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A Sword Without a Hilt: A Song of Ice and Fire/D&D 3.5 Crossover

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BronzeTongue said:
For long term stuff, but I'm thinking more about reducing casualties during an assault on our cities as they stand. If our enemies are willing to expend troops on spite they can kill a lot of people, even with good defenses and active PC opposition.

If the others or the deep ones attacked SD or Bravos we might be able to fight them off, but if they start popping plague spells or turn their minions on the populace we'd lose a lot of people. Making it hard for them to do that without stopping and focusing on it will make those tactics much less effective.
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Well, take it up with Goldfish. When it comes to budgets, the only one that truly matters in the short term for negotiating what to do with it is the crafting budget. And he guards it quite jealously.

We could also just buy it in the marketplace.

But think about this even in the medium term of enemies attacking cities. We have a lot of fucking cities and those pocket dimensions will not even protect a tiny fraction of them.

Relying on RAW spell effects is a terrible idea for matters of scale.
 
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Adhoc vote count started by Crake on May 2, 2020 at 2:12 PM, finished with 102 posts and 12 votes.
  • [X] Gather up the remains of all those who were slain and can still be returned to life, including the Wyvern pilots if their remains were recoverable.
    -[X] Alyssa and Danar will be restored using Wild Arcana duplicated True Resurrection spells immediately upon Viserys' arrival, while the Thenns will be restored using one or more of Dany's Reached Chained Raise Dead spells and the Wyvern pilots via a Reached Chained Resurrection spell once we have returned to the Stepstones.
    -[X] The evacuation is to begin immediately, with surviving Thenns loaded into the Moonchasers as quickly as possible, along with what belongings they can carry with them.
    -[X] While the evacuation is truly underway Viserys' group, a few Heralds and the Harbinger, along with Nirah, will slay the Wraiths still remaining in the Valley with Viserys using a Wild Arcana to cast Undermaster to uncover any hiding in the earth and then finish looting the Barrows of Thenn Kings. The Others will find nothing, not even ashes or bones.
    -[X] Viserys will reserve Ancestral Awakening to learn Transdimensional Spell in case of large groups of Wraiths.
    --[X] The other Heralds will gather the bodies of the unraiseable dead and burn them to ashes while the evacuation is underway before accompanying the ships with the rest of the group. We will not even leave those behind.
    -[X] Before leaving the valley you will burn the entire settlement to the ground using Shadow of the Doom. Something to remember you by, and as thorough a means to get rid of any material samples of the people living there as is possible.
    [X] Gather up the remains of all those who were slain and can still be returned to life, including the Wyvern pilots if their remains were recoverable.
    -[X] Alyssa and Danar will be restored using Wild Arcana duplicated True Resurrection spells immediately upon Viserys' arrival, while the Thenns will be restored using one or more of Dany's Reached Chained Raise Dead spells and the Wyvern pilots via a Reached Chained Resurrection spell once we have returned to the Stepstones.
    -[X] The evacuation is to begin immediately, with surviving Thenns loaded into the Moonchasers as quickly as possible, along with what belongings they can carry with them.
    -[X] While the evacuation is truly underway Viserys' group, a few Heralds and the Harbinger, along with Nirah, will slay the Wraiths still remaining in the Valley with Viserys using a Wild Arcana to cast Undermaster and then finish looting the Barrows of Thenn Kings. The Others will find nothing but bones and ash by nightfall, as you plan on leaving well before then.
    --[X] The other Heralds will gather the bodies of the dead and burn them to ashes while the evacuation is underway before accompanying the ships with the rest of the group.
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[X] Gather up the remains of all those who were slain and can still be returned to life, including the Wyvern pilots if their remains were recoverable.
-[X] Alyssa and Danar will be restored using Wild Arcana duplicated True Resurrection spells immediately upon Viserys' arrival, while the Thenns will be restored using one or more of Dany's Reached Chained Raise Dead spells and the Wyvern pilots via a Reached Chained Resurrection spell once we have returned to the Stepstones.
-[X] The evacuation is to begin immediately, with surviving Thenns loaded into the Moonchasers as quickly as possible, along with what belongings they can carry with them.
-[X] While the evacuation is truly underway Viserys' group, a few Heralds and the Harbinger, along with Nirah, will slay the Wraiths still remaining in the Valley with Viserys using a Wild Arcana to cast Undermaster to uncover any hiding in the earth and then finish looting the Barrows of Thenn Kings. The Others will find nothing, not even ashes or bones.
-[X] Viserys will reserve Ancestral Awakening to learn Transdimensional Spell in case of large groups of Wraiths.
--[X] The other Heralds will gather the bodies of the unraiseable dead and burn them to ashes while the evacuation is underway before accompanying the ships with the rest of the group. We will not even leave those behind.
-[X] Before leaving the valley you will burn the entire settlement to the ground using Shadow of the Doom. Something to remember you by, and as thorough a means to get rid of any material samples of the people living there as is possible.
 
