Remove ads

A Sword Without a Hilt: A Song of Ice and Fire/D&D 3.5 Crossover

Reader mode
Goldfish said:
Given what we've seen of the Sarnori Undead, both how they died, how they were raised as Undead, and how they've unlived since then, I doubt continued Undeath will be even slightly common. I also doubt the Queen will give her subjects a choice in the matter.

I'm not completely opposed to some remaining Undead, but I would prefer that to be a choice someone makes for themselves before they die. Informed metaphysical consent and whatnot.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I'm not really seeing a difference between deciding before or after. If they feel uncomfortable with their current state as undead, they can change that and if they feel comfortable, why would you force them to live again? There have been plenty of people who chosen to live again, and nobody felt that choice was invalid just because they didn't live at that point.

On the contrary. Someone who is undead now and remembers being alive knows exactly what he is choosing, while a living person that never experienced undeath can't make a fully informed choice, as they never felt the latter state themselves.

See Wylla wondering if getting her vampire powers back wouldn't be so bad when there is no longer an undue influence from her state on her personality and reasoning.
 
Goldfish said:
Ah, thanks for the reminder. Numbers updated.

Bronze would probably be the choice for all spellcasters, since it comes with the Spellcasting Prodigy feat and a +2 Charisma bonus without a level adjustment.

Given what we've seen of the Sarnori Undead, both how they died, how they were raised as Undead, and how they've unlived since then, I doubt continued Undeath will be even slightly common. I also doubt the Queen will give her subjects a choice in the matter.

I'm not completely opposed to some remaining Undead, but I would prefer that to be a choice someone makes for themselves before they die. Informed metaphysical consent and whatnot.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Actually when it comes to their specific choice of existence Naamaru is fine with undeath, as long as they are lead-proofed against mystical pollution. she only cares about the private lives of her subjects in so much as they affect the state.
 
DragonParadox said:
Actually when it comes to their specific choice of existence Naamaru is fine with undeath, as long as they are lead-proofed against mystical pollution. she only cares about the private lives of her subjects in so much as they affect the state.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
We can escort her to the Plane of Earth for the purchase of all the lead she might need.
 
DragonParadox said:
Actually when it comes to their specific choice of existence Naamaru is fine with undeath, as long as they are lead-proofed against mystical pollution. she only cares about the private lives of her subjects in so much as they affect the state.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Oh, thats cool then. Another good bit of info about the Queen, too.
 
@DragonParadox, as part of the lore exchange, is Queen Namaaru willing to tell us how to make those awesome undead guards she has? We know she uses Jhogwin Giants as a base... Would it be possible for us to recreate a soulless giant husk as a base in our Flesh Forge?
 
I'm a bit baffled that you offered her lead-lining instead of using the full process based on Qyburns research once it's done.
 
Azel said:
I'm a bit baffled that you offered her lead-lining instead of using the full process based on Qyburns research once it's done.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
That was my fault. I knew that Qyburn had a research action done for making sure that his undead don't contaminate the environment, but the details escaped me, so I defaulted to saying they were insulated by lead.

I think we can assume that the spirit of the agreement, though, was to gift Queen Namaaru the appropriate lore to insulate her undead subjects.
 
Duesal said:
@DragonParadox, as part of the lore exchange, is Queen Namaaru willing to tell us how to make those awesome undead guards she has? We know she uses Jhogwin Giants as a base... Would it be possible for us to recreate a soulless giant husk as a base in our Flesh Forge?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Yes, but that might not be enough, with making this sort of composite undead the life the body once lived, its triumphs and its tragedies are a part of what empower it.
 
Duesal said:
That was my fault. I knew that Qyburn had a research action done for making sure that his undead don't contaminate the environment, but the details escaped me, so I defaulted to saying they were insulated by lead.

I think we can assume that the spirit of the agreement, though, was to gift Queen Namaaru the appropriate lore to insulate her undead subjects.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Well, the process for sentients isn't done yet. That's what Wylla is working on.

But she could have preserved and improved on all her mindless undead already.

On the other hand, this leaves her weaker and easier absorbed, so meh.
 
DragonParadox said:
Possibly, you will have to ask IC.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
It's not like we'll lack for Fire Giant corpses in the near future, so I'll make sure to ask.
Azel said:
Well, the process for sentients isn't done yet. That's what Wylla is working on.

But she could have preserved and improved on all her mindless undead already.

On the other hand, this leaves her weaker and easier absorbed, so meh.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
... Damn. Okay, I take responsibility for that. I didn't properly keep track of the research actions.
 
Duesal said:
... Damn. Okay, I take responsibility for that. I didn't properly keep track of the research actions.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Eh. Not a problem really.

On that note though, another correction. Qyburns research also aims to Void-proof undead. The ancient Bolton necromancers had worked out a way to diminish or eliminate the influence that the Others could exert on Bolton-made undead. The problem is just that the process was lost and Qyburn is not sure how the process he invented from the scraps of lore left interacts with Other / Void control attempts. He simply never had the means to test it, but is confident that it works.
 
