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A Sword Without a Hilt: A Song of Ice and Fire/D&D 3.5 Crossover

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Goldfish said:
AMF is NOT a good idea here. DP already confirmed that AMF doesn't always block psionics, and vice versa with the Anti-Psionic Field power. We could use AMF, suppress our really important buffs, such as Mind Blank, and be completely vulnerable to a follow-up psionic attack.
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@Goldfish, @Artemis1992, fight it out, I'll be back in ~10 minutes.
:sour:

Woop woop woop
 
Regarding the "creating sentient beings" debate : is it truly evil to create a servant that is happy to serve? You aren't going to mistreat it, and you aren't going to enslave it (if it decides to quit for some reason, it's not your property and can presumably do so). You aren't killing it pointlessly, and it's living rather well. Hell, it's even happy and enjoys its job!
Or is this a "False Ravens should be paid" issue? That would make more sense to me, honestly. They're working for us, so it would make sense for them to demand some sort of salary. I'm not saying we should be paying them a massive fortune, but they're definitely worth "skilled worker + danger pay" at the very least.

Anyway, that seems as morally upstanding as creating sentients is ever likely to get. In many cases, this is even more morally upstanding than actual humans having actual children!
 
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Goldfish said:
@DragonParadox, did you ever decide on the numbers of Teleport, Plane Shift and Sending charms we bought in Vialisk?

And to go even further off topic, what kind of non-Elemental animals live in the City of Brass? Are there rodent equivalents, birds, vermin, etc?

Speaking of the City of Brass, an update interlude would be neat to see how things are going at the shop.
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*rolls*

You found twenty each. I'll add them tomorrow to the proper update

There are indeed rodents, insects and even petty spirits that serve similar roles in the City of Brass

I'll do and interlude soon.
 
Goldfish said:
AMF is NOT a good idea here. DP already confirmed that AMF doesn't always block psionics, and vice versa with the Anti-Psionic Field power. We could use AMF, suppress our really important buffs, such as Mind Blank, and be completely vulnerable to a follow-up psionic attack.
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It's meant only for the specific case that our Diviner who doesn't want to be called that turns into a squid.

If the statue becomes something fighty, I agree with you our own options are more important.
 
DragonParadox said:
The research cost would be reasonably small since it is just a level 1 spell and it has a certain thematic resonance with snakes and reptiles, so I would say 10 progress. That said I would suggest using a larger snake, Hoard Gullet on a tinny creature can only fit a tiny corpse.
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I gave up on using them for corpse collecting, they're now for looting magic items and other valuables, I'm thinking the Celestial fortresses would be very glad to have them, according to what information we have they're ever besieged, and in such a siege, most of the time when they kill something they don't have the opportunity to loot it, looting snakes could allow them to retrieve a lot more of that loot, denying it to their enemies and giving it to them.

Also are you sure a tiny snake can only fit tiny creatures in its mouth? A real life snake managed to eat a creature 1.6 times its mass, the looting snakes would only need to the thing in its mouth not actually eat it, and they would be specially designed to be able to stretch their mouth as much as possible, so I would think they would be able to fit something at least a quarter of a size category bigger than them, maybe as much as half a size category.

And both tiny and small Vipers are 1HD, I just prefer using Tiny Vipers as they have better hide skills.
Azel said:
Fine. Let me go on the record then and tell you it is a bad idea for a lot of reasons and given the choice between a disposable loot grabber and an actual combat capable minion, any prospective buyer would use the second and just give a skilled scout a Bag of Holding to go looting.

Unrelated to that, both Vee and the Old Gods would not be entirely happy with the idea of mass-producing animals as disposable war assets. It would be quite a deviation from how Viserys has been treating his Fungus Forge creatures and intelligent constructs so far.

Non-intelligent Undead or Constructs would be a much better choice.
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If they cost the same I definitely agree with you, but a minion capable of combat on the kind of battlefields my looters are meant for, are likely to cost at least 10 times as much as a looter, when they're only supposed to sneak, you can get away with them being 1HD creatures, which mean they cost almost nothing to make in the Fungus Forge, if they have to fight, then they need to at least be on the level of the average warrior on the battlefield, and on the Planar battlefields, that tend to mean more than 5HD.

Edit and this is the last I say on this until we visit the Fortresses and find out the actual situation, until then I can't determine, if they're worth the 10 research point cost.
 