The biggest takeaway for us here (aside from making sure to do evacuations before excavations) is that those wardstones are no joke. We might just have lost all of the Thenns if they weren't in place.

@DragonParadox, what level of runecrafting is necessary to make those?
 
BronzeTongue said:
For long term stuff, but I'm thinking more about reducing casualties during an assault on our cities as they stand. If our enemies are willing to expend troops on spite they can kill a lot of people, even with good defenses and active PC opposition.

If the others or the deep ones attacked SD or Bravos we might be able to fight them off, but if they start popping plague spells or turn their minions on the populace we'd lose a lot of people. Making it hard for them to do that without stopping and focusing on it will make those tactics much less effective.
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@Crake is right about the issue of scale.

A single-use Astral Hospice item would cost 190 IM. If one Astral Hospice Demiplane could hold 100 people, that is 190,000 IM just for 100,000 people. There are millions of people in our cities.

The biggest obstacle to using Astral Hospice for emergencies, however, is that it can only be cast from the Astral Plane. That takes it out of the running entirely.

An alternative would be single-use items of Rope Trick. Those would only cost 30 IM each, but can only hold a maximum of eight people for up to three hours actually isn't a bad duration to avoid the worst of an attack. It would also cost 375,000 IM for enough to hold 100,000 people.

Magic is great for solving a lot of problems, but there are some things it just doesn't work too well for handling.
 
Anybody feel like hitting up those phase spiders in the plane of air and buying or ripping out their biological secrets?

"Gargantuan phase spider silk web" has a nice ring to it.
 
We can always make it into a ritual spell and spread it among the people? I mean Ritual spells exist which can allow even lowly caster to cast a higher level spell.
 
The best thing to do is to have a lot of mobile assets that can kill the enemy dead faster than they can kill innocent civilians.
 
Crake said:
Well, take it up with Goldfish. When it comes to budgets, the only one that truly matters in the short term for negotiating what to do with it is the crafting budget. And he guards it quite jealously.

We could also just buy it in the marketplace.

But think about this even in the medium term of enemies attacking cities. We have a lot of fucking cities and those pocket dimensions will not even protect a tiny fraction of them.

Relying on RAW spell effects is a terrible idea for matters of scale.
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Azel said:
As the US and the Soviet Union found out: You can't realistically do this. The logistics of scale make it impossible to shield civilians against direct terror attacks.

You are better served with deterrents and active assets that keep the enemies far away from your civilians.

Hence the game plan for the Long Night being to hold the Wall.
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Fair enough point about the logistics of it. I don't think the issues are the same as those faced in real life since we don't need to build large structures all over the place, but manufacture or purchase an item that can be mass produced.

The more I look at the crafting requirements the less viable it seems, but the fungus forge can produce a ridiculous number of creatures simultaneously from the bones of our enemies.

A golden retriever with 1/day AH as a spell like ability seems like it would be pretty cheap. Can we make creatures with specific SLAs without giving a casting template, or would we need to make it a cleric creature? I almost want to do it the second way just to see what a dog with the 10 hd needed to cast a level four spell is like.

