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Threads Of Destiny(Eastern Fantasy, Sequel to Forge of Destiny)
- Thread starter yrsillar
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- Original Users' Choice!
Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
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- somewhere over there.
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- They/It
The funniest way to take things is that the major benefits mirror the major conflicts. So 90's would be some amazing synergy between construction techniques, 100's would be a bunch of mid realms throwing a party, and 111+ is the heron general going on a date with a tree.
Dun Dun Duuuuun.
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For context, this is the commission page on the discord. That commission set should come out in a bit over half a year. The commissions are how we get the side-stories once a week.
Dun Dun Duuuuun.
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And... there, caught up. I have two silly omakes, one written somewhere around Turn 13, one written when I was early in Turn 17.
So You've befriended a Ling: Themes
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- They/Them
(Note: This was Written when I was at Early Turn 13, so even more than it already is, this is incredibly non-canon.
So You've Befriended A Ling: Themes
When one speaks of the Ling Clan, there is no longer any need to differentiate one from the other. Everyone knows which Ling is being talked of. This is written as a sort of informal guide, something to be kept secret and passed carefully, to those who have the regard of a Ling, positive or negative. The Ling Clan, or many might say Clans, are notorious for the importance of the bonds and ties upon them.
One begins from Ling Qi, first called the legendary Left Hand of the Cai Clan, and later the Clockwork Breaker and Dream of Spring In Winter. This White Cultivator still leads them, with the second at the 7th Realm being Ling Biyu, her sister. It is the case that many of their greatest Arts rely on personal connections. It is the genius of the Lings to realize these personal connections do not have to be positive: a rival, an enemy, or a hated foe might find the very strength of their own feelings an obstacle against the Ling.
So it is that the Ling Clan is defined by many things. They are defined by a definite, sometimes even scandalous, tendency towards change, though there are definite breaks within them on the matter of the Weilu and indeed on spirits. They are also known to adopt far easier than many Clans, with a common 'target' being moderately or very talented young cultivators of a common background whose Ways resonate with those of their scions. They do not demand as much for those willing to fold themselves beneath the shroud of their Moons, or so it is said, as they perhaps should.
They're defined by the strength of their bonds, and also the variety of ties. But they're also defined by music. The founder of the Ling is a musician of great talent, and so therein lies some of the most radical beliefs of the Ling Clan.
But I write not talking about the Ling supposition on the highest stages of Cultivation, but instead about that most dangerous question: what to do now that one has the regard of a Ling?
The first step in such a Way is not to panic, and these terms will help you understand something of their nature. I speak, of course, of the Themes.
Minor Theme
A minor theme is a short piece of music granted, first off, to every Ling who has awakened at all. A Ling may have several minor themes, granted by parents, but it is said that all Ling have a minor theme written by Ling Qi herself, whose connections to their dreams allow her to witness and create a unique piece even though her level of Cultivation is such that she cannot meet face to face any below the Third Realm.
It is the case that Ling tends to incorporate this minor theme in some way into their works and Art, whether they are a warrior, crafter, artist or most famously a musician. At a gathering, it is often considered the height of rudeness--and a marker of antipathy towards the Ling--not to announce them with their Minor Theme if it is provided.
But Minor Themes are also granted to friends and those who grow close to the Ling… and of course, as noted above to enemies of a certain style. These come in, by rough classification, two types: personal Themes, and Clan Themes. The former is simply a statement of regard, with Ling who lack musical talent either trying anyway or asking for aid from another to capture what they want it to say about their friend. The latter is an acknowledgment by the family, and is as one might imagine sometimes deeply political. To have a Minor Theme, one acknowledged by the Clan, is to have a tie to the Ling that carries possibilities and obligations with it.
It is aid personified, though what this means depends. It is no chain, yet if a Ling does ask for permission to do so, you should judge for yourself what this means.
