But the general rule of Earth Bet is it can't have nice things cause of people and more along the lines of crazy parahumans powers that make use of this to an insane degree for villainous purposes.
Transposition, or: Ship Happens [Worm/Aoki Hagane no Arpeggio | Arpeggio of Blue Steel]
- Thread starter ensou
- Start date
- Crossover
Y Ddraig Goch
Previously Unknown Solder 1
- Location
- Terra
But isn't that our own understanding of humanity, We as humans always think being human is better, that our humanity is what makes us unique, but to an outsider, an alien, or an otherworldly being or an AI. Humanity isn't all that special in the Grand scheme of things if anything humanity would be like every other race that thinks their special because of the way they think and how they think.
We know in worm that humanity isn't the only sentient species, that there must be countless species that the Entities have come into contact with and copied off.
Our humanity doesn't make us unique, losing your humanity isn't necessarily a bad thing, as long as you replace it with something else.
My point is you don't have to be human to have spark.
If anything the Endbringers tend to target people who try to make the world better, they tend to annihilate or corrupt that so-called spark.
This excerpt comes from the Endbringers wiki
"their attacks have had the effect of killing or otherwise removing parahumans who served as luminaries and leaders willing to sacrifice themselves for the greater good, perhaps contributing to more prevalent cynicism and hopelessness in the general population"
The more you try to make the world better the worse life is for you, and with the Simughs subtitle manipulation, you could either die before you get anywhere.
Or end up corrupted like Sphere.
But that may just be my opinion your free to refute me
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Burning Baron
This position needs more entrenching.
- Location
- In here, not out there.
Well, given that diamonds aren't that rare and thusly valuable, to begin with, DeBeers is correct. Actual gemstones such as sapphires and emeralds are vastly more rare, as the specific mineral compositions are unique to each vein. Such as the fully mined out fire emeralds of India. No such similar vein exists anywhere. Diamonds are valuable because diamonds distributors keep demand high and supply low, and drum up sales with ad campaigns. If Taytay can synthesize valuable and semi-precious stones, it doesn't matter what distributors say.
Hundreds of millions of dead people.
Archimedes was in the middle of developing the steam engine when he died. Because of that, Rome collapsed under its own weight and was brought down by barbarians, and instead of an Industrial Revolution two thousand years ago we had the Dark Ages. I defy you to tell me how the Spanish Inquisition and the Crusades helped humanity in any way to play cultural catch-up to steam engine technology.
This whole idea that humanity needs time to adjust to technology is at best an oversimplification, and in many instances is kind of a ridiculous fantasy. Lengthening out the technology curve doesn't somehow magically give people wisdom; all it does is ensure that people whose lives could have been saved or made more bearable by life-saving advances instead die of starvation, lack of clean water, or disease.
Seihai-kun
[Unverified Wish Granting Device]
- Location
- Brasil
Meanwhile all I wanted was figure out a follow up plan to revitalize Brockton Bay's economy after getting rid of the excuse called "Boat Graveyard". Not uplift the entire human race.
Xexilf
Oblivion Sempiternum Daemonis
It also ignores that "natural" development of technology may well translate to "random" in places, since some discoveries could be made decades earlier or later essentially by chance, which means societal development can be just as unpredictable that way.
Crusader Jerome
Subsisting on Supplication
- Location
- My home away from Rome
Rome didn't fall because their technology wasn't sufficient to keep the barbarians out. Rome fell because its leaders were corrupt, because its soldiers didn't care about keeping the empire together or were barbarian mercenaries themselves, and because the people didn't have a real reason to be invested in the continuation of a corrupt system. While it's possible that steam technology could have increased the empire's longevity by improving transportation and communication, it would have still fallen eventually. Every empire does.
Secondly, please don't bring the Inquisition into this. The Inquisition was a religious institution temporarily commandeered by the Spanish government to enforce loyalty among its subjects. It has nothing to do with technological progress.
The Crusades opened trade between Europe and the Middle East, allowing exchange of ideas, foods, and materials, which translates to technological progress. The Renaissance would not have been possible without the Crusades. (Also, coffee, spices, and silk were first introduced to Europe through trade routes opened by the Crusades.)
- Location
- Bullcity
Its curious how it s the Spanish Inquisicion the only one the people remember or how the we expel jew and moriscos when we were the LAST ones in expel this people and last one to have inquisición
Or that the Spanish inquisición normaly respond to the spanish crown so it was lightly more controled NOT too much but a little
Or that the Spanish inquisición normaly respond to the spanish crown so it was lightly more controled NOT too much but a little
Hakazin
Serpent Admirer
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Eeeeh. The Renaissance probably would have still happened, it just would have taken longer for the relevant texts to circulate without the direct contact a foreign occupying army results in. Without the Crusades souring relations, there's a decent chance of a similar influx of ideas would have happened post-Mongol invasion. Besides, they was hardly a direct jump between "Crusade!" and "We have now discovered art." If you want a more direct cause, you could look at Mansa Musa I unintentionally blowing up the Egyptian gold markets, or the founding of the Schola Medica Salernitana.
And this is also horribly off topic. Go make a thread in War & Peace for further discussion.
TimeDiver
Herald of Dis Lev
- Location
- In-between the parallel worlds...
The art of the thread de-rail is both ancient and eternally mysterious... or not.HOw did we even get to medieval history
Well we can't exactly have a historical discussion on the last time an alien came from space and had to decide whether or not to uplift humanity, because (to our knowledge) it hasn't happened; the best we can do is look at near-misses in technological progress, like the time the ancient Greeks could have kicked off the Industrial Revolution early, and look at what came after to decide whether the world was better off that technological progress was held back by a couple thousand years.HOw did we even get to medieval history
I disagree with the interpretation.
