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A Sword Without a Hilt: A Song of Ice and Fire/D&D 3.5 Crossover

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Artemis1992 said:
No point in it.
She'll be known as Lya to the world and the multiverse eventually.
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This.
Wizards of levels 15+, let alone epic levels, where the group is slowly heading, are Known.

Poor Rhaella just does not realize, yet, what being a high level wizard really means. A noble daughter from Westeros vs Lya the common born wizard... Even without taking feelings into account this is not a contest.
 
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[X] 2 days

We can come back and copy more stuff later. So far this turn we've gotten a ton of shit done in record time, so much so that we can add the sellsword action back to the schedule. Let's not squander that on copying book.
 
By the way, @Goldfish @TotallyNotEvil, since we're going to be bringing Lya up to Bloodraven for our next trip North--to learn lore directly, learn the basics of First Men wards and to get the chance to study the wards of that giant weirwood, and to learn spells--can you guys think ahead on which druid spells you want her to learn? Particularly the spells that would be hard for us to buy.

We saw Bloodraven cast Stone to Flesh, a level 6 Sorcerer spell. And I just did some reading on Bloodraven's predominant class Arcane Heirophant and--like Lya's Sage of Creation class--it advances an arcane spellcasting class and a divine spellcasting class.
Spellcasting: At each level, you gain new spells per day and an increase in caster level (and spells known, if applicable) as if you had also gained a level in an arcane spellcasting class and a level in a divine spellcasting class to which you belonged before adding the prestige class level.
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So Bloodraven, to our knowledge, currently has this:
DragonParadox said:
Class: Sorcerer 4/Druid 3/ Arcane Heirophant 10
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Although it is very likely he's gained a level since then given how much he dreams and the things he regularly fights in the Far north. So he effectively has the casting power of a level 13 Druid, meaning he has access to Druid spells up to level 6 at minimum.

One thing, though, is that the Old Gods have a hate-boner for Ice spells because of the Others. But that aside the only major restriction is the amount of Lya time we spend up there learning the spells, so they'd have to be the absolute best picks. Do you guys have anything on your wishlists?
 
[X] 5 days
All the books are important, even shit diaries contain vital information as the show proved.
But perhaps we could delegate a bit? How many days of the allocated 10 have we used?
 
tenchifew said:
This.
Wizards of levels 15+, let alone epic levels, where the group is slowly heading, are Known.

Poor Rhaella just does not realize, yet, what being a high level wizard really means. A noble daughter from Westeros vs Lya the common born wizard... Even without taking feelings into account this is not a contest.
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It's still a good idea to get her ennobled as well, just because here being a high level wizard is more important, don't mean the prestige bonus of a title isn't worth having.

Of course we shouldn't ennoble just her, would be too obvious a ploy then, we should ennoble her and a few other magic users.

And we actually have plenty of precedent for doing this, Volantis ennoble anyone with magic, which mean we have something to point towards, to show she's a legitimate foreign noble not just a sham, sure it's a recent precedent, but magic is only recently returned, there can't be old precedents for new things, but the mere fact that Volantis has been ennobling magical commoners and even slaves, mean that ennobling Lya for magic should be significantly more legitimate.
 
tarrangar said:
It's still a good idea to get her ennobled as well, just because here being a high level wizard is more important, don't mean the prestige bonus of a title isn't worth having.

Of course we shouldn't ennoble just her, would be too obvious a ploy then, we should ennoble her and a few other magic users.

And we actually have plenty of precedent for doing this, Volantis ennoble anyone with magic, which mean we have something to point towards, to show she's a legitimate foreign noble not just a sham, sure it's a recent precedent, but magic is only recently returned, there can't be old precedents for new things, but the mere fact that Volantis has been ennobling magical commoners and even slaves, mean that ennobling Lya for magic should be significantly more legitimate.
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Well, yes, ennobling the magic users as a class might be an idea, this said there will be drawbacks to it as well.
I think a better idea could be ennobling everyone who can cast, say, 4 circle spells and up?
 
tarrangar said:
It's still a good idea to get her ennobled as well, just because here being a high level wizard is more important, don't mean the prestige bonus of a title isn't worth having.

Of course we shouldn't ennoble just her, would be too obvious a ploy then, we should ennoble her and a few other magic users.

And we actually have plenty of precedent for doing this, Volantis ennoble anyone with magic, which mean we have something to point towards, to show she's a legitimate foreign noble not just a sham, sure it's a recent precedent, but magic is only recently returned, there can't be old precedents for new things, but the mere fact that Volantis has been ennobling magical commoners and even slaves, mean that ennobling Lya for magic should be significantly more legitimate.
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This is true. We should set some bar though, between "I know some magic" and being an official wisdom. Access to the 4th circle of spells, perhaps? It would limit it to truly skilled magic users (solidly PC), which would keep it from becoming diluted.

It would also let us officially establish precedence for Tyene, Vee, and Lya.
 
To be considered a mage, you need to be in a mage guild. See the constitution.

I would keep enobling to a case by case base.
 
Azel said:
To be considered a mage, you need to be in a mage guild. See the constitution.

I would keep enobling to a case by case base.
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There might be worth in making a protected title for Master guildsmen in a mage's guild, and setting it equal in precedence to a knight, without shifting them from the Mage Estate to the Noble Estate.
 
