mainstream interpretation is a real piece of work, it is possible to reform the religion into something better because the problem isn't the foundation, but what has been built upon that foundation.
I don't see the book as the foundation. The book is merely a prop, an element of the religion. The religion (the core and hte foundation) are what people believe.
When convenient, the prop gets changed. You see that with the Catholic Church deciding which books were relevant, or the Mormons deciding to believe in an entirely different book, and so on.
I don't see the book as the foundation. The book is merely a prop, an element of the religion. The religion (the core and hte foundation) are what people believe.
When convenient, the prop gets changed. You see that with the Catholic Church deciding which books were relevant, or the Mormons deciding to believe in an entirely different book, and so on.
To be clear regarding the tenets, they are not a book, they are direct commandments from Zaranna herself. To change them, you would have to change Zaranna herself so she would change them. It isn't a prop or an element, but the foundation of the religion and what you need to follow if you are to call yourself a Zarannist. There are differing interpretations of what the tenets mean, but every devout Zarannist knows them and follows them in their chosen way.
To be clear regarding the tenets, they are not a book, they are direct commandments from Zaranna herself. To change them, you would have to change Zaranna herself so she would change them. It isn't a prop or an element, but the foundation of the religion and what you need to follow if you are to call yourself a Zarannist. There are differing interpretations of what the tenets mean, but every devout Zarannist knows them and follows them in their chosen way.
If they are so foundational, isn't using the 2 different interpretation (which end up nearly directly opposed), already changing them? It's not that different from keeping the same words, but changing the language so that the meaning becomes something else.
If they are so foundational, isn't using the 2 different interpretation (which end up nearly directly opposed), already changing them? It's not that different from keeping the same words, but changing the language.
That is pretty much the case. When I say that the tenets are foundation, it means that the tenets are going to stick around in their exact wording. The wording will continue to remain the same even if just what those words means differs.
For example, unless there is a major change to Zaranna, the Zarannist will always try to be Striving for the future, Thinking in the present and Seizing both your own future and whatever you want. Just what those things mean can and will change over time. You can change what it means to be thinking in the present or striving for the future, but you won't convince them to stop doing those things even if you change what they think those things are.
For example, unless there is a major change to Zaranna, the Zarannist will always try to be Striving for the future, Thinking in the present and Seizing both your own future and whatever you want. Just what those things mean can and will change over time. You can change what it means to be thinking in the present or striving for the future, but you won't convince them to stop doing those things even if you change what they think those things are.
I'm fairly certain that Zarannism is far too decentralized at the moment to have any sort of organized priesthood, not even to mention a High Priest.
These rebellions are currently happening because:
1) a Chosen of Zaranna told people to rise up and reclaim the Lowlands in her name (or something close to it)
2) Zarannists are prone to rebellion and trying to change their place on the totem pole if they think they can get away with it (and they usually do, even when they really can't)
There is no High Priest to contest, it's just that the current interpretation of Zaranna is very, very convenient for Lowlander Warlords to gain power and treat everyone else like shit.
Even as there was fighting aboard, life went on for the Arthwyd at home. On the North Coast, the Merntir continued focus on the bounty that Sunrise Mountain had to offer. Many expeditions scoured the mountains and hills for sites of interest while the tin and lead mines were developed into something that would produce plenty of metal for the Arthwyd to make use of. Yet the most exciting news from the north was a discovery of a new copper deposit in the hills, allowing for another copper mine to be built.
In the south, Caermyr was spared from the fighting that had engulfed all of its neighbours. Neither the Zaradysh or the Zarannist rebels made a move on the trading outpost, but the Arthwydish down there remained wary nonetheless. As expected, shrines were put it up to ensure that everyone could have access to them and more stone walls were put up around the lesser villages in the region. More villages than not were still undefended, but that was a problem for another day.
Back in the heartland of the Arthwyd, the Arthwydish focused on a mixture of spiritual and martial matters. Even as the Catclaws and Cateyes were summoned by the Cadlon and organised into warbands, work continued on the temple and the second sacred forest.