Part of me wants all the undead to put on their metal suits so that we can blast the entire region with Positive Energy to try and mitigate all the undead bullshit. But part of me also understands that Sarnor will probably the Undead research area for centuries to come. The city of necromancy.
 
Azel said:
Eh. Not a problem really.

On that note though, another correction. Qyburns research also aims to Void-proof undead. The ancient Bolton necromancers had worked out a way to diminish or eliminate the influence that the Others could exert on Bolton-made undead. The problem is just that the process was lost and Qyburn is not sure how the process he invented from the scraps of lore left interacts with Other / Void control attempts. He simply never had the means to test it, but is confident that it works.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Void-proof Undead would be nothing short of amazing. I'm really looking forward to the results of that. Would that research synergize with the Otherbane and Voidbane enchantments or no?
 
Duesal said:
It's not like we'll lack for Fire Giant corpses in the near future, so I'll make sure to ask.

... Damn. Okay, I take responsibility for that. I didn't properly keep track of the research actions.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I thought we offered the lead for now, and told her we had ongoing research for this, and would be sharing that once it is complete?

Edit: We did. This is from the winning vote

-[ ] If there are those who for some reason wish to stay in their undead half-life, give Queen Namaaru the tech Qyburn developed to encase the undead in a lead suit to prevent negative energy leakage, and privately inform the queen that there is research being done to ensure the mental stability of intelligent undead which we will share with her upon completion
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
 
Last edited:
Duesal said:
Void-proof Undead would be nothing short of amazing. I'm really looking forward to the results of that. Would that research synergize with the Otherbane and Voidbane enchantments or no?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Dunno. The idea was always that the next step is intentionally blasting Qyburns undead with Other / Void power and seeing what happens, but all pushes I've made to actually do so went ignored or were shot down because someone argued that Undead in the North would be a bad idea, precisely because such an exposure scenario could happen.
 
Looking further on it the Undead thing isn't really a problem tbh. If we can contain the negative energy or warforge them then it becomes a simple matter. Sure food will be a pain in the ass to grow but the people population can be supported by magic-aided farming or some nonsense. Plus with leakage being gone the land will slowly go back to not sucking.
 
Azel said:
Eh. Not a problem really.

On that note though, another correction. Qyburns research also aims to Void-proof undead. The ancient Bolton necromancers had worked out a way to diminish or eliminate the influence that the Others could exert on Bolton-made undead. The problem is just that the process was lost and Qyburn is not sure how the process he invented from the scraps of lore left interacts with Other / Void control attempts. He simply never had the means to test it, but is confident that it works.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
*slaps the armored rump of a Black Knight*

"Yes sirree, when you need quality Undead at a reasonable price, come on down to Crazy Qyburn's Undead Emporium, where we put the craftsmanship in Necro-craft! All products guaranteed to be environmentally friendly and proof against Void-taint or your money back!"
 
Azel said:
Dunno. The idea was always that the next step is intentionally blasting Qyburns undead with Other / Void power and seeing what happens, but all pushes I've made to actually do so went ignored or were shot down because someone argued that Undead in the North would be a bad idea, precisely because such an exposure scenario could happen.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

I recall us putting it off. Not saying we shouldn't. I want to test out Qyburn's hunch...preferably with a deadman switch undead that we can blow up when we please. You know, just in case.
 
Archibald said:
I thought we offered the lead for now, and told her we had ongoing research for this, and would be sharing that once it is complete?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
That was for stabilizing intelligent undead, IIRC.

The research @Azel was talking about was containment of their natural negative energy.
Azel said:
Dunno. The idea was always that the next step is intentionally blasting Qyburns undead with Other / Void power and seeing what happens, but all pushes I've made to actually do so went ignored or were shot down because someone argued that Undead in the North would be a bad idea, precisely because such an exposure scenario could happen.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I think it's better safe than sorry to experiment with a few controlled groups rather than not do the research at all. This is useful intel, and developing Void-proof undead would be a huge strategic asset.

I'd like to do this, but we'd need a strike force on standby in case the Others decide to send loot and XP our way. That or a means for Qyburn and all other researchers to quickly bolt if things go pear shaped.
 
One Autumn Leaf said:
I recall us putting it off. Not saying we shouldn't. I want to test out Qyburn's hunch...preferably with a deadman switch undead that we can blow up when we please. You know, just in case.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
As a rule of thumb, you should always treat your potentially contaminated samples as definitely contaminated. Very contaminated.

So expose a bunch and then treat them as if you captured them straight from a True Others control. Dissect, disassemble, analyze as if they were hostile combatants and memetic hazards.

If you still find nothing after having ground down 100 of them to their finest parts, then you are sure that it's safe.
 
Azel said:
As a rule of thumb, you should always treat your potentially contaminated samples as definitely contaminated. Very contaminated.

So expose a bunch and then treat them as if you captured them straight from a True Others control. Dissect, disassemble, analyze as if they were hostile combatants and memetic hazards.

If you still find nothing after having ground down 100 of them to their finest parts, then you are sure that it's safe.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Maybe an Imperial Steel cage to trap those fucking ghosts inside, too.
 
Reader mode
You must login or register to reply here.
Remove ads
Back
Top