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A Sword Without a Hilt: A Song of Ice and Fire/D&D 3.5 Crossover

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Crake said:
Yeah I dunno. A fey ruling the Stormlands?

And wasn't it said that it would take a ridiculous amount of power to create a whole person who could truly be regarded as real and wholly realized?

This talk of "a kind of Renly Baratheon" is utter tripe. He's an imposter who's acting in some kind of idealized manner of what Renly Baratheon should be. Kind and authoritative and maybe even acting with wisdom, but to what end, to what purpose? Maybe to the meter and whim of this Dancer figure.

This Renly would not even be subordinate to us when we take the Iron Throne, he would be subordinate to this Dancer, and this Dancer would not be subordinate to us. He would be vassal in name only.
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First, this is an act of a deity, which can totally create a whole person. Even whole races of people.

Second, he's propably not under orders from this Dancer, not if he believes himself to be Renly. A lord under control of a Feylord would not have been what Renly wished for anyway.
 
Another possible guy:

Damh (pronounced "dav," meaning "horned beast"[1]:118) is the fey deity of dance, song, and celebrations. His symbol is flutes, pipes, and a drum. Damh appears as a male korredwith long, tawny-auburn hair tied into braids. He carries a set of pipes, a wooden flute, and a harp. A physically powerful god, he may ambush hostile invaders into fairy lands. He is a god of the Inner Circle of the Seelie Court, Damh is the son of Titania and Oberon.

Damh's main worshipers are korreds, satyrs, and atomies. According to Monster Mythology, Titania worries so much about the various sylvan races that Damh felt compelled to take over some of her responsibilities and, therefore, lighten her load.[1]
 
We go meet with Other Renly, get his measure, and go from there.
 
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[X] Head to Evenfall Hall and meet this Other Renly

I really hope we can let him stay and do his thing. Anything else would really upset the one area we've seen so far that's nice without needing our constant intervention.
 
[X] Artemis1992

Beyond Stannis I'm not actually seeing any reason to interfere here unless the god that made the Other Renly starts meddling overtly. This Renly is supposed to be the idealized version of a lord, and funnily enough is doing his job properly.
 
Would Stannis even believe us?
"Hello, here is fake Renly! He looks like Renly, acts like Renly, has Renly's memories, and sincerely thinks he's Renly! But he isn't Renly, so I have to keep you prisoner, honest!"
 
[X] Artemis1992

I the other renly wants to Pay, and stannis can go free after that , i say we let him, he can try to find his brother on his own if he wishes.
 
We have two real options, honestly. Go seek out the real Renly wherever he's gone, which could be tremendously difficult and dangerous if the pact was guaranteed by a deity and not just a mere lord of the fey.

Or lie to Stannis and say that by all the powers of our sorcery, we cannot discern the difference between the man who made the offer to pay his ransom and his brother.

I mean, our word holds a little more weight. After all, have we acted in accordance to his expectations of what Viserys Targaryen would act when he first met us?
 
TalonofAnathrax said:
Would Stannis even believe us?
"Hello, here is fake Renly! He looks like Renly, acts like Renly, has Renly's memories, and sincerely thinks he's Renly! But he isn't Renly, so I have to keep you prisoner, honest!"
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Stannis wouldn't want to believe us, but he's seen far too much strange shit by now and when push comes to shove we can convey our sincerity pretty easily.

Bottomline if we tell Stannis, there will be war as Stannis tries to depose of the "usurper" in Storm's End. Not only is something else posing as his brother, but to add insult to injury it's doing it in the castle that he still sees as his by right.

I think we might have to break out the epic diplo along with a promise to help find the real Renly (which I'm not really keen on) if we tell Stannis the truth and don't want to kick off a civil war in the Stormlands.
 
TalonofAnathrax said:
Would Stannis even believe us?
"Hello, here is fake Renly! He looks like Renly, acts like Renly, has Renly's memories, and sincerely thinks he's Renly! But he isn't Renly, so I have to keep you prisoner, honest!"
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I think that Stannis will go to Strom's End and put FRenly in prison, and then go back to SD and put on his manacles back.