It is rare but far from unheard of for a mortal to have a Minor Theme, as a valued servant or as the parent of an adopted Ling, or through several other means.
Major Theme
The Major Theme is granted to all Ling when they reach the third Realm of cultivation, and there are two of them. The first is created by their parents or someone closest to them, the second after a personal meeting with Ling Qi, the character of which is certainly not shared with outsiders. But the theme, lasting a minute or two, is said to encapsulate the Way of those granted it remarkably well, up to the point in which it is created. It can be renewed and transformed as one grows in Cultivation and carves out one's own path.
Only the very closest friends or lovers--and the Ling do not divide bonds between the familiar, romantic, or platonic as others might--will ever have a hope of being granted a Major Theme. Yet it is said that the first Major Theme was granted to Bai Meizhen, so it is not impossible that you might find yourself faced with this. The obligations and ties are even stronger here, whether acknowledged by the Clan or otherwise, but so too are the possibilities.
An enemy having a Major Theme is rare, but hardly unknown, as when Ling Biyu declared, upon entering the Fifth Realm, that Diao Chen was her Hearts' Enemy.
Duet
This is the only theme where the family composer is not directly the Matriarch or one working for her. Indeed, the person themselves or Clan Head Ling Biyu are far more common. It is often created when marriages are, but can also be a sign of great and truly lasting friendships that bind two people together in a way that will not easily break.
As an acknowledgment, it is one that among the Ling is said to differentiate a marriage for power or a politically useful friendship, from one which is something more, with the 'blessing' of Ling Qi regarded as an even stronger indication that the bond is true.
Yet I have met a Ling who said that the lack of answer from Ling Qi is not necessarily a lack of benediction. He said, in a quote preserved here for its absurd, Ling-like familiarity with figures said to still be Cultivating yet higher to the furthest reaches that any can reach, that "Grandmother is sometimes awkward around these kinds of things."
Orchestra
An Orchestra refers to the combined Themes of an entire family or group, including close friends, family, and Spirits, which are--in a baffling topic best left for later--regarded as friends and sometimes as a legal family to the extent of being written within wills and acknowledged in the complicated and many-pronged genealogy of this young yet increasingly vast Clan.
It is said that there are Seven Great Orchestras of the Ling, with the oldest having now split off between the Founding Generation and the children of children of children. If one ever does wish to flatter a Ling who takes pride in their family, and indeed it seems that there are many Ling who rebel against their Clan and yet do so in a way that yet marks them as such, it is best to begin learning stories of Zhenghui, So Xiuan, Hanyi, Sixiang, and indeed on the human side of a veritable cast of characters that played key roles in the founding stories of the Ling.
These Orchestras have very different political views at times, and so the Ling in this sense reflect both the formalism of branches of the Bai, and the chaotic free-for-all of the Zheng.
A/N: This is based on being caught up to Turn 13, and my idea of what is hypothetically possible of Ling Qi. It began as a more personal exploration of how Ling Qi might rise to the White without losing the fact that her Way is of connection, which had me imagining her meddling and getting involved through many intermediaries in her Clan's burgeoning population, building ties even though a part of her no longer entirely grasps why.
Which is sad, but this is in that sense a story of a successful Ling Qi, someone who even at absurd heights has people she loves and who care for her, and who has created something that will outlast her whenever she does become a Great Spirit. (Ling Biyu stays at the cusp of White at least in part because two is not company in this kind of Loneliness.)
This is meant to vaguely be many hundreds of years into the future. (If you're wondering who So Xiuan is? Presumably, a spirit that became an important part of her story sometime between now and a few hundred years from now.)
Also the idea that the Ling literally have theme songs is just kinda funny to me.
So You've Befriended A Ling: Themes
When one speaks of the Ling Clan, there is no longer any need to differentiate one from the other. Everyone knows which Ling is being talked of. This is written as a sort of informal guide, something to be kept secret and passed carefully, to those who have the regard of a Ling, positive or negative. The Ling Clan, or many might say Clans, are notorious for the importance of the bonds and ties upon them.
