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A Sword Without a Hilt: A Song of Ice and Fire/D&D 3.5 Crossover

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I always thought it was because we stole the idea from Warhammer and no other splat in DnD has Astarte's :V

Also psych evals for your super gene warriors is just basic sanity as far as I am concerned.
 
065tdsa said:
No, because the whole reason we're doing augments is we're worried about Outsiders. We don't want Praetorians to fight squishy humans, the Legion is enough to dominate all mortal armies we've faced. By the same token, Outsiders don't want Praetorian equivalents to fight other Outsiders.

And even if they did, they have existing methods of self-improvement which are likely more efficient than a new augmentation program since they don't demand a ton of research (we piggybacked off Valyrian flesh crafting, which piggybacked off deals with Aberrations, of all things, and reason we can do what we can so easily is because we have a pre-existing Valyrian Flesh Forge besides), or have chances of failure and side effects.
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You miss the point: while the average genie is much stronger than the average human, not only do genie fight genie, but the ladder doesn't stop with your average CR 4-8 outsider, oh no, it goes much, much higher.

They have as many reasons to want them as we do, if not more, as they are far "closer" to the Big Nasties than we are. Way, way easier to go from Hell to, say, the City of Brass, than from Hell to King's Landing.
 
TotallyNotEvil said:
You miss the point: while the average genie is much stronger than the average human, not only do genie fight genie, but the ladder doesn't stop with your average CR 4-8 outsider, oh no, it goes much, much higher.

They have as many reasons to want them as we do, if not more, as they are far "closer" to the Big Nasties than we are. Way, way easier to go from Hell to, say, the City of Brass, than from Hell to King's Landing.
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I got the impression lords or hell can and did just slap the advanced template on things if they felt like it.

Which is... Most of what we have right?
 
Goldfish said:
I wonder how much soul juice it takes for an Archduke to slap an Advanced template on a Devil? Just curious! No ulterior motives at all.
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Well they probably don't need to catch a godlike Landwarden as step one of the process like flesh forges require, so it's certainly cheaper to set up than the stuff we do.
TotallyNotEvil said:
You miss the point: while the average genie is much stronger than the average human, not only do genie fight genie, but the ladder doesn't stop with your average CR 4-8 outsider, oh no, it goes much, much higher.
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You do realize that there's higher genies right? There's nobles and then there's bigger nobles all the way to the sultans, who can't quite fake being gods but then most of them don't want to. The genies are not in fact in danger of being conquered by the lower planes, easier access or not. Being a race of beings with Wish SLAs of all the damn things, it baffles me that you think they'd feel outgunned.

If the Genies ever feel in danger, then step one isn't researching some complicated enhancement process, it's using all the natural gifts they already have.
 
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I had previously tried to make an anti-Illithid construct, that fell by the wayside a little and I started thinking on a Fungus Forge creation, with our more frequent clashes with Deep Ones it seems all the more important, if we can get ahold of a Bar-Lgura to feed the forge then we can be much more ready to go hot with faster and more disposable assets.

Bar-Lgura are one of the only things that can at-will teleport AND take an unwilling creature with them (with a save). If we also include a Wildfire suicide charge inside of them they can be extremely useful with a successful abduction or not, force their allies to decide between stopping an asset from being taken from the Elder Brain or allowing Ur-Fire to tear through their domain.

Thoughts?
 
Deliste said:
C'mon man we've all seen Stargate, you just send a scout first :p. Definitely a good callout though, any other tricks we should look out for?
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Forgotten Demiplanes may have been "forgotten" for a reason. They make excellent prisons for beings unable to Plane Shift, as well as repositories for nasty shit. Drop someone or something in the place, then leave it there forever.

I wouldn't want to unleash a plague, or worse, by accident.
 
Deliste said:
I had previously tried to make an anti-Illithid construct, that fell by the wayside a little and I started thinking on a Fungus Forge creation, with our more frequent clashes with Deep Ones it seems all the more important, if we can get ahold of a Bar-Lgura to feed the forge then we can be much more ready to go hot with faster and more disposable assets.

Bar-Lgura are one of the only things that can at-will teleport AND take an unwilling creature with them (with a save). If we also include a Wildfire suicide charge inside of them they can be extremely useful with a successful abduction or not, force their allies to decide between stopping an asset from being taken from the Elder Brain or allowing Ur-Fire to tear through their domain.

