This is interesting. It seems we are politically heading towards something like "Father Governs Children" (Civ V name for Siamese passive). For us it'd be Mother Governs Children, where the Mother allows the Children to live their own lives and grow, but will offer advice and assistance both freely and when asked. In extraordinarily dire circumstances, the Mother will be listened to. There are times when the Mother must lay down stricter laws for unruly children, for their own good and the good of the family collective. This suits our theology, as well as our political situation.

our MIL is at 10, does that mean we successfully completed the prior quest for the free-wall? Because good. I like wall. We'll get another if we finish the next quest? Great! Walls are great!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Minor Ice Age inbound huh? This is the preamble, it will grow increasingly severe. Already some have decided to attack us from the pressure. This is the real risk of global climate disruption. It's not just our groups and our direct neighbors. It's everyone. And when they destabilize, there are refugees of course (which we can handle) but also invasions. Wars. Political upstarts looking to consolidate their rule the quick and dirty way, unifying against an external "grand enemy".

The two major threats are 1. Navigating civil violence effectively. 2. The Boar Nomads being severely affected and deciding to go on another conquest

Making sure that trade with the Boar Nomads is flowing effectively, goods exchanged for food fairly, should make sure that they are not offended by charity freely given, nor suffer overmuch from the ice age. Some of our vassals will be pouring military into Maradysh, given the sheer audacity of the insult, and if the Lochanysh prove to be troublesome they'll already be prepared to reinforce Cernn. The risk, then, is not the Lochanysh war going poorly but another front opening up suddenly. Especially the Boar Nomads, who may be particularly vulnerable to the ice age and are the most-able to hit us from an awkward position.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

One thing to note about the Minor Ice Age is how incredible Arthwydish teachings are in regards to agriculture. This is an excellent opportunity to spread such teachings among our less religious subjects. We are generous, and the Arthwydish Pantheon is not a particularly jealous one.

A diplomatic mission post-war to ask if the Cernn would wish to learn of such teachings would be good. Zaranna is a goddess that is extremely at odds with our Ordered religion, and if she wasn't she would likely have already been folded in somehow. We don't know whether the Cernn have an established religion, or if their magic is non-divine in origin. With lessons from the Maradysh conversion/integration, this might be when/where we develop "Mother-Governs-Children" as our early diplomatic tech. But, our diplo is fairly low currently so . . . no idea.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

looking at the map again, I think I'd like to begin colonizing the Sunrise Mountains. Specifically the areas nearest the outpost already established and pre-connected by the Sunrise Path. Mountain living is a sort of living that makes use of verticality, limited land-area, variable arability, and large amounts of non-sustenance labor (quarrying, mining). Combined with our emphasis on self-sufficiency, I think this is the crucible that will forge our version of True Cities.

Census is a good project. Laws is a good project. A colony founded with the explicit purpose of figuring out how to apply Arthwydish teachings to Mountain settlements?

that colony should have a wealth of innovative ideas coming out of it, and potentially a wealth of stones/metals too lol.

for now we'll be busy, but I figured I'd mention it so people think about it for the future
 
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Indeed, unthinking panic is not a good reason to switch.
Rather, you should switch to the Economy policy if you actually want to have the provinces focus on expanding our resource pools. For example through MAIN Farming(which might in turn raise our urban density).

The Cernn are fighting a war during a time when crop yields are going down. They might not *need* the extra food, but it probably helps free up more manpower for military service or walls and will probably be appreciated.

Maradysh is more a case of bolstering the elements other than the power-hungry nobles who rejected the authority of Greenbay's priesthood out of selfish greed. Because this selfish greed is an unholy heresy.
The Maradysh do not need food. They have our farming tech and have adequate food storage policies in place. They do not lack resources. What they lack is quantity of warriors, fighting in their war, and giving them more resources wouldn't help them get more any more than it'd help us get more warriors because again, they have all the resources they need.