One begins from Ling Qi, first called the legendary Left Hand of the Cai Clan, and later the Clockwork Breaker and Dream of Spring In Winter. This White Cultivator still leads them, with the second at the 7th Realm being Ling Biyu, her sister. It is the case that many of their greatest Arts rely on personal connections. It is the genius of the Lings to realize these personal connections do not have to be positive: a rival, an enemy, or a hated foe might find the very strength of their own feelings an obstacle against the Ling.
So it is that the Ling Clan is defined by many things. They are defined by a definite, sometimes even scandalous, tendency towards change, though there are definite breaks within them on the matter of the Weilu and indeed on spirits. They are also known to adopt far easier than many Clans, with a common 'target' being moderately or very talented young cultivators of a common background whose Ways resonate with those of their scions. They do not demand as much for those willing to fold themselves beneath the shroud of their Moons, or so it is said, as they perhaps should.
They're defined by the strength of their bonds, and also the variety of ties. But they're also defined by music. The founder of the Ling is a musician of great talent, and so therein lies some of the most radical beliefs of the Ling Clan.
But I write not talking about the Ling supposition on the highest stages of Cultivation, but instead about that most dangerous question: what to do now that one has the regard of a Ling?
The first step in such a Way is not to panic, and these terms will help you understand something of their nature. I speak, of course, of the Themes.
Minor Theme
A minor theme is a short piece of music granted, first off, to every Ling who has awakened at all. A Ling may have several minor themes, granted by parents, but it is said that all Ling have a minor theme written by Ling Qi herself, whose connections to their dreams allow her to witness and create a unique piece even though her level of Cultivation is such that she cannot meet face to face any below the Third Realm.
It is the case that Ling tends to incorporate this minor theme in some way into their works and Art, whether they are a warrior, crafter, artist or most famously a musician. At a gathering, it is often considered the height of rudeness--and a marker of antipathy towards the Ling--not to announce them with their Minor Theme if it is provided.
But Minor Themes are also granted to friends and those who grow close to the Ling… and of course, as noted above to enemies of a certain style. These come in, by rough classification, two types: personal Themes, and Clan Themes. The former is simply a statement of regard, with Ling who lack musical talent either trying anyway or asking for aid from another to capture what they want it to say about their friend. The latter is an acknowledgment by the family, and is as one might imagine sometimes deeply political. To have a Minor Theme, one acknowledged by the Clan, is to have a tie to the Ling that carries possibilities and obligations with it.
It is aid personified, though what this means depends. It is no chain, yet if a Ling does ask for permission to do so, you should judge for yourself what this means.
It is rare but far from unheard of for a mortal to have a Minor Theme, as a valued servant or as the parent of an adopted Ling, or through several other means.
Major Theme
The Major Theme is granted to all Ling when they reach the third Realm of cultivation, and there are two of them. The first is created by their parents or someone closest to them, the second after a personal meeting with Ling Qi, the character of which is certainly not shared with outsiders. But the theme, lasting a minute or two, is said to encapsulate the Way of those granted it remarkably well, up to the point in which it is created. It can be renewed and transformed as one grows in Cultivation and carves out one's own path.
Only the very closest friends or lovers--and the Ling do not divide bonds between the familiar, romantic, or platonic as others might--will ever have a hope of being granted a Major Theme. Yet it is said that the first Major Theme was granted to Bai Meizhen, so it is not impossible that you might find yourself faced with this. The obligations and ties are even stronger here, whether acknowledged by the Clan or otherwise, but so too are the possibilities.
An enemy having a Major Theme is rare, but hardly unknown, as when Ling Biyu declared, upon entering the Fifth Realm, that Diao Chen was her Hearts' Enemy.
