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A Sword Without a Hilt: A Song of Ice and Fire/D&D 3.5 Crossover

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Crake said:
Just wait until you get your first belligerent Great House nobles bitching and moaning about this state of affairs.

That won't be grating. It'll be amusing.
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"Ok, let's make this nice and simple. Anyone with a problem with me being with She-who-gives-the-gods-pause, please stand over there while I fire up the ole' freezing gaze.

And then stab you through the eye into your skull, knowing you can do nothing to escape.

What, no takers? But there has been so much contention and talking about this 'issue' so... hm, apparently none of you have a problem with it. Well, I am confused. Eh, if it pops up again I'll whip out the divinations and ask those who are sharing these concerns exactly what their problem is.

And then stab them through the eye while they can't move, but can see me coming, with a sword, towards their face."



Because fire is just so overdone, and this is much more horrifying on a "trapped" level than fire would be.
 
Snowfire said:
The problem with seeing things this way is that she's trying to help in the only way she knows how. Rejecting that...eeesh. Like, I understand the annoyance. I truly do. But there's no real way to avoid it, and that's just down to the person that Viserys is. We're not going to change course, I'm entirely committed to the relationship with Lya. It's just that situation as it stands requires a gentler touch that we've ever really had to use. And that's...grating.
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At some point we might have to say that we're not going so much for a Tagerain Restoration, so much as a re-conquering.

But that is its own kettle of fish, and I'm not sure if we should ever tell anyone tbh. Just have it be the thing that happened.
 
BeepSmile said:
At some point we might have to say that we're not going so much for a Tagerain Restoration, so much as a re-conquering.

But that is its own kettle of fish, and I'm not sure if we should ever tell anyone tbh. Just have it be the thing that happened.
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We kinda told Malarys when we recruited him.

Though he thinks we spoke about Westeros and western Essos.

The poor fool...
 
Sqweaktoy said:
I understand why you interpreted it that way DP, but saying Hearts Ease would be a 'first step on the road to recovery' from insanity makes about as much sense as saying Heal would be a 'first step on the road to recovery' from physical injury.

I totally get that it makes no sense irl, but a lot of things about D&D mechanics don't so I'm not sure why this spell is so different from its description?

Also, earlier in the thread you said it wasn't ' mind control' but: "Enchantment (Compulsion) [Mind-Affecting]"

It sort of is exactly that.
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It's different because unlike the people who wrote the Book of Exalted Deeds I do not think 'sanity' is an on off switch, it's a spectrum. Being functional is one thing, but there existing some ideal state of sanity.... well that begs the question sanity according to who? The victim, the caster? If I cast this on the apocalypse cultist villain will he just.... stop? That seems a bit much for a spell of its level.
 
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I just realized that Rhaella could well take to magic with a vengeance, if only to assert herself against a world that makes no sense. I envision a Targaryen dowager queen: unmarried, out of the line of succession, traumatized, and less than happy with this new world. Whose only remaining motivation is to protect her two children, made all the bitterer by her already having failed once in doing so. Someone with the potential of Viserys or Dany, but with nothing left to lose if you hurt her children.

...oh dear.
 
Eleas said:
I just realized that Rhaella could well take to magic with a vengeance, if only to assert herself against a world that makes no sense. I envision a Targaryen dowager queen: unmarried, out of the line of succession, traumatized, and less than happy with this new world. Whose only remaining motivation is to protect her two children, made all the bitterer by her already having failed once in doing so. Someone with the potential of Viserys or Dany, but with nothing left to lose if you hurt her children.

...oh dear.
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>.>
Stop peeking at my notes.

More seriously, there's a very good way to get her there without the bitterness and trauma.
 
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DragonParadox said:
It's different because unlike the people who wrote the Book of Exalted Deeds I do not think 'sanity' is an on off switch, it's a spectrum. Being functional is one thing, but there existing some ideal state of sanity.... well that begs the question sanity according to who? The victim, the caster? If I cast this on the apocalypse cultist victim will he just.... stop? That seems a bit much for a spell of its level.
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So the basic point that we should take from this is that we should get a level 6 version/heightened heart's ease then?

:p. I jest.

But yeah, you can easily chalk it up to "Heart's Ease" is for emergency treatment, but due to the complexity of a person's mind, over the relatively simple DNA/Magic!DNA pattern-restoration of physical healing, it has limits-indeed, they may be built into the spell - broad, cross-species/mode-of-existence, but not targeted attempts to limit a person by the spellcrafter's version of "Sanity". "Functional" sounds much more attainable, and broad.

