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A Sword Without a Hilt: A Song of Ice and Fire/D&D 3.5 Crossover

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Eleas said:
Why would you say that D&D5 represents "the way P&P systems are evolving"? It's popular, but to attribute that to D&D being groundbreaking is unwarranted IMHO. I don't see it, so I'd be interested in hearing more.
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Increased streamlining and simplification of systems, with a strong trend to "default builds" and little ability to stray from that path.

Which, again, isn't wrong in of itself, but it seems when you want a complex system these days, you need to dig out old editions, since the new ones are all getting shallower.
 
I just got an insane idea.

So the Others have Ice Spiders, right?

I want to make a Valyrian Steel Winterbane Construct Spider. It can be Benjen Stark's pet monstrosity.

Spiders are ridiculously fast, btw.
 
...Is anyone else tired of the tourney already?
I somehow find myself tired and not really caring for even melee finals :/

Let's hope mage fights will be more interesting, or something...

(Not advocating for stopping the updates, or cutting anything out. Just kinda uninterested atm)
 
egoo said:
...Is anyone else tired of the tourney already?
I somehow find myself tired and not really caring for even melee finals :/

Let's hope mage fights will be more interesting, or something...
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There's the jousts, the team battles, and the mage battles. :p We've only gotten done with one fourth of the Grand Tourney.
 
egoo said:
...Is anyone else tired of the tourney already?
I somehow find myself tired and not really caring for even melee finals :/

Let's hope mage fights will be more interesting, or something...

(Not advocating for stopping the updates, or cutting anything off. Just kinda disinterested aam)
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I'm getting your fatigue, but we also have a lot of social stuff in between.

Though in general, I think we could have a lot less updates for the joust (since those are not terribly varied), none for the archery (sorry, but there is no way to make shooting at targets interesting) and then go on to a few selected mage fights and the group battles.
 
Azel said:
What makes me view 5e with a lot of apprehension is the fake depth. It's still the rules heavy and constraining system of D&D, but they cut down on a ton of options, leaving me a lot heavier constrained then 3.5, which has a splat-book and thus a rules conform way to achieve almost everything.

It's like... training wheels D&D, offering a lot of it's problems in granular character design and none of the depth that 3.5 and Pathfinder have. And I hate constraining systems.

If you want to play mainly story focused game, I would suggest to try out FUDGE, which leaves your with a system so light on rules that you can explain it in 15 minutes.
If you want an engine heavy game, I turn to something like D&D 3.5 or Shadowrun, where the engine has many, many options.

But 5E looks like neither fish nor meat.
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FISH ARE MEAT. I don't get it.
 
Vote closed
Adhoc vote count started by DragonParadox on Mar 14, 2019 at 3:41 PM, finished with 69 posts and 11 votes.
  • [X] Speak with Sandor
    -[X] Wait until he has regained an acceptable amount of blood and the right number of bodily openings.
    -[X] Congratulate him on his victory. There are few men who could have won here and even fewer who would have been willing to take as much punishment as he did. // I mean, it's established that our tourney is a lot more brutal then others thanks to healing magic, but Sandor won half his fights while literally bleeding to death and the last one with a spear in his lung.
    -[X] Ask him what he plans to do now with his winnings. // Sometimes the simple questions are the best. He can't exactly waltz back into the Red Keep with all his Targ merchandise and Tywin will be less then pleased at receiving him after publicly appearing in the tourney and even having a friendly chat with the Red Viper during the finale.
    -[X] Whatever he does, let Valaena level up
    --[X] Attribute: +1 Dexterity
    --[X] Class: +1 Magus
    --[X] Skills (6 Points): +1 Concentration, +1 Knowledge(Arcana), +1 Ride, +1 Spellcraft, +2 Handle Animal
    --[X] Spell:
    ---[X] 3rd Level: Displacement
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Xander quest on spacebattles has been doing the same birthday for 9 months now. They have approximately done one and a half days out of 3.

Just be happy. :)
 
egoo said:
...Is anyone else tired of the tourney already?
I somehow find myself tired and not really caring for even melee finals :/

Let's hope mage fights will be more interesting, or something...

(Not advocating for stopping the updates, or cutting anything out. Just kinda uninterested atm)
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I was afraid of something like this. Fortunately the joust should go quickly. I can probably do it all in one or two updates since the rolls are simple. We will see about the mage duels and team fights, those are naturally quite complex.
 
Sqweaktoy said:
To be blunt, disagree in the strongest possible terms. But I feel I can' t elaborate on in a way you won't find insulting. Thank you for your input, genuinely. It's nice to get a look at a perspective I disagree with so fundamentally phrased in a thorough, honest fashion.
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Feel free to PM me.
I've read through these debates on 4chan's /tg/ - I'm pretty sure that I can't be offended anymore :D

At a guess, you disagree over what kind of priorities D&D is supposed to have? So my priorities sound stupid, etc ?

To me D&D isn't the "simple entry to RPGs" game, you see. It's the "high magic RPG" where tactics and socials matter a lot, where skillmonkeys and combat power are the center of a successful campaign and where a good session 0 to make sure everyone's concepts and builds are compatible is necessary and expected.
 
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DragonParadox said:
I was afraid of something like this. Fortunately the joust should go quickly. I can probably do it all in one or two updates since the rolls are simple. We will see about the mage duels and team fights, those are naturally quite complex.
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Please do not skip over Mage and group to much.

Don't really care about Archery and Joust, but the former two are something I'm really looking forward to.
 
DragonParadox said:
I was afraid of something like this. Fortunately the joust should go quickly. I can probably do it all in one or two updates since the rolls are simple. We will see about the mage duels and team fights, those are naturally quite complex.
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@egoo's issues aside, I'm not in any hurry to finish up the Festival. The month is coming to a close and there isn't much left to show. Jousting shouldn't be time intensive, archery needs at most one update and maybe not even that, and mage duels should be covered in two or three days.

Despite all the Festival events, we've covered a ton of other stuff this month. It's been awesome.
 
I am perfectly happy to get a close and in-depth look at all potential minions.

EDIT: I don't mind streamlining a few things, though. I just need the relevant numbers and the loot they have.
 
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Goldfish said:
@egoo's issues aside, I'm not in any hurry to finish up the Festival. The month is coming to a close and there isn't much left to show. Jousting shouldn't be time intensive, archery needs at most one update and maybe not even that, and mage duels should be covered in two or three days.

Despite all the Festival events, we've covered a ton of other stuff this month. It's been awesome.
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+1000
 
Azel said:
Increased streamlining and simplification of systems, with a strong trend to "default builds" and little ability to stray from that path.

Which, again, isn't wrong in of itself, but it seems when you want a complex system these days, you need to dig out old editions, since the new ones are all getting shallower.
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I deleted my post as I felt you'd gone into sufficient detail in subsequent posts*. But I'm not sure this is correct in general. Most modern systems don't really have the concept of the "build": that kind of straitjacket is largely emblematic of the d20 family.

(*Regardless, thank you for explaining.)
 
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Eleas said:
I deleted my post as I felt you'd gone into sufficient detail in subsequent posts*. But I'm not sure this is correct in general. Most modern systems don't really have the concept of the "build": that kind of straitjacket is largely emblematic of the d20 family.

(*Regardless, thank you for responding.)
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Most games I play that have actual character stats have the concept of "build". One PC has limited resources, and can't be good at everything. Thus you pick a character concept and try to achieve it. Unless the rules fit in one page, there's typically certain things to prioritize.

Usual things that result in "builds":
  • The cost of certain character traits (skills, "feats", advantages of some sort) depends on previous selections, like in Dark Heresy 2E
  • Actual skill mechanics exist, where one skill can't do everything. For example, being a social character requires having a certain subset of skills or is incompatible with certain other choices (being an obvious mutant, being heavily armed...)
  • Class systems, "Archetypes"
  • Racial effects that are very important
  • Cybernetics or otherwise difficult to obtain gear that you can get at character creation, that is fundamental to certain activities and that is otherwise very hard to get in other contexts (surprisingly common)
  • Setting-specific stuff, of course. This is usually intended. For example, trying to play an illegal wizard in Warhammer Fantasy Battle requires the skills and gear to hide your talents. Otherwise you'll die quickly at the hands of witch hunters / the mob. This seems deliberate.
 
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