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tarrangar said:
Also are you sure a tiny snake can only fit tiny creatures in its mouth? A real life snake managed to eat a creature 1.6 times its mass, the looting snakes would only need to the thing in its mouth not actually eat it, and they would be specially designed to be able to stretch their mouth as much as possible, so I would think they would be able to fit something at least a quarter of a size category bigger than them, maybe as much as half a size category.
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Things 1.6 larger than a tiny creature is still in the same size category. Size categories increase by x8 with every step by volume due to the square cube law. I'd rule that is too much of a stretch.
 
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DragonParadox said:
Things 1.6 larger than a tiny creature is still in the same size category. Size categories increase by x8 with every step by volume due to the square cube law. I'd rule that is too much of a stretch.
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Size categories increase by up to x8, but there's sub size categories in the size categories, if we say a tiny snake is a 5 pound snake, then it might be able to swallow a small creature that weight 10 pounds, by that same point a 50 pound small snake, might be able to swallow an 80 pound medium creature, size categories are scales, and so there's variations within those sizes, a goblin is on the big side of small creatures, and a human is on the small side of medium creatures, so the human average size, is only 2-3 times the goblin average size.

That's why I said the snakes should be able to swallow something a quarter size category up, so they should be able to swallow things, that are only barely in the next size up.
 
tarrangar said:
Size categories increase by up to x8, but there's sub size categories in the size categories, if we say a tiny snake is a 5 pound snake, then it might be able to swallow a small creature that weight 10 pounds, by that same point a 50 pound small snake, might be able to swallow an 80 pound medium creature, size categories are scales, and so there's variations within those sizes, a goblin is on the big side of small creatures, and a human is on the small side of medium creatures, so the human average size, is only 2-3 times the goblin average size.

That's why I said the snakes should be able to swallow something a quarter size category up, so they should be able to swallow things, that are only barely in the next size up.
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The logic here is sound, but the trouble is I don't really want to go into that level detail, size categories exist for a reason and that is because abstraction makes the game easier to run. For instance a snake that is almost small (rather than tiny) would have to posses a bit more HD. How much? I don't know and I don't think it's worth finding out, it's just splitting the hairs too fine for the system. Better to just make the snake small, or medium for that matter, it's not that much more costly
 
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Vote closed.
Adhoc vote count started by DragonParadox on Nov 6, 2019 at 3:31 PM, finished with 106 posts and 9 votes.
  • [X] Do it in the Snare, inside the summoning circle, the safest place you know to hold the darkness, should the Idol release some sort of corruption, or make a guiding light for transposing the forces of Deep Ones.
    -[X] Have Breath Taker, Jeyne and Relath present.
    -[X] Have Chain Mindblank cast on everyone present by Dany.
    -[X] Spread many of the Aberration-detecting Pearls from Vialesk throughout the room, so that nothing can escape in secret without triggering them.
    --[X] Pick them up after the identification, they can be of more use elsewhere, Snare's main function has little to do with Psionics.
    -[X] Apply additional precautions, like setting a carefully arranged Refusal spell upon the Snare chamber and layering Ghoul Glyphs as closely within the Summoning Circle as possible.
    -[X] Keep a readied action to cast Anti-Magic field when the identification happens, in case the Idol will start transforming the Gith in manner alike to Fearex's - an AMF would likely disrupt that process.
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DragonParadox said:
The logic here is sound, but the trouble is I don't really want to go into that level detail, size categories exist for a reason and that is because abstraction makes the game easier to run. For instance a snake that is almost small (rather than tiny) would have to posses a bit more HD. How much? I don't know and I don't think it's worth finding out, it's just splitting the hairs too fine for the system. Better to just make the snake small, or medium for that matter, it's not that much more costly
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I wasn't thinking about using it for size categories, so much as using it for gathering other loot, so the calculation for what loot a snake can swallow, is twice the average weight for its size category, a tiny snake average out at 4 pounds, so it can swallow items up to eight pounds.

Also good news everyone, I just wrote a new chapter of Falabix's story.
 
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I don't remember, is there some way to make a spell go from self only, to being able to use it on other? Because if there is, instead of a research action, the problem of the Vipers not being able to cast magic, could be solved with their handler having an item that can cast hoard gullet.

Also I know I said I would stop talking about this idea for now, but I thought of something new, and so of course I had to ask.
 
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egoo said:
I fucking knew it!

*summer teaching practice-flashbacks intensify*

[:V]
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You made me spit my soda.

edit:
I have been busy. But todays discussion fascinated me. For one pretty big reason.


Looking fly, as usual.

edit: Too wordy.