Both projects went swimmingly with another sacred forest outside of Greenbay being finished while the temple was completed generations after work on it had begun. A lot of that work was figuring out what would be needed, designing the temple and then the logistics of getting everything in place, but the physical construction still took plenty of time and effort.
The temple is itself is in Greenbay of course and it is positioned on a hill overlooking the cove that the city covers. The main hall is round and made of stone with statues of Arthryn and her Daughters forming the centre piece of the temple. The back rooms are a mixture of places to store holy items and places for the resident priests and priestesses to work.
Megaproject Complete!
Arthrynite Temple A large stone building that resides on a hill overlooking Greenbay, the Arthrynite Temple is the first temple in the known world. With a centre piece built around stone statues of Arthryn and her Daughters, this temple is one of the holiest places in the world.
Effects: Increased Stability Gains from Venerating the Goddesses, +1 Temp Mysticism at the start of each turn,
[] [Mega] The work on the Temple reveals a talented individual. (Gain a Hero)
[] [Mega] The work on the Temple results in a new religious discovery being made. (Gain one religious-based Innovation)
[] [Mega] The work on the Temple results in new discoveries being made. (Gain two Innovations)
[] [Mega] The new Temple enables the priesthood to strengthen their influence. (Priests gain +1 Faction Power)
[] [Mega] The completion of the Temple inspires the Arthwyd to take it a step further and make an even greater temple. (Unlock Grand Temple megaproject)
[] [Mega] In response to the completion of the Temple, one of the goddesses gives their Blessing to the Arthwyd. (Gain a new Divine Blessing)
[] [Mega] In response to the completion of the Temple, one of the goddesses improves their Blessing to the Arthwyd. (Upgrade one of your existing Divine Blessings)
Yet even as religious matters were tended at home, there was war and stifle aboard. Over the last couple of generations, countless individuals, groups and families have fled the turmoil of their lands and made the journey to the Arthwyd. Seeking safety and shelter from the war and death threatening their old homes, these refugees came from all over. While many came from the Cernn, others started their journey in the Tordysh or the Lorvysh or the Raradysh or just one of the insignificant minor tribes of the lowlands.
While the Arthwyd weren't heartless enough to turn all of them away, there was the question of just how many they were willingly to accept into their lands. Bringing so many foreigners would run the risk of problems, of which the chances would only rise with the more refugees allowed into Arthwydish land. In the highest numbers, it would even divert the attentions of priests and priestesses as they had to deal with a massive influx of outsiders.
[] [Haven] Accept some of the Cernn refugees. (Small chance of stability loss, +1 Temp Econ next Mid Turn)
[] [Haven] Accept some of the lowlander refugees. (Small chance of stability loss, +1 Temp Econ next Mid Turn)
[] [Haven] Accept a mixture of Cernn and lowlander refugees. (Large chance of stability loss, +2 Temp Econ next Mid Turn)
[] [Haven] Accept all of the Cernn refugees. (Large chance of stability loss, +2 Temp Econ next Mid Turn)
[] [Haven] Accept all of the lowlander refugees. (-1 Stability, -1 Temp Mystic +3 Temp Econ next Mid Turn)
[] [Haven] Accept all of the lowlander refugees and send some to the Merntir. (Large chance of stability loss, -1 Temp Diplo, +2 Temp Econ next Mid Turn)
[] [Haven] Accept every last refugee. (-1 Stability, Large chance of stability loss, -2 Temp Mystic, +5 Temp Econ next Mid Turn)
[] [Haven] Accept every last refugee and send some to the Merntir. (-1 Stability, -1 Temp Diplo, -1 Temp Mystic, +3 Temp Econ next Mid Turn)
As the Zarannist uprisings continued to rage across the lowlands, the Arthwyd went to war. Catclaws and Cateyes were sent both to aid the Maradysh against their rebels and against the Zaradysh, who were responsible for the uprisings. The former went as well as could be expected with the holy warriors of the Arthwyd smashing apart the battered and bloodied militias of the rebels. While the Maradysh rebels had held their own against the offences of the loyalists, they soon fell to the Arthwydish warbands.
