- Location
- Voidbetweenstars
Which is why that's what we should give them that and nothing more, if they want more the can get it next time after they prove not stupid with it.
Paths of Civilization II: Paths of Industrialization
- Location
- Illinois
Oh, I know. I just wanted to give the quotes other people were using.
Fighting the nobles = everything cost more PW = we fall even further behind everyone else.
We are literally behind the sketch even after they crashed and burned, and the only reason that everyone else hasn't zoomed past us is because they keep getting lit on fire by Republicans.
We need this government to be as good as we can get.
That's why we invested the PW into this ConCon, so we could massively liberalise. It's there, so we should use it now, rather than having to worry about this in the future.
Wiadi
Uncompromising Radical Leftist
- Location
- Something Clever
- Pronouns
- She/Her
That's referring to a long-term refusal to allow polluting actions by the legislature. Entirely unrelated to the discussion at hand.
Not to mention that getting more PW per turn will let us store up an even bigger chunk of PW during the next Constitution Convention, which will allow us to (if we aren't in a massive war) afford changes to minority rights, conscription, officership, social benefits, or even our economy. And we'll have already paid for power of the purse, so it won't be competing with those at that time.
And I don't think this has been said enough: increasing the rights of our upper house will increase our troop morale in the ongoing war.
And I don't think this has been said enough: increasing the rights of our upper house will increase our troop morale in the ongoing war.
- Location
- Illinois
UH is our officers, land owners, buisnessmen and other assorted groups.
Their factions have proven to be fairly easy to balance up to this point, because they have a nice, diverse range of desires.
Why, then, are you assuming that they will somehow destroy the country if we give them more power?
Yeah misread your post, hence the strikethrough.
- Location
- Voidbetweenstars
Magic.
Because they will want more, and we wont be able to give it because you want to give it all now.
I quote:
This is for something they don't even have legal rights to.
Give them the Power of the Purse and taking it away from them to give to the Lower House may well trigger internal unrest.
Again, bad idea.
- Location
- Illinois
We can give both the power of the purse, you know?
Who said anything about taking it away at any point in the near future??
Alectai
Speaks Words of Wisdom... On occasion
After AN just said that actual magic isn't a thing? Just "Star Trek Physics?"
Eh, I suppose it's plausible if they invested in a metalight that makes people agreeable. It's okay to give your various factory barons freedom to do what they want and get all the benefits of a decentralized hypercapitalist economy if you have mind control beams to get them all 100% in line in times of crisis.
- Location
- Leeds
Island OP. Pls Nerf.
Did you mention the education hit before? I feel we'd be having a lot less salt if people knew that.
Seriously nerf islands.
Perhaps not but is AN's see quote:
rofl::lol
Wiadi
Uncompromising Radical Leftist
- Location
- Something Clever
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Uh...why would it do that? It might make the officers happier, but the troops aren't gonna care about the Upper House. The Lower House is the one that (at least nominally) represents their interests. Note also that increasing the power of the Lower House is what gets us a Happiness boost.
Ah, yeah, sorry, hadn't seen that yet when I posted.
Horologer
Incertae sedis
- Location
- a risen sea
Nnnnngh. Rebalancing the Houses is going to be awful, but the arguments for devolving power of the purse are pretty compelling.
[X] Plan FREEDOM
-[X] [UH] 2 PW - Power of the purse
-[X] [LH] 4 PW - Minor lawmaking (+1 Temp Happiness)
-[X] [Assembly] 2 PW - Broad (+1 Happiness, Min. Consciousness from Education Increased by 1)
-[X] [Press] 2 PW - Free press (-1 Temp Happiness, Min. Consciousness from Education Increased by 1, Academic Freedom Provides Half Consciousness to Innovation)
We'll just have to iron out the kinks next ConCon.
[X] Plan FREEDOM
-[X] [UH] 2 PW - Power of the purse
-[X] [LH] 4 PW - Minor lawmaking (+1 Temp Happiness)
-[X] [Assembly] 2 PW - Broad (+1 Happiness, Min. Consciousness from Education Increased by 1)
-[X] [Press] 2 PW - Free press (-1 Temp Happiness, Min. Consciousness from Education Increased by 1, Academic Freedom Provides Half Consciousness to Innovation)
We'll just have to iron out the kinks next ConCon.
- Location
- Voidbetweenstars
It's because they have less people in their core, everyone else is blowing up because they have to many people to handle in positions of power.
- Location
- Leeds
Oh also are we sure that the correct way to mimic sketch goverment is to give away more power?
In the original PoC and also VickyII it was a much less linear system than: One end of this slider is bad the other is good.
In the original PoC and also VickyII it was a much less linear system than: One end of this slider is bad the other is good.
Welcome to the new system, not the same as the old system. In this system it's clearly such a tremendous advantage to devolve power that keeping up is impossible without it.
- Location
- Voidbetweenstars
Despite the fact that where currently 1 of the top 3 world powers. Clearly we are falling behind.
keenscythe
No longer NEET
- Location
- WA, USA
[X] Plan FREEDOM
Joy so the Sketch either work on plot Fiat or despite our high espionage we are woefully incorrect on the Sketch's ability to just literally rebuild their entire economy in a turn with no meaningful consequences just do to their ludicrous IC.
Joy so the Sketch either work on plot Fiat or despite our high espionage we are woefully incorrect on the Sketch's ability to just literally rebuild their entire economy in a turn with no meaningful consequences just do to their ludicrous IC.
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Alectai
Speaks Words of Wisdom... On occasion
Despite the fact that where currently 1 of the top 3 world powers. Clearly we are falling behind.
That sounds great, and then we just learned that the gap between number one and number two is to the point where the rest of the top ten combined can't match the number one.
That the only reason we qualify as number two/three is because everyone else is too busy dealing with crises to abuse the Sketch's cheat code.
- Location
- Brazil
Considering a bunch of other, tiny, nations would have outstripped us if they weren't constantly at war... Yeah.Despite the fact that where currently 1 of the top 3 world powers. Clearly we are falling behind.
It seems the Sketch have hit a system of government with all the benefits and no downsides.
Sounds reasonable
- Location
- Illinois
Here's a lot of the AN quotes on the government reforms. I'd like to point out that the arguments that giving the UH more power seem to be reliant on the assumption that Nokly will be able to stop them better somehow.
However, AN notes that we'd be watching from the POV of the Prime Minister if we upgrade. This implies that Nokly isn't some super special snowflake who is single handily stopping out upper class (Again, our landowners, businessmen, military officers and administrators, AKA the people who generally run the country already) from ruining our country.
Factions are very much important, and as we can see with the Sketch,
Trying to remain a monolith is going to kill us long term. Empowering the parliament lets us balance the actions of the factions against each other, while allowing us to do more.
We are at the point were we need to move fast, and our current political system is too slow to do so. We need to upgrade, and this ConCon is all about upgrading the very basic parts of our government. Let's take advantage of the fact that we aren't distracted by other shiny things that will pop up in future ConCons, and go as far as we can to get the best government we can out of this.
- Location
- Leeds
?
Walk me through this again, it sounds like you're saying the exact opposite of everyone else regarding decentralisation, maybe? Pretty sure its that the Sketch are isolated so that they haven't been damaged by war and revolution like the mainlanders have.