Whatever is inside is not going to be stopped by even the entire keep collapsing on top fo it.

Can we stop mincing words? @Azel is referring to the high CR murdergolem that the Lannisters turned the Throne into.

That's what we are dealing with here. We are not avoiding this fight. This is a fight that was always going to happen.
Yes. Which is why we should not fight a golem indoors. We should fight it outdoors. But it won't go outdoors, so we should bring the outdoors indoors. Hence, removing the roof.

The thing will most likely be large enough for fire support to hit it and I see no reason to fight exactly where they wanted us to fight it.
 
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Yes. Which is why we should not fight a golem indoors. We should fight it outdoors. But it won't go outdoors, so we should bring the outdoors indoors. Hence, removing the roof.
That's not going to make any difference... room size and terrain is not an advantage or disadvantage in this case. If we wanted, we could go Full True Dragon shape, but we are not winning this fight by Dragon-ing it.

In fact. The opposite. We should be a dragon as far away from it as we can, which, if we are still relevant in that fight, is not any further than we would be by popping up in the middle of the throne room rather than fighting it in mid air, or in the middle of a street crowded with civilians.

At least this way we know what we are walking into, and can limit collateral.
 
That's not going to make any difference... room size and terrain is not an advantage or disadvantage in this case. If we wanted, we could go Full True Dragon shape, but we are not winning this fight by Dragon-ing it.

In fact. The opposite. We should be a dragon as far away from it as we can, which, if we are still relevant in that fight, is not any further than we would be by popping up in the middle of the throne room rather than fighting it in mid air, or in the middle of a street crowded with civilians.

At least this way we know what we are walking into, and can limit collateral.
No, by definition if there is no roof, we can be farther from it than we can if there is a roof, since we can fly and it probably can't.

And while I agree we should not let it escape into the city, I see no reason not to fight it in the keep's courtyard.
 
If it was made to fight dragons, I guarantee you it can fly.
If it could fly, why would they leave it instead of evacuating it to somewhere it'd be more useful, like literally any battle where the Golden shields would have enough force concentration to stop it getting action-economied to death by the full Companion roster, which we don't have with us right now but theoretically could have brought along.

It is more likely that it has some trick to trap us in the room, with dimensional anchor and other such things so we can't leave and other people can't come in, but which also makes the golem itself both harder to relocate and significantly more useful in this room than outside it.
 
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Whatever is inside is not going to be stopped by even the entire keep collapsing on top of it.

Can we stop mincing words? @Azel is referring to the high CR murdergolem that the Lannisters turned the Throne into.

That's what we are dealing with here. We are not avoiding this fight. This is a fight that was always going to happen.
Even if that's the case, I'd rather not start a fight with a super terminator inside of what could very well be a ritual chamber primed to curse the fuck out of Viserys the moment he arrives.
 
It is more likely that it has some trick to trap us in the room, with dimensional anchor and other such things so we can't leave and other people can't come in, but which also makes the golem itself both harder to relocate and significantly more useful in this room than outside it.
Spellbane: Dimensional Anchor (and Greater Dispel Magic, Mage's Disjunction and some other "gotcha" spell).
 
Spellbane: Dimensional Anchor (and Greater Dispel Magic, Mage's Disjunction and some other "gotcha" spell).
If they hooked their trap spell up to Maegor's wards (the ones powered by some kind of sealed evil) that may not work. Of course if they did that we may find that the keep cannot be trivially demolished, but at least when the siege projectiles start bouncing off seemingly normal stone we'll be forewarned.
 
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Spellbane: Dimensional Anchor (and Greater Dispel Magic, Mage's Disjunction and some other "gotcha" spell).
Dimensional Anchor might not be worth trying to block. I would be wary of Teleporting in the Red Keep to begin with.

We've got a Ring of Counterspells currently set to Greater Dispel Magic, but I would probably leave that as is.

Whatever else it is blocking, we should be running a Spellbane against Mage's Disjunction and AMF. Probably Wall of Suppression as well.
 
The fact that we can Teleport at all makes me suspect that the wards are down. Forbiddance is one of the most basic magical defenses there is.
 
Where's your "climatic encounter" spirit?!

@Azel @DragonParadox Seriously, can I get a refund? This crowd is killing me!
Climactic encounters are great and all, but not at the expense of tactical advantage. We're not even in full combat buff mode right now, and the Lannisters have clearly shown that they're strategy is based on expensive magic items and traps. I see no reason they wouldn't put a nuke under the floorboards, replicate a high grade Tomb Curse with a suite of effects that don't allow for saves, flood the area with anti-dragon aids, or something similarly whacky.

Walking into a kill box on the assumption that the worms can't touch us is just asking for Mammon to mail us a membership card for the six second club.
 
The fact that we can Teleport at all makes me suspect that the wards are down. Forbiddance is one of the most basic magical defenses there is.
Well, that does imply a few possibilities:
  • The Lannisters broke our shiny new ward system while monkeying around with it. Not very likely unless Cersei got her paws on it.
  • The Lannisters deliberately broke our shiny new ward system, to get rid of the sealed evil or;
  • because the wards might recognize Targaryens. This seems like the most likely option, since that is a feature Maegor would have installed. If anything he'd have probably keyed it to himself alone, but his successors would probably have hacked into it and keyed it to Targaryens in general.
  • The Lannisters rigged the ward system as part of their trap, which requires that it be off up until it turns back on.
 
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  • because the wards might recognize Targaryens. This seems like the most likely option.
The wards didn't recognize or treat us well when we entered the Red Keep the first time, due to them being at least partially powered by Maegor having the foundations of the keep stuffed full of living people who carry a bit of a grudge against our family.


Anyway, I'm not budging on my vote for reasons that I can not adequately explain. Simply put, I do not think that we will have any way to defuse the bomb without stepping on the trigger first.
 
The wards didn't recognize or treat us well when we entered the Red Keep the first time, due to them being at least partially powered by Maegor having the foundations of the keep stuffed full of living people who carry a bit of a grudge against our family.
Point. That does enhance the theory that the wards could be turned against us since the components would certainly be willing if someone offered them the chance. And not just the people, also the sealed evil. Which may not even be properly sealed anymore but waiting for us to step on a metaphorical trip wire so it can come out and also have its revenge.

We should probably avoid any scenario in which we may have to fight both a murdergolem and a no-longer-sealed evil on their shared homeground.
 
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[X] Azel

Hey @Azel how hard would it be to enchant a pair of sticks so that when one breaks the other does as well?
 
[X] Azel

Hey @Azel how hard would it be to enchant a pair of sticks so that when one breaks the other does as well?
I want to say an item like this already exists. Feels like it's on the tip of my tongue, but I can't remember exactly what they're called. Probably something in the 3.5 Magic Item Compendium.
 
I was trying to think of a way the bombers could have been signalled and the paired sticks idea seemed like a good one.
 
Actually, there's an idea.

@Goldfish An object which breaks in such a way to light a spark if the paired item breaks? Probably as a component within an explosive casing?

If you could key that one item to multiple trigger mechanisms, you could have a poor man's remote detonator.
 
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