The fight against the Zaradysh did not go so well. Zandis Maereach was personally leading the Zaradysh warriors against the Arthwydish expeditions and the woman had become feared across the lowlands for a reason. Maereach battled the Arthwydish warbands in a mixture of defensive battles and offensive ones, fighting across both Zaradysh territory, Maradysh territory and unclaimed land in a series of small wars across the seasons. A clever general and fearsome fighter, Maereach was always one step ahead of her foes and while she took heavy losses in the process, the Zandis did claim the lives of many Catclaws and Cateyes.
Ultimately, the end result was a nominal victory for the Zaradysh as despite what it had cost her, Maereach did keep the Catclaws and Cateyes from establishing a foothold in Zaradysh lands.
Other news from aboard regarding the Zarannist uprisings was mixed. The Tordysh had completely fallen to their rebels with the coalition of chiefs losing power as quickly as they had gained it. Now the leaders of the uprising had taken their place and had pledged service to Zandis Maereach as the Champion of Zaranna. How much of a problem they could pose was up for debate given that the Tordysh had been a state of civil war since Torhall's death, but it could not be denied that the Tordysh were now firmly in the camp of Maereach and the Zarradysh.
The Lorvysh had fared better to a degree. Lorvir's death was a great boon to rebels, but the loyalists still had a couple hundred Boarfolk on their side and that was no small thing. The uprising was a hard-fought campaign and the fires of rebellion had not been entirely extinguished, but Lorvir's grandson had emerged victorious even if his position was not entirely secured.
Of the Zarannist uprisings, the Raradysh had done best outside of the Maradysh. Zandis Aslynn had claimed her position with no small amount of fighting and the warlord had smashed the rebellion in her western territory before falling in battle. From there, Mairyn had taken over as the leader of the Raradysh from her mother and she had acquitted herself well.
The priestess had taken to the art of war like a fish takes to water or a bird takes to the sky. She had learnt the ropes under her mother's command and earnt respect from her mother's warriors. Mairyn had proven herself to be a capable general as her mother and had taken apart the remaining rebels in the east. A priestess with clear divine blessings alongside being a bloodied warrior who had proven herself in a successful campaign, Mairyn's position was secured as the new Zandis of the Raradysh.
At least it was until she declared herself the Cadlon of Raradysh. That had turned caused some upset, but not as much as it could have given her loyal army and the friendly relations between the Arthwyd and the Raradysh. It helped that it was well known that Mairyn had learnt the ways of the Arthwyd and was a devout Arthrynite. Yet while it did not provoke outright rebellion, declaring herself a Cadlon rather than Zandis earnt Mairyn few friends from the lesser leaders of the Raradysh.
This turn of events had great potential for the Arthwyd. Cadlon Mairyn was cultural Arthwydish despite her lowlander origins and it would be a trivial matter to bring the Raradysh into the Arthwyd Empire provided the Arthwyd did not mind potential putting down a rebellion in the Raradysh. A more moderate approach would be to give some extra resources to Mairyn to help prop her up and secure her reign.
[] [Rara] Bring the Raradysh into the fold. (Raradysh becomes a Vassal of the Arthwyd, -1 Temp Diplo, -2 Temp Econ, -1 Temp Martial, -1 Temp Mystic, ???)
[] [Rara] Send some resources and materials to help Cadlon Mairyn. (+1 Temp Diplo, -2 Temp Econ, ???)
[] [Rara] Send some priests and priestesses to help Cadlon Mairyn. (+1 Temp Diplo, -1 Temp Mystic, ???)
[] [Rara] Send both resources and members of priesthood to help Cadlon Mairyn. (+1 Temp Diplo, -2 Temp Econ, -1 Temp Mystic, ???)
[] [Rara] Do nothing.