:D.

Edit: We should stick Rhaella in Hogwarts as soon as we can. That'd teach her some respect for Lya, an actual understanding of how ridiculously... ridiculous the supposed "Mistress" actually is.

Edit Edit: Also, Viserys would totally resent any so-called "wife" for not being Lya - and he's never gone for the long con, he knows that anyone would be able to see such by the shape of his actions.
 
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Would that make her a good choice for cleric of Draconic Glory then? or should she just go about learning magic from the scholarium?
 
Snowfire said:
She has the blood of dragons in her veins. Sorcerer is the only class I'd really see as justified from that.
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Yeah... but Sorcerer is a shitty class. Like, her desperate attemepts to understand what the changes the world has undergone, and what that means for her children might be enough to push her wiz. I hope she has the INT score for it.
 
BeepSmile said:
Yeah... but Sorcerer is a shitty class. Like, her desperate attemepts to understand what the changes the world has undergone, and what that means for her children might be enough to push her wiz. I hope she has the INT score for it.
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That's...actually a really good point. If she has the Int for it, that would be great. And it would also give her common ground with her future daughter-in-law. So really, positives all around.
 
Is Sorcerer really that bad? I mean I guess everything looks bad when held up against Cleric or Wizard...
 
Vote closed.
Adhoc vote count started by DragonParadox on Jan 26, 2018 at 8:25 AM, finished with 144804 posts and 16 votes.
  • [X] Feathers in the Wind
    -[X] "Thank you, mother, but I'm afraid it's more complicated than that. It's fortunate that you talked of Dorne, however. I've told you of the aid I've given them, I think, but I treated with Prince Doran on the matter of the agreement made in the name of our house eight years ago." Breath. "I offered Dorne something other than my hand, and they accepted. Tyene's words were very correct in calling your return a hope for the future, given what I promised. And it is a promise I have no intentions of breaking." Address dynastic alliance concerns first. This might confuse her a little, but it's important to get this in ahead of anything else. Securing our Southern flank, as it were.
    -[X] "I've spoken of how the world has changed, of how magic has caused the lines of power to warp and shift given the power that mages can wield. Yet many still refuse to see that change, and so any sufficiently powerful ally would consider us a junior party in a dynastic alliance at best. At worst, their lack of understanding for the powers I and my companions wield could be a liability, preventing us from applying our full strength. I rule a Kingdom now, and that has been recognised, but it is a small one. And many can claim the right to the Iron Throne when they do not hold it." Logic on the matter of dynastic alliances, pointing out the potential weaknesses of one given our status within the feudal game. Also the beginning of explaining that it's starting to become hopelessly obsolete.
    -[X] "And yet, when our power is understood by those who currently dismiss or try to avoid it, our backing of a single house in Westeros could send the entire realm into turmoil. With the Others stirring, that could prove a fatal development." More of the above.
    -[X] "The Targaryens weren't always one of the Forty. They won their way into the Houses of Valyria through power, the same power as runs in my veins and that is mirrored by my companions. The Freehold prized magic above all else, both power in the Art and understanding of it. Sorcerer's Deep and my other holdings are its closest analogue, and it has been magic that has tended to my people, and held our walls against those who would seek to tear them asunder. Lya's knowledge of the forgotten arts goes beyond any of those in my company. In the days of Valyria, I have little doubt that if she wished to she would have founded her own dynasty." Further logic mixed with ancestral history, trying to solidify the place of Mage as equivalent to Noble without bringing it too close to Maester due to how they aren't marriage prospects at all.
    -[X] "To marry one without such power would be to sentence them to the life of a caged bird, and no matter the gilding of that cage, it would still be a prison." Emotion mixed with logic, moving into the more emotional side of the argument to finish it. Rhaella lived that prison, after all. Our unwillingness to subject someone to it is likely to win some points somewhere.
    -[X] "We have gone through fire and hell together, and if either of us were to fall, we have the knowledge and means to pursue the other's restoration. Her aid has saved Dany and I more often that I would care to count, and without her I doubt I would be standing here with you. And...I love her, mother, and she loves me. For all she has given, I could not ask her to be a mistress." The final words, emotional resolution following a chain of logic and reassurance.
    [X] Plan Politics
    -[X] The political landscape has vastly changed. Westeros alone is not everything we have to consider and the vast personal powers of mages make them a force in their own right.
