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Yeah I'm calling it here. Vote Closed

Adhoc vote count started by Teen Spirit on Mar 12, 2025 at 9:14 AM, finished with 165 posts and 46 votes.

  • [X] Plan Doctor Visit and Girl Talks
    -[X] [Conversation] Speak with Alicent Hightower
    -[X] [Conversation] Speak with Ser Raylon Tarly
    -[X] [Conversation] Speak with Maester Orwyle
    -[X] [Conversation] Speak with Laena Velaryon
    -[X] [Action] Train
    --[X] Challenge to a Duel: Raylon has suggested dueling others as a way of sharpening yourself against new blades. Have others find flaws in you that he has missed (Pick One)
    ---[X] [Duel] One of the Dornish Nobles
    -[X] [Action] Train with Syrax
    [X] Plan: Important Talks
    -[X] [Conversation] Speak with Otto Hightower
    -[X] [Conversation] Speak with Alicent Hightower
    -[X] [Conversation] Speak with Ser Raylon Tarly
    -[X] [Conversation] Speak with Laena Velaryon
    -[X] [Action] Train
    --[X] Challenge to a Duel: Raylon has suggested dueling others as a way of sharpening yourself against new blades. Have others find flaws in you that he has missed (Pick One)
    ---[X] [Duel] One of the Dornish Nobles
    -[X] [Action] Train with Syrax
    [X] Plan Doctor Visit
    -[X] [Conversation] Speak with Gwayne And Alicent
    -[X] [Conversation] Speak with Ser Raylon Tarly
    -[X] [Action] Train
    --[X] Challenge to a Duel: Raylon has suggested dueling others as a way of sharpening yourself against new blades. Have others find flaws in you that he has missed (Pick One)
    ---[X] [Duel] One of the Dornish Nobles
    -[X] [Conversation] Speak with Laena Velaryon
    -[X] [Action] Train with Syrax
    -[X] [Conversation] Speak with Maester Orwyle
    [X] Plan: Grand Maester Conspiracy
    -[X] [Conversation] Speak with Ser Raylon Tarly
    -[X] [Conversation] Speak with Alicent Hightower
    -[X] [Action] Study
    --[X] Study Law
    ---[X] Specifically, study the legalistic relationship between the Crown and the Citadel, and how Mellos might best be removed in a way that best furthers your position without unwanted damage.
    -[X] [Conversation] Speak with Otto Hightower
    -[X] [Action] Train with Syrax
    -[X] [Conversation] Speak with Laena Velaryon
    [X] High Flying Connections
    [X] Plan: Very Important Conversations
    -[X] [Conversation] Speak with Alicent Hightower
    -[X] [Conversation] Speak with Gwayne And Alicent
    -[X] [Conversation] Speak with Maester Orwyle
    -[X] [Conversation] Speak with Ser Raylon Tarly
    -[X] [Action] Train
    --[X] Challenge to a Duel:
    ---[X] [Duel] One of the Dornish Nobles
    -[X] [Action] Fly to Harrenhal
    [X] Plan An Application of Soft Power.
    [X] Plan: Important Talks (Doubling Down on the High Siblings Version)
    -[X] [Conversation] Speak with Alicent Hightower
    -[X] [Conversation] Speak with Gwayne And Alicent
    -[X] [Conversation] Speak with Ser Raylon Tarly
    -[X] [Conversation] Speak with Laena Velaryon
    -[X] [Action] Train
    --[X] Challenge to a Duel: Raylon has suggested dueling others as a way of sharpening yourself against new blades. Have others find flaws in you that he has missed (Pick One)
    ---[X] [Duel] One of the Dornish Nobles
    -[X] [Action] Train with Syrax
    [X] High Flying Connections
    -[X] [Conversation] Speak with Otto Hightower
    -[X] [Conversation] Speak with Ser Raylon Tarly
    -[X] [Conversation] Speak with Laena Velaryon
    -[X] [Conversation] Speak with Isembard Arryn
    -[X] [Action] Train
    --[X] Challenge to a Duel: Raylon has suggested dueling others as a way of sharpening yourself against new blades. Have others find flaws in you that he has missed (Pick One)
    ---[X] [Duel] One of the Dornish Nobles
    -[X] [Action] Train with Syrax
 
Yeah admittedly I would have been very surprised if you guys ever even considered romancing Daemon.
I always toyed with the idea of Omake showing Knight!Rhaenyra meeting Canon!Rhaenyra through "Dreams", and inevitably they compare their Sexual lifes:

C!Rhae: *disgusted* Just what kind of Deviant are you? And really?! You "Love" that back stabbing Hightower Harlot?!

K!Rhae: *also disgusted* Says the one who got "charmed" by our Asshole Womanizer of an Uncle as a child! Ugh! almost want to puke...
 
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I always toyed with the idea of Omake showing Knight!Rhaenyra meeting Canon!Rhaenyra through "Dreams", and inevitably they compare their Sexual lifes:

C!Rhae: *disgusted* Just what kind of Deviant are you? And really?! You "Love" that back stabbing Hightower Harlot?!