Unfortunately, Mairyn's ascension and the submission of the Tordysh were not the only pieces of diplomacy going on in the lowlands. In unexpectedly cunning move, Zandis Maereach of the Zaradysh offered to marry her daughters and sons to the sons and daughters of the Farkas of the Forluc. To the surprise of the Arthwyd, the Forlucan Farkas decided to accept even if meant breaking off a few prior engagements amongst his children.
While it was a surprise that the Forluc were willingly to intertwine their royal line with foreign bloodline, it quickly became apparent why the Forluc were willing to align themselves with the Zaradysh. Put simply, the Arthwyd had the Forluc worried, especially with their expanding presence in the lowlands. While it was an accepted fact that the Forluc were the strongest and greatest power in the lowlands, which was the entire world as far as lowlanders were concerned, the Arthwyd were beginning to make some doubt that.
Between Mairyn declaring herself Cadlon, the Maradysh settling the lowlands and Caermyr's existence, the Arthwyd were rapidly increasing their presence and influence in the lowlands and it was becoming clear that they were a rival to the Forluc's claim of being the greatest. To no longer be the uncontested best in the world was an unacceptable to the Forluc Empire and when the Forlucan envoys delivered their messages to the Arthwyd, the Forluc's play was revealed.
Their Farkas hoped to use the Zaradysh as a buffer against the Arthwyd, to hinder the Arthwdydish expansion into the lowlands whilst propping up their own prestige. Meanwhile Zandis Maereach was hoping to use the Forluc to keep the Arthwyd at bay while she secured her own position.
As the latest clash between the Arthwyd and Zaradysh came to a close, Forluc had delivered both a proposal and an ultimatum to the Arthwyd. The proposal was a splitting up of the lowlands. The Arthwyd got the Raradysh, the Forluc got the Lorvysh and the Zaradysh got the Tordysh with each other respect those claims. It was pretty much the current status quo as the Tordysh had already submitted to the Zaradysh while the Raradysh were close to the Arthwyd. The only real change was that the Forluc would be conquering the Lorvysh.
While the Arthwyd could easily ignore the proposal, the ultimatum was a more serious matter. The ultimatum was simple as the Arthwyd Empire had to stop their attacks on the Zaradysh or they would find themselves at war with the Forluc Empire.
[] [Diplo] Accept the proposal.
[] [Diplo] Ignore the proposal but cease the war with the Zaradysh.
[] [Diplo] Reject the proposal and continue the war with the Zaradysh.
Priests (5) = Mood: Pleased, Ability: Add half of faction power to Mystic, Objective: Plant one more Sacred Forest in 2 Turns, Success/Failure: Free Nature Innovation/-1 Temp Econ
Elders (2) = Mood: Happy, Ability: Add half of their faction power to another faction, Objective: Conquer the Zaradysh in 2 Turns, Success/Failure: Free Trade Expedition/-1 Temp Econ
Warriors (5 (6)) = Mood: Mixed, Ability: Add half of faction power to Martial, Objective: Increase Martial by 2 in 4 Turns, Success/Failure: +1 Stability/-1 Temp Econ
Farmers (1) = Mood: Happy, Ability: Add half of faction power to Econ, Objective: More Farming, Success/Failure: +1 Temp Econ/-
Crafters (1) = Mood: Happy, Ability: Add half of faction power to Culture, Objective: Study Metal, Success/Failure: +1 Temp Econ/-
***
Okay, plenty of stuff this update. The Zarannist uprisings are pretty much over at this point, having either failed or succeeded with the latter only happening with the Tordysh. The Zaradysh have been able to fend off your attacks thanks to Maereach with both sides taking heavy losses.
Temple is complete with megaproject bonuses and in regards to your province policy, I have decided to save giving you a chance to switch policies until you chosen whether or not to get the new megaproject.
