Threads Of Destiny(Eastern Fantasy, Sequel to Forge of Destiny)

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The big problem is that next month, the only 'Core skill and art' we'll be able to train... Is SCS...

And on a second re-read of it... No, you're right, Silverblood Pills are still good, but they'd only effectively give us one bonus Physical and Spiritual Cultivation action for a full court press, I thought it was still "One third of the successes goes to your Physical/Spiritual"

That was true of this month, too, and we still managed to fill it up. Next turn looks something like:
4*Physical, 4*spiritual, 4*SCS, and maybe an AP on EPC if it doesn't cap this turn, which leaves us with seven AP. Three-four in AG should bring that to the Green One cap even without the Silverblood pill. Spend the rest on a mix of Sect Duties and Jobs?

Don't burn the Silverblood Pill until Green Two, when AG has two levels to go through and we're burning through max GSS - the higher dice pool should result in a greater number of successes, which means the Silverblood accomplishes more.
 
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The big problem is that next month, the only 'Core skill and art' we'll be able to train... Is SCS...

And on a second re-read of it... No, you're right, Silverblood Pills are still good, but they'd only effectively give us one bonus Physical and Spiritual Cultivation action for a full court press, I thought it was still "One third of the successes goes to your Physical/Spiritual"
Really? I was under the impression we were gonna hit appraisal the end of our current turn. Eh, if we don't we'll figure it out.

I also would rather overload Genesis for any use of the Silverblood Pill (and would it affect a month or a week in the new system? How would that even work?) It's possible that isn't good either though, due to the bonus successes also being halved, in which case I think it'd be better to ignore the pill entirely and just overload Spiritual/Physical themselves.

The problem with AC and AS is they are basically entirely wasted actions now, with the Tourney in the back window we don't need to be developing desperation tier arts like that anymore.
I don't know if silverblood's bonus 1/10th are affected by the halving from overloading, given that overloading is only spelled out to affect the ap multiplier.
 
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Really? I was under the impression we were gonna hit appraisal the nd of our current turn. Eh, if we don't we'll figure it out.


I don't know if silverblood's bonus 1/10th are affected by the halving from overloading, given that overloading is only spelled out to affect the ap multiplier.

Not quite reaching Appraisal unless our dice are very hot, but we'll be about 2 AP away I think.
 
That was true of this month, too, and we still managed to fill it up. Next turn looks something like:
4*Physical, 4*spiritual, 4*SCS, and maybe an AP on EPC if it doesn't cap this turn, which leaves us with seven AP. Three-four in AG should bring that to the Green One cap even without the Silverblood pill. Spend the rest on a mix of Sect Duties and Jobs?

Don't burn the Silverblood Pill until Green Two, when AG has two levels to go through and we're burning through max GSS - the higher dice pool should result in a greater number of successes, which means the Silverblood accomplishes more.
And this is a point I forgot.
 
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Eh, fair enough.

There'll probably be a hefty dead period on Green 2 when we finish off our current core suite but haven't quite gotten replacements yet that we can do this in anyway. The real problem is going to be getting max GSS.
 
We should take more missions and test some of this stuff on turn 3.

Cultivation Aids
Junior Pillmaker: 30 points
Senior Pillmaker: 60 points

Tutoring
Core Disciple(minor): 40 points
Core Disciple(Major): 80 Points
 
Can you show that math please? I'm interested.
Here's some math for the what the pill can do. First off, here's the pill text:
1 Silverblood Pills
Adds ten dice to the cultivation of Argent Arts. Adds one tenth of the resulting successes to spiritual and physical cultivation

The equation for dice is ([T+S/4+R)xA=Dice after which we times it by the multiplier we have for various bonuses. Here, our talent is 6, Stones would be 160 (16 yellow stones x 10), and resources would be 20 dice (high). Assuming that the Silverblood pill works like a special resource that effects everything, that is another +10. This means that

(6+160/4+30) x A = Dice. Which is 76 x A = Dice. Assuming 4 ap spent on an activity, that means that it is 304 dice. Then comes our multipliers.