The benefits people get for staying with us is our first and greatest weapon as a ruler. We should never stop sharpening it. Even beings created to be loyal can and will turn against you if motivated correctly. Something people are undoubtedly skilled at by now.

edit:edit: Much cleaner.
 
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Inserted tally
Adhoc vote count started by DragonParadox on Nov 6, 2019 at 3:31 PM, finished with 106 posts and 9 votes.
  • [X] Do it in the Snare, inside the summoning circle, the safest place you know to hold the darkness, should the Idol release some sort of corruption, or make a guiding light for transposing the forces of Deep Ones.
    -[X] Have Breath Taker, Jeyne and Relath present.
    -[X] Have Chain Mindblank cast on everyone present by Dany.
    -[X] Spread many of the Aberration-detecting Pearls from Vialesk throughout the room, so that nothing can escape in secret without triggering them.
    --[X] Pick them up after the identification, they can be of more use elsewhere, Snare's main function has little to do with Psionics.
    -[X] Apply additional precautions, like setting a carefully arranged Refusal spell upon the Snare chamber and layering Ghoul Glyphs as closely within the Summoning Circle as possible.
    -[X] Keep a readied action to cast Anti-Magic field when the identification happens, in case the Idol will start transforming the Gith in manner alike to Fearex's - an AMF would likely disrupt that process.
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Part MMMCLX: To Snare a Wandering Mind
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    • To Snare a Wandering Mind ​

    Nineteenth Day of the Eleventh Month 293 AC

    The Snare has held a great many spirits over the past few months; daemons of plague and pestilence, abyssal generals and on one memorable occasion, whose trophy is now a familiar weight upon your shoulders, an Arch-Duke of Hell. Yet for all the horrors of the Dark Realms that have stood in this place there has never been something stranger than the twisted idol that now stands within the summoning circle, not that you expect it to contain whatever might be lurking within. With cunning wards layered upon those already anchored into the stone and runes of death laid out so close to the line that thin arcs of sickly green light dance between them you hope to trap any foe, even as heavy lead and a protection forged by Dany is placed upon each mind present aught to keep any wandering seer's eyes from glimpsing what is to come.

    To his credit Master Nazath had waited patently through all your preparations, though his eyes never strayed from the idol for a moment. Hatred smolders there, but not untempered by the caution and the restraint of his strange discipline of the mind. At your nod to proceed he steps from between Relath and Lya opposite to you. A colorless crystal ring upon his finger that you had missed before burns with white flame, the light reflected in the scores of Pearls of Clarity scattered throughout the chamber, be they hung upon chains, spread along the ground or fused into walls, all the better to detect unseen trespass, or so at least you hope.

    There is no incantation to the githzerai master's work, nor can you sense more from it even with your senses humming in anticipation than a vague luminescence floating though the chamber, as his eyes remain closed, his expression serene. Turning your gaze to Jeyne you see her watching intently, almost fearfully. She is probably getting more out of this than you.

    The mind mage's robes rustle in an breeze only he can feel, he takes half a step back, his expression momentarily pained, then determined. A muscle in his jaw twitches. Abruptly his eyes snap open. "You must destroy it quickly, before it can call for aid. There is no time for gods and sacrificial daggers. The sooner it is cleansed the sooner the peril is passed from your realm, great lord."

    You open your mouth to ask for details on just what is coming, you had dealt with Mammon in this chamber after all. If an enemy was so considerate as to give you time to prepare... But something feels odd rather than merely disappointing about the answer. You had not mentioned any sacrificial daggers and Nazath had not felt the need to grant you any titles when you had first met. Mayhap it was only a moment's awkwardness. Were this any other time, any other place, you would not give the matter a second thought. Here and now you strain your sight to its utmost, the contours of the room almost painfully bright... there.

    Thin tendrils of corpse-pallid light now bind the deformed idol to the mystic, like strings on a puppet, the subtlest you have ever seen and all done through the mind ward. A chill runs down your spine... no, the aura is a little too bright, hollow. The idol, or whatever power inhabited it, has dispelled the ward, enthralled Nazath and spun a false aura all under the cover of his own magic. Better than the enthrallment working through the ward but not by much.

    What do you do?

    [] Attempt to break the enthrallment
    -[] With dispel
    -[] With an antimagic field
    -[] With a miracle

    [] Play along, perhaps, it does not know you have seen though the guise, perhaps you might learn something of use

    [] Write in

    OOC: The gith did not have much luck with rolls, but Viserys rolled quite high on his Sense Motive so here we are.
     
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