As for the Cernn, manpower would also free up manpower. If we send warriors, it means they can afford to do more farming instead of fighting war, and this is entirely assuming that they don't have adequate amounts of food already. And if they don't need extra food? Then they could instead simply throw more warriors into the war. So, in short, food aid has no chance of giving the Cernn an advantage, while sending warriors certainly does.
But let me break this logic down to make it easier to parse.
If the Cernn need food and we send food: Cernn can send another war party; +1 war party fighting the Lochanysh.
If the Cernn don't need food and we send food: Absolutely no benefit whatsoever.
If the Cernn need food and we send warriors: Cernn farm while we fight; +1 war party fighting the Lochanysh.
If the Cernn don't need food and we send warriors: Cernn send a war party and we send a war party; +2 war parties fighting the Lochanysh.
As you can see, sending warriors is objectively better than sending food, as in all scenarios it is as good or better.

As for the province policy, we shouldn't have it be anything but Defensive while we're at war. War is a dangerous thing and a lot of things can go very wrong with insufficient focus.

After the war, Megaproject policy is better. Sewers are good for a True City and Census is better for everything, including temp econ damage resistance. As I'd explained earlier, a minor little ice age is entirely irrelevant to us and a major little ice age would affect us so little that we should ignore it.

EDIT:
But, our diplo is fairly low currently so . . . no idea.
We've got Diplo 6 and 8 temp diplo so it's not really low.

looking at the map again, I think I'd like to begin colonizing the Sunrise Mountains. Specifically the areas nearest the outpost already established and pre-connected by the Sunrise Path. Mountain living is a sort of living that makes use of verticality, limited land-area, variable arability, and large amounts of non-sustenance labor (quarrying, mining). Combined with our emphasis on self-sufficiency, I think this is the crucible that will forge our version of True Cities.

Census is a good project. Laws is a good project. A colony founded with the explicit purpose of figuring out how to apply Arthwydish teachings to Mountain settlements?

that colony should have a wealth of innovative ideas coming out of it, and potentially a wealth of stones/metals too lol.

for now we'll be busy, but I figured I'd mention it so people think about it for the future
Another subordinate isn't a good idea. The bigger our empire is the more fracture and crisis points we create. Making it bigger simply to increase our power is not good. We have all the power we need, and we'll continue to grow in power even without giving ourselves more weaknesses. We should focus on our infrastructure and social advancements to make our civilisation more robust. Our civilisation needs to be more robust, not more powerful.
 
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One thing to note about the Minor Ice Age is how incredible Arthwydish teachings are in regards to agriculture. This is an excellent opportunity to spread such teachings among our less religious subjects. We are generous, and the Arthwydish Pantheon is not a particularly jealous one.

A diplomatic mission post-war to ask if the Cernn would wish to learn of such teachings would be good. Zaranna is a goddess that is extremely at odds with our Ordered religion, and if she wasn't she would likely have already been folded in somehow. We don't know whether the Cernn have an established religion, or if their magic is non-divine in origin. With lessons from the Maradysh conversion/integration, this might be when/where we develop "Mother-Governs-Children" as our early diplomatic tech. But, our diplo is fairly low currently so . . . no idea.
Could do it via Support Subordinate. Send in the priests and preachers to act as teachers, offer food for their time.
The Maradysh do not need food. They have our farming tech and have adequate food storage policies in place. They do not lack resources. What they lack is quantity of warriors, fighting in their war, and giving them more resources wouldn't help them get more any more than it'd help us get more warriors because again, they have all the resources they need.
Again, the Maradysh Support isn't about food. It is about supporting devout Arthrynites over the community-harming heresy of the pretenders.
As for the Cernn, manpower would also free up manpower. If we send warriors, it means they can afford to do more farming instead of fighting war, and this is entirely assuming that they don't have adequate amounts of food already. And if they don't need extra food? Then they could instead simply throw more warriors into the war. So, in short, food aid has no chance of giving the Cernn an advantage, while sending warriors certainly does.
But let me break this logic down to make it easier to parse.
If the Cernn need food and we send food: Cernn can send another war party; +1 war party fighting the Lochanysh.
If the Cernn don't need food and we send food: Absolutely no benefit whatsoever.
If the Cernn need food and we send warriors: Cernn farm while we fight; +1 war party fighting the Lochanysh.
If the Cernn don't need food and we send warriors: Cernn send a war party and we send a war party; +2 war parties fighting the Lochanysh.
As you can see, sending warriors is objectively better than sending food, as in all scenarios it is as good or better.