Duet
This is the only theme where the family composer is not directly the Matriarch or one working for her. Indeed, the person themselves or Clan Head Ling Biyu are far more common. It is often created when marriages are, but can also be a sign of great and truly lasting friendships that bind two people together in a way that will not easily break.
As an acknowledgment, it is one that among the Ling is said to differentiate a marriage for power or a politically useful friendship, from one which is something more, with the 'blessing' of Ling Qi regarded as an even stronger indication that the bond is true.
Yet I have met a Ling who said that the lack of answer from Ling Qi is not necessarily a lack of benediction. He said, in a quote preserved here for its absurd, Ling-like familiarity with figures said to still be Cultivating yet higher to the furthest reaches that any can reach, that "Grandmother is sometimes awkward around these kinds of things."
Orchestra
An Orchestra refers to the combined Themes of an entire family or group, including close friends, family, and Spirits, which are--in a baffling topic best left for later--regarded as friends and sometimes as a legal family to the extent of being written within wills and acknowledged in the complicated and many-pronged genealogy of this young yet increasingly vast Clan.
It is said that there are Seven Great Orchestras of the Ling, with the oldest having now split off between the Founding Generation and the children of children of children. If one ever does wish to flatter a Ling who takes pride in their family, and indeed it seems that there are many Ling who rebel against their Clan and yet do so in a way that yet marks them as such, it is best to begin learning stories of Zhenghui, So Xiuan, Hanyi, Sixiang, and indeed on the human side of a veritable cast of characters that played key roles in the founding stories of the Ling.
These Orchestras have very different political views at times, and so the Ling in this sense reflect both the formalism of branches of the Bai, and the chaotic free-for-all of the Zheng.
A/N: This is based on being caught up to Turn 13, and my idea of what is hypothetically possible of Ling Qi. It began as a more personal exploration of how Ling Qi might rise to the White without losing the fact that her Way is of connection, which had me imagining her meddling and getting involved through many intermediaries in her Clan's burgeoning population, building ties even though a part of her no longer entirely grasps why.
Which is sad, but this is in that sense a story of a successful Ling Qi, someone who even at absurd heights has people she loves and who care for her, and who has created something that will outlast her whenever she does become a Great Spirit. (Ling Biyu stays at the cusp of White at least in part because two is not company in this kind of Loneliness.)
This is meant to vaguely be many hundreds of years into the future. (If you're wondering who So Xiuan is? Presumably, a spirit that became an important part of her story sometime between now and a few hundred years from now.)
Also the idea that the Ling literally have theme songs is just kinda funny to me.
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- FR
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Loved this, @The Laurent . Can't wait to read the other one
I don't expect the whole Ling clan to be exclusively about musinc. We have a few very nice non-musical arts, and I'm still holding out hope that we can get Biyu to transform the coldstar blade art into (roll drums) a sword dance. Alternatively, She could take up dancing painting, what with the Hui brush (I'm quite certain the art form exists somewhere IRL)
I don't expect the whole Ling clan to be exclusively about musinc. We have a few very nice non-musical arts, and I'm still holding out hope that we can get Biyu to transform the coldstar blade art into (roll drums) a sword dance. Alternatively, She could take up dancing painting, what with the Hui brush (I'm quite certain the art form exists somewhere IRL)
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Loved this, @The Laurent . Can't wait to read the other one
I don't expect the whole Ling clan to be exclusively about musinc. We have a few very nice non-musical arts, and I'm still holding out hope that we can get Biyu to transform the coldstar blade art into (roll drums) a sword dance. Alternatively, She could take up dancing painting, what with the Hui brush (I'm quite certain the art form exists somewhere IRL)
Oh, not exclusively, hence the note about poets and artisans and soldiers. The unspoken thing the narrator of the piece wouldn't know is that a lot of this is about giving Ling Qi a way to relate to her family, since True Connection is so vital to her Way while also being something so very difficult to maintain, if not nearly impossible, at White level.