Thoughts?
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We can make some of the anti-Illithid Constructs next turn.

FYI, though, according to DP, Lya and possibly others Companions are unwilling to create sentient beings meant to suicide. That's why the Beetle Bombs aren't intelligent.
 
Goldfish said:
Forgotten Demiplanes may have been "forgotten" for a reason. They make excellent prisons for beings unable to Plane Shift, as well as repositories for nasty shit. Drop someone or something in the place, then leave it there forever.

I wouldn't want to unleash a plague, or worse, by accident.
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Again though, Planeshifting a pigeon that we have cast Chain of Eyes or Possession on means we don't have to let anything at all out after exploring what's inside.
 
065tdsa said:
Well they probably don't need to catch a godlike Landwarden as step one of the process like flesh forges require, so it's certainly cheaper to set up than the stuff we do.

You do realize that there's higher genies right? There's nobles and then there's bigger nobles all the way to the sultans, who can't quite fake being gods but then most of them don't want to. The genies are not in fact in danger of being conquered by the lower planes, easier access or not. Being a race of beings with Wish SLAs of all the damn things, it baffles me that you think they'd feel outgunned.
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True, but souls spent on improving Devils are souls which themselves cannot become Devils. You pay for quality but lose quantity. Sometimes it's worth it and sometimes it's not.
 
Goldfish said:
We can make some of the anti-Illithid Constructs next turn.

FYI, though, according to DP, Lya and possibly others Companions are unwilling to create sentient beings meant to suicide. That's why the Beetle Bombs aren't intelligent.
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Hmmmm, we could give it beast intelligence and just hyperfocus it on Deep Ones through it's drive and it's senses, there's plenty of low intelligence planes predators out there that are supernaturally good at hunting a single type of being.
Adhoc vote count started by Deliste on May 4, 2019 at 12:39 AM, finished with 272 posts and 20 votes.
  • [X] Plan Wages of Blood
    -[X] The Sept
    --[X] The Red Abishai is to be bottled and taken for full interrogation followed by execution. Exact method to be determined, but most likely via Yss to deny Tiamat the return of her invested power.
    --[X] As for the cultists, examine the traces of blood magic upon them with the aim of ensuring that Tiamat may not easily pick a new focus for her power here in Oldtown from among their number. Wild Arcana a Brain Spider spell to examine their minds for any further information on the cult that might be of import, then if nothing can be found, leave them to their fate at the hands of Oldtown justice. If any have done more than simply be deceived, ensure that this information is passed on to the relevant authorities so that they might be judged for those crimes as well.
    --[X] Leave Malarys and the Erinyes to guard the Sept until such time as the Watch or Lantern Bearers can be brought in to take the cultists into custody.
    -[X] The Manse
    --[X] Lormar and his apprentice are our prisoners. They will be bottled and taken for full interrogation and probably one of either execution or turning.
    --[X] Inspect the minds of the Golden Company soldiers with the same casting of Brain Spider (it lasts 1 minute/CL and can inspect the minds of up to 8 people as a standard action) and get everything you can from them before explaining in simple terms the options available to them. Make certain that they understand that any attempts to bring the worship of Tiamat into the Night's Watch shall be met with your...poor humour. They can draw their own conclusions. They can face death or the Wall.
    --[X] Make sure to retrieve the 'Darkenbeast' and dispose of it completely.
    -[X] Deep One Containment
    --[X] Bottle the Greater Intellect Devourer and have it placed within a lead-lined box before securing it within your cloak. It will be used as payment for the Merling King's aid against Tiamat.
    --[X] Explain to the Lantern Bearers that there does exists a power utterly opposed to the Deep Ones, a God of Sea who would reward the spilling of tainted blood in his honour in ways that would not be unwholesome. The Merling King can offer many boons from the sea; cleansing the foulness of Deep One power from person and place both - make note of the Bilestone present in the city - and more besides. For abominations like these creatures, turning their deaths against their master would surely be to the aid of all that stand against them.
    --[X] If the Lantern Bearers accept this premise, outline the manner in which one would sacrifice these creatures safely to the Merling King, and offer to transform the lesser monsters into harmless animal forms until the time comes. Suggest that an altar (or maybe more, once the Conclave has passed) to the Merling King could bring with it many advantages in Oldtown's war against Deep One machination.
    [X] Plan Easy Does It
    -[X] Viserys
    --[X] Uses bracers for a Silent Stilled Ancestral Awakening: Still Spell
    --[X] Use bracers for a Silent Stilled Bloodwish: Major Creation for a bit of phosphorus.
    --[X] Cast a Silent Stilled Bloodwish: Symbol of Sleep. Set it so the Erynies aren't affected (everyone else is too strong), and some trigger he can use as a free action, such as scuffing the symbol with his foot.
    --[X] Make Varys invisible, and have her hold onto an AMF.
    --[X] Discreetly uses his item to heal the charisma damage.
    --[X] Triggers the Symbol and change into LHD and move to subdue the Abishai.
    -[x] Malarys and Vee
    --[x] If Viserys noticed any other protections, they Greater Dispel it just before Varys triggers the AMF. Otherwise, just be ready to react to something unexpected, like catching straglers. Don't forget Beads of Karma. Malarys also triggers his Sign spell.
    -[X] Ser Richard and the Furies
    --[X] Charge and subdue it
    -[X] Pick a monotonous bit of the sermon to act, at least a point where everyone is seated.
    -[x] Varys just has to stay within 10 ft of it, should be easy as she can fly very fast, and hover.
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Artemis1992 said:
[X] Snowfire