@Duesal how many dragonpens do we have in the swarm? Do we already have 1 for everyone we want to give one? If not, this would be the time to make more.
@DragonParadox would creating more pens reduce the number of days? How many to bring It down to 4?
 
Diomedon said:
There might be worth in making a protected title for Master guildsmen in a mage's guild, and setting it equal in precedence to a knight, without shifting them from the Mage Estate to the Noble Estate.
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What's the point though? If you don't shift them legally, then it has no meaning.

Prestige wise, guild masters will eclipse knights all on their own in short order.

A single sword swinger is pretty small fry when compared to a leading member of a reality warper club.
 
Azel said:
To be considered a mage, you need to be in a mage guild. See the constitution.

I would keep enobling to a case by case base.
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Exept Malarys, because I told you from the day this came up first that when we get any actually powerful mages the rules will be bend for personal compromises and we sould have left room in the rules for that.
 
das_slash said:
@Duesal how many dragonpens do we have in the swarm? Do we already have 1 for everyone we want to give one? If not, this would be the time to make more.
@DragonParadox would creating more pens reduce the number of days? How many to bring It down to 4?
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We've got 12. Current holders include:

Lya -- Aebys, the original pen
Viserys -- for ruling
Dany -- for a pet I guess ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Ser Richard -- war logistics
Garin -- merchantile stuff
Alinor -- administration of the Realm
Teana -- administering the Scholarum
Tyene -- intrigue and to help keep track of poison crafting
Waymar -- to help with alchemy
Vee -- so she doesn't have to read and write
Xor -- Since he doesn't have arms in his natural form
Maelor -- Just because

1 extra up with Bloodraven right now learning all that extra lore for us. So that's 13 dragonpens in existence.

Anyway, DP has told us that everyone wants a dragonpen because they're very useful and genuinely love to serve, so since everyone wanted one I'm assuming that everyone truly had a good use for them even if we can't really see it (like Dany getting a pen). Either way, they are fantastic status symbols. Rhaella and Malarys are next in line for their own pens.

But that being said @das_slash, I'm against just making more pens if we don't have people to take them when they're done copying stuff down. These pens need masters to protect them from theft.

Maybe in the future we can give pens to Kyla, Leila, Valaena, etc, but that'd be far in the future if they finally reach full PC levels.
 
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Azel said:
What's the point though? If you don't shift them legally, then it has no meaning.

Prestige wise, guild masters will eclipse knights all on their own in short order.

A single sword swinger is pretty small fry when compared to a leading member of a reality warper club.
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Ah, precedence has more to do with our own court and signalling than any legal demand. It gives the Westerosi nobility a handle. They know, perhaps, that Vee is important, but how important? Are they supposed to bow? Probably not. Is she supposed to bow to them? What's the relative standing here?

They don't know, and they'll take a guess at it and stick their foot in their mouth or feel foolish. Establishing precedence helps them know "Oh, her title isn't mage, it's wisdom. Not someone to lord over."

It's not an issue right now because our court is so tiny that everyone knows everyone else closely enough to make confusion of precedence moot, but we should firm this sort of thing up.
 
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Diomedon said:
Ah, precedence has more to do with our own court and signalling than any legal demand. It gives the Westerosi nobility a handle. They know, perhaps, that Vee is important, but how important? Are they supposed to bow? Probably not. Is she supposed to bow to them? What's the relative standing here?

They don't know, and they'll take a guess at it and stick their foot in their mouth or feel foolish. Establishing precedence helps them know "Oh, her title isn't mage, it's wisdom. Not someone to lord over."

It's not an issue right now because our court is so tiny that everyone knows everyone else closely enough to make confusion of precedence moot, but we should firm this sort of thing up.
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I get what you are going for, but using the head priestess of Yss for that example ... :lol
I mean, she's the one that treat's the living avatar of a god like a recalcitrant kid. I just try imagining what would happen to a Westerosi lord that actually manages to get noticed by Vee.

Edit: Not the best comparison ...
 
Duesal said:
We've got 12. Current holders include:

Lya -- Aebys, the original pen
Viserys -- for ruling
Dany -- for a pet I guess ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Ser Richard -- war logistics
Garin -- merchantile stuff
Alinor -- administration of the Realm
Teana -- administering the Scholarum
Tyene -- intrigue and to help keep track of poison crafting
Waymar -- to help with alchemy
Vee -- so she doesn't have to read and write
Xor -- Since he doesn't have arms in his natural form
Maelor -- Just because

1 extra up with Bloodraven right now learning all that extra lore for us. So that's 13 dragonpens in existence.

Anyway, DP has told us that everyone wants a dragonpen because they're very useful and genuinely love to serve, so since everyone wanted one I'm assuming that everyone truly had a good use for them even if we can't really see it (like Dany getting a pen). Either way, they are fantastic status symbols. Rhaella and Malarys are next in line for their own pens.

But that being said @das_slash, I'm against just making more pens if we don't have people to take them when they're done copying stuff down. These pens need masters to protect them from theft.

Maybe in the near future we can give pens to Kyla, Leila, Valaena, etc, but that'd be far in the future if they finally reach full PC levels.
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I dont want to have the pens just floating around either, but if making 2 more for malarys and mother now will reduce the number of days we should do so.
I was kinda hoping we hadnt made everyone their pen yet.
 
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