As for the province policy, we shouldn't have it be anything but Defensive while we're at war. War is a dangerous thing and a lot of things can go very wrong with insufficient focus.

After the war, Megaproject policy is better. Sewers are good for a True City and Census is better for everything, including temp econ damage resistance. As I'd explained earlier, a minor little ice age is entirely irrelevant to us and a major little ice age would affect us so little that we should ignore it.
The Lochanysh have no magic, no divine blessings and their forces are about evenly matched with those of the Cernn, with each side having less than two hundred warriors at the latest estimate.
We're not dealing with a major power here. This is not a matter of whether or not the Cernn will be able to win the war if we step in.

It does not warrant a MAIN War Party from us. Especially not with a Defensive Province Policy throwing supporting War Parties. The main reason it even warrants a SEC War Party is because they had the temerity to attack one of our subjects.

The Lochanysh have burned down two Cernnite villages however. So the Cernn will have to do some rebuilding.
Fill their granaries. Let them spare the manpower for other things. Prepare them for the coming Ice Age. Be a wise and benevolent overlord for a change.
 
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Again, the Maradysh Support isn't about food. It is about supporting devout Arthrynites over the community-harming heresy of the pretenders.
*blink* You mean...the aid is token? About symbolism more than anything? If so, military aid is still way better.

The Lochanysh have no magic, no divine blessings and their forces are about evenly matched with those of the Cernn, with each side having less than two hundred warriors at the latest estimate.
We're not dealing with a major power here. This is not a matter of whether or not the Cernn will be able to win the war if we step in.

It does not warrant a MAIN War Party from us. Especially not with a Defensive Province Policy throwing supporting War Parties. The main reason it even warrants a SEC War Party is because they had the temerity to attack one of our subjects.

The Lochanysh have burned down two Cernnite villages however. So the Cernn will have to do some rebuilding.
Fill their granaries. Let them spare the manpower for other things. Prepare them for the coming Ice Age. Be a wise and benevolent overlord for a change.
You will not convince me to take a war less seriously, especially with greater and increasing regional instability. Nor will you convince me that sending more warriors to help them fight a war is not the best thing we could do for them while they're fighting a defensive war.
 
*blink* You mean...the aid is token? About symbolism more than anything? If so, military aid is still way better.
The Maradysh support is basically about soft pushing for theocracy over bloodline aristocracy.

Basically, the Arthrynite priesthood in Greenbay tried to use their influence to end the violence between Arthrynites. We should support the Maradysh leaders who listened to the Arthrynite priesthood in Greenbay while the Empire's(including our own) war parties help us bring the pretenders to justice.
This approach is also known as the "Carrot and Stick" method.
You will not convince me to take a war less seriously, especially with greater and increasing regional instability. Nor will you convince me that sending more warriors to help them fight a war is not the best thing we could do for them while they're fighting a defensive war.
I acknowledge that you cannot be reasoned with on this point.
 
I mean, 'our' faction is doing the best out of the three, with the pretenders bleeding troops and defectors, the Zarans bleeding due to casualties...our guys are comign through fine. We don't *need* to do a lot to win this situation.

But it wouldn't be an update without the usual manipulative fear mongering and attempted strongarming...so I say we move on cause otherwise we're giving effort where it isn't worth it.
 
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The Maradysh support is basically about soft pushing for theocracy over bloodline aristocracy.

Basically, the Arthrynite priesthood in Greenbay tried to use their influence to end the violence between Arthrynites. We should support the Maradysh leaders who listened to the Arthrynite priesthood in Greenbay while the Empire's(including our own) war parties help us bring the pretenders to justice.
This approach is also known as the "Carrot and Stick" method.
If we're pushing against bloodline aristocracy, giving aid to the biggest of the bloodline aristocrats sends a little bit of a mixed message. We should take a stick and stick method, doing nothing more than beating up bloodline aristocrats and the priests who support them and replacing the priests with Arthwyd priests.
 