Diplomacy wise, the Tordysh are now a vassal of the Zaradysh, the Raradysh are aligned with you, but only because their head of state is culturally Arthwydish and the Forluc and Zaradysh have formed alliance over their mutual desire to keep the Arthwyd in check. The latter is the most important as if you continue the war with the Zaradysh, you will be at war with the Forluc, Fornn, Forden and the Caradysh as well as the Zaradysh and Tordysh.
Please point out any spelling or grammar mistakes that you spot. Please quote them in the thread and explain what you think is wrong so I know what you are referring to. Feel to ask questions for more details and information.
The Arthwyd Early Ancient Theocratic Elective Monarchy UpperCentralisationLimit: 8 Lower CentralisationLimit: -2 Admin Strain Free Provinces: 4 Penalty Accumulation: Additional +2 Lower Centralisation required per 1 Province Player Actions: 2 Secondary Actions +1 Secondary Action per 2 Provinces Province Actions: 1 Secondary Action per 2 Provinces Passive Policies: 1 +1 per 2 Provinces. Subordinates: 1 Special: -1 Temp Econ Damage per a Province Special: Free Subordinate Slot for Subordinates that share the same religion per a point of Legitimacy. Special: Monarchs are more likely to be competent.
Early Ancient Palace Economy Temp Econ Damage: Event, -1 per 1 Centralisation. Wealth Generation: 1 per Dominant. Passive Policies: 1 +1 per 2 Provinces. Additional Actions: None Special: Negative Centralisation or lower than Minimum Centralisation will lead to collapse. Special: Increased polity size will raise the level of Minimum Centralisation required.
Statuses Growing Overpopulation Crisis (Minor): The Arthwyd have far too many people and the sheer size of their population is straining their ability to feed and house all of them. Lose 1 Temp Econ plus cumulative additional Temp Econ for each Main Turn and Mid Turn that the crisis has been ongoing for. Solved by ??? Population Explosion: +2 Temp Econ every Main Turn or Mid Turn.
Subordinates Type/Loyalty/Dependence
Caermyr = Religious Trade Post/Very High/Very Low
Maradysh = Vassal/Very High/Very Low
Merntir = Religious Vassal/Very High/Very Low
Values & Legacies Agricultural Innovators: +1 Temp Econ to Farming actions. Ancient Centre of Civilisation (Great Bay): Extra Innovation Roll at the start of each turn, Chosen of Arthryn: Gain +1 to all Innovation Rolls. Copper Blooded: +1 Temp Econ to Econ Generation Actions, Rush Builders: Extended Projects take less actions, but each action is more expensive.
Born Equal While the choices of a person and the world around them can make a person greater or lesser, everyone is born equal to each other.
Pros: Decreased social stratification,
Cons: Decreased social stratification,
Caretakers of Nature The Arthwyd are the guardians of their land and that means looking after the place that they call home. They will safeguard and preserve their lands lest they fail in their duty.
Pros: Bonus to land management projects,
Cons: Additional consequences for harming the land,
Charitable Haven The lands of the Arthwyd are prosperous and peaceful. Free from war, slavery and other forms of suffering, many seek sanctuary in Arthwyd lands in times of turmoil and the Arthwyd are more than happy to grant it.
Pros: Increased Idea Spread, Increased Refugee Arrivals, Gain a Value from current or historical neighbour,
Cons: Reduced Social Cohesion, Many think you weak,
Communal Mandate As per the words of the goddess, loyalty and kindness to one's people is of the highest importance and even when times are tough or when it is not personally beneficial, one should stick by their community.
Pros: Reduced Internal Discontent, Increased Resistance to Foreign Intrigue,
Cons: Increase stability loss from taking actions which harm the People,
Marital Prowess (Linked to Charitable Haven) Your people are renowned for common pregnancies and the resulting large families. Men are encouraged to get women pregnant while women are encouraged to produce plenty of offspring.
Pros: Increased Population Growth, Value familial unit more,
Cons: More mouths to feed,
Sacred Defence The People do not abandon their own for it is their sacred duty to protect each other. They stand by their neighbours and community through thick and thin and do not yield when it comes to protecting their fellows for that is their duty as commanded by the goddesses.