    -[X] A marriage alliance cuts both ways and tying us to a LP in that fashion would be a considerable investment.
    -[X] Westeros is disunited since the Rebellion. Strong royal favor to a single house would significantly worsen that issue.
    -[X] The changes to the world mean that reforms are necessary to the way countries are governed. The Rebellion has shown how brittle a system without strong central authority can become and it needs institutions, not Lord, to address this.
    -[X] Due to our awakening blood and personal might, we will probably live for centuries. Dynastic considerations have changed vastly and a wife who we will easily outlive is untenable.
    [X] "You misread the situation entirely, Mother. Lya will not be my mistress. I care for her too much to ever demean her so. I intend to make her my wife, if she will have me."
    -[X] "Do you think the Targaryen family was always prominent within the Freehold, that we have been the equivalent of nobility since our ancestors were little more than shepherds? Through arcane means, I have the memories of the first Targaryen to ascend to the heights of power in Old Valyria. His family? Craftsmen of little note."
    -[X] The Forty Families became such not through force of arms or noble breeding, but through the power and skill of their founding members, reinforced by their heirs in each following generation. By that measure, one such as Lya would have founded her own dynasty, and more likely than not shaken the foundations of the world. You don't make a woman like that into a mistress. You crown her as queen."
    [X] "I understand your confusion, Mother, and forgive your presumption. Lya will not be my mistress. I care for her too much to ever demean her so. I intend to make her my wife, if she will have me."
    -[X] "Before you object, let me speak." Gently, but firmly. This is a worldview that needs...readjustment.
    -[X] "The world has changed a great deal from what you once knew, Mother. For one such as I, who possesses the power to burn armies and sunder entire fleets with no more than word and gesture, their is little value in a political marriage. Sorcerous power buys allies just as surely, and without half the hassle or intrigue."
    -[X] "The return of magic has made the world small. You saw it yourself, how easily I journeyed thousands of miles in an instant, and returned just as quickly. Westeros is but a single continent of a single world, Mother. Why bind myself to a noble daughter from one small province of a small world? I would much prefer sharing all the worlds within my reach with an equal, who can appreciate the splendor of the Planes just as much as I."
    -[X] "There is also the matter of my draconic nature. I am on the cusp of a great transformation, one born of our Valyrian ancestry and the magic flowing through my veins, which will prolong my life for centuries, if not millennia, barring accident or injury. Lya is fully capable of making similar arrangements for herself. Would you rather I spend a few decades with a mortal woman, who will soon enough return to the dust of the earth, or one who can stand by my side as I build an empire that would make the Lords of the Freehold weep tears of bitter envy?"
    [X] "Consider, too, the terrible enemies I have made in the short time since magic awakened. From us you have learned of but the barest fraction of what truly lurks in the darkness, Mother. Beings unlike any you could ever imagine already have designs on my life, and the lives of my friends. Such is the price for protecting the world from their ceaseless predation. I do not need a helpless wife to serve as a target of opportunity for any creature that bears a grudge against me. A powerful wife loyal to me through bonds of love and mutual respect, who can defend our future children just as surely as I, will be of far greater worth than any noble's daughter bound by duty or greed."
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Crake said:
Is Sorcerer really that bad? I mean I guess everything looks bad when held up against Cleric or Wizard...
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Sorc is tier two so it's worse than the alternatives. On the other hand there's some prestige classes that let you do well with it, and the "Shadow" line of spells can give a lot of flexibility to a sorcerer, specially if he manages to rise the quasireality of his spells to 100% or nearly so.
 
DragonParadox said:
It's different because unlike the people who wrote the Book of Exalted Deeds I do not think 'sanity' is an on off switch, it's a spectrum. Being functional is one thing, but there existing some ideal state of sanity.... well that begs the question sanity according to who? The victim, the caster? If I cast this on the apocalypse cultist villain will he just.... stop? That seems a bit much for a spell of its level.
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So you're saying we should take Mindrape as our first level 9 spell?
 
Wouldn't there be some interesting classes available to somebody who had died / been resurrected?

Dragonblooded(?) mystic could also work, are there any 'family' or 'motherhood' domains?

Edit: Whatever class she ends up with, Rhaella is the perfect candidate for a dragonegg!
 
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