It'll probably continue beyond her Ascension/death/etc, because that's how traditions get started, but it was initially (in my headcanon for my own thing) a way to give someone who had refined herself so a way to connect to and understand the webs of friendship and love and family that she now sits at the center of.
Hence why every Ling meets Ling Qi at Third Realm so they can have a heart-to-heart and presumably she can, like, figure stuff out and renew her ties and etc, etc, yada yada.
(It ties into the rather skeptical view the Ling Clan has of the 8th Realm in general in this apocryphal version of the future.)
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I was hoping not to double-post, but I was curious about a few things.
First, how is Xiulan doing in general? I know that letters are being exchanged and the friendship being kept up, I don't doubt that, but I'm still curious.
Second, what does it take to Create and Master a Personal Successor Art? I don't doubt that everyone's going towards it well, since obviously the 50% boost to XP is a way to speed things up, but what does it take to reach that goal, etc, etc?
Third, is there any chart/explanation for what the Talent number means?
Fourth, and this is more of a WoG question, IS it possible to have a partial breakthrough at 8th? It feels like it might be possible at lower stages, but everything about 8th we've ever heard makes it sound that being half-in and half-out is roughly the same as being all dead, that there's no way to be part of the way there, no way to dip your toes in the water when you're trying to become the ocean.
First, how is Xiulan doing in general? I know that letters are being exchanged and the friendship being kept up, I don't doubt that, but I'm still curious.
Second, what does it take to Create and Master a Personal Successor Art? I don't doubt that everyone's going towards it well, since obviously the 50% boost to XP is a way to speed things up, but what does it take to reach that goal, etc, etc?
Third, is there any chart/explanation for what the Talent number means?
Fourth, and this is more of a WoG question, IS it possible to have a partial breakthrough at 8th? It feels like it might be possible at lower stages, but everything about 8th we've ever heard makes it sound that being half-in and half-out is roughly the same as being all dead, that there's no way to be part of the way there, no way to dip your toes in the water when you're trying to become the ocean.
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- FR
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For Xiulan, no idea, that's a question for the peoples on patreon.
A good example of the creation of a successor art is what we did during this arc: Threads Of Destiny(Eastern Fantasy, Sequel to Forge of Destiny) Original - Users' Choice! . So you want full mastery of the original art, additional
insights that you want to add to it, and to master it... Well, gotta select the projects for it when we do the turn votes until we can't take any more.
For talent, it lost mechanical significance, but basically, it was the initial number of dice we got to throw to determine how successful cultivation was back in forge of destiny.
4th is indeed more of a WoG question
Aliya
Someone I might become
- Location
- Kazakhstan
- Pronouns
- They/She/It
I can answer first question.
Xiulan currently has her own side series you can see on Royal roads (or patreon) called Journey to the East. I have not yet had time to read it, but I heard its cool.
Here is the link:Journey to the East Chapter 1 - Tales of Destiny
- Location
- United States of America
Xiulan is burning bright and burning fierce! Her father has taken up the responsibility of instructing her on the intricacies of Gu style techniques and she has assumed an officer's position in his army in the fight against the unending ashen legions.
Aliya
Someone I might become
- Location
- Kazakhstan
- Pronouns
- They/She/It
I believe its still influences the speed of cultivation and breakthrough chance.
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Yeah, I think I noticed that, so our 110 is multiplied by 6 rather than anything else. I was just kinda wondering if there was a scale, since I was vaguely assuming it was an eight-point system or something.
A lot of things are eight in the Forge/Threads universe.
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Talent is a 1-10 scale...though higher numbers are increasingly rare.
Technically it's anywhere from 1 which is "you cannot cultivate at all period" to 10 which is "you would make the sage emperor look like a scrub" and is unheard of. Back when the mechanics were more important rolling under your talent number would be a success. And that's still the case for breakthroughs. In world talent represents both the natural ability and the drive of a cultivator.