Taylor is not giving up her humanity. As described, she is or will be acting very much like a human and an exemplar of the ideal American.
"I got all this cool shit"
"What about helping the rest of us with it?"
"Fuck you, I got mine."
UrsaTempest
Don't Panic!
She also uses her cool shit to create increasingly elaborate and over-engineered war machines.
Burning Baron
This position needs more entrenching.
- Location
- In here, not out there.
Like the Nazis but without a budget.
I thought she stole the Nazis budget to buy the shipyard...?
Hayateknight
Avatar of Apathy
- Location
- Texas
To comment on this, not really since the Roman Empire had millions of people in poverty and unemployed due to an over abundance of labor. Slave labor to be specific. Hence why they had those games that fed people and entertained them all the time. To make them forget about how godawful their lives were and to not get ideas of rebellion. Adding a labor saving device would not have helped as much as you would think.
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- Location
- U.S.
There was 0 chance of an Industrial revolution then. Any thought it was is fantasy. The industrial revolution was a confluence of factors, most of which didn't arise at all until the late Renaissance era, and having a working steam engine a thousand years earlier wouldn't have done anything to bring them about. We know this, because there were working steam engines in the Muslim world during the European dark age. They were just curiosities, because they are one component of a much more complex puzzle.
I will also put forth that "humanness" is not the end all be all of the thinking condition. It's entirely possible that there are other ways of being that are better or equitable by any standard, but we lack good references. Being Human is not the same as being Good, or Virtuous anyway, so it's not convincing to me to equate inhumanity with some sort of loss, when we really have no way to know.
Neruz
Rogue Spiderbanana
- Location
- The Land of Fire and Poison
The Greeks would never have had an industrial revolution because, amongst other reasons, they didn't have any flooded coal mines and they had plenty of slaves to do physical labor more cheaply than building engines for the same.
The 'flooded coal mines, use steam engines to pump water out of mines, mine coal to power the steam engines' loop was actually vital to kicking off the industrial revolution, as it provided the incentive to develop more advanced and efficient steam engines that were more effective and less costly at getting physical labor done than a bunch of poor people.
The 'flooded coal mines, use steam engines to pump water out of mines, mine coal to power the steam engines' loop was actually vital to kicking off the industrial revolution, as it provided the incentive to develop more advanced and efficient steam engines that were more effective and less costly at getting physical labor done than a bunch of poor people.
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Selonianth
Writer of Words
And yet it can't even be accurately called a near-miss. Even if Relentless *could* figure out a viable way to share her tech and didn't do so, calling a near-miss is... entitled for lack of a better word.
Okibruez
(Verified Mid-Boss)
- Location
- Dreams
When I say 'human' I mean 'empathy and ability to connect with others.' (There's some other bits too, but largely, that.)
And I only use the word 'human' since there isn't a way to include other races that are both sentient and capable of the same emotions since we don't have a word for 'all the sentient species'.
On the other hand; AI or an otherworldly being or outsider doesn't see humanity as all that special. That's the point. They aren't likely to care about humanity. So... yeah. Taylor's human anchors are the things that she does care about beyond being a ship of steel, stardust, and quantum impossibility, and those will keep her grounded. Hate to see what happens if someone took one from her....
- Pronouns
- Yes
Bad reasoning. If the greeks had the metal working needed and the design for an actually useable steam engine (they didn't, Hero's toy was about a dozen generations removed from something usable they'd have found all sorts of stuff to use it on. The first application wouldn't be pumping out mines, that's true, but they'd have found steam powered catapults or paddle wheel ships very useful. However They not only didn't have usable steam engines, they didn't have many of the per-requisites to make one.
No, it wasn't.
It happened to be the first application steam was used for, but plenty of other applications from trip hammers, and mills to tug boats and cranes.
For that matter steam power is far from required for the industrial revolution. Of course without steam it wouldn't be centered where it was historically but there 's plenty that could be done with wind and water power that wasn't historically because steam was cheaper.
Okibruez
(Verified Mid-Boss)
- Location
- Dreams
I want to argue this point. But it's not actually wrong. This both amuses and upsets me. Well done.
eschwartz
Glorious Wordsmith and Author-Whisperer
- Location
- Roundworld
"people"?
I guess they aren't likely to care about humanity moreso than their general habit of caring about sentient beings, no. But I don't particularly see why Taylor becoming a boat would make her stop being able to empathize and connect with other sentient beings.
Those aren't human anchors you're discussing there -- those are just "people" anchors, and while I'd agree that Taylor needs emotional anchors to prevent her from just being a glorified calculating machine focused on, I guess, generating nanomaterial for the sake of nanomaterial, I don't really consider this to be like a huge danger?
The actual, real worst-case scenario with non-human AIs is *not* "I have no emotional connection to anything whatsoever and purposelessly meander around demonstrating my utter non-caringness".
It is "I have a very strong emotional connection to these humans and it's a negative one".
And I think we've probably established that Taylor *does* have emotions, and that she *does* care about humanity to some extent, certainly, and that even if she decided to swan off and have fun somewhere else in the galaxy that she hasn't figured out how to find yet, the absence of a malevolent relationship with the entire planet means that the active inverse (a positive, friendly relationship) is dramatically more likely.
Even without considering that the alternative would not make a very fascinating story.
...
I simply don't get *how* people dream up such negative what-ifs about things.
Neruz
Rogue Spiderbanana
- Location
- The Land of Fire and Poison
The same way they conclude that any true AI would go full Skynet given the opportunity.
Basically, it's the same part of the mind that hears rustling noises in the dark and goes 'oh no its a hungry lion stalking me!' and then nine times out of ten, it's a rabbit.
Of course, the tenth time, it is a hungry lion...
In short; paranoia.