Being a PC is a bigger boost and often comes with trauma, so I wouldn't worry on that side.
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Dude, PCs we can control to a degree. We will be making NPCs with a lot of power with no mental check up to find out whether or not they are in danger of snapping and going berserk.

Normally that wouldn't be as bad with magic on our side but if they take part in the project they will be able to do a lot more damage than would be normally possible.


There is a reason people are required to take a mental evaluation before they are allowed to own a gun in the USA. Now imagine not even doing THAT MUCH for someone buying a rocket launcher and some heavy machine guns because that seems to be what we might end up doing....
 
lockingbane said:
Dude, PCs we can control to a degree. We will be making NPCs with a lot of power with no mental check up to find out whether or not they are in danger of snapping and going berserk.

Normally that wouldn't be as bad with magic on our side but if they take part in the project they will be able to do a lot more damage than would be normally possible.


There is a reason people are required to take a mental evaluation before they are allowed to own a gun in the USA. Now imagine not even doing THAT MUCH for someone buying a rocket launcher and some heavy machine guns because that seems to be what we might end up doing....
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We never made a policy of psych-evaluations for the people we teach to throw 10d6 Fireballs at level 6.
Don't get started with how tankier fighters will be a big risk.
 
Artemis1992 said:
We never made a policy of psych-evaluations for the people we teach to throw 10d6 Fireballs at level 6.
Don't get started with how tankier fighters will be a big risk.
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True, but we HAVE focused quite a bit into making our law enforcement and investigation particularly skilled in finding criminals, the fact that the headmistress is almost everywhere in the tower at the same time, the fact the students self police and would report trouble students, and more.

Most of that is well established and taken care of and mentally unstable students are often weeded out, marked for observation, and so on due to the way the scholarium has developed.

We have no such thing for our army as shown by the disregard for lives and more. The most they will do is follow the law and enforce it but it is done almost mindlessly and the fact our law keepers are mostly focused around stopping and dealing with magical crime and relying mainly on the army for the muscle and actual enforcement leaves them rather poorly equipped for this.


It would just be simpler to nip problems in the bud before they can occur than work to put out fires as they pop up.
 
Since Duesal ragequitted over some posters being dicks and may or may not return in a week, I'm overtaking Larder for now*.
I'm leaving cultist mages and Abishai bottled until then though, since I'm hilariously bad at compiling actual questions to ask throughout the interrogations.


Day of Blood Stockpile:
Sacrifices Presumed Individual HD Total HD Old Gods Bonuses Individual HD after Old Gods bonuses
Total HD after Old Gods
Bonuses
Individual CR
Total CR
1 Abishai Wizard Creature 14 14 +35% (Outsidier), +20% (Caster) 22.4 22.4 16 16
      Total   22.4   16
Day of Blood (Blood Magic, Greater)

School: Transmutation & Divination; Level 8

Casting time: 80 minutes

Material Components: The powdered remains of a sentient (Int greater than 3) creature or creatures of no less then 8 HD (bonemeal, dried organs, etc...)