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[X] [SEC] War Party = (Maradysh Pretenders)
[X] [SEC] War Party = (Lochanysh)
[X] [SEC] Support Subordinate = (Maradysh)
[X] [SEC] Switch Province Policy = (Defensive)
 
[X] [SEC] War Party = (Maradysh Pretenders)
[X] [SEC] War Party = (Lochanysh)
[X] [SEC] Support Subordinate = (Maradysh)
[X] [SEC] Switch Province Policy = (Defensive)
 
[X] [MAIN] War Party = (Maradysh Rebels)
[X] [MAIN] War Party = (Lochanysh)
[X][SEC] Switch Province Policy = (Defensive)
[X][SEC] War Party = (Maradysh Pretenders)
 
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The vote is still open.
Vote Tally : Chronicles of Nations Redux - Civ Quest Original | Page 103 | Sufficient Velocity [Posts: 2561-2585]
##### NetTally 2.2.0

Task: MAIN

[X][MAIN] War Party = (Lochanysh)
No. of Votes: 5

[X][MAIN] More Farming.
No. of Votes: 2
[X] Qeqre
[X] argenten

[X][MAIN] War Party = (Maradysh Rebels)
No. of Votes: 2



——————————————————————————————————————————————
Task: SEC

[X][SEC] Switch Province Policy = (Defensive)
No. of Votes: 7

[X][SEC] War Party = (Maradysh Pretenders)
No. of Votes: 6

[X][SEC] Support Subordinate = (Maradysh)
No. of Votes: 4

[X][SEC] War Party = (Lochanysh)
No. of Votes: 4

[X][SEC] More Farming.
No. of Votes: 2
[X] Qeqre
[X] argenten

[X][SEC] Study Magic.
No. of Votes: 2
[X] Qeqre
[X] argenten

[X][SEC] Study Metal.
No. of Votes: 2
[X] Qeqre
[X] argenten

[X][SEC] Study Nature.
No. of Votes: 2
[X] Qeqre
[X] argenten

[X][SEC] Support Subordinate = (Cernn)
No. of Votes: 2
[X] Qeqre
[X] argenten

[X][SEC] Switch Province Policy = (Economy)
No. of Votes: 2
[X] Qeqre
[X] argenten

[X][SEC] Train Sacred Warriors
No. of Votes: 2
[X] Qeqre
[X] argenten

[X][SEC] War Party = (Maradysh Rebels)
No. of Votes: 1
[X] Kiba


Total No. of Voters: 9
 
[X] [MAIN] War Party = (Lochanysh)
[X][SEC] Switch Province Policy = (Defensive)
[X][SEC] War Party = (Maradysh Pretenders)
 
[X] [SEC] War Party = (Maradysh Pretenders)
[X] [SEC] War Party = (Lochanysh)
[X] [SEC] Support Subordinate = (Maradysh)
[X] [SEC] Switch Province Policy = (Defensive)
 
The Lochanysh have no magic, no divine blessings and their forces are about evenly matched with those of the Cernn, with each side having less than two hundred warriors at the latest estimate.

While Tomag started with less than two hundred, the Lochandysh do have more than that. Likewise with Aogan, he has about three hundred and the Cernn have more at their disposal.
 
If we're pushing against bloodline aristocracy, giving aid to the biggest of the bloodline aristocrats sends a little bit of a mixed message. We should take a stick and stick method, doing nothing more than beating up bloodline aristocrats and the priests who support them and replacing the priests with Arthwyd priests.
The bloodline aristocrats we'd be giving aid to are the ones who tried to obey us when we called for an end to the violence between Arthrynites.
They have accepted the pecking order of Greenbay Priesthood > Local Aristocrats and the rule of "no attacking Arthrynites for selfish reasons." By rewarding the local leaders who listened to Greenbay's priesthood, we promote these ideas.