"There, everything as it should be"
 
TalonofAnathrax said:
Would Stannis even believe us?
"Hello, here is fake Renly! He looks like Renly, acts like Renly, has Renly's memories, and sincerely thinks he's Renly! But he isn't Renly, so I have to keep you prisoner, honest!"
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He's already mostly bought it, just from our divinations. I actually think the harder sell to Stannis would be going along with a fake, even if by all appearances he is Renly. In the question of "between two completely identical objects, but one is real and the other fake, which is more valuable," Stannis would come down on the "original" every time.

We need to gauge Fenly's intent with the ransom. If he isn't planning on ensorceling or imprisoning or otherwise harming Stannis, I think we might actually be able to go ahead with it. Fenly might not get the goodwill he's expecting from Stannis, but eh.
 
I bet if the original Renly gets restored, there will be a rumour saying the evil sorcerer Viserys cursed the king's little brother to be bad at ruling the Stormlands.
 
The thing is, we already basically told Stannis in no uncertain terms "That Renly be fake, yo".

We weren't really *ambiguous about it.
 
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TalonofAnathrax said:
Would Stannis even believe us?
"Hello, here is fake Renly! He looks like Renly, acts like Renly, has Renly's memories, and sincerely thinks he's Renly! But he isn't Renly, so I have to keep you prisoner, honest!"
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Anything that grants true sight would reveal a changeling.

Honestly, the fact that Renly was replaced with a changeling isn't necessarily a bad thing for us. After all, it's Robert's fault for not protecting his vassals which in turn places doubt on him. If his own brother is replaced, and he never noticed what protects vassals he doesn't really know?

Edit: Yes we promsied Stnnis we'd bring back his brother, but his brother wanted to leave. I don't think going up against either a god, or an extremely powerful fae, is worth it at that point.
 
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I still dont see the problem, he is fake, but he is not Evil, we only want his money so we can release stannis.
Stannis its not going to ask us for help, and once he is no longer our prisoner he is no longer our responsibility, if the people of the stormlands somehow collected enough money to pay for his release on their own, we would not be asking ourselves "is he going to believe us?", we would take the money and let him go, thats it.
If for some reason Stannis can convince himself to ask for our help (in exchange for his loyalty), we can investigate, but otherwise why bother?
 
Crake said:
We have two real options, honestly. Go seek out the real Renly wherever he's gone, which could be tremendously difficult and dangerous if the pact was guaranteed by a deity and not just a mere lord of the fey.
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As seen with Ymeri there is no functional difference.

If something with power of a Feyqueen wants to call itself god or not doesn't matter to us little mortals.
 
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To be fair calling this Renly a fake is a bit unfair.

He think's he's Renly, he has his memories, his face, even his flesh (presumably).

if he walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, swims like a duck, flies like a duck, he's a duck.

It might not be the first edition, but it is a Renly, and doing a far better job than the original would at that.

Considering the 'real' Renly decided to deal with a (possible) deity, pay his price, and run like a rabbit with his tail on fire the question of who would be a better ruler of these lands has been rather definitively answered.
 
Tomcost said:
For the record, Ymeri has the same CR as an Elder Brain
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And Ymeri helped a family of non-magical people to get two relativly powerful Sorcerers, some half-fiendish monsters and a bunch of Gargyles over just a few months.

She not only ha personal power similar to a god, but she can clearly power up her minions like one.
 
Duesal said:
Stannis wouldn't want to believe us, but he's seen far too much strange shit by now and when push comes to shove we can convey our sincerity pretty easily.

Bottomline if we tell Stannis, there will be war as Stannis tries to depose of the "usurper" in Storm's End. Not only is something else posing as his brother, but to add insult to injury it's doing it in the castle that he still sees as his by right.

I think we might have to break out the epic diplo along with a promise to help find the real Renly (which I'm not really keen on) if we tell Stannis the truth and don't want to kick off a civil war in the Stormlands.
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On the other hand the fact that Renly willingly gave Storms End to Frenly, might mean Stannis will seek out real Renly to yell at him instead, I mean technically it's a Lord's right to abdicate, so seeing as Renly apparently did it willingly, Stannis might not think it his place to interfere, no matter how much teeth grinding he will do, over Renly not giving him back Storms End if Renly didn't want it.

Considering Renly did it to himself as opposed to being forced into it, I think Stannis would seek out the real Renly, before trying to dispose of the fake.
 
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