Blood Component: Sacrifice of 16 HD worth of sentient creatures who must be hung from the tree, or if the branches will not support them, impaled before its roots.

Special: The value of the sacrifice is modified by the following factors:
  • Low Intelligence (INT 3 to 6): -50%
  • Native Outsider: +25%
  • Fey: +30%
  • True Outsider (Called): +35%
  • Aberration: +35%
  • Undead: +40%
  • Cold Subtype: +50%
  • Caster (not SLAs): +25%
  • Dragon: +35%
  • Willing Sacrifice (no magical compulsions): +100%
  • Mythic: +2 HD to base subject to all bonuses for every Mythic Rank
For each secondary effect desired the Blood Cost increases as follows:
  • 1 Secondary effect: 24 HD worth of sacrifices
  • 2 Secondary effects: 36 HD worth of sacrifices
  • 3 Secondary effects: 54 HD worth of sacrifices
Sacrificing more than needed may lead other gifts as the gods will.
Required Caster: Druid or Adept (Old Gods) level 4; Arcane caster level 7

Secondary Casters: Up to five

Skill Checks: Knowledge Nature (DC 25) 2 success; Knowledge Religion (DC 20) 2 success; Craft Wood-Carving (DC 16) 2 successes; Spellcraft (DC 26) 2 successes

Backlash: All base metal objects in a 50 ft radios of the Nascent Heart Tree fall to dust

Effects:

Primary: Grow a Heart-Tree from a sapling in the span of the ritual, which serves as the focus of a permanent CL 20 Hallow or Unhallow spell (Primary caster's choice)

Secondary: Select an effect or effects to be tied to the Hallow or Unhallow effect from the list ordinarily permitted for such a purpose, up to a maximum of three.

Failure: Primary caster becomes bound to the site of the weirwood and may not travel more than 100 ft from it until such a time as the ritual is complete. If the ritual fails a second time while a creature is so bound the creature dies, its remains feeding the Heart Tree allowing it to grow to full size regardless. A creature so slain cannot be returned from the dead save by the spells Reincarnate and True Reincarnate.



Special Project Stockpile:
Sacrifices Presumed Individual HD Total HD Old Gods Bonuses Individual HD after Old Gods bonuses
Total HD after Old Gods
Bonuses
Individual CR
Total CR 		Reason
1 Colossal
FiendishMonstrous Spiders 		32 HD 32 HD -50% (Low Intelligence) +35% (True Outsider) 27.2 HD 27.2 HD 13 13 Valyrian Steel
1 Wizard CreaturePleasure Devil 12 HD 12 HD +25% (Caster) +35% (True Outsider) 19.2 HD 19.2 HD 13 13 Fungus Forge
1 Sorcerer Creature Blood Maidens 12 HD 12 HD +25% (Caster) 15 HD 15 HD 10 10 Fungus Forge
1 Imp Sorcerer 4 7 HD 7 HD +25% (Caster) +35% (True Outsider) 11.2 HD 11.2 HD 6 6 Potential Recruit
1 Desert Devil 8 HD 8 HD +35% (True Outsider) 10.8 HD 10.8 HD 6 6 Fungus Forge
1 Sand Devil 4 HD 4 HD +35% (True Outsider) 5.4 HD 5.4 HD 3 3 Fungus Forge
1 Zebub 4 HD 4 HD +35% (True Outsider) 5.4 HD 5.4 HD 3 3 Fungus Forge
1 Obsidian Devil 10 HD 10 HD +35% (True Outsider) 13.5 HD 13.5 HD 6 6 Fungus Forge
1 Harvester Devil Sorcerer (4 levels Sorcerer) 13 HD 13 HD +35% (True Outsider) +25% (Caster) 20.8 HD 20.8 HD 11 11 Potential Recruit
Astral Dreadnaught 18 HD 18 HD +35% (True Outsider) 24.3 HD 24.3 HD 17 17 Possibly upgrade Xor's eye, or short of that try to reverse-engineer the anti-magic field effect
1 Greater Intellect Devourer (Advanced by HD, Psion caster 13) 13 HD 13 HD +35% (Aberration), +25% (Caster) 20.8 HD 20.8 HD 16 16 To be the sacrifice for Merling King's participation in creation of Tiamat-Snare among other gods.
1 Lormar (level 11 Wizard) 11 HD 11 HD +25% (Caster) 13.75 HD 13.75 HD 10 10 To be questioned and possibly subverted based on the results of questioning.
1 Lormar's Apprentice 5 HD 5 HD +25% (Caster) 6.25 HD 6.25 HD 4 4 To be questioned and possibly subverted based on the results of questioning.
      Total   172.8 HD   102 CR  
Day of Change Stockpile:
Sacrifices Presumed Individual CL Total CL Bonuses Individual CL after Bonuses Total CL after Bonuses
Arson Ice-Axes' frost magic axes CL 8 CL 8 None CL 8 CL 8
Gilded Devil's Loot CL ??? CL ??? None CL ??? CL ???
3 Winterborn Ala Talismans (2 Amulets, 1 Ring) CL 5 CL 15 None CL 5 CL 15
Wyrm-Breaker Spear CL 8 CL 8 None CL 8 CL 8
3 Fire Giant Greatswords (+1) CL 5 CL 15 None CL 5 CL 15
Claw sheaths that give the worn creature's claws the keen property and count as evil for the purposes of overcoming damage residence. CL 7 CL 7 None CL 7 CL 7
2 Djezet Skin CL 5 CL 10 +2 (Strength Domain) CL 7 CL 14
Cursed Bracelet CL 5 CL 5 None CL 5 CL 5
Warped Dragonsteel Sword CL 12 CL 12 None CL 12 CL 12
Cursed Amulet CL 14 CL 14 None CL 14 CL 14
5 Thanadaemon Staves CL 11 CL 55 None CL 11 CL 55
      Total CL Accumulated   153 + ??? CL
Day of Change (Greater)