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We have at least met a 7/8 though, I'm pretty sure, since Ji Rong was obviously made from the Prisoner Opening Choice from Forge where it said "Highest Talent."
Which is a lesson that Talent isn't absolutely everything, since we've managed to surpass him. But it is definitely something.
Which is a lesson that Talent isn't absolutely everything, since we've managed to surpass him. But it is definitely something.
- Location
- Finland
Talent is probably a good indicator on average.
But Empire does not have the means to accurately gauge for talent, if they had, there would be lot less Han Fans out there.
And even with talent, what matters more is drive (hi Renxiang), willingness to absolutely break yourself to get somewhere (hi Xiulan), getting lucky with patrons (hi Ling Qi), etc...
I could see high talent becoming a detriment when you get out of the lower tiers and what was once easy stops being so.
Good teachers would be able to counter that, but not every cultivator is going to get one.
In a way, Ji Rong was lucky that he got his ass kicked so thoroughly early on.
It showed him that being good is not good enough.
But Empire does not have the means to accurately gauge for talent, if they had, there would be lot less Han Fans out there.
And even with talent, what matters more is drive (hi Renxiang), willingness to absolutely break yourself to get somewhere (hi Xiulan), getting lucky with patrons (hi Ling Qi), etc...
I could see high talent becoming a detriment when you get out of the lower tiers and what was once easy stops being so.
Good teachers would be able to counter that, but not every cultivator is going to get one.
In a way, Ji Rong was lucky that he got his ass kicked so thoroughly early on.
It showed him that being good is not good enough.
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He was advancing faster than Ling Qi until he ran into the out of context problem (for him) of Renxiang actually meaning it when she said she wouldn't tolerate any corruption whatsoever.
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Oh sure, but sucks to suck for him.
Also I was doing amateur math based on a very loose understanding of the system, and I think there's a real chance that, like all child prodigies, we could peak at 19.
He was probably a 7 yeah, but he didn't get the patronage of 3 great spirits
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Actually, how DO omake points work?
E: Wait, no, there's a tab in Info, let's see...
Oh, it hasn't been updated in a while, but I see.
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- FR
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One of the readers (can't remember who) keeps count, and you can say you're spending them to add to a roll or to add a point in a cultivation action for a turn vote (which matters because if you've got double the score needed to succeed at a cultivation action, there's a bonus to it, typically a doubling of the concept points we get). 1 Omakke point add 10 to any roll, and we can't use more than 2 points/ roll.
Here's our almost-guaranteed progress for turn 18:
Spirit: 1930 + 900 [6 * (110+30+10)] = 2830/7400
Physical: 1580 + 660 [6 * (110)] = 2240/7400
Qi: (12/18) -> (15/18)
[PLAN BONUSES]
Four Winds Joy: +2 Choice/Motion, Advance West Wind Step
Ice and Dust: +2 Cycles/Endings, Advance Year's End Aria
Primacy of Beasts: +2 Want/Power, Advance Primal War Calling
Motion IV (2/8) -> (4/8)
Power IV (2/8) -> (4/8)
Want IV (2/8) -> (4/8)
Choice III (0/5) -> (2/5)
Endings II (1/3) -> III (0/5)
Cycles I (0/2) -> II (0/3)
Physical: 1580 + 660 [6 * (110)] = 2240/7400
Qi: (12/18) -> (15/18)
[PLAN BONUSES]
Four Winds Joy: +2 Choice/Motion, Advance West Wind Step
Ice and Dust: +2 Cycles/Endings, Advance Year's End Aria
Primacy of Beasts: +2 Want/Power, Advance Primal War Calling
Motion IV (2/8) -> (4/8)
Power IV (2/8) -> (4/8)
Want IV (2/8) -> (4/8)
Choice III (0/5) -> (2/5)
Endings II (1/3) -> III (0/5)
Cycles I (0/2) -> II (0/3)
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