K!Rhae: *also disgusted* Says the one who got "charmed" by our Asshole Womanizer of an Uncle as a child! Ugh! almost want to puke...
I've honestly toyed with the same kind of omake idea myself.
 
To expand a little bit my previous post, I thought on a comedic scene going like this:

K!Rhae: You know, you look kind of thin. You should eat more Meat to keep impressing Alicent with your muscles.

C!Rhae: *blinking in shock* ...just what are you on about? Why would I want impress that woman? I can barely tolerate her being my Step-Mother!

K!Rhae: *also in shock* Ehm, what are you talking about? Johanna Westerling is our Step-Mother. Alicent is our Girlfriend

C!Rhae: SHE IS WHAT??!!

K!Rhae: ...... I think you just lost me.
 
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Alicent is personally my least favorite characters in the series. It takes something special to get your child maimed by virtue of your hypocritical views and then stand aside while your other child risks his father's wrath bailing you out.
 
C!Rhae: *disgusted* Just what kind of Deviant are you? And really?! You "Love" that back stabbing Hightower Harlot?!

K!Rhae: *also disgusted* Says the one who got "charmed" by our Asshole Womanizer of an Uncle as a child! Ugh! almost want to puke...
And then they kissed, right?
K!Rhae: You know, you look kind of thin. You should eat more Meat to keep impressing Alicent with your muscles.
Book!Rhaenyra: Way ahead of you darling!
 
Alicent is personally my least favorite characters in the series. It takes something special to get your child maimed by virtue of your hypocritical views and then stand aside while your other child risks his father's wrath bailing you out.

Book or show Alicent?

Book!Rhaenyra: Way ahead of you darling!

If i had a penny for every time Martin wrote abaout a Queen putting on weight while she was spiraling into madness and paranoia i would have two coins, wich is not much but its weird it happened twice.

Jokes aside, that stuff worked better with Cersei than with Rhaenyra for thematic purposes. Rapresenting Cersei hypocrisy and how she was becoming the female version of Robert Baratheon.

With Rhaenyra it felt out of place, and kinda like a sexist "fat women are evil" thing.

Fire and Blood in general is absolutely worse in writing female characters than Asoiaf, and you can't blame all of it on the unreliable narrator.
 
Alicent is personally my least favorite characters in the series. It takes something special to get your child maimed by virtue of your hypocritical views and then stand aside while your other child risks his father's wrath bailing you out.
I am conflicted about Alicent in the show because I really like pre time-skip Alicent while I find Post Time-Skip Alicent deeply fustrating both because of the awful person she becomes and the fact so many people misunderstand her.
 
Book or show Alicent?
Show. I said series after all. Though honestly there mostly superficially different from what I can see until very late in events.

Actually it's more surprising Martin only did that twice given the number of times he's killed the hand of the king to replace them with someone new. He's has a bit of a formula when it comes to his writing.
I am conflicted about Alicent in the show because I really like pre time-skip Alicent while I find Post Time-Skip Alicent deeply fustrating both because of the awful person she becomes and the fact so many people misunderstand her.
Yes your supposed to like early Alicent. An unlikable character who succumbs to lust for power and hypocrisy is less compelling compared to an initially likeable one.
 
It would've been absolutely hilarious if Charmer!Rhaenyra got Daemon's marriage dissolved, "freeing" him and driving up his hopes that the Stepstones war would earn him his brother's approval and his niece's heart at the same time, just for Nyra to get betrothed to Qoren while upstaging Daemon's efforts at the same time :V

lol it would be pretty funny, Daemon's just delulu his way into thinking Rhaenyra loves him only for her to pull out the platonic unclezoning

Only problem I could see is that we would already have a "Ser Incel" in Criston Cole.

I guess we could have called Daemon "Prince Incel," but it doesn't have the same ring to it.

We'd just start collecting incels lol everyone just collectively seething at Qoren, especially Cole in that TL since he's dornish too :V

Yeah admittedly I would have been very surprised if you guys ever even considered romancing Daemon.

Tbh even if we ignore his... multiple issues... and the VERY large age gap (which is gross, even if Daemon afaik largely looks younger than his actual age because he was blessed with the pretty boy genes, unlike Viserys), there's just not... any benefits beyond his great dragon-riding? He's kinda a pain to deal with for most people, so, not many like him lol

Plus, I'm pretty sure he'd try to subtly put us down so he can be more than just King-Consort (unless that TL Rhaenyra charmed the ambitions outta him), which would work a lot more since he's also a Targaryen

Like if we went Realm Delight I'd probably just lobby harder for the Laenor marriage before ever considering marrying Uncle Creep not gonna lie
 
With Rhaenyra it felt out of place, and kinda like a sexist "fat women are evil" thing.
That's interesting because I read the Rhaenyra aspect as a commentary on people "getting by on looks" which is still deeply sexist thing but not intended as fatphobic sexism?