School: Transmutation & Divination; Level 8

Casting time: 80 minutes

Material Components: The powdered remains of a sentient (Int greater than 3) creature or creatures of no less than 8 HD (bonemeal, dried organs, etc...)

Special: Artifact(s) to be sacrificed. Minimum (combined) caster level:
  • 8 for the primary effect
  • 12 for for the first secondary effect
  • 16 for the second secondary effect
  • 20 for the third secondary effect
The effective caster level of the artifact is increased as follows if its origin bears some afinity to the Old Gods' domains, as follows:
  • Travel, Strength +2
  • Protection, Magic +4
  • Time +7
Objects with no affinity have a 20% chance to be rejected. Should this happen, the primary caster will not suffer the failure condition, but all material components will be lost. Sacrificing more than needed may lead other gifts as the gods will.

Required Caster: Druid or Adept (Old Gods) level 4; Arcane caster level 7

Secondary Casters: Up to five

Skill Checks: Knowledge Nature (DC 25) 2 success; Knowledge Religion (DC 20) 2 success; Craft Wood-Carving (DC 16) 2 successes, Spellcraft (DC 26) 2 successes

Backlash: All base metal objects in a 50 ft radios of the Nascent Heart Tree fall to dust

Effects:

Primary: Grow a Heart-Tree from a sapling in the span of the ritual, which serves as the focus of a permanent CL 20 Hallow or Unhallow spell (Primary caster's choice)

Secondary: Select an effect or effects to be tied to the Hallow or Unhallow effect from the list ordinarily permitted for such a purpose, up to a maximum of three.

Failure: A random artifact or 1d4 ordinary magic items in the caster's possession are destroyed. If no such objects exist the failure condition defaults to that of Day of Blood
Corpse Stockpile (for Fungus Forge):

1 Hero-Killer Xenarth (CR 15; 11 HD) -- 11 HD Total
14 Flying Chupacabra Corpses (4HD; CR3) -- 56 HD Total
3 Faceless Stalker Corpses (5 HD; CR 4) -- 15 HD Total
1 Shadow-Traced Kamaitachi (14 HD; CR 15) -- 14 HD Total
17 Green Children (8 HD; CR 5) -- 136 HD Total
3 Frost Worms (14 HD; CR 12) -- 42 HD Total
1 Barbed Devil (12 HD; CR 11) -- 12 HD Total
1 Dogai (14 HD; CR 11) -- 14 HD Total
35 HD worth of Ancient Bones bleached by the Astral Currents -- 35 HD Total

Grand Total: 335 HD
Recyclable: 111.67 HD of anything up to CR 5

*though to be fair, if neither Azel nor Duesal return by the end of their respective weeks, I see little point staying myself :/
 
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This not a post I ever wanted to write.