Argent Genesis = 1.7
Argent Current = 1.7 + .1 + .1 + .2 + .1 = 2.2
Argent Storm = 1.7 + .05 + .1 + .1 + .2 = 2.15

Which means that the dice total and roughly estimated successes comes out to
Argent Genesis = 516 x .5 = 258
Argent Current = 668 x .5 = 334
Argent Storm = 653 x .5 = 326

A tenth of all of these successes comes out to
Argent Genesis = 258 x .1 = 25
Argent Current = 334 x .1 = 33
Argent Storm = 326 x .1 = 32

All told the number of successes towards both spiritual and physical would be
25 + 33 + 32 = 90 successes.

In contrast, the number of successes for 1 ap of spiritual or physical is roughly
Spiritual = 58 successes
Physical = 55 successes

This means that for spending 12 ap on the argent arts we could get a little less than a combined total of 4 ap free for both spiritual and physical cultivation.

Edit: Stuff like the silverblood pill seems that they could be really potent when cultivating arts that we already want to cultivate and then boosting those art's success to spiritual and physical cultivation (such as EPC, SCS, and PLR) but cultivating arts for the sake of the silverblood bonus doesn't seem worth it.
 
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Not entirely wasted, AM did give us the innate Qi Sense as a permanent, and we can salvage some use out of them with the Silverblood Pill.
This is a real bugbear of mine, but the qi sense is super basic. Detecting nearby qi and being able to gauge stages/realms is something all 3rd realm cultivators ought to be able to do. Similar with the darksight we got from FVM. At this point, a Darkness cultivator should just be able to do that. The difference is it was kinda redundant right away, since AM's add was in 3rd realm.

Here's some math for the what the pill can do. First off, here's the pill text:


The equation for dice is ([T+S/4+R)xA=Dice after which we times it by the multiplier we have for various bonuses. Here, our talent is 6, Stones would be 160 (16 yellow stones x 10), and resources would be 20 dice (high). Assuming that the Silverblood pill works like a special resource that effects everything, that is another +10. This means that

(6+160/4+30) x A = Dice. Which is 76 x A = Dice. Assuming 4 ap spent on an activity, that means that it is 304 dice. Then comes our multipliers.

Argent Genesis = 1.7
Argent Current = 1.7 + .1 + .1 + .2 + .1 = 2.2
Argent Storm = 1.7 + .05 + .1 + .1 + .2 = 2.15

Which means that the dice total and roughly estimated successes comes out to
Argent Genesis = 516 x .5 = 258
Argent Current = 668 x .5 = 334
Argent Storm = 653 x .5 = 326

A tenth of all of these successes comes out to
Argent Genesis = 258 x .1 = 25
Argent Current = 334 x .1 = 33
Argent Storm = 326 x .1 = 32

All told the number of successes towards both spiritual and physical would be
25 + 33 + 32 = 90 successes.

In contrast, the number of successes for 1 ap of spiritual or physical is roughly
Spiritual = 58 successes
Physical = 55 successes

This means that for spending 12 ap on the argent arts we could get a little less than a combined total of 4 ap free for both spiritual and physical cultivation.

Edit: Stuff like the silverblood pill seems that they could be really potent when cultivating arts that we already want to cultivate and then boosting those art's success to spiritual and physical cultivation (such as EPC, SCS, and PLR) but cultivating arts for the sake of the silverblood bonus doesn't seem worth it.
If I'm reading these numbers correctly, it'd be more effective to cultivate into the softcap for spiritual/physical. Nice if we want the argents anyway, inefficient if we do not plan to use them.
 
We're not actually intending to get a new art this turn.

@yrsillar hasn't really indicated that the way archives work is changing (at least, not that I have seen), despite lots of whining about it from various parties. If the system is still 1 AP = One look and one Art, no reason to waste the Art grab. If on the other hand we're able to store up art grabs in some useful way then that idea might have weight, but we haven't seen any indication this is more than a hopeful dream of the planners.
 
@yrsillar hasn't really indicated that the way archives work is changing (at least, not that I have seen), despite lots of whining about it from various parties. If the system is still 1 AP = One look and one Art, no reason to waste the Art grab. If on the other hand we're able to store up art grabs in some useful way then that idea might have weight, but we haven't seen any indication this is more than a hopeful dream of the planners.
If it doesn't, which never really made sense to me in the first thread, I'm going to be fucking pissed. It contradicts the entire point of that option in the plan and if it works like old times I'd have likely not put the option in.