... This is better than items honestly. I can't think of a more ASwaH action than looting our enemies to fuel a public works program based on mad science. :V
 
Crake said:
The best thing to do is to have a lot of mobile assets that can kill the enemy dead faster than they can kill innocent civilians.
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For city wards we either need something to keep incorporeal monsters out completely and/or incorporeal guardians of our own who can challenge invaders on their own turf. I imagine an in-depth study of Winterfell's dreamscape can yield results there.

Also Imperial Steel with its Ghost Touch properties spammed for as many legionnaires and guardsmen as possible.
 
zxzx24 said:
Anybody feel like hitting up those phase spiders in the plane of air and buying or ripping out their biological secrets?

"Gargantuan phase spider silk web" has a nice ring to it.
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"We've come for your spinnerettes. Cooperate and your biological diversity will be added to the Imperium. Fight us and you will end up in the Trophy Room. Resistance is futile."
 
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I'm against banning Erupt. It's a fun spell, and I like it. It's also not "that" broken, and we've used crazier level 9 spells in the past.

By the way @DragonParadox, I have a few questions :
  • Would this attack have happened if we hadn't tried to loot everything, and had simply focused on evacuating the locals?
  • Why did they start their attack by air?
  • Why didn't they go straight for the Magnar if breaking him would let their reinforcements in?
 
zxzx24 said:
Anybody feel like hitting up those phase spiders in the plane of air and buying or ripping out their biological secrets?

"Gargantuan phase spider silk web" has a nice ring to it.
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We could modify that spider collective we were talking about earlier to get their phase ability, so that they can just rise up out of the ground around their targets. Nothing says "comply with the State" quite like having sapient ghost spider swarms that producing burning acid venom as secret police.
 
I think the particular danger to the civilians here is rather unique to the Others.

Because Wyrmwraiths just turned CR 1-5 common people into CR 13 Dread Wraiths.
And those in turn could at least turn people into CR 5 Wraiths.

That kind of propagating damage and profit is absolutly unique to greater Undead.
Only the Others could have pulled of the attack and come out with more HD and CL in minions than they lost (even though the Wyrmwraiths were likely irreplacable, the profit in lesser ghosts technically outweights them).

The Deep Ones at there best can take over common soldiers and civilians with a value equal to what value they had for us. They couldn't have made a profit on an action like this.
 
zxzx24 said:
Mmm. Maybe time to touch base with a shaitan about a way to trap incorporeal creatures in the ground? Can't say if they would have a way or not.

As an aside. @DragonParadox how hard would it be to start producing and distributing alchemical capsules from complete adventurer? The craft(alchemy) dc is listed as... n/a

I can't find a website link, but its complete adventurer, page 121.
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Call it DC 10, they are pretty minor.

Duesal said:
The biggest takeaway for us here (aside from making sure to do evacuations before excavations) is that those wardstones are no joke. We might just have lost all of the Thenns if they weren't in place.

@DragonParadox, what level of runecrafting is necessary to make those?
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Lya could attempt it at her current level, though she would be more effective if she got 1-2 more.

TalonofAnathrax said:
I'm against banning Erupt. It's a fun spell, and I like it. It's also not "that" broken, and we've used crazier level 9 spells in the past.

By the way @DragonParadox, I have a few questions :
  • Would this attack have happened if we hadn't tried to loot everything, and had simply focused on evacuating the locals?
  • Why did they start their attack by air?
  • Why didn't they go straight for the Magnar if breaking him would let their reinforcements in?
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  1. There would have been a small chance of it happening from just taking the Thenns away though unlikely it would have happened with that many forces
  2. Because they are the Lords of Air and Night, the Other Dragon Rider wanted to participate and he would not have lowered himself to burrowing though the earth like a maggot
  3. Because that was only viable after enacting an attack elsewhere. Styr had to belive Viserys was killed and turned, kind of hard to do that without any known battle

On the matter of Erupt I have to admit I'm not a great fan of the fluff, but I don't dislike it enough to ban it out of hand. Maybe we can have a brief OOC vote?
 
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