I know this sounds ominous but it's not quite that bad. With @Azel and @Duesal taking a break from the thread, the recent mess with the moral choice update that fell like a pig from the sky (and has rightfully been called out for it) I find myself less enthusiastic about writing this. It's not that I lost all enjoyment or anything, but more and more I'm thinking less of themes and the flow of the story and instead focusing on the mechanics,on getting though this or that action without dragging or pushing the characters into doing something OOC, all things any storyteller should be concerned with of course, but it's taking a lot more of my time and effort to keep everything and everyone straight. Those moments when my fingers practically fly off the keyboard not able to keep up with the story that's in my head are getting rarer.

I'm not saying this to get sympathy or reassurances just to warn you that it is happening so that if one day I look at the thread and realize I can't go on it will not just be an abrupt closing. Once again it's nowhere near that bad right now, hopefully it will never get that bad I just felt it was right to tell you guys my concerns after all we've gone though.
 
DragonParadox said:
This not a post I ever wanted to write.

I know this sounds ominous but it's not quite that bad. With @Azel and @Duesal taking a break from the thread, the recent mess with the moral choice update that fell like a pig from the sky (and has rightfully been called out for it) I find myself less enthusiastic about writing this. It's not that I lost all enjoyment or anything, but more and more I'm thinking less of themes and the flow of the story and instead focusing on the mechanics,on getting though this or that action without dragging or pushing the characters into doing something OOC, all things any storyteller should be concerned with of course, but it's taking a lot more of my time and effort to keep everything and everyone straight. Those moments when my fingers practically fly off the keyboard not able to keep up with the story that's in my head are getting rarer.

I'm not saying this to get sympathy or reassurances just to warn you that it is happening so that if one day I look at the thread and realize I can't go on it will not just be an abrupt closing. Once again it's nowhere near that bad right now, hopefully it will never get that bad I just felt it was right to tell you guys my concerns after all we've gone though.
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Have you considered putting the quest on hiatus and taking a break? It might help you get your energy back and find new ideas. Whatever you decide to do though remember that your enjoyment of the quest is the most important part of making it fun for us as well, so don't feel bad if ya need to slow down or take a break.
 
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DragonParadox said:
This not a post I ever wanted to write.

I know this sounds ominous but it's not quite that bad. With @Azel and @Duesal taking a break from the thread, the recent mess with the moral choice update that fell like a pig from the sky (and has rightfully been called out for it) I find myself less enthusiastic about writing this. It's not that I lost all enjoyment or anything, but more and more I'm thinking less of themes and the flow of the story and instead focusing on the mechanics,on getting though this or that action without dragging or pushing the characters into doing something OOC, all things any storyteller should be concerned with of course, but it's taking a lot more of my time and effort to keep everything and everyone straight. Those moments when my fingers practically fly off the keyboard not able to keep up with the story that's in my head are getting rarer.

I'm not saying this to get sympathy or reassurances just to warn you that it is happening so that if one day I look at the thread and realize I can't go on it will not just be an abrupt closing. Once again it's nowhere near that bad right now, hopefully it will never get that bad I just felt it was right to tell you guys my concerns after all we've gone though.
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We will support you no matter what you choose to do. Maybe like @Noobody77 suggested we can all take a break.
 
Noobody77 said:
Have you considered putting the quest on hiatus and taking a break? It might help you get your energy back and find new ideas.
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I don't think that could really work. If you look at the very first page of this quest you will find an author's note regarding Kings of Men, a quest I also thought I was just taking a break from when I focused more on this. It died and in hindsight the reason it died is obvious. My quests, my stories are huge sprawling things that I have to keep in mind on some level at all times or they just slip away, I no longer remember what made the characters tick, what I had in mind for this or that part of the world and if I try to lay that down on paper as notes I get a ghost, an image that bears as much resemblance to the character in my head as a charcoal drawing does to the person it's supposed to represent.
 
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