All of which is doubly interesting because Daemon "not even the worst uncle in this family alive at the time" Targaryen was apparently still besotted with his grooming victim even when she kept the pregnancy weight. So I'm unsure what we're meant to read into this - did she not actually keep much weight and it was exaggerated by her political rivals, did she actually get fat and Daemon was still attracted to her, or did she get fat and he was just using her for power and she in fact wasn't paranoid over Nettles?
Fire and Blood in general is absolutely worse in writing female characters than Asoiaf, and you can't blame all of it on the unreliable narrator.
Oh agreed. Which is just so odd because there's some genuinely compelling and interesting Targaryen women it introduced. Rhaenys, Laena, Baela, all fucking badass. But the writing is as you say just so sexist urgh.

There's a reason I read dance fanfic I guess
 
Hmmm… maybe go with "Princel?" Then again… that doesn't sound right either.
That was my first thought as well! And why not, words grow familiar with time anyway.

We'd just start collecting incels lol everyone just collectively seething at Qoren, especially Cole in that TL since he's dornish too :V
This is a hilarious mental image. Rhaenyra trying to wave away a flock of incels who are deeply offended that someone could just charm her by Not Being Sexist and Actually Caring About What She Thinks. No doubt Qoren used some Dornish devilry!

Tbh even if we ignore his... multiple issues... and the VERY large age gap (which is gross, even if Daemon afaik largely looks younger than his actual age because he was blessed with the pretty boy genes, unlike Viserys), there's just not... any benefits beyond his great dragon-riding? He's kinda a pain to deal with for most people, so, not many like him lol
He's the very epitome of "with friends like this, who needs enemies", but he also sucks to have as an enemy, too :V
 
All of which is doubly interesting because Daemon "not even the worst uncle in this family alive at the time" Targaryen was apparently still besotted with his grooming victim even when she kept the pregnancy weight. So I'm unsure what we're meant to read into this - did she not actually keep much weight and it was exaggerated by her political rivals, did she actually get fat and Daemon was still attracted to her, or did she get fat and he was just using her for power and she in fact wasn't paranoid over Nettles?

...if you break up with the mother of your children because she gained weight from a pregnancy and didn't lose it, then you're a kind of pond scum that mass murderers on that genocide grind would look at and go, "Wow, what a shithead."
 
He's the very epitome of "with friends like this, who needs enemies", but he also sucks to have as an enemy, too :V

Low-key I'd have voted to have him as an "ally" (at great pains of ++STRESS when we inevitably realized the grooming shit and still had to put up with him) only to be able to poison/kill him better.

This is a hilarious mental image. Rhaenyra trying to wave away a flock of incels who are deeply offended that someone could just charm her by Not Being Sexist and Actually Caring About What She Thinks. No doubt Qoren used some Dornish devilry!

Our Rhaenyra is pretty in a Rhaegar way methinks, like this:



Maybe this is too pretty, but this is how I've been imagining her when she isn't in knight-armor

Anyways, our Nyra is pretty but a Realm's Delight Rhaenyra that's girlbossing gatekeeping gaslighting everyone she meets with high Diplo? She'd be swimming in incels and simps.

Which is... certainly something to deal with...

If we still married Qoren because we thinks he's neat, the horde of butthurt incels would be but inevitable, with Daemon leading it :V
 
...if you break up with the mother of your children because she gained weight from a pregnancy and didn't lose it, then you're a kind of pond scum that mass murderers on that genocide grind would look at and go, "Wow, what a shithead."
Oh entirely agreed to get this out of the way. But if I can remember the exact ordering of the build up to the dance correctly Daemon married her after she's had her first three pregnancies and she didn't lose the weight from that.

I'm dancing around the fact that book canon Daemon can easily be read as being into milfs / mum bods.

I'll end on the observation that Daemon was a massive murderer who only dodged the genocide allegations because his nephew did it first.
 
especially Cole in that TL since he's dornish too :V

Wait, he is from Dorne? Were those the over the top sexism comes from then?

Oh agreed. Which is just so odd because there's some genuinely compelling and interesting Targaryen women it introduced. Rhaenys, Laena, Baela, all fucking badass. But the writing is as you say just so sexist urgh.

Honestly, the number of child brides is the thing that bothers me the most.

But that is also a problem with the writing of all the books in general, not just Fire and Bloof, Fire and Blood just makes it very hard to ignore.

Like, people in the Middle Ages didn't marry THAT young!
 
Wait, he is from Dorne? Were those the over the top sexism comes from then?

Pretty sure he's of Dornish descent, but he's also like the son of the steward of a Stormlander house (Dondarrion, I believe)

I think the sexism was always there (even dornish can't all be women's rights saints methinks) but in canon it was exacerbated by Rhaenyra being a "temptress" and him then pinning all his failings on her (which weirdly reminded me now of Frollo lmao)

Here, who knows how he feels since Rhaenyra would only ever rizz up (intentionally) Alicent and there's no way he thought she was giving him false hopes lol Crispin in this timeline likely feels salty about Rhaenyra not being the pretty princess in the castle he can protect that he might have imagined up
 
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Like, people in the Middle Ages didn't marry THAT young!
And most of the documented extreme child marriages we have would be understood in modern parlance more along the lines of very long engagements. The child marriages were rarely consumated until the children were not children, because even medieval european nobility cared a little bit about some of this. Albeit from a pragmatic angle of "they can't safely have kids" not because they actually cared about the ethical issues.
 
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