The point of the silly thing was to be able to use it as an actual archive rather than a rather shite gacha machine via two intents: getting context on what we can actually find on the first floor, what does our small sample trend towards and so on. Second is having a safety net in case our incoming art crunch is looking to be too tight cause another option fell through. There is also our clan to look after as well.

E: to be clear I don't expect or want it to let us pull multiple arts out at one go, but I do want it to be more open than the old one was.
 
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Here's some math for the what the pill can do. First off, here's the pill text:


The equation for dice is ([T+S/4+R)xA=Dice after which we times it by the multiplier we have for various bonuses. Here, our talent is 6, Stones would be 160 (16 yellow stones x 10), and resources would be 20 dice (high). Assuming that the Silverblood pill works like a special resource that effects everything, that is another +10. This means that

(6+160/4+30) x A = Dice. Which is 76 x A = Dice. Assuming 4 ap spent on an activity, that means that it is 304 dice. Then comes our multipliers.

Argent Genesis = 1.7
Argent Current = 1.7 + .1 + .1 + .2 + .1 = 2.2
Argent Storm = 1.7 + .05 + .1 + .1 + .2 = 2.15

Which means that the dice total and roughly estimated successes comes out to
Argent Genesis = 516 x .5 = 258
Argent Current = 668 x .5 = 334
Argent Storm = 653 x .5 = 326

A tenth of all of these successes comes out to
Argent Genesis = 258 x .1 = 25
Argent Current = 334 x .1 = 33
Argent Storm = 326 x .1 = 32

All told the number of successes towards both spiritual and physical would be
25 + 33 + 32 = 90 successes.

In contrast, the number of successes for 1 ap of spiritual or physical is roughly
Spiritual = 58 successes
Physical = 55 successes

This means that for spending 12 ap on the argent arts we could get a little less than a combined total of 4 ap free for both spiritual and physical cultivation.

Edit: Stuff like the silverblood pill seems that they could be really potent when cultivating arts that we already want to cultivate and then boosting those art's success to spiritual and physical cultivation (such as EPC, SCS, and PLR) but cultivating arts for the sake of the silverblood bonus doesn't seem worth it.
A few nitpicks:

First, Argent Current is very likely to be capped in 2 actions, so we can't exactly have 12 argent training. This means we are likely to get 312 (AS) + 247 (AG) + 184 (AC) = 743 successes, so 74~ successes to both Spiritual and Physical (148~ total)

Second, our spiritual/physical successes are a bit higher: 60 for physical and 64 for spiritual. So a full argent month would give slightly more than 1AP to both spiritual and physical.
 
Here, our talent is 6, Stones would be 160 (16 yellow stones x 10), and resources would be 20 dice (high). Assuming that the Silverblood pill works like a special resource that effects everything, that is another +10.

You almost got it right.

Yellow stones add 5 dice each for the first four, and 10 dice for each stone after the first four. So stones actually add 140 dice, not 160; divided by 4 that's 35 instead of 40.

On the other side, you missed the six resource dice we get for Stealth Ranks, so the numbers work out to just about the same. I usually forget about this bonus myself.

Furthermore, we don't multiply dice by the multiplier, we multiply successes by the multiplier. As we can only guesstimate successes, we use the .55 average successes per dice rolled, because on average we'll get 55 successes per 100 dice (with the bonus successes from rolling 1's included).

So we end up with 308 dice, *.55 (average successes per die) * multiplier:

AG: 308 * .55 = 169.4 * 1.7 = 287 * .1 =~ 28
AS: 308 * .55 = 169.4 * 2.2 = 372 * .1 =~ 37
AC: 308 * .55 = 169.4 * 2.15 = 364 * .1 =~ 36

28 + 37 + 36 = 99.

As far as the straight math is concerned it doesn't matter, it's all multiplication anyway. As far as the actual results are concerned, it matters a great deal, because our actual successes can vary a great deal. The sheer number of dice we're rolling tends to minimize the overall effects of randomness.

Also what @Arkeus just said.