Pros: Increased Unity during times of crisis, Sacred Warriors, Increased loyalty from religious subordinates,
Cons: Legitimacy loss when abandoning members of the People to harm and danger, increased Legitimacy loss when the threat is from those with conflicting beliefs,
Completed Megaprojects
Arthrynite Temple A large stone building that resides on a hill overlooking Greenbay, the Arthrynite Temple is the first temple in the known world. With a centre piece built around stone statues of Arthryn and her Daughters, this temple is one of the holiest places in the world.
Effects: Increased Stability Gains from Venerating the Goddesses, +1 Temp Mysticism at the start of each turn,
The Census (Neolithic) A grand administrative project to give the Cadlon information about the population such as how many people there are, where they are and what they need to get by in life.
Effects: +2 Temp Stats each Main Turn, -1 Temp Econ Damage,
The Evalynite Walls The Evalynite Walls are the first stone walls in the known world and are devoted to Evalyn, the Arthrynite Goddess of Battle. They stand guard around the ancient capital of the Arthwyd and the religious centre of the Arthrynite religion.
Effects: Bonus to defending walled settlements, Bonus to defending Greenbay,
Grand Sacred Forest A grand forest planted throughout the settlement of Greenbay, this forest is the supposed to be the opposite of the Cursed Forest and is sacred to Arthryn and her Daughters.
Effects: +1 Temp Mystic from Venerate the Goddesses, Bonus to Study Nature,
Extended Sunrise Mountain Passage A grand pathway though the Sunrise Mountains, this passage was carved out over generations with hard work and divine aid. Now it stands completing, forging a safe route overland between the Arthwyd in the south and the Merntir in the north.
Effects: +1 Temp Mysticism whenever a travel-based infrastructure project is completed,
Technologies
Carts
Straw/Reed Rope
Wheel
Wicker
Agriculture
Basic Fertiliser (Primitive Compost & Manure)
Basic Irrigation
Primitive Concept of Growth Energy
Two-Field Crop Rotation
[X] [Mega] The completion of the Temple inspires the Arthwyd to take it a step further and make an even greater temple. (Unlock Grand Temple megaproject)
[X] [Haven] Accept some of the Cernn refugees. (Small chance of stability loss, +1 Temp Econ next Mid Turn)
[X] [Haven] Accept some of the lowlander refugees. (Small chance of stability loss, +1 Temp Econ next Mid Turn)
[X] [Rara] Bring the Raradysh into the fold. (Raradysh becomes a Vassal of the Arthwyd, -1 Temp Diplo, -2 Temp Econ, -1 Martial, -1 Mystic, ???)
[X] [Diplo] Accept the proposal.
@Oshha temples would go here now. Also, can we send some of the refugees to the Merntir? Actually, given our victories in the Maradysh, would the Maradysh be willing to accept refugees now?
Also, can we send some of the refugees to the Merntir? Actually, given our victories in the Maradysh, would the Maradysh be willing to accept refugees now?
Hmm...I'm going to say yes, but I'm going to be busy for the next hour and a bit in RL and away from a computer so I'm not going to be able to add in extra options until after I get back.
We will likely lose. The Forluc are a peer power on their own, but they're also supported by the Zaradysh and the Caradysh. The Zaradysh have a Heroic Martial/Mystic and the Caradysh have Urth. The easiest thing to do is to wait the situation out. Maereach will eventually die.
[] [Diplo] Ignore the proposal but cease the war with the Zaradysh.
I think this is the ideal solution. It's very important we keep the Lorvysh out of the Forluc's hands. If they conquer them, they'll have supremacy over us, and treaty or no treaty that's a big danger. By ignoring the Forluc's proposal, we can secure Lorvysh independence unencumbered by a war with the Zaradysh and hopefully stay out of a war with the Forluc.
No priests, just the 'chosen' that loves to try and seize power through a good old fashioned crusade.....