It being a softball approach doesn't mean the message is mixed.

Likewise, if there are Maradysh Arthrynite priests who tried to obey Greenbay's calls for peace and unity, they should be commended rather than condemned.
The only ones who need to be removed are the heretics who claimed the Arthwydish Arthrynite priesthood had no authority over the Maradysh Arthrynites. But their replacements don't need to be Arthwyd if there are enough orthodox Maradysh Arthrynite priests to pick up the slack.
While Tomag started with less than two hundred, the Lochandysh do have more than that. Likewise with Aogan, he has about three hundred and the Cernn have more at their disposal.
Still pretty small.
 
The vote is now closed.
Vote Tally : Chronicles of Nations Redux - Civ Quest Original | Page 103 | Sufficient Velocity [Posts: 2561-2592]
##### NetTally 2.2.0

Task: MAIN

[X][MAIN] War Party = (Lochanysh)
No. of Votes: 6

[X][MAIN] More Farming.
No. of Votes: 2
[X] Qeqre
[X] argenten

[X][MAIN] War Party = (Maradysh Rebels)
No. of Votes: 2



——————————————————————————————————————————————
Task: SEC

[X][SEC] Switch Province Policy = (Defensive)
No. of Votes: 10

[X][SEC] War Party = (Maradysh Pretenders)
No. of Votes: 10

[X][SEC] War Party = (Lochanysh)
No. of Votes: 6
[X] Qeqre
[X] argenten
[X] jamie96969
[X] nat_401
[X] sunrise
[X] veekie

[X][SEC] Support Subordinate = (Maradysh)
No. of Votes: 5
[X] Qeqre
[X] argenten
[X] jamie96969
[X] nat_401
[X] veekie

[X][SEC] Study Nature.
No. of Votes: 3
[X] Qeqre
[X] argenten
[X] sunrise

[X][SEC] More Farming.
No. of Votes: 2
[X] Qeqre
[X] argenten

[X][SEC] Study Magic.
No. of Votes: 2
[X] Qeqre
[X] argenten

[X][SEC] Study Metal.
No. of Votes: 2
[X] Qeqre
[X] argenten

[X][SEC] Support Subordinate = (Cernn)
No. of Votes: 2
[X] Qeqre
[X] argenten

[X][SEC] Switch Province Policy = (Economy)
No. of Votes: 2
[X] Qeqre
[X] argenten

[X][SEC] Train Sacred Warriors
No. of Votes: 2
[X] Qeqre
[X] argenten

[X][SEC] War Party = (Maradysh Rebels)
No. of Votes: 1
[X] Kiba


Total No. of Voters: 12
 
I made a miscalculation. Before, I said that a minor little ice age couldn't hurt our temp econ and a major one (estimated at d6 temp econ damage) only has a 1 in 6 chance of hurting us, and then would only do 1 temp econ damage.

In truth, we would never take any temp econ damage from a little ice age no matter how severe. We have -4 temp econ damage from our provinces, -5 from our Centralisation, -1 from the Census, and -1 from the Palace, for a total of -11 temp econ damage.

If we had a major little ice age, we rolled the worst possible result, and we took in the maximum number of refugees, the absolute worst that could happen is taking a very minor temp econ hit.

In short, worrying about economic damage from the little ice age can't really be justified. Things like trade disruption, war, and Stability loss from taking in refugees are legitimate worries, but our economy is virtually invulnerable.
 
In truth, we would never take any temp econ damage from a little ice age no matter how severe. We have -4 temp econ damage from our provinces, -5 from our Centralisation, -1 from the Census, and -1 from the Palace, for a total of -11 temp econ damage.

If we had a major little ice age, we rolled the worst possible result, and we took in the maximum number of refugees, the absolute worst that could happen is taking a very minor temp econ hit.

In short, worrying about economic damage from the little ice age can't really be justified. Things like trade disruption, war, and Stability loss from taking in refugees are legitimate worries, but our economy is virtually invulnerable.

Well, that certainly makes climate issues largely irrelevant to us. What level of event would it take for us to start actually feeling it's effect?
 
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