----

Maxed out Green Stones at Green Two for Argent Genesis, four AP (curiosity's sake):
[6 + (4*5 + 4*10 + 4*40 + 4*80)/4 + 20 (High resources) + 10 (Silverblood) + 6 (Stealth bonus)] * 4 = 6 + 135 + 36 = 177 * 4 = 708
708 * .55 = 398.4 * 1.7 = 661* .1 =~ 66

Argent Pulse, Expected: 708 * .55 * 1.9 (.7 (location) + .1 (Imperial 8) + .1 [Heart/Lung]) * .1 = 398.4 * 1.9 * .1 = 756.96 * .1 =~ 75.

Spiritual at Green Two, one AP:
6 + 135 + 20 (High Resources) + 20 (EPC bonus*) + 15 (Argent Vent) + 6 (Larceny) = 202 * .55 = 111.1 * 1.2 =~ 133

Physical at Green Two, one AP:
6 + 135 + 20 + 15 + 15 + 6 = 197 * .55 = 108.35 * 1.2 = 130

Maxed out GSS at Green Two will typically provide twice as many successes as YSS, and four AP on an Argent Art with a Silverblood Pill is about half an AP to both Spiritual and Physical.

*: If it doesn't change with EPC hitting 6.

----

Expected Spiritual Cultivation Successes, First Month:
6 + 35 + 20 (High Resources) + 20 (EPC bonus) + 15 (Argent Vent) + 6 (Stealth) = 102 * 4 (AP) = 408 * .55 = 224.4 * 1.2 (Way) = 269.28.

Should bring us to 946/1200, or roughly four AP away.

Even if every die succeeds, that's 408 * 1.2 = 495.6; an extra 226 successes, for 1,172/1200. We simply can't throw enough dice at the problem to succeed this turn.

Physical:
6 + 35 + 20 + 15 + 15 + 6 = 97 * 4 = 388 * .55 = 213.4 * 1.2 =~ 256 + 61 = 317/1200; ~3.44 turns away, or fourteen AP with YSS - another turn of that is 573/1200 - 627 away - roughly five AP away at Green Two on GSS.

So if the numbers average out appropriately, we should hit Green Two next turn (Month 2), and Bronze Two two turns after that (Month 4).
 
The archive system makes no sense tbh. Like, if we get a month's access to the second floor does that mean we can get all the arts we want from it?

I doubt that.

We aren't really paying for access, we're paying to get stuff out.

The system should allow us to browse freely, and we should have to pay to get art slips.
 
The archive system makes no sense tbh. Like, if we get a month's access to the second floor does that mean we can get all the arts we want from it?

I doubt that.

We aren't really paying for access, we're paying to get stuff out.

The system should allow us to browse freely, and we should have to pay to get art slips.

I suspect that 'Research' is what leads to us getting actually good Arts out of the Archive, rather than just grabbing a couple off the shelves that looks nice like we did in the 1 AP weekly trips. Hence the hard cap on how many times we can do Archive Art Research.
 
I suspect that 'Research' is what leads to us getting actually good Arts out of the Archive, rather than just grabbing a couple off the shelves that looks nice like we did in the 1 AP weekly trips. Hence the hard cap on how many times we can do Archive Art Research.
I think the simpler explanation for the limit is that yrsillar (probably) doesn't want to have to invent like 20 new arts in a single turn.
 
The archive system makes no sense tbh. Like, if we get a month's access to the second floor does that mean we can get all the arts we want from it?

I doubt that.

We aren't really paying for access, we're paying to get stuff out.

The system should allow us to browse freely, and we should have to pay to get art slips.
Arts aren't the only thing in the archive, though. People tend to forget this, but there's other, more academic, resources. There's nothing insensible about gating general access and then appending limits on particular resources in addition. Buffets have policies where they reserve the right to restrict you from just taking huge amounts of one thing. This is the most appropriate analogy, yes: archives/libraries = buffets. Such wisdom.
 
Arts aren't the only thing in the archive, though. People tend to forget this, but there's other, more academic, resources. There's nothing insensible about gating general access and then appending limits on particular resources in addition. Buffets have policies where they reserve the right to restrict you from just taking huge amounts of one thing. This is the most appropriate analogy, yes: archives/libraries = buffets. Such wisdom.
Yes, and I wouldn't expect what we have to pay for that kind of access to be the same as what we have to pay for art slips.

The art archives and the regular archives kinda have different requirements here.
 
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