- Location
- France
A Sword Without a Hilt: A Song of Ice and Fire/D&D 3.5 Crossover
- Thread starter DragonParadox
- Start date
-
- Tags
- a song of ice and fire a sword without a hilt d&d 3.5 dungeons & dragons 100% high octane dragon fuel ave corvidae battle action dragon diplomacy best sister bureaucromancy delicious soul-stuff dragon dreams come true dragon ta'veren greatest uncle hubris is a coward's word in defiance of gods and men mammon's folly mutually assured mage's disjunction qm murderhobo top tier coatl
- Location
- Germany
The SSE has always been extremely vaguely defined.
I honestly don't remember.
tarrangar
Fat arctic chicken
I'm okay with using Flesh Forge Krakens, and with those we can apply the Half-dragon and Deep dragon template to make them burrowing, have to apply a template to bump them down a CR though, a Half-dragon Deep dragon Kraken is CR16.
That is much better, than using the Deep dragon template, on a Half-dragon Kraken, I must admit.
- Location
- Germany
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Get them a cut, 'making more money for the company is more money for me' is an incentive that works with humans.
- Location
- France
The issue with that is that we semiregularly send them on voyages that don't really turn a profit (dealing with Dalla, carrying Arcane Marked stones to weird areas, etc).
- Location
- Germany
Surprisingly, it doesn't. Studies show that performance based pay works fine for mechanical jobs, but negatively affects both happiness and performance in cognitive jobs.
My personal observations during my working life suggest the same.
- Location
- France
My personal experience is that it also promotes unhealthy competition between colleagues. "I need to be the one to make this sale, so I'll try to stop my colleagues from doing it or I'll rush to do it as fast as possible even if a little more preparation/buildup/waiting would have been better".
Internal sabotage for the sake or promotions is very difficult to control, and can easily go very wrong. Devils are a prime example of this in-setting, actually : if the leader is great then everything works fine and everyone is very productive (if stressed, distrusting and unhappy), but if the leader can't keep an eye on everyone at all times then the whole operation suffers.
Internal sabotage for the sake or promotions is very difficult to control, and can easily go very wrong. Devils are a prime example of this in-setting, actually : if the leader is great then everything works fine and everyone is very productive (if stressed, distrusting and unhappy), but if the leader can't keep an eye on everyone at all times then the whole operation suffers.
- Location
- Germany
Don't forget the most important aspect. Even if you motivate your employees with this system, you will only ever motivate then to do the thing they get paid for.
I've seen an insane amount of, let's be honest here, fraud that was generated by these schemes.
In the end, you always ended up with formerly decently performing departments turning into cesspits where everyone was unhappy, hated each other and was actively sabotaging the company, either to fraudulently gain additional pay or out of pure spite.
Hell is bad management.
egoo
Totally Not Creating Problems Where None Existed
- Location
- Russia
Hey, @DragonParadox, you alright?
...I'm going...
For a...
Na~ap...
*menacing*
(But, like, seriously, shall we think again about buying DP satellite internet now? The last time was only semi-joking iirc)
...I'm going...
For a...
Na~ap...
*menacing*
(But, like, seriously, shall we think again about buying DP satellite internet now? The last time was only semi-joking iirc)
- Location
- France
Although obviously all of this doesn't apply to "good performance gets everyone a bonus, and getting noticed obviously increases your odds of a promotion", right?
Just to check : we're badmouthing systems while give a lot of weight to commissions here, right? Not general reward/bonus systems added on top of a reasonable base pay structure?
EDIT : @egoo I would be up or contributing to getting DP satellite. Although for banking reasons I'd have to literally send my participation as cash by post.
Just to check : we're badmouthing systems while give a lot of weight to commissions here, right? Not general reward/bonus systems added on top of a reasonable base pay structure?
EDIT : @egoo I would be up or contributing to getting DP satellite. Although for banking reasons I'd have to literally send my participation as cash by post.
- Location
- Germany
While the issues are ludicrously magnified the larger the percentage of commission pay to fixed pay is, even small "sugar on top" incentives can turn ugly. Especially communal things.
Imagine everyone would get a 5% bonus if some target is met by doing extra wirk and one person in the department is not interested in the bonus, thus not doing the extra work necessary to get everyone the bonus.
You get three guesses how that will turn out.
- Location
- Germany
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Are you sure that isn't a problem with the KPIs for 'performance-based'?
- Location
- Germany
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Hm. The department meets, rationally discusses things, comes to the conclusion that 5% after taxes etc. isn't worth the hassle and agrees to skip on the 'bonus'?
- Location
- France
True, but that kind of interpersonal office issue is the reason we pay managers.
- Location
- Germany
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Ooookay. Did anyone tell the managers?
- Location
- Germany
Definitely. Though I admit that scientific consensus might be tainted due to the plethora of intentionally malicious implementations.
Though I still hear all my colleagues, over years and years, all saying the same thing: "How about a not-shit fixed salary instead?"
- Location
- Germany
You must be really young and idealistic to believe that would work.
Numbers fictitious. Should have written X%.
- Location
- France
Just to be clear : every manager I've ever had was there to resolve that kind of issue. Of course they're not there to keep everyone from fighting, they're there to make that one guy work harder (and hopefully also to avoid letting things become too toxic, if they can).
EDIT : Wait, that's not true, I once worked in a small business where the owners were fighting with the manager and staff, and in that "us vs them" situation the managers were more or less on our side against the bosses. Horrible atmosphere overall of course, but for once we got managers who were genuinely there to keep employees happy and working together.
I quit as soon as my temp contract ended of course, that sort of dispute clearly wasn't going to end well.
EDIT : Wait, that's not true, I once worked in a small business where the owners were fighting with the manager and staff, and in that "us vs them" situation the managers were more or less on our side against the bosses. Horrible atmosphere overall of course, but for once we got managers who were genuinely there to keep employees happy and working together.
I quit as soon as my temp contract ended of course, that sort of dispute clearly wasn't going to end well.
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- Location
- France
Remember this, everyone? If we really were Azor Ahai we'd probably be feeling bad about this and attempting to help; but in fact we're not huge friends of the Red Priests and therefore don't consider this a priority at all.
All those faithful waiting for their prophet have been bamboozled!
- Location
- Germany
My personal theory is that the issue stems from the lack of control a employee has over his work and it's outcome.
Take a smith. He gets paid per sword forged. He can set his own pace, organize himself and does not need to rely on any factor outside his control. He will be motivated by a performance bonus, since honest work gets him honest money.
Now look at the modern office drone (a mirror should help most of you here). The amount of control you have over your work is often tiny. You need to interact with customers and suppliers, who might act in surprising ways. You need interact with other departments that have different priorities. At any moment, you might get a call from higher up on the corporate ladder and do whatever that person tells you.
Sales departments are reliant on product quality, logistics, customer service, the economic environment and the whims of their customers. They can barely affect any of that.
If you work as a cashier at Walmart, you can't set prices, do marketing, select products to sell or do anything else that would affect how many people will leave how much money in your register. You just sit there and take it.
Of course these people will not be happy with "performance" pay. Their own performance is a vanishingly small cog in a extremely complex chain of events. In effect, it's "arbitrary pay" and people will obviously resent that.
Take a smith. He gets paid per sword forged. He can set his own pace, organize himself and does not need to rely on any factor outside his control. He will be motivated by a performance bonus, since honest work gets him honest money.
Now look at the modern office drone (a mirror should help most of you here). The amount of control you have over your work is often tiny. You need to interact with customers and suppliers, who might act in surprising ways. You need interact with other departments that have different priorities. At any moment, you might get a call from higher up on the corporate ladder and do whatever that person tells you.
Sales departments are reliant on product quality, logistics, customer service, the economic environment and the whims of their customers. They can barely affect any of that.
If you work as a cashier at Walmart, you can't set prices, do marketing, select products to sell or do anything else that would affect how many people will leave how much money in your register. You just sit there and take it.
Of course these people will not be happy with "performance" pay. Their own performance is a vanishingly small cog in a extremely complex chain of events. In effect, it's "arbitrary pay" and people will obviously resent that.
- Location
- France
I agree with you, obviously, but I'm rating this as "funny" because of the mirror line.
- Location
- United States
Actually I was gonna push for helping evacuate those guys as soon as we're done with the Golden Company. Cooperative Pro-Viserys Red Priests should be protected as valuable assets.
- Location
- Germany
Our pet has his own Powermetal song:
Not bad, I like it so far.
Not bad, I like it so far.
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So much for the notion that I would have more time today
Vote closed.
Vote closed.