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A Sword Without a Hilt: A Song of Ice and Fire/D&D 3.5 Crossover

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Amrelath has had six thousand years to think about all the ways he will strike it rich. He has probably actually got a good plan in the works, as Vaela noted by the end of their conversation.

Amrelath plays 4th Dimensional Hyper Cyvasse with the rest of us.
 
Deliste said:
I'd really rather let him do it himself altogether, unless your motivation is to ensure they don't become too personally loyal then involving ourselves is undermining near every positive aspect of this.
He's a big Dragon, he can take care of his hoard.
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He needs good contacts to purchase from (ak or ov does for that) and he needs gold. He has ten k. That's it. And finding more takes time. I'm all for giving them stuff and a permanent (bought with xp scrolls) method of surviving the plane of fire. I'd say planar adaption, but (I think) it's level 4, and resist elements (fire) gives 30 resistance against fire, and is level 2 or 3. Much cheaper.

Obviously, antimagic is a problem, but eh. Only so much you can do.
 
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Deliste said:
I'd really rather let him do it himself altogether, unless your motivation is to ensure they don't become too personally loyal then involving ourselves is undermining near every positive aspect of this.
He's a big Dragon, he can take care of his hoard.
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If he really wants to do things all on his own then he's welcome to, it's his party members who are going to be dealing with the resulting shortage of gear.
 
Duesal said:
If he really wants to do things all on his own then he's welcome to, it's his party members who are going to be dealing with the resulting shortage of gear.
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Could always take a loan. To be fair a debt of coin is preferable to those who are confident they can make more money. Tyene could always just heal people for money and confidently pay off any debt even if her business floundered.

A favored owed can be called in at any time, and of course you risk wrinkling your pride by refusing to adhere to your word of honor in such matters. Or that might be a draconic perspective.

Though I mean, if it weren't for us, I doubt many banks would be lining up to make a loan to a Red Chromatic Dragon. :V

#RecoveringRedRep
 
Duesal said:
If he really wants to do things all on his own then he's welcome to, it's his party members who are going to be dealing with the resulting shortage of gear.
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Yeah and it's his party, he can hardly learn anything if we constantly hold his hand talon.

They are his responsibility, to manage, to teach, to equip if necessary, it is his responsibility to ensure they are capable to do their job in all respects.
 
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Deliste said:
Yeah and it's his party, he can hardly learn anything if we constantly hold his hand talon.

They are his responsibility, to manage, to teach, to equip if necessary, it is his responsibility to ensure they are capable to do their job in all respects.
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The reason why I proposed stepping in was because I believed Amrelath would have the foresight to realize that his overall position would be far better for it. So what if his liege helps him gear up his party? All of a sudden his party is far more equipped to survive the plane where he's supposed to set up, and the bonds of loyalty that you're worried about can be forged through the inevitable battles as he carves out his own province. Helping out our vassal with gear is not 'holding his hand', especially since we made the plane hyperattentive to Red Dragons very recently.

But alright. I take it that in addition to providing no gear, none of them should get the standard contingency spells like Stalwart Pact and Renewal Pact? That might be holding their hands too much.
 
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Duesal said:
The reason why I proposed stepping in was because I believed Amrelath would have the foresight to realize that his overall position would be far better for it. So what if his liege helps him gear up his party? All of a sudden his party is far more equipped to survive the plane where he's supposed to set up, and the bonds of loyalty that you're worried about can be forged through the inevitable battles as he carves out his own province. Helping out our vassal with gear is not 'holding his hand', especially since we made the plane hyperattentive to Red Dragons very recently.

But alright. I take it that in addition to providing no gear, none of them should get the standard contingency spells like Stalwart Pact and Renewal Pact? That might be holding their hands too much.
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Ok I understand where you're coming from now but consider what Amrelath is doing, he is emulating Viserys, Viserys takes care of his own, he doesn't "allow" his companions to become better equipped, he makes it happen.

If Amrelath came to us and asked to have his people equipped that is a very different scenario.
 
Deliste said:
Ok I understand where you're coming from now but consider what Amrelath is doing, he is emulating Viserys, Viserys takes care of his own, he doesn't "allow" his companions to become better equipped, he makes it happen.

If Amrelath came to us and asked to have his people equipped that is a very different scenario.
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And this is what's frustrating to me. With this mindset, we cannot help our own subjects to the fullest extent, simply because of a desire for Amrelath to do everything on his own. No gear, no contingency spells, nada, because it's "his party"... even though the fate of our province effectively rests on their wellbeing, and even though the Efreeti are terrifying when they move in force.

But I can see this has no little to no support, so I'm not going to waste more time on this. You win, no equipment.
 
Don't know what y'all are talking about. Big Red can do whatever he likes five years from now, but for the foreseeable future if I want him in an enchanted tutu, Big Red asks how high he's about to pirouette for the crowd. And as far as I'm concerned if he picks up any back-up dancers along the way, those get tutus too.
 
Duesal said:
The reason why I proposed stepping in was because I believed Amrelath would have the foresight to realize that his overall position would be far better for it. So what if his liege helps him gear up his party? All of a sudden his party is far more equipped to survive the plane where he's supposed to set up, and the bonds of loyalty that you're worried about can be forged through the inevitable battles as he carves out his own province. Helping out our vassal with gear is not 'holding his hand', especially since we made the plane hyperattentive to Red Dragons very recently.

But alright. I take it that in addition to providing no gear, none of them should get the standard contingency spells like Stalwart Pact and Renewal Pact? That might be holding their hands too much.
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I strongly hold the position of gear and pacts being good things. These (horribly fragile) people work for Viserys through Amrelath. As Amrelath's liege, and one who has an idea of Amrelath's limited wealth, the practical reality of the situation means that being the boss person means we should cover home for these resources

@Deliste I strongly disagree with your perspective. We love it when our people come with equipment, or at least I do. We just don't have it happen very often. Wyla's wish blade is a lovely example of a rare exception.

Also, draconic pride might mean Amy won't bring the issue up unless we do. Maybe. Of course, a good way would be, as Crake suggested, a loan to Amrealth for the value of all the equipment he's getting. I mean, if Viserys could have taken an interest free (for X years) loan to be paid in gold for the price of magic items, someone trustworthy, I would have jumped on that.

Unrelated, does relath have a familiar!?!?

I mean, I just thought dragonpen, but those are strategic assets, but whatever, I just wanna see what people think he would want as one?

Wait... Did Relath replace it with an Alternate Class Feature? *Wanders off to check*
Duesal said:
And this is what's frustrating to me. With this mindset, we cannot help our own subjects to the fullest extent, simply because of a desire for Amrelath to do everything on his own. No gear, no contingency spells, nada, because it's "his party"... even though the fate of our province effectively rests on their wellbeing, and even though the Efreeti are terrifying when they move in force.

But I can see this has no little to no support, so I'm not going to waste more time on this. You win, no equipment.
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Noooo! Max equipment!
 
BeepSmile said:
I mean, I just thought dragonpen, but those are strategic assets, but whatever, I just wanna see what people think he would want as one?
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I'm going to be campaigning for every governor to get a dragonpen. Relath can absolutely get one as a familiar (or just about anything he wants, really). As per the ritual we came up with, anyone with proper casting can get themselves an Improved Familiar through it.
 
Duesal said:
I'm going to be campaigning for every governor to get a dragonpen. Relath can absolutely get one as a familiar (or just about anything he wants, really). As per the ritual we came up with, anyone with proper casting can get themselves an Improved Familiar through it.
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I mean, thatttt has a small difference in what you said and what our shared aims are. Local governors in westerns are lords. I want to undermine their power, so not blanket dragonpens for all governors, just those we like. What about ones for governors we like and for all our top regional andmistrators? Also, rather than a pen being bound to an individual person, can it be bound to a role in the beaurcracy (with provisions to move to different roles as the systems and organisations change, obviously. No point setting this up in such a way that forces calcification of the sturcure more than is natural).


After gold devalues massively on POB I want to make many dragonpens

Also... The cold that we remove from the plnetos economy.. can that not be spent in AK? Or possibly a city in the plane of water?

Edit: I'm not kidding about all the gear. I want them at 50% party quality, I mean we have to invest in plane of fire protection in some way, might as well go full hog.
 
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BeepSmile said:
I mean, thatttt has a small difference in what you said and what our shared aims are. Local governors in westerns are lords. I want to undermine their power, so not blanket dragonpens for all governors, just those we like. What about ones for governors we like and for all our top regional andmistrators? Also, rather than a pen being bound to an individual person, can it be bound to a role in the beaurcracy (with provisions to move to different roles as the systems and organisations change, obviously. No point setting this up in such a way that forces calcification of the sturcure more than is natural).


After gold devalues massively on POB I want to make many dragonpens

Also... The cold that we remove from the plnetos economy.. can that not be spent in AK? Or possibly a city in the plane of water?

Edit: I'm not kidding about all the gear. I want them at 50% party quality, I mean we have to invest in plane of fire protection in some way, might as well go full hog.
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Governors are like provincial. Leaders of cities and kingdoms, those are the governors.
 
@bigbow, I would release the Companions right now since this pretty much is the birth of the Imperium. It's this huge event that will for the first time foster a feeling of we between our holdings.

Also, you are missing:
- The angelic archers who are totally not Erinyes. You can tell by the way that they look stern and fierce instead of showing cruel laughter and their equipment isn't spiky.
- The Djinn and Shaitan, allies of the Dragon.
- The Efreeti, who look like magical slaver magisters.
- Tywin Lannister, carrying bags of gold and sneering at his surroundings.
- Gregor Clegane, a grotesquely oversized and malformed knight.
- Armory Lorch, a weasely looking knight who carries some human heads on his belt.
- The underfed Westerosi peasant line, who look pretty starved and unwilling, yet carry crude weapons for their masters.
- The Unsullied, looking decently fierce, though rather weak next to the armored bulk of the Legion.
- Slave soldiers, who resemble the peasants, but have collars.
 
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Duesal said:
That was pretty funny. :rofl: I think we really made a big impression on him in Valyria when Viserys and his Companions took down the Maharaja Rakshasa, something that could have easily murdered us on an individual level. That, and he also worked with them during cleanup.

He's seen firsthand just how incredibly valuable competent party members can be. Good on him for taking initiative and finding his own... even if the first one was literally a level 3 cleric. :facepalm: I really hope DP takes my suggestion of adventures in Prime Material to toughen her up before tossing her into the Plane of Fire.
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He is doing it on purpose. He has seen some people who would be very weak be very strong instead (human children). So now he is seeing if he can stress test a weak mortal with dragon blood to something impressive. after all the worst thing that can happen is that she dies and that will just mean he overshot and should test again with someone sttronger. Amrelath is not being foolish here, he is being callous.
 
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Great omake @Crake I covered the more down to earth part of the battle that I did not have time to go over wonderfully.I may borrow the characters in future updates.

@bigbow great work on the figurines. They provide a great bit of fluff and background elements for the many young characters we have running about.
 
@DragonParadox
What stats does Vaela have?

I have an idea for a Pathfinder Cleric with the Crashing Wave archetype eventually going for Envoy of Balance under the Merling King and would like to try out making her sheet this evening.
 
@DragonParadox, seeing as the turn vote seems stabilised now, could we get Minor Actions one next?

You can keep the threadmark on the previous one, and I'll just edit it.
 
Azel said:
- The angelic archers who are totally not Erinyes. You can tell by the way that they look stern and fierce instead of showing cruel laughter and their equipment isn't spiky.
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He already has the Imperial Furies that are totally not devils.

@bigbow
Some more ideas:

Our Iron Golems, guarding something.

The Elemental Wyrmlings.

Moonsong and her crew?

The B-Party, Valaena and her dragon, Argo, Bronn